Christ has died. Christ is Risen. Christ will come again.

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frdave20

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The US Bishops Conference at their spring meeting took up the discussion of the Anamnesis – Christ has died…

one bishop mentioned that it will likely be scrapped in the future because it is “theologically incorrect”… does anyone have any knowledge as to why?
 
This is the same post I had in a previous thread about the same topic. It can be found here:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=61166

“Christ has died. Christ is risen. Christ will come again” is the memorial acclamation which takes place after the consecration of the blood. The USCCB is considering changing this. Some say it is liturgically incorrect. The Latin version of this was Mortem tuam annuntiamus, Domine, et tuam resurrectionem confitemur, donec venias. This translates in english to We proclaim your death, O Lord, and confess your ressurection, until you come.

matthew
 
This acclamation is not theologically wrong, as far as it goes. Christ did die [for us], Christ is risen [now and forever], and Christ will come again [in glory with the fullness of salvation].

However, the greatest deficiency is its very form. It is a statement about Christ, not a prayer or acclamation to Christ. The Mystery of Faith (currently called the Memorial Acclamation) in the original Latin, as well in all its other translated forms, current and new, are addressed to Christ, as in, “Dying you destroyed our death…” or “We proclaim your death, O Lord…”

When we made the Acclamation a pure statement of faith, a Memorial, it encourages us to treat our faith as purely intellectual, an assent of the mind to the truths of Christ and God, salvation, and so on. We already have strong tendencies to do this. It is particularly sad that this form is by far the most commonly used; I suspect 90+% of our faithful use this form 90+% of the time. It became the standard of our faith on this point. (Remember the saying Lex orandi, lex credendi, loosely translatable as “the law of prayer is the law of belief”? This is one illustration of the saying.)

But when we make the Mystery of Faith a prayer, addressed to Jesus Christ himself, the greatest Mystery of our Faith, it engages us with the person of Christ, who has just become more deeply present in the Eucharistic species. I particularly like the new form C: “Save us, Savior of the world, for by your Cross and Resurrection, you have set us free.” with its added outcry “Save us…”! We are (I hope) so fully caught up in the moment, in our need and in Christ’s presence, that we cannot remain passive and objective, but must call out to Christ who has drawn so near us.
 
Check the dates friends.

The original post here was done in 2005.

Just in case anyone was wondering why the OP doesn’t know about the new Missal translation. 😃
 
benedictgal said:
Maybe this might also help:

benedictgal-lexorandilexcredendi.blogspot.com/2010/11/case-for-retiring-christ-has-died.html

Something to consider is the fact that “Christ has died…” appears nowhere in the Latin original. In fact, none of the other language groups have this, not even the Spanish language text of the Roman Missal.
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Not even the Spanish? 🙂

I just viewed the Pope’s Mass from Westminster Cathedral on Youtube, and as familiar as the words are, the impression made by that English coming from him on that occasion was–well, I was sorry for the poor man for having to pronounce such an impoverished a rendering of so great a service.
 
jbuck919 said:
Not even the Spanish? 🙂

I just viewed the Pope’s Mass from Westminster Cathedral on Youtube, and as familiar as the words are, the impression made by that English coming from him on that occasion was–well, I was sorry for the poor man for having to pronounce such an impoverished a rendering of so great a service.
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The reason why I included Spanish is because OCP has a notorious habit (and, to some extent, WLP) of also translating “Christ has died…” into Spanish, even if this proclamation does not exist in any other language.
 
I am shocked that a thread started and answered 6years ago had not been purged by the site…I wonder how far back someone had to go to find this post?
 
Maureen1125 said:
I am shocked that a thread started and answered 6years ago had not been purged by the site…I wonder how far back someone had to go to find this post?
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However, while the thread is old, the issue is quite current, as this change will come during the First Sunday of Advent of this year.
 
While that is true, my statement was that I was shocked this thread is even still around. I have seen countless threads…basically a new one every day…about the changes that are coming.
 
My daughter, when she was about four years old, thought we were saying, “Rice had died, rice has risen, rice will come again.”

She’s ten now and told me recently that she always wondered how rice would come again and why it would come back, where it went to in the first place, etc.

The Dominican Sisters at her school straightened her out. 👍

-Tim-
 
benedictgal said:
The reason why I included Spanish is because OCP has a notorious habit (and, to some extent, WLP) of also translating “Christ has died…” into Spanish, even if this proclamation does not exist in any other language.
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There’s at least one composer who’s done the same thing in French. I used to hate singing that acclamation in my former parish.

Not satisfied with the three ‘died, risen, come again’, he had added steps to gave us an acclamation that had us singing that Jesus “came, was born, suffered, died, rose, will come again, is here”.

Why composers take such liberties is beyond me!
 
TimothyH said:
My daughter, when she was about four years old, thought we were saying, “Rice had died, rice has risen, rice will come again.”

She’s ten now and told me recently that she always wondered how rice would come again and why it would come back, where it went to in the first place, etc.

The Dominican Sisters at her school straightened her out. 👍

-Tim-
Click to expand...
HAHAHA!

So cute
 
frdave20 said:
The US Bishops Conference at their spring meeting took up the discussion of the Anamnesis – Christ has died…

one bishop mentioned that it will likely be scrapped in the future because it is “theologically incorrect”… does anyone have any knowledge as to why?
Click to expand...
The Christ has died … in not in the typical edition of the Latin Roman missal, neither it is in the New Translation of the Missal. It will be illicit after Advent 2011, unless it is approved by the Apostolic See.

Here are the three licit acclamations
usccb.org/romanmissal/order-of-mass.pdf (page 36)

The mystery of faith.
And the people continue, acclaiming:
We proclaim your Death, O Lord,
and profess your Resurrection
until you come again.
Or:
When we eat this Bread and drink this Cup,
we proclaim your Death, O Lord,
until you come again.
Or:
Save us, Savior of the world,
for by your Cross and Resurrection
you have set us free.

All three is personal, we recall our action, the Christ has died is impersonal, as if we would be only spectators.
 
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