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safa92
Guest
I don’t understand how Christ dying on the cross did anything? Why did God do it? Isn’t he the one that makes the rules? Can’t he just redeem us because he says so?
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annad347
Guest
Then we wouldn’t be choosing Him.
He wants us to love and choose Him.
He wants us to love and choose Him.
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TULIPed
Guest
Somebody kicks you in your hamstring, spray paints “Loser Head” on your house, and then steals your car. The local sheriff comes by, has a look shrugs his shoulders, pats you not he back, climbs in his cruiser and drives off.
What’s wrong with this story?
What’s wrong with this story?
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John_Martin
Guest
He died to pour out his life into the Father, which he does for all eternity (the Holy Spirit spirated into the Father from the Son and into the Son from the Father), but as a Human, when he pours out his life, his body dies; that he gives to us to eat, and his blood to drink, so that when the Father pours life into the Son, he pours it also into his Whole Son, who has a Body that was awaiting resurrecton; and so he gives life to his Son, including his Body, which we have consumed; we are now participating in the resurrection.
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Vico
Guest
The Holy Trinity is just. Only the Atonement of Christ can offer adequate expiation for the sins of men – it is a voluntary performance that outweighs the injustice done.
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SPBlitz
Guest
CS Lewis discusses this exact thing in his books Mere Christianity and The Problem of Pain. In a nutshell: as fallen creatures our will is turned towards ourselves, not to God, as it should be. And it is impossible for us to fix our own fallen nature. Now Jesus’ death was the exact opposite of the sin of Adam - Jesus literally Preferred the Fathers will over his own (his own will being to avoid pain and death). He could do this since he is God and is able to make that sacrifice perfectly. But he is also human, so that perfect sacrifice now also has a seat in human nature - something that is now communicated to us. This is a very brief summary, and I’m sure I didn’t do it justice. But give Lewis’ books a read - he explains it better.
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Justin_Mary
Guest
Really good question. To the last, yes, he absolutely could have. But the truth & the reality is he didn’t. & it’s on us to try to understand that.
Seek the truth, seek God. The way, the truth, & the life.
Did Jesus Have To Die?
Tim Staples discusses why the crucifixion was necessary for salvation.
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Amac1
Guest
I have often wondered this exact thing, and my dim mind sometimes can’t get my head around Jesus’ sacrifice, and I often feel very guilty for that.
I wish I knew the answers.
All we have to do is trust the reasons and have faith. Which I do feel inside. So I suppose that’s the main thing.
I wish I knew the answers.
All we have to do is trust the reasons and have faith. Which I do feel inside. So I suppose that’s the main thing.
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JerryZ
Guest
Many threads have been opened with this question and is also repeated in the many radio programs that are there to help us understand our faith.
To fully comprehend why the sacrifice of Jesus is necessary we need to understand what happens when we sin.
GOD is an infinite being. Has no beginning and no end. We cannot grasp the magnitude of HIS reality since we are finite.
When we sin against HIM our transgression by virtue of to whom we are doing it cannot be satisfied by any human.
Let us use an analogy. I drive a car and have an accident and break a house wall. Well I now am responsible to paying the repairs to that house, right.
Now imagine me doing the same but instead my action is against an INFINITE being. I have nothing that can repair that damage.
Even my life which by the way was given to me by GOD therefore is not mine to repair the debt.
In order to satisfy our debt to an infinite being we need the sacrifice of an infinite being that will be willing to put Himself in OUR place and repay OUR debt to GOD.
THIS Jesus did for us. And so the phrase “For HE so loved the world that gave up HIS only SON to die for us” is true.
Hope this helps.
Peace!
To fully comprehend why the sacrifice of Jesus is necessary we need to understand what happens when we sin.
GOD is an infinite being. Has no beginning and no end. We cannot grasp the magnitude of HIS reality since we are finite.
When we sin against HIM our transgression by virtue of to whom we are doing it cannot be satisfied by any human.
