Christians are committing wrong by eating halal meat

[Beryllos]

The God of Islam, on the other hand, is very different. Theirs is not a God of love, but of will. Terrible, callous, and often cruel, the God of Islam does not demand love or understanding, only obedience and submission. He creates people for the sole purpose of damning them to Hell, and he demands of his followers murder, rape, torture, mutilation, theft, denigration, and every other dark excess of human nature. He is not to be questioned, and he is not to be understood. He neither requires, nor requests our love for him or each other, and in fact shows no love for his creations. In many ways, the God of Islam is the very antithesis of the Judeo-Christian understanding of God.

Could you cite a source for that? I imagine they say stuff like that on talk shows, but that is not reliable. I read the news, but that only tells you the worst of human nature. I have not taken much time to study Islam, so I cannot say much more. There must be scholars, theologians, and other truth-seekers who have actually examined the writings, talked to Muslim believers, and analyzed this question. What do they say?

 

[meltzerboy]

Muslims may believe in one God, but their understanding of the One God is clearly nothing like the God that Jews and Christians believe in.

To begin with, let’s look at how Jews and Christians view God. The word, Israel,.literally means, “he that struggles with God and wins.” In that spirit, the people of Israel have constantly sought to understand God by struggling against God when he appears to be unjust and holding Him accountable when He appears to have violated His covenant. For example, in the Old Testament, Abraham can be seen “bargaining” with God for the lives of the people in Sodom and Gamorah. This is always done with great respect and out of love, having faith that God loves them enough to listen to their grievances, and ultimately it helps them to understand the God they love. Similarly, Christians view suffering as a way to understand God and demonstrate our love for Him, knowing He did the same for us.

The God of Islam, on the other hand, is very different. Theirs is not a God of love, but of will. Terrible, callous, and often cruel, the God of Islam does not demand love or understanding, only obedience and submission. He creates people for the sole purpose of damning them to Hell, and he demands of his followers murder, rape, torture, mutilation, theft, denigration, and every other dark excess of human nature. He is not to be questioned, and he is not to be understood. He neither requires, nor requests our love for him or each other, and in fact shows no love for his creations. In many ways, the God of Islam is the very antithesis of the Judeo-Christian understanding of God.

The description of Islam you provide in the last paragraph does not ring true according to the Church or Jewish belief. It is, so to speak, over the top. Islam is an Abrahamic monotheistic religion. Surely some distort its meaning for their own purposes, as is the case in Catholicism, Judaism, and nearly all other religions. But the essence of Islam is not what you claim.

 

[EasterJoy]

OP, there is no prohibition on eating halal or kosher foods, which have both been available for purchase in Christendom for many centuries. If we are wrong about this, find us a single bishop in the UK or anywhere else to the ends of the Earth who has taught what you are teaching.

Be as wary of falsely adding your own precepts, pretending to be able to direct the pious on your own, as if your interpretations belong to the deposit of the faith. Be as wary of this as you are wary of subtracting from the faith on your own authority!

*Hypocrites, well did Isaiah prophesy about you when he said: ‘This people honors me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me; in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines human precepts.’" * Matt. 15:7-9

If you are concerned about something of this nature, of course you may look for an answer, but do not just make up an answer to your question or accept any hearsay about it that you run across. There is, very unfortunately, no foolishness in doctrine that has not been attributed to some priest at some time or another (although not always fairly). That is no way to separate the wheat from the chaff.

Ask what the bishops teach openly. Even if the bishops are too permissive on some matter (I speak of something not of dogma, but of discipline), you will do better to suggest rather than to demand that piety is better served by voluntarily taking on a stricter meaning, since you have not been given the office of shepherd yourself. Even the bishops, after all, have to take care not to add their own human precepts to their teachings, implying that their personal opinions are binding on the faithful in ways that their authority does not allow.

