Christians & Psychics/New Age

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GeorgiaPeach

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I am talking specifically about a close family member who:
  • Grew up baptist and is currently a practicing member of the Anglican Church
  • Is Studying for a degree in theology (through the Anglican church)
  • Is knowledgeble about the Bible
On the other hand this person:
  • visits reputable psychics several times a year
  • talks about reincarnation and past lives
  • meditates on family members
  • reads ruin cards (safe, unlike tarrot cards eyeroll)
  • is into astrology
  • refers to dreams as* visions*
  • is into chakras and auras
  • believes they have psychic gifts
I’m trying to understand how one can reconcile being Christian and having such New Age beliefs. The most concerning to me is the idea that this person believes their psychic abilities as a gift from God. After all, all of the psychics this person visits claim to be Christian.

I’ve been dealing with this person for over 25 years now. For the most part I just listen to what they have the say and forget about it. I figure to each his own. Now that my kids are getting older it is bothering me more. I don’t want to turn them against this person and I am also afraid they will repeat things I say because they still lack tact. I in no way want to poison our relationship.
 
According to the book “Catholicism for Dummies” by Father John Trigilio, PhD… and Father Ken Brighenti, PhD. (can be found on page 184)…

The practices of astrology (or horoscope reading), numerology, dianetics (Church of Scientology), New Age spirituality, etc… are all in violation of the First Commandment:

“I am the Lord thy God, thou shalt not have any strange gods before Me”.

New Age spirituality, is specifically warned against… as a blend of ancient paganism, the occult, superstition, gnosticism… and so on.

The Cathechism of the Catholic Church is the best place to look for more on the subject. You can find the answers in sections 2110-2117.

2110 The first commandment forbids honoring gods other than the one Lord who has revealed himself to his people. It proscribes superstition and irreligion. Superstition in some sense represents a perverse excess of religion; irreligion is the vice contrary by defect to the virtue of religion.

2111 Superstition is the deviation of religious feeling and of the practices this feeling imposes. It can even affect the worship we offer the true God, e.g., when one attributes an importance in some way magical to certain practices otherwise lawful or necessary. To attribute the efficacy of prayers or of sacramental signs to their mere external performance, apart from the interior dispositions that they demand, is to fall into superstition.

2112 The first commandment condemns polytheism. It requires man neither to believe in, nor to venerate, other divinities than the one true God. Scripture constantly recalls this rejection of “idols, [of] silver and gold, the work of men’s hands. They have mouths, but do not speak; eyes, but do not see.” These empty idols make their worshippers empty: “Those who make them are like them; so are all who trust in them.” 42 God, however, is the “living God” 43 who gives life and intervenes in history.

2113 Idolatry not only refers to false pagan worship. It remains a constant temptation to faith. Idolatry consists in divinizing what is not God. Man commits idolatry whenever he honors and reveres a creature in place of God, whether this be gods or demons (for example, satanism), power, pleasure, race, ancestors, the state, money, etc. Jesus says, “You cannot serve God and mammon.” 44 Many martyrs died for not adoring “the Beast” 45 refusing even to simulate such worship. Idolatry rejects the unique Lordship of God; it is therefore incompatible with communion with God.

2114 Human life finds its unity in the adoration of the one God. The commandment to worship the Lord alone integrates man and saves him from an endless disintegration. Idolatry is a perversion of man’s innate religious sense. An idolater is someone who “transfers his indestructible notion of God to anything other than God.”

2115 God can reveal the future to his prophets or to other saints. Still, a sound Christian attitude consists in putting oneself confidently into the hands of Providence for whatever concerns the future, and giving up all unhealthy curiosity about it. Improvidence, however, can constitute a lack of responsibility.

2116 All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to “unveil” the future. 48 Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone.

2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others – even if this were for the sake of restoring their health – are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another’s credulity.

Hope this helps. God bless.
 
I I’m trying to understand how one can reconcile being Christian and having such New Age beliefs. The most concerning to me is the idea that this person believes their psychic abilities as a gift from God. After all, all of the psychics this person visits claim to be Christian.
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there is no way to reconcile them because the actions and beliefs they are based on are mutually exclusive. The are in addition, specifically forbidden for Christians and are offenses against the 1st and 2nd commandments.

I can claim to be Christian or psychic or athletic, that doesn’t make it true. “Reputable” when applied to a psychic can only mean they are not breaking any local laws. A person can have psychic abilities which indeed may be a gift from God, but if she uses them in a way that implies she has access to or can control the supernatural, she is acting in violation of all Christian religion and breaking the commandments. If she charges money that is proof positive she is not sincere, not religious, and casts grave doubts on her legal standing as well.
 