Let us use an analogy. I drive a car and have an accident and break a house wall. Well I now am responsible to paying the repairs to that house, right.
Now imagine me doing the same but instead my action is against an INFINITE being. I have nothing that can repair that damage.
Even my life which by the way was given to me by GOD therefore is not mine to repair the debt.
In order to satisfy our debt to an infinite being we need the sacrifice of an infinite being that will be willing to put Himself in OUR place and repay OUR debt to GOD.
THIS Jesus did for us. And so the phrase “For HE so loved the world that gave up HIS only SON to die for us” is true.
Hope this helps.
Peace!
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ColoradoCatholic
Guest
so that, among other reasons, man could not accuse Him of never having suffered. Given our predicament of being born into original sin (being born into suffering).
Honestly it just shows how merciful he is because he was willing to come down and wallow in the “mud” with us even though he never did anything. He’s a good leader, a perfect leader, and He loves His children. On further reflection, we are (here in our earthly life) called the church militant, isn’t a good leader suppose to lead from the front? Well he certainly did.
Honestly it just shows how merciful he is because he was willing to come down and wallow in the “mud” with us even though he never did anything. He’s a good leader, a perfect leader, and He loves His children. On further reflection, we are (here in our earthly life) called the church militant, isn’t a good leader suppose to lead from the front? Well he certainly did.
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Usagi
Guest
As I understand it (now, as a Catholic), He could have.
But He made the rules (particularly, “sin leads to death” and “to buy a life back from Me costs another life”) in order to illustrate the seriousness of sin. We know that He loves us and pours out His grace on us while we are still in sin, but for Him to just wave His hand and fix everything up would be to undercut all that stuff about how terrible sin is.
So He kept all the stuff about death and sacrificing something precious to redeem a life in place, and did the sacrificing and dying Himself to redeem all of us. He does what we couldn’t, we reap the benefit, but we always have the Cross to remind us that, just because God is eager to forgive doesn’t mean sin is no biggie.
But He made the rules (particularly, “sin leads to death” and “to buy a life back from Me costs another life”) in order to illustrate the seriousness of sin. We know that He loves us and pours out His grace on us while we are still in sin, but for Him to just wave His hand and fix everything up would be to undercut all that stuff about how terrible sin is.
So He kept all the stuff about death and sacrificing something precious to redeem a life in place, and did the sacrificing and dying Himself to redeem all of us. He does what we couldn’t, we reap the benefit, but we always have the Cross to remind us that, just because God is eager to forgive doesn’t mean sin is no biggie.
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umamibella
Guest
This is a bonza question and one I ask too.
Christ died to redeem our sins and kick satan in the backside all the way back to hell.
We also got our eternal life back.
To establish His church on earth and to show us the kingdom of heaven was also around us.
Thats the way I see it.
Such a huge way to accomplish all thatm God really loves us.
Christ died to redeem our sins and kick satan in the backside all the way back to hell.
We also got our eternal life back.
To establish His church on earth and to show us the kingdom of heaven was also around us.
Thats the way I see it.
Such a huge way to accomplish all thatm God really loves us.
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ThomasMT
Guest
Sure, but in doing it this way He demonstrates how much He loves us.
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Eric_Hyom
Guest
Jesus not only preached that we should love and pray for our enemies; he showed us how as well.
When Jesus spent his time on Earth, he would have lived by the greatest commandments, he could do nothing greater. But how did Jesus love all his neighbours as he loves himself? How did Jesus look at the man who was nailing him to the cross and love him as he loves himself?
We know that Jesus prayed forgave them Father on the cross. To forgive is a great thing to do; but loving someone as you love yourself seems so far above just forgiving them. All the law of God hangs and depends on the greatest commandments.
When Jesus spent his time on Earth, he would have lived by the greatest commandments, he could do nothing greater. But how did Jesus love all his neighbours as he loves himself? How did Jesus look at the man who was nailing him to the cross and love him as he loves himself?