 

[JorduSpeaks]

The description of Islam you provide in the last paragraph does not ring true according to the Church or Jewish belief. It is, so to speak, over the top. Islam is an Abrahamic monotheistic religion. Surely some distort its meaning for their own purposes, as is the case in Catholicism, Judaism, and nearly all other religions. But the essence of Islam is not what you claim.

The description of Islam I provide rings true according to the Quran and the hadith, and according to the vast majority of Muslim clerics and faithful, it is the “Westernized” Muslims who distort its meaning by softening its message to make it more palatable to people like yourself and by not insisting on Shariah law. One only needs to look to their religion’s founder to see the truth of this. Mohammed was a bloodthirsty warlord and a callous pedophile, and Muslims believe they are called to live by his example.

I understand your desire to be respectful of other religions, but I assure you that it is not at all respectful to twist another’s faith into what you wish it was. Accept Islam for what it is, and pray for them.

 

[Wildgraywolf]

Halal?

Kosher?

Just don’t call me late for dinner

Haha! I was going to say that…

 

[chrisfaith100]

I only give my opinion. All I want is to have the choice of knowing the food I eat based upon my faith. Please allow me that.

Rau, says:
“You are purchasing meat to meet your bodily needs, and the supermarket supplies it to you with that purpose in mind too.”

In regards to:
“You are purchasing meat to meet your bodily needs.”

Matthew 4 chapter 4
Jesus said, “It is written: 'Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.”

I believe this to mean, if you cannot follow what is right in the sight of God, you will not live as God had wished for. If your soul turns completely from God, the body becomes worthless.

I would also say to those who cast aside my words without consideration - tell me, who is the more righteous, the man who lives by the word of God but does not have all the food he desires, or a man who has all the food he desires, but does not live by the word of God?

Rau, you also say:
“The supermarket supplies it to you with that purpose in mind too.”

The supermarkets primary purpose is to make money. Plain and simple. Human needs are secondary to its business objectives. Shops and supermarkets are not a charity. The amount of food wasted every year by all of them combined astounds the mind.
Supermarkets will do whatever they will do to make a profit. That is why supermarkets trade seven days a week. Sunday used to be a day of rest, but the supermarkets and shops have taken that away. But for some, it seems that it does not matter, just as eating halal meat does not matter, because as you say, you purchase to meet your bodily needs first, and concern yourself with what is right in the sight of God second.

Rau, you also add:
“Nothing in your faith requires you to know these things or to decline a purchase in light of them.”

My answer is:
The more a person wants to know about life and his faith, tell me, does it help him, or hinder him…? For the more a man knows, the greater his strength of mind, and the better decisions he will make in life. The man who does not wish to learn as much as he can, will struggle to make a wise judgement.

You also add:
“If this truly does matter to you, shop elsewhere.”

Unfortunately, all of the major supermarkets and stores have decided that they do not want to label all halal meat. So whichever shop I go to, it would mean the food I could be eating is halal…meaning I was not given the choice of knowing and making a decision based upon my faith.

Berryllos said:
Muslims believe in one God, the God of Abraham, the same God you and I worship.

And Pnewton said:
Even if it were halal meat is not offered to idols. The Catholic Church does clearly state the Muslims worship the same God we do.
From section 841 of the Catechism:

Underacloud said:
Firstly, I don’t agree with your analysis. And I have no idea of your credentials (shall we say). Wheras I offer an article written by a respected Catholic pirest discussing all these issues.

And to EasterJoy who said:

“Be as wary of falsely adding your own precepts, pretending to be able to direct the pious on your own, as if your interpretations belong to the deposit of the faith. Be as wary of this as you are wary of subtracting from the faith on your own authority!”

Peace to everyone, but I say this to all of you…

If you truly believe it is OK to eat halal meat, which is blessed according to the Islamic faith and all believe in the same God, have you asked yourself this:

“Why at mass during scripture reading, particularly when words are spoken referring to God, who is the ‘God of Abraham, Isaac and Israel,’ why is scripture quoted from both the from the old testament (that is Judaism and Christianity) and the new testament (Christianity), but never are any words quoted from any Islam text that specifically relates to the God of Abraham?”

