Christianity is not meant to be Christ-centered only

[mikeledes]

I think that what Hail Mary meant was that our spiritual life as Christians should not exclude the Father and the Holy Spirit. Sometimes, it seems that Christians talk so much about Jesus that they forget the other two Persons of the Blessed Trinity.

God Bless,
Michael

 

[Greg27]

I think true Christianity is both Christocentric and Trinitarian. Christ is one of the trinity by nature, and all worship to God the Father is made through him, ‘in the unity of the Holy Spirit’ as it is said in the Eucharistic prayer.

 

[NonDenom]

That’s sad, you should have answered no. Jesus is not “a personal Lord and Savior” and this heretical, extra-scriptural teaching is promulgated in great

error by unwitting protestants.

Having a personal relationship with your Triune God, great. But this whole personal Savior nonsense is just man-made mumbo jumbo.

Hi Promethius
The great thing about the Scriptures is that they reveal truth. I would encourage you to do a word search of the Scriptures on the subject of “Savior”
You will find
“Their Savior”
“Them a Savior”
“The Savior”
“Thy Savior”
“Our Savior”
“Lord and Savior”
And my favorite, “MY Savior”
Wheather you think I have a personal relationship with (Add any of the above) our not, doesn’t matter to me, but I would suggest trying to get personal with “Our Savior”. You would be amazed at how that can change your life. I will keep you in my Prayers.
In Him and Only Him

 

[SPH1]

Believing in Christ is one thing. But when Protestants use “personal Lord & Savior”, IMO, that is an attempt to undercut the Church and Sacraments.

And most of those Protestants who use “personal Lord & Savior” the most do seem to neglect the Father and Holy Spirit. It isn’t all about (just) Christ.

 

[McKevin]

Jesus is my savior and he is the redeemer of the world! But “the world” did not accept him…(John Chapter 1)

God is my father. Mary is my mother. The Saints are my family. Jesus is my savior. The Holy Spirit is my comforter.

The believers were first called Christians in Antioch because they followed Christ and were a reflection of Christ.

Here’s Jesus’ prayer to God the Father for us:

John
Chapter 17: 1-26

(By the way this has been the Gospel readings in the Catholic Church for this week)

When Jesus had said this, he raised his eyes to heaven and said, "Father, the hour has come. Give glory to your son, so that your son may glorify you, just as you gave him authority over all people, so that he may give eternal life to all you gave him. Now this is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ. I glorified you on earth by accomplishing the work that you gave me to do. Now glorify me, Father, with you, with the glory that I had with you before the world began. "I revealed your name to those whom you gave me out of the world. They belonged to you, and you gave them to me, and they have kept your word. Now they know that everything you gave me is from you, because the words you gave to me I have given to them, and they accepted them and truly understood that I came from you, and they have believed that you sent me. I pray for them. I do not pray for the world but for the ones you have given me, because they are yours, and everything of mine is yours and everything of yours is mine, and I have been glorified in them. And now I will no longer be in the world, but they are in the world, while I am coming to you. Holy Father, keep them in your name that you have given me, so that they may be one just as we are. When I was with them I protected them in your name that you gave me, and I guarded them, and none of them was lost except the son of destruction, in order that the scripture might be fulfilled. But now I am coming to you. I speak this in the world so that they may share my joy completely. I gave them your word, and the world hated them, because they do not belong to the world any more than I belong to the world. I do not ask that you take them out of the world but that you keep them from the evil one. They do not belong to the world any more than I belong to the world. Consecrate them in the truth. Your word is truth. As you sent me into the world, so I sent them into the world. And I consecrate myself for them, so that they also may be consecrated in truth. “I pray not only for them, but also for those who will believe in me through their word, so that they may all be one, as you, Father, are in me and I in you, that they also may be in us, that the world may believe that you sent me. And I have given them the glory you gave me, so that they may be one, as we are one, I in them and you in me, that they may be brought to perfection as one, that the world may know that you sent me, and that you loved them even as you loved me. Father, they are your gift to me. I wish that where I am they also may be with me, that they may see my glory that you gave me, because you loved me before the foundation of the world. Righteous Father, the world also does not know you, but I know you, and they know that you sent me. I made known to them your name and I will make it known, that the love with which you loved me may be in them and I in them.”

…and here is St. Paul’s prayer for the Ephesians…notice he prayed that Christ may dwell in their hearts and that they would know the love of Christ that surpasses knowledge

Ephesians Chapter 3:14-21

For this reason I kneel before the Father, from whom every family in heaven and on earth is named, that he may grant you in accord with the riches of his glory to be strengthened with power through his Spirit in the inner self, and that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; that you, rooted and grounded in love, may have strength to comprehend with all the holy ones what is the breadth and length and height and depth, and to know the love of Christ that surpasses knowledge, so that you may be filled with all the fullness of God. Now to him who is able to accomplish far more than all we ask or imagine, by the power at work within us, to him be glory in the church and in Christ Jesus to all generations, forever and ever. Amen.

