Christmas Mass

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decn2b

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Went to the 530 Mass yesterday. Got to the church 1 hour beforehand (already people there) it was great I prayed the rosary. Kids were getting restless after an hour and half…

The one thing that bothered me with Mass was it was packed. relatively small parish 450 families but I didn’t recognise any regulars. (I was told later that the regulars mostly attend 730 mass) My family 4 kids wife and I are mass frequenters but it was more than Obvious (and very very very sad) that the cultural once a year Catholics had showed up for this mass. Big time chatter before mass and I ended up being the leader for the congregation as to when to kneel when to stand and I swear I was the only person singing…so I sang REALLY REALLY loud. People look so foolish when they show up for Mass and have ABSOLUTELY no idea what to do. Funny some people (the johnny come latelys) we visibily upset that they had to sit in the front few pews. They acted very very uncomfortable. Of course they had me sittng in the second pew…blaring out the hymns. 😛
 
Its nice to see a lot of the faithful and the general public (non-Catholics) who ordinarily don’t make it out, come to mass on Christmas.
People look so foolish when they show up for Mass and have ABSOLUTELY no idea what to do.
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Good point, this is a problem, and the Church ought to address it. Maybe the ushers ought to pass out instruction sheets to the people on high attendance days such as Christmas to try and alleviate it.
 
People look so foolish when they make posts like this.

One thing I can say is that your actions and thoughts deprived you of a lot of grace. Your continual preoccupation with the actions of the ‘johnny come lately’s’ is blocking the wonder of the feast day from you.

Irrespective of frequency, dress, manners, familiarity with the rubrics, desire to sing etc all have a right to be there.

Yes, I agree it is sad to see thay don’t go more frequently to Holy Mass but it is not your place to judge them especially at this time.

This type of self rightoeus hyprocisy really makes me sad. Shame on you.
 
Fergal point taken BUT

In my Latin parish there are frequently complaints from the Easter and Christmas Catholics that they

Don’t understand the Readings

Don’t know the hymns

The services are too long and are boring .

And we have booklets prepared for them with everything in them - responses , hymns the lot - they don’t need a hymn book or Missal - they are presented with this booklet as they enter.

When the Liturgy Group discussed this we decided against dumbing down the Liturgy for them .

The real problem is how to bring them back ?

Last night our Deacon - a Seminarian in Rome sang the Gospel he’s wonderful - has chanted it in Rome in St Peter’s Square for a Papal Mass ] and going out I heard complaints about that - again Christmas and Easter Catholics 😦

These C & E Catholics are the ones who turn up having drink taken , read newspapers during Mass Surprising what the Choir can see 🙂 ] sit and chat , eat , etc etc - then they expect you to accede to their whims.
 
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Fergal:
People look so foolish when they make posts like this.

One thing I can say is that your actions and thoughts deprived you of a lot of grace. Your continual preoccupation with the actions of the ‘johnny come lately’s’ is blocking the wonder of the feast day from you.

Irrespective of frequency, dress, manners, familiarity with the rubrics, desire to sing etc all have a right to be there.

Yes, I agree it is sad to see thay don’t go more frequently to Holy Mass but it is not your place to judge them especially at this time.

This type of self rightoeus hyprocisy really makes me sad. Shame on you.
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Sorry friend, but I agree with the OP to a point. I have said for years that there should be a secret Mass on Christmas and Easter for the regulars.
Yes you are right, the “johnny come latelys” do have a right to be there, but I should also be allowed to have a Mass with my family and friends that are with me every week.

Why not?
 
Isn’t is basically wrong to gossip about this anyway? Christ loved all people in the Gospel, regardless of their class, wealth or nationality.

Some people you don’t recognize may in fact be people visiting relatives and aren’t from your town/area/parish.

How do you bring back members of the parish that aren’t at mass every sunday? First off don’t talk badly about them and pass them off as an outcast group.

Once again, Jesus loves us all. In His time on Earth life wasn’t easy. Only the citizens of Rome and/or the rich and wealthy got any kind of decent treatment in their society. There were plenty of slaves in that time as well. Anyone that was ill, physically or mentally challenged, didn’t appear to be status quo… etc… were treated as they didn’t exist. There was no life insurance or health insurance. There weren’t provisions for basic needs of the people.
Christ taught us to take care of each other and to love one another, that we are all equal. Let’s not forget that.
 