So for those who disaggree with me, what you are saying therefore, is that it is OK to eat meat blessed by Islamic faith who you see as the same God, but it is not OK to read any Islamic text in a Christian church, or any Islamic text specifically relating to the very God whose food which has been blessed in His name and you have eaten and who you believe in… The only logical conclusion from this is inconsistency.

To all those who speak of Matthew 15, verses 10 to 20:

Please let me put forward two points regarding cleanliness in this part of scripture:

Firstly, Jesus is referring to the washing of hands, that is how the disagreement started between the teachers of the law and Pharisees who disliked Jesus… They wondered why his disciples didn’t wash their hands. Matthew 15 verse 2:
“Why do Your disciples break the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat bread.”

Jesus said that washing your hands before eating is not what a man should be worried about (because the others saw it as ritually unclean for a man not to wash his hands before eating, so it was frowned upon by them). Dirt on a mans hands says nothing about his worth, or what is in his heart. Washing your hands will not make you any more righteous if you had not done so…

Also, at that time, people refrained from eating certain types of food because they felt it was not right. Acts 10, verses 14 and 15:
"14 But Peter said, “By no means, Lord, for I have never eaten anything unholy and unclean.”
15 Again a voice came to him a second time, “What God has cleansed, no longer consider unholy.”

Nowhere in Matthew chapter 15 (the passage which some mentioned) does Jesus mention that food being offered to idols is OK to eat.
In fact, to do so would be against the will of God, which is the very point he says in verse 19 of Matthew 15 of this passasage you refer to:
“from his heart come the evil ideas which lead him to…and other immoral things.”

Continued…

 

[chrisfaith100]

continued…
To Easterjoy and those who disagree:

Have not any of you remembered the greatest commandment of them all, Matthew 22, verses 36 to 40.
“Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”
Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment."

Deuteronomy 6
13 Fear the Lord your God, serve him only and take your oaths in his name. 14 Do not follow other gods, the gods of the peoples around you; 15 for the Lord your God, who is among you, is a jealous God and his anger will burn against you, and he will destroy you from the face of the land. 16 Do not put the Lord your God to the test…

Finally, do not forget what happened to Uzzah and the Ark of the Covenant… What man can learn from this is never take God for granted and assume to think you will do no wrong because you see it as right what you do in your own eyes and in the eyes of others.

Again, all I say is that I would like the choice of knowing the food I eat based upon my faith. Please allow me that.

 

[heidi_storage]

Again, all I say is that I would like the choice of knowing the food I eat based upon my faith. Please allow me that.

This sentence is quite different from the title and tenor of your first post. I disagree that Christians commit sin by eating halal meat, but if you are concerned about the matter, it is on you to seek out meat sources that don’t offend your conscience. Government regulations are meant to protect people from foodborne illnesses and from eating horse that has been labeled as cow (not that they’re always successful in either endeavor). You have every right to take whatever measures you believe are necessary to avoid sin, but I don’t think you are right in placing a burden upon us to believe as you do in this matter.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I found it interesting some time ago to learn that in “state of the art” poultry processing plants, the only difference between Halal, Kosher and the regular product is who blesses it, if anyone, and who puts a special sticker on the package.

Otherwise, there is no difference at all, and some poultry plants have kosher lines or halal lines, or both, plus ordinary product lines, but the physical process for all lines is the same.

I can’t say about beef processing, and of course there’s no such thing as kosher or halal pork.

 

[Ridgerunner]

This sentence is quite different from the title and tenor of your first post. I disagree that Christians commit sin by eating halal meat, but if you are concerned about the matter, it is on you to seek out meat sources that don’t offend your conscience. Government regulations are meant to protect people from foodborne illnesses and from eating horse that has been labeled as cow (not that they’re always successful in either endeavor). You have every right to take whatever measures you believe are necessary to avoid sin, but I don’t think you are right in placing a burden upon us to believe as you do in this matter.