Of course they cannot be reconciled.

However, be aware that the Anglican Church has nearly ceased to be Christian. Some of their prominent “theologians” and Bishops deny the divinity of Christ, the resurrection, etc, and of course embrace homosexuality, abortion, divorce and remarriage, and any number of other heresies and perversions.

Not every member of the Anglican Church embraces these things, but given the fact that many prominent writers in that tradition today spout such nonsense it is not unreasonable to believe that even a person actually *studying *theology could come up with this nonsense.

Remember, this is the denomination that brings you a female “priest” who has now decided she is also a Muslim. Yes, she actually thinks she is both a Christian and a Muslim.

So, why wouldn’t your friend think she could be a Christian and practice New Age philosophy? UGH!
 
  • visits reputable psychics several times a year
  • talks about reincarnation and past lives
  • meditates on family members
  • reads ruin cards (safe, unlike tarrot cards eyeroll)
  • is into astrology
  • refers to dreams as* visions*
  • is into chakras and auras
  • believes they have psychic gifts
First, do you mean RUNE cards?

Oh, hey, no, no danger there at all. Except, of course, that they’re magic from the Norse religion and fairly spooky, at that.

Here’s where they came from:
I know that I hung on a windy tree
nine long nights,
wounded with a spear, dedicated to Odin,
myself to myself,
on that tree of which no man knows
from where its roots run.
No bread did they give me nor a drink from a horn,
downwards I peered;
I took up the runes, screaming I took them,
then I fell back from there.
Odin, chief of the Norse gods, made himself a sacrifice *to *himself, in order to gain the secret of the runes.

As for church teaching on psychic powers, I would point out that many of what are called “Gifts of the Spirit” work out, in practice, to be not unlike psychic powers–healing, for instance, is biokinesis. Therefore if one has them, it’s not wrong to use them for the glory of God. But it’s silly, and probably wrong, to try to get them when one hasn’t got them.

The only other thing I know is it’s the sin of simony to charge for using them.
 
I am talking specifically about a close family member who:
  • Grew up baptist and is currently a practicing member of the Anglican Church
  • Is Studying for a degree in theology (through the Anglican church)
  • Is knowledgeble about the Bible
On the other hand this person:
  • visits reputable psychics several times a year
  • talks about reincarnation and past lives
  • meditates on family members
  • reads ruin cards (safe, unlike tarrot cards eyeroll)
  • is into astrology
  • refers to dreams as* visions*
  • is into chakras and auras
  • believes they have psychic gifts
I’m trying to understand how one can reconcile being Christian and having such New Age beliefs. The most concerning to me is the idea that this person believes their psychic abilities as a gift from God. After all, all of the psychics this person visits claim to be Christian.

I’ve been dealing with this person for over 25 years now. For the most part I just listen to what they have the say and forget about it. I figure to each his own. Now that my kids are getting older it is bothering me more. I don’t want to turn them against this person and I am also afraid they will repeat things I say because they still lack tact. I in no way want to poison our relationship.
I recommend a book called Catholics and The New Age by Father Mitch Pacwa who explains all the dangers and concerns.
 
First, do you mean RUNE cards?

Oh, hey, no, no danger there at all. Except, of course, that they’re magic from the Norse religion and fairly spooky, at that.

Here’s where they came from:

Odin, chief of the Norse gods, made himself a sacrifice *to *himself, in order to gain the secret of the runes.

As for church teaching on psychic powers, I would point out that many of what are called “Gifts of the Spirit” work out, in practice, to be not unlike psychic powers–healing, for instance, is biokinesis. Therefore if one has them, it’s not wrong to use them for the glory of God. But it’s silly, and probably wrong, to try to get them when one hasn’t got them.

The only other thing I know is it’s the sin of simony to charge for using them.
Wow, Hastrman, I have looked at 3 threads in 15 minutes, & you have proven to be a veritable Pagan encyclopedia in all 3! At least, I think all of these things you have been talking about are Pagan, I’m not even sure… Did you mention you used to be Pagan on another thread? If so, I’m glad you came over to our side & can help us out with all of this stuff. You have been a treasure trove of trivia that was indeed impressive & helpful today!

This is so far over my head (thankfully I just don’t get it), but are you saying that the Rune cards are truly spiritually dangerous because they stem from another religion & magic? Thanks.
 