Peace of Christ!

Kevin

 

[promethius95945]

Wheather you think I have a personal relationship with (Add any of the above) our not, doesn’t matter to me, but I would suggest trying to get personal with “Our Savior”. You would be amazed at how that can change your life. I will keep you in my Prayers.
In Him and Only Him

This admonition is silly at best. My familiarity with scripture is MORE than sufficient. Even so, if Christ is the universal Savior then OF COURSE by extension He is MY Savior as well. That still doesn’t validate the heretical claim that Jesus is somehow a “personal Savior.”

On a second note, my personal relationship with God is VERY strong, so never you worry. Just because i’m not satisfied with the skin deep worship of the “personal Savior OSAS crowd” doesn’t mean that I don’t have a close relationship with God and my faith.

 

[apophasis]

That still doesn’t validate the heretical claim that Jesus is somehow a “personal Savior.”

Heretical? How so?

Just because i’m not satisfied with the skin deep worship

Skin deep? How so?

of the “personal Savior OSAS crowd”

So only the OSAS “crowd” consider Jesus their “personal” Savior?

 

[w1956]

I can only share my experience of my savior and the effect he has had on my life.

For me Christianity IS Jesus Christ, our very personal, up close, in our hearts God! And because our God is a triune God he is also the Holy Spirit and God the Father as well. Truly a glorious mystery. Jesus points us to God the Father and the Holy Spirit, but Jesus Christ has saved me! He literally died on the cross for me! And this is what makes Christianity very different from any other religion, God dwelling within in a most personal relationship.

I was a Catholic Christian for years and never understood what my “Jesus freak” friends were talking about. They talked about “personally” knowing Christ and I scoffed at such romantic “feelings”.

Then two years ago I received the gift of understanding that Christ dwells in my very heart. He dwells within me as my personal friend and savior. He not only died for the world, but me alone, and that is a very personal thing! He knows everythign about me, every hair on my head, every weakness and failure and yet he loves me completely and died for me. Again VERY personal. And yet he didn’t do it for me alone but for all! What a glorious gift! That is our good news!

Suddenly all the verses in the Bible about Christ living within me made sense, they were literal! I literally felt him dwelling within my heart. My heart burned within me. He is with me always, he is no longer walking beside me, nor do I need to seek him outside of myself. He is here always with me until the end of the world as he promised. He is the love of my life!

And that may possibly be what your Protestant friend was trying to discuss with you.

God bless and my the peace of our Lord Jesus Christ be always with you!

 

[NonDenom]

I can only share my experience of my savior and the effect he has had on my life.

For me Christianity IS Jesus Christ, our very personal, up close, in our hearts God! And because our God is a triune God he is also the Holy Spirit and God the Father as well. Truly a glorious mystery. Jesus points us to God the Father and the Holy Spirit, but Jesus Christ has saved me! He literally died on the cross for me! And this is what makes Christianity very different from any other religion, God dwelling within in a most personal relationship.

"AMEN"

 

[promethius95945]

I was a Catholic Christian for years and never understood what my “Jesus freak” friends were talking about. They talked about “personally” knowing Christ and I scoffed at such romantic “feelings”.

i’m going to make an assumption here, but from the way you’ve worded it, i think it’s safe to say:

I find it sad that you found it necessary to leave God’s church to discover what (in my opinion) all catholics should already know.

 

[apophasis]

i’m going to make an assumption here, but from the way you’ve worded it, i think it’s safe to say:

I find it sad that you found it necessary to leave God’s church to discover what (in my opinion) all catholics should already know.

But you consider the concept of a personal Savior “heretical.”

“That still doesn’t validate the heretical claim that Jesus is somehow a “personal Savior.””

Are you saying all Catholics should embrace something that in your opinion is “heretical?”

 

[w1956]

i’m going to make an assumption here, but from the way you’ve worded it, i think it’s safe to say:

I find it sad that you found it necessary to leave God’s church to discover what (in my opinion) all catholics should already know.

No need to be sad! I am still Catholic and even more devoted to my church since experiencing this even fuller union with God. The sacraments of the Catholic Church are an incredible blessing to us. I will never leave my church. Thank you for your concern though!

What is sad is that many Christians (of all denominations) do not know this. Many struggle under the false assumption that they have to be good enough for God to love them fully, and until they are good enough THEN they will be with God. It’s our job to spread the Good News that we are already good enough. God loves us with all our flaws and sins and died for each one of us!

 

[promethius95945]

But you consider the concept of a personal Savior “heretical.”

yes, because there is a distinct difference between having a personal relationship with God and believing the notion of a “personal” Savior.