To me, this is sort of like having your ancesors baptized Mormon by Mormons. It doesn’t mean they’re really Mormons, and they can do it (usually do) without you knowing it. That’s why they’re so big into family trees and such. They baptize every name they find.

 

[heidi_storage]

To me, this is sort of like having your ancesors baptized Mormon by Mormons. It doesn’t mean they’re really Mormons, and they can do it (usually do) without you knowing it. That’s why they’re so big into family trees and such. They baptize every name they find.

That’s always seemed pretty goofy to me. I do love their genealogy resources, though!

 

[EasterJoy]

continued…
To Easterjoy and those who disagree:

Have not any of you remembered the greatest commandment of them all, Matthew 22, verses 36 to 40.
“Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”
Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment."

Deuteronomy 6
13 Fear the Lord your God, serve him only and take your oaths in his name. 14 Do not follow other gods, the gods of the peoples around you; 15 for the Lord your God, who is among you, is a jealous God and his anger will burn against you, and he will destroy you from the face of the land. 16 Do not put the Lord your God to the test…

Finally, do not forget what happened to Uzzah and the Ark of the Covenant… What man can learn from this is never take God for granted and assume to think you will do no wrong because you see it as right what you do in your own eyes and in the eyes of others.

Again, all I say is that I would like the choice of knowing the food I eat based upon my faith. Please allow me that.

We didn’t say you couldn’t have your own standards. We’re asking that you be extremely careful not to imply on a Catholic board that what you say is the teaching of the Church.

The 1st Council at Jerusalem said this: ‘It is the decision of the holy Spirit and of us not to place on you any burden beyond these necessities, namely, to abstain from meat sacrificed to idols, from blood, from meats of strangled animals, and from unlawful marriage. If you keep free of these, you will be doing what is right. Farewell.’ Acts 15: 28-29 The bishops have never made any pronouncement prohibiting halal meat, either, in spite of having opportunities spread over many centuries, including the centuries of the Crusades, when the Christian regard of the Muslim faith was hardly at a high point.

Halal meat is not a sacrificial offering, and if it were, it is the stated intention of Muslims to worship the God of Abraham, who is not a false god. They don’t have their facts straight, but it is their intention to worship and serve the one true God alone. Therefore, eating halal meat does not fall under the category of eating “meat sacrificed to idols.”

You may choose to avoid it for any reason of your own. We are not saying that your piety is false. You can avoid eating all meat altogether for religious reasons, if you like. We are asking that you please do not teach that halal meat is “meat sacrificed to idols,” though, or that there is any precept requiring Christians to avoid eating it, because that is not correct. Thank you!

 

[TEPO]

What would happen if halal meat was mixed with pork? Would that be sinful or uncharitable to think, do or say? Would God be offended? Is it a punishable offense in Islam?

…if so, you’d think the Muslims would be more upset about selling this meat to the public -in case someone accidentally did something like that. Maybe someone would do it intentionally.

 

[TEPO]

Unfortunately UK shops and supermarkets have decided to put aside Christian concerns and sell halal meat as non halal meat. The definition of halal meat is meat which
has been blessed by a muslim and then slaughtered according to the Islamic faith,
thus making it a food offering of the Islamic faith.

Whilst British supermarkets and the government have shown consideration to other faiths
and clearly labelled Halal meat, so those of Islamic faith know the food that they
are eating, unfortunately, the supermarkets and government have shown no consideration
to Christians and have decided that halal food can be both labelled and unlabelled in the
meat section (or any section of a shop), thus Christians who do not wish to buy halal
meat, would in a lot of circumstances, actually be buying and eating it.

If you are a Christian, as halal food has been blessed according to a faith
which a Christian does not believe in, it makes the food a blessing to an idol.
The bible clearly states it is a sin to eat food offered to idols.

Acts 15. 28-29. “For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay upon
you no greater burden than these essentials: that you abstain from things sacrificed to idols.”