GeorgiaPeach, your friend seems to be so heavily into this stuff that is against the Christian faith, that you might just want to be open with her & let her know you are concerned. Consider giving her the book that thistle mentioned. You are afraid one of your children might repeat something you say, so you might just want to talk to her. She might disagree, but I would hope she doesn’t take offense if you are kind. She should see that you are acting out of concern.
 
Wow, Hastrman, I have looked at 3 threads in 15 minutes, & you have proven to be a veritable Pagan encyclopedia in all 3! At least, I think all of these things you have been talking about are Pagan, I’m not even sure… Did you mention you used to be Pagan on another thread? If so, I’m glad you came over to our side & can help us out with all of this stuff. You have been a treasure trove of trivia that was indeed impressive & helpful today!

This is so far over my head (thankfully I just don’t get it), but are you saying that the Rune cards are truly spiritually dangerous because they stem from another religion & magic? Thanks.
Shucks, thanks, and yeah, they’re pagan. And I’m fairly sure runes usually aren’t dangerous, but divination can be, that’s why Catholics aren’t allowed to do it.

I’ve never been a pagan; I’m just interested in other cultures. My mother has a BS in anthropology, and a lot of anthropological thinking has rubbed off on me.

I would say, actually, nobody nowadays has ever been a pagan, unless you count East Asian, African, or Native American religions. European paganism’s dead; the modern “pagans” don’t understand the mindset, at all. They think, for instance, that the gods care about them.

A good place to begin, I think, in trying to understand real paganism, is G.K. Chesterton’s book “The Everlasting Man”. Another would be Japanese anime–they, after all, have never been Christian, and have most of the same religious ideas as European pagans.
 
Sorry, Rune cards…like the game Rune Scape.

Thanksfor the thoughful replies! I understand that New Age stuff doesn’t jive with Christian teachings. I’ve been racking my brains trying to figure out how one justifies it. It does seem like a lot of the stuff she is learning in her Anglican classes are New Age ideas - a lot of mother God stuff. Honestly, most of it is way over my head. She was into all this stuff before her conversion. Maybe that was the draw for her.

I am currently reading the book recommended - Catholics and the New Age by Pacwa. I’ve been stuck in the Jungian chapter. I’m going at it slowly because most of the ideas are foreign to me and I don’t want to miss anything.

Considering it is a close relative it makes this a sticky situation. She is also paranoid that people think she is crazy so that makes her defensive. First off, I need to finish the book and pray. I really want to understand where she is coming from before I talk to her. I don’t want to come across as arrogant or condescending.
 
Sorry, Rune cards…like the game Rune Scape.

Thanksfor the thoughful replies! I understand that New Age stuff doesn’t jive with Christian teachings. I’ve been racking my brains trying to figure out how one justifies it. It does seem like a lot of the stuff she is learning in her Anglican classes are New Age ideas - a lot of mother God stuff. Honestly, most of it is way over my head. She was into all this stuff before her conversion. Maybe that was the draw for her.

I am currently reading the book recommended - Catholics and the New Age by Pacwa. I’ve been stuck in the Jungian chapter. I’m going at it slowly because most of the ideas are foreign to me and I don’t want to miss anything.

Considering it is a close relative it makes this a sticky situation. She is also paranoid that people think she is crazy so that makes her defensive. First off, I need to finish the book and pray. I really want to understand where she is coming from before I talk to her. I don’t want to come across as arrogant or condescending.
The prayer 1st is a great idea. She is lucky to have such a caring relative. Good luck, I will say a prayer for you & her!
 
Shucks, thanks, and yeah, they’re pagan. And I’m fairly sure runes usually aren’t dangerous, but divination can be, that’s why Catholics aren’t allowed to do it.

I’ve never been a pagan; I’m just interested in other cultures. My mother has a BS in anthropology, and a lot of anthropological thinking has rubbed off on me.

I would say, actually, nobody nowadays has ever been a pagan, unless you count East Asian, African, or Native American religions. European paganism’s dead; the modern “pagans” don’t understand the mindset, at all. They think, for instance, that the gods care about them.

A good place to begin, I think, in trying to understand real paganism, is G.K. Chesterton’s book “The Everlasting Man”. Another would be Japanese anime–they, after all, have never been Christian, and have most of the same religious ideas as European pagans.
Well, I was looking at Pagan Fury’s thread, the cainism thread & then this one, & I was truly impressed! Lately I have trouble remembering the name of movies I saw yesterday, so I enjoyed your responses. That Vampire game thing was too much! Sounds like you have a great Mom, too. I’m just sorry I was thinking you were a former pagan, that must have been someone else on Pagan’s thread. This has been enough paganism in one day for this “soccer mom”…:o
 
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