We know that Jesus prayed forgave them Father on the cross. To forgive is a great thing to do; but loving someone as you love yourself seems so far above just forgiving them. All the law of God hangs and depends on the greatest commandments.
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stpurl
Guest
If you did something really rotten to another person, lied, cheated, stole, etc., and he said to you, “Hey, I forgive you. I’ll just stay wounded like this, and you can go on and live life however you choose”. . .
What would you learn? How would this help you grow to be the best person you could be?
If you just did whatever you choose (and let’s face it, we’re all sinners, no matter how we justify it, and if some of the sins are little white lies, some of the others are really horrific), with no consequences except somebody waving a magic wand and saying, “you’re forgiven, welcome to heaven anyway”, is that just? Is it even merciful? Imagine it’s happened to YOU, YOU are the one who was robbed and beaten, and God just smiles at you and the guy who beat you and says to him, “I forgive you, you’ll both laugh about this in heaven where you are bound because I made the rules, you’re not really responsible, and it’s all good”. . .are you going to smile at God and say, “Yeah, it’s OK. I’ve got a broken jaw from the mugging and no way to pay my bills and I’ll probably wind up on the streets, but YOU forgive him Lord so I do too??
But what if you did something awful and God not only forgave you, but went off and was punished in your place. Punished so severely that He even died under the punishment for you. And all He asked was that YOU love God and your neighbor and to choose His offer of salvation. . . Freely. He would still take on that punishment for you and die for you even if in the end you walked away from Him and said, “No. I know you did this for me, but I can’t submit to that kind of love. I can’t acknowledge that this thing I did is something that I have to put aside. I would rather stay in hell in my sin because I cannot and will not give it up, and I choose this forever.”
Imagine God, who made us and everything, who is all powerful, all good, offers us everything and dies in agony for the sins of people who reject Him completely, because that’s His nature.
Can you really ask MORE from God than He has already given?
You can’t. But it is so much that we understandably feel how low, small, pitiful and ugly we are in comparison to Him.
And that makes some people so angry, because they are so puffed up with pride that they cannot stand to see and experience God’s pure goodness. They would rather think that they can be ‘better’ than God. They will hold onto their own sins and ‘intellect’ and ‘emotions’ and make that into their god, and choose separation from the True God.
Let’s pray that we never do such a thing.
What would you learn? How would this help you grow to be the best person you could be?
If you just did whatever you choose (and let’s face it, we’re all sinners, no matter how we justify it, and if some of the sins are little white lies, some of the others are really horrific), with no consequences except somebody waving a magic wand and saying, “you’re forgiven, welcome to heaven anyway”, is that just? Is it even merciful? Imagine it’s happened to YOU, YOU are the one who was robbed and beaten, and God just smiles at you and the guy who beat you and says to him, “I forgive you, you’ll both laugh about this in heaven where you are bound because I made the rules, you’re not really responsible, and it’s all good”. . .are you going to smile at God and say, “Yeah, it’s OK. I’ve got a broken jaw from the mugging and no way to pay my bills and I’ll probably wind up on the streets, but YOU forgive him Lord so I do too??
But what if you did something awful and God not only forgave you, but went off and was punished in your place. Punished so severely that He even died under the punishment for you. And all He asked was that YOU love God and your neighbor and to choose His offer of salvation. . . Freely. He would still take on that punishment for you and die for you even if in the end you walked away from Him and said, “No. I know you did this for me, but I can’t submit to that kind of love. I can’t acknowledge that this thing I did is something that I have to put aside. I would rather stay in hell in my sin because I cannot and will not give it up, and I choose this forever.”
Imagine God, who made us and everything, who is all powerful, all good, offers us everything and dies in agony for the sins of people who reject Him completely, because that’s His nature.
Can you really ask MORE from God than He has already given?
You can’t. But it is so much that we understandably feel how low, small, pitiful and ugly we are in comparison to Him.