Are you saying all Catholics should embrace something that in your opinion is “heretical?”

never. not in 1,974 years… and not ever in the future either…

 

[porthos11]

There is actually nothing anti-Catholic or unBiblical in accepting Jesus as a personal Lord and Savior. St. Paul refers to Christ (with regards to himself, but extendable to us), as “…the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself up for me” (Gal 2:20).

This is clearly pointing to Christ’s saving work applicable to an individual, and so it is indeed a good and Biblical thing for a Catholic to make an act of faith in Jesus as one’s personal Lord and Savior.

And when you receive him in the Holy Eucharist, you don’t get much more personal than that eh?

The mistake is hinging one’s eternal salvation on this one act, THAT’s the unbiblical part.

 

[biblebeliver]

John 14:6, “Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.”
John 6:40, “And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.”
Acts 26:18, “To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.”
Romans 10:13, “For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.”
1st Corinthians 3:11, “For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.”
Galatians 3:26, “For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.”

 

[whatevergirl]

That’s sad, you should have answered no. Jesus is not “a personal Lord and Savior” and this heretical, extra-scriptural teaching is promulgated in great error by unwitting protestants.

Having a personal relationship with your Triune God, great. But this whole personal Savior nonsense is just man-made mumbo jumbo.

Jesus is mankind’s Savior…but we all have a personal relationship with Him…I think that is what is meant by ‘personal Lord and Savior.’ He saves us each day–right down to our levels. Gets right into the trenches of our lives…no matter where we are, He meets us there. That is very personal no?

 

[whatevergirl]

That’s sad, you should have answered no. Jesus is not “a personal Lord and Savior” and this heretical, extra-scriptural teaching is promulgated in great error by unwitting protestants.

Having a personal relationship with your Triune God, great. But this whole personal Savior nonsense is just man-made mumbo jumbo.

But thinking of God as triune, is most important, so we agree there. lol

 

[Cari]

I’ve spent too much time reading this thread. All I can hear is Depeche Mode’s “Personal Jesus” in my head now.

For me, I have to be careful that hearing the phrase “personal lord and Savior” doesn’t inspire a kneejerk response in me. Yes, sometimes one hears this from street corner preachers who will press Chick Tracts in your hand if you let them, but not all people who use this phrase have the same “me and buddy Christ don’t need a church” mentality. For some (as previous posters have attested) it is a sign of a deep commitment to our Lord, and an expression of our love for Him.

But yes, I have sometimes felt that some Christians have forgotten about the other two members of the Trinity. But not all.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

If it not meant to be Christ centered then it is not Christianity.
Look at what Paul said. He most certainly thought Christianity is Christ centered.
Phil 1:21

For to me, to live is Christ and to die is gain.
NASU

Phil 3:10-11
10 **that I may know Him **(Jesus Christ)and the power of His resurrection and the fellowship of His sufferings, being conformed to His death;
NASU

Phil 4:13
13 I can do all things through Him who strengthens me.
NASU

Gal 2:20
20 "I have been crucified with Christ; and it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself up for me.
NASU

2 Cor 5:21
21 He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that **we might become the righteousness of God in Him.**NASU

Christianity is not about us, it is all about Christ.

Posts 18 & 19 - ​

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

I can only share my experience of my savior and the effect he has had on my life.

For me Christianity IS Jesus Christ, our very personal, up close, in our hearts God! And because our God is a triune God he is also the Holy Spirit and God the Father as well. Truly a glorious mystery. Jesus points us to God the Father and the Holy Spirit, but Jesus Christ has saved me! He literally died on the cross for me! And this is what makes Christianity very different from any other religion, God dwelling within in a most personal relationship.

I was a Catholic Christian for years and never understood what my “Jesus freak” friends were talking about. They talked about “personally” knowing Christ and I scoffed at such romantic “feelings”.

Then two years ago I received the gift of understanding that Christ dwells in my very heart.

I can vouch for this too - it is a very different thing from thinking of Him as some character from 2000 years ago; which I what used before that to take for granted that He was. No Church ever taught me that: I had to mix with Evangelicals to find that out - liturgical Christianity is apt to ignore it, which is too sad for words ​

But thanks for sharing your testimony

He dwells within me as my personal friend and savior. He not only died for the world, but me alone, and that is a very personal thing! He knows everythign about me, every hair on my head, every weakness and failure and yet he loves me completely and died for me. Again VERY personal. And yet he didn’t do it for me alone but for all! What a glorious gift! That is our good news!

Suddenly all the verses in the Bible about Christ living within me made sense, they were literal! I literally felt him dwelling within my heart. My heart burned within me. He is with me always, he is no longer walking beside me, nor do I need to seek him outside of myself. He is here always with me until the end of the world as he promised. He is the love of my life!

And that may possibly be what your Protestant friend was trying to discuss with you.

God bless and my the peace of our Lord Jesus Christ be always with you!

“Amen” to all that.