Thus, what this actually means, is the supermarkets and the government are turning Christians away from their faith. For every time a person sins, they themselves further away from God.

This is why I believe shops and supermarkets should clearly label all halal meat and should not let Christians eat halal food without giving them the opportunity to know what they are eating.

I feel it is a great shame those who people look up to in the Christian and Catholic community have not voiced their concern, or at least spoken a little louder, if they have actually done so.

People have raised their voice about animal welfare and rightly so, but I have not heard
the Christian argument that should have been made, and that of committing sin.
For either they have loosened their faith or are too afraid to speak.

Regards,
Christopher

If you sprinkle bacon bits into the meat, maybe it will ‘undo’ the ‘blessing’… I mean if you’re that worried about it.

 

[PhiloMed]

This may be your personal opinion or personal prefernce, but it is certainly not the opinion of the Church.

And I sure am glad because the halal food from some middle eastern street carts is de-lish! For those who have never tried it, I highly recommend it!

 

[TEPO]

This may be your personal opinion or personal prefernce, but it is certainly not the opinion of the Church.

And I sure am glad because the halal food from some middle eastern street carts is de-lish! For those who have never tried it, I highly recommend it!

It couldn’t be as good as bulgogi. That’s Koran style marinated beef -it’s so good! Especially with Asian style cole slaw, cold corn and white rice… Oh my goodness, it’s so good!

 

[heidi_storage]

It couldn’t be as good as bulgogi. That’s Koran style marinated beef -it’s so good! Especially with Asian style cole slaw, cold corn and white rice… Oh my goodness, it’s so good!

That’s the beauty of food carts…you can enjoy both!

 

[TEPO]

…I’m so hungry right now, can you tell?

 

[underacloud]

Underacloud said:
Firstly, I don’t agree with your analysis. And I have no idea of your credentials (shall we say). Wheras I offer an article written by a respected Catholic pirest discussing all these issues.

And to EasterJoy who said:

“Be as wary of falsely adding your own precepts, pretending to be able to direct the pious on your own, as if your interpretations belong to the deposit of the faith. Be as wary of this as you are wary of subtracting from the faith on your own authority!”

Peace to everyone, but I say this to all of you…

If you truly believe it is OK to eat halal meat, which is blessed according to the Islamic faith and all believe in the same God, have you asked yourself this:

“Why at mass during scripture reading, particularly when words are spoken referring to God, who is the ‘God of Abraham, Isaac and Israel,’ why is scripture quoted from both the from the old testament (that is Judaism and Christianity) and the new testament (Christianity), but never are any words quoted from any Islam text that specifically relates to the God of Abraham?”

So for those who disaggree with me, what you are saying therefore, is that it is OK to eat meat blessed by Islamic faith who you see as the same God, but it is not OK to read any Islamic text in a Christian church, or any Islamic text specifically relating to the very God whose food which has been blessed in His name and you have eaten and who you believe in… The only logical conclusion from this is inconsistency.

For similar reasons we don’t allow protestant ministers to preach in our churchs. They teach different things about this same God that we worship.

Or do you think protestants worship a different God?

Perhaps you think it’s wrong to eat a meal if a protestand minister has said grace?

If you hold the view that proestants worship a different God, you’d be wrong, as you are regarding Islam. The relevant Church teaching that they worship the one true God has been provided for you, so you should cede to it.

 

[TEPO]

For similar reasons we don’t allow protestant ministers to preach in our churchs. They teach different things about this same God that we worship.

Or do you think protestants worship a different God?

Perhaps you think it’s wrong to eat a meal if a protestand minister has said grace?

If you hold the view that proestants worship a different God, you’d be wrong, as you are regarding Islam. The relevant Church teaching that they worship the one true God has been provided for you, so you should cede to it.

I don’t think the OP has an issue with Muslims or Protestants at all. Sounds like it’s more about Islam to me -and the issues involved with a false religion.

…the Catechism clearly refrains from using the term “Islam”. Therefore, there is a separation between that false religion and those people who call themselves the Muslims.