And that makes some people so angry, because they are so puffed up with pride that they cannot stand to see and experience God’s pure goodness. They would rather think that they can be ‘better’ than God. They will hold onto their own sins and ‘intellect’ and ‘emotions’ and make that into their god, and choose separation from the True God.
Let’s pray that we never do such a thing.
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NevermoreLenore
Guest
In the OT it explains how sacrifices must be offered up to God to atone for sin, ie the sacrificial lamb was the best of the herd. The NT talks of Jesus fulfilling the Law–He became the most perfect sacrificial lamb and His death atoned for sin, making the act of sacrificing regularly to atone for sins unnecessary–the debt was paid completely.
Understanding the OT is the key for fully understanding what Jesus’ sacrifice means for us.
Understanding the OT is the key for fully understanding what Jesus’ sacrifice means for us.
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Justin_Mary
Guest
I believe this speaks to more than just physical death. But also (& primarily) a spiritual death. Adam & Eve dies a spiritual death the moment they ate from the Tree of Knowledge of Good & Evil.
Their hearts were set against God’s. No longer at peace with Him.
& we come into this world our hearts oriented towards ourselves, thinking we must fend for ourselves doing whatever we must to survive; lie, cheat, steal.
& as we participate in the life of Christ (through the sacraments) we live in Him & He in us.
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Mmarco
Guest
Let me try to explain why I believe that Chirst’s sacrifice was necessary to redeem us.
I believe that God loves us infinitely, and He desires to lead each of us to the true life and true happiness, a condition existing only in communion with God. But God cannot tolerate evil and sin, because they are incompatible with His good and holy nature. A deep interior change is then necessary for all of us to reach the eternal happiness; we must be sanctified and purified from all our evil and sinful desires. God has the power to change us but He wants to do that with our consent. In fact God has chosen to create man with a free will, He wants to respect our free will. Man cannot really accept to be changed by God and he cannot be in comunion with God as long as even a shadow of doubt and distrust remains in his heart ( it must be stressed that such a distrust may exist even without the man is aware of it, at the unconscious level).
In order to destroy every shadow of doubt and distrust in our heart, God has chosen to give us the greatest proof of love that may exist: Christ’s Passion. Christ’s Passion has reconciled us to God because it has uprooted from our heart our distrust and doubts about God’s love; it has satisfied our (conscious or unconscious) desire and need of a proof of love, so that it has given us the strength to trust God and feel loved by Him.
I believe that each of us needed to know that God was willing to accept such a terrible suffering for us, in order to really trust God. Every man needed that proof of love, and God, who knew this, has accepted to give man what he consciously or unconsciously asked to Him. Jesus had to suffer and die that way to convince us about God’s goodness and God’s love towards us. It is man’s obstinate distrust against God that has forced God to give man that proof of love, the proof he needed to trust God. By His death on the cross, Jesus destroys our distrust and our doubts, and He gives us the strength to believe in Him and trust Him. This means that each of us is personally responsible of Jesus’ sufferings and death. This distrust, this lack of faith in God, as well as the excess of trust in oneself, is just the essence of the original sin. Blinded by his pride, man rejects God’s authority and prefers to trust himself, instead of His Creator; man deludes himself to be able to be independent from God, to be the god of himself. But God only is the source of all true good and true love. Man is unable to pursue the true good with his only strengths; man needs God, His grace, His teachings, His spiritual help, and so, after his rebellion against God, he gets deeper and deeper into a vortex of sin, which he can get out of only if he allow God to change his evil and impure heart.
I believe that Chirst suffered His Passion to help us to have faith in Him and trust Him, to make us understand that He loves us infinitely, that He is good and mercifull and that He is near to us so that we may open our heart to Him, be in communion with Him and be saved.
I believe that God loves us infinitely, and He desires to lead each of us to the true life and true happiness, a condition existing only in communion with God. But God cannot tolerate evil and sin, because they are incompatible with His good and holy nature. A deep interior change is then necessary for all of us to reach the eternal happiness; we must be sanctified and purified from all our evil and sinful desires. God has the power to change us but He wants to do that with our consent. In fact God has chosen to create man with a free will, He wants to respect our free will. Man cannot really accept to be changed by God and he cannot be in comunion with God as long as even a shadow of doubt and distrust remains in his heart ( it must be stressed that such a distrust may exist even without the man is aware of it, at the unconscious level).
In order to destroy every shadow of doubt and distrust in our heart, God has chosen to give us the greatest proof of love that may exist: Christ’s Passion. Christ’s Passion has reconciled us to God because it has uprooted from our heart our distrust and doubts about God’s love; it has satisfied our (conscious or unconscious) desire and need of a proof of love, so that it has given us the strength to trust God and feel loved by Him.
I believe that each of us needed to know that God was willing to accept such a terrible suffering for us, in order to really trust God. Every man needed that proof of love, and God, who knew this, has accepted to give man what he consciously or unconsciously asked to Him. Jesus had to suffer and die that way to convince us about God’s goodness and God’s love towards us. It is man’s obstinate distrust against God that has forced God to give man that proof of love, the proof he needed to trust God. By His death on the cross, Jesus destroys our distrust and our doubts, and He gives us the strength to believe in Him and trust Him. This means that each of us is personally responsible of Jesus’ sufferings and death. This distrust, this lack of faith in God, as well as the excess of trust in oneself, is just the essence of the original sin. Blinded by his pride, man rejects God’s authority and prefers to trust himself, instead of His Creator; man deludes himself to be able to be independent from God, to be the god of himself. But God only is the source of all true good and true love. Man is unable to pursue the true good with his only strengths; man needs God, His grace, His teachings, His spiritual help, and so, after his rebellion against God, he gets deeper and deeper into a vortex of sin, which he can get out of only if he allow God to change his evil and impure heart.
I believe that Chirst suffered His Passion to help us to have faith in Him and trust Him, to make us understand that He loves us infinitely, that He is good and mercifull and that He is near to us so that we may open our heart to Him, be in communion with Him and be saved.
You’re not the first to ask this question. The Church recognizes that Jesus could have redeemed us by simply anything that he did, since he is God and all his merits have infinite value. Obviously though, God did find it necessary–and we will never fully understand why in this life–for sacrifice to be offered in atonement for sin, and he prefigured this in the sacrifices of the Old Testament. Costly, bloody sacrifices. Perhaps it was to drill into man the horror and ugliness of sin.
Since sacrifice was deemed necessary, only Jesus the God-Man can offer this sacrifice as man with the infinite value only God can offer to atone for man’s sin. And his choice of death was to show man not only the full horror of sin, but also the depths of his love. Whatever God’s reason was for ordaining sacrifice as necessary for redemption, the fact that it is and that Jesus willfully under went this only tells us how much he loved us. I’m not sure I would have incentive to love him in return if he just snapped his fingers.
“I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me; and the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.*” Galatians 2:20. Me singular. You singular.
If this is the depths of God’s love for me that he would do that for me, then a flippant “so?” is not the answer I would give to his Sacred Heart. I would rather it be “Thank you, Jesus for your love. Help me to love you as I should.”
Since sacrifice was deemed necessary, only Jesus the God-Man can offer this sacrifice as man with the infinite value only God can offer to atone for man’s sin. And his choice of death was to show man not only the full horror of sin, but also the depths of his love. Whatever God’s reason was for ordaining sacrifice as necessary for redemption, the fact that it is and that Jesus willfully under went this only tells us how much he loved us. I’m not sure I would have incentive to love him in return if he just snapped his fingers.
“I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me; and the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.*” Galatians 2:20. Me singular. You singular.
If this is the depths of God’s love for me that he would do that for me, then a flippant “so?” is not the answer I would give to his Sacred Heart. I would rather it be “Thank you, Jesus for your love. Help me to love you as I should.”
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