Most Parishes have an influx of visitors over the Christmas and most new faces are visiting relatives and friends. we cannot say they are all ‘johhny come lately’s’.

Last night in my Parish the Church was packed. I gave thanks to God for such a wonderful vision. of couse I told God that it would be lovely to see the Church this way every week. Then I left the rest up to Him. I focussed on the Holy Mass and was moved to tears many times throughout simply because of love.

Whilst it is important, frequent / infrequent attendance is not at the heart of the matter. What is at the heart of the matter is how you come, how you are involved, how you receive Christ and how you are after you leave.

Regular / daily attendance at Holy Mass gives us no privilages at any Mass. In fact it brings with it extra responsibilities and expectations most of which the original poster fails to display.

If we decide to tamper with the Mass just for the sake of those who don’t come so often then we are displaying comtempt for something we ourselves, by our regular attendance, show we highly value.

You are worried about how to bring them back?? You won’t. Thats God’s job through the Holy Spirit. You simply pray for them, mortify yourself for them and set an example of supreme fidelity.

We cannot weigh up what has happened in each individual heart, we cannot see the reasons for infrequent attendance. We cannot see the conversions that did happen last night.

Believe you me there will be more folk at Mass next Sunday because of last night. You won’t see them cause they will be diluted or perhaps they will have returned to their own parish.
 
Merry Christmas to all of you, and may Christ’s peace be with you on this day and on all days.
 
Good to know that the Pharisees are alive and well.

Baldwin
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decn2b:
Went to the 530 Mass yesterday. Got to the church 1 hour beforehand (already people there) it was great I prayed the rosary. Kids were getting restless after an hour and half…

The one thing that bothered me with Mass was it was packed. relatively small parish 450 families but I didn’t recognise any regulars. (I was told later that the regulars mostly attend 730 mass) My family 4 kids wife and I are mass frequenters but it was more than Obvious (and very very very sad) that the cultural once a year Catholics had showed up for this mass. Big time chatter before mass and I ended up being the leader for the congregation as to when to kneel when to stand and I swear I was the only person singing…so I sang REALLY REALLY loud. People look so foolish when they show up for Mass and have ABSOLUTELY no idea what to do. Funny some people (the johnny come latelys) we visibily upset that they had to sit in the front few pews. They acted very very uncomfortable. Of course they had me sittng in the second pew…blaring out the hymns. 😛
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Went to 4:30 PM yesterday, but that is the normal Mass I attend. I guess I am a creature of habit.

PF
 
I think you are all being to harsh on the op. I personally was one of the people he is talking about once or twice a year and hey i was good. I wish that someone would have sat me down and told me why what i was doing was first a mortal sin and then given me the reasons. 2 Years ago I had a drastic conversion and my life has change substantially. My life revolves around Christ and His Church now. I think what is meant by the op about it being sad is that the beautiful souls which God has created seem to not fully comprehend the importance of spiritual life. I know many catholics who very rarely go to church. While all most all the protestants I know do go to weekly worship, my point here is that isnt it odd that those who are lacking in the fullness of truth seem to out do the majority of us when it comes to the basic fundemental need of weekly worship. I personally do not let a day go by when I dont pray for those who neglect God to return so that they can rejoice in the joy that they will receive when they do. I am nothing, and I dont judge anyone, but I can judge actions and I am supposed to according to St. Paul. I hate the sin but I love the sinner.
 
for those who attend Mass infrequently, or who are returning after a long absence, how they are received and welcomed by the congregation is a huge factor in whether or not they remain and come back a second time
 
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tdandh26:
I think you are all being to harsh on the op. I personally was one of the people he is talking about once or twice a year and hey i was good. I wish that someone would have sat me down and told me why what i was doing was first a mortal sin and then given me the reasons. 2 Years ago I had a drastic conversion and my life has change substantially. My life revolves around Christ and His Church now. I think what is meant by the op about it being sad is that the beautiful souls which God has created seem to not fully comprehend the importance of spiritual life. I know many catholics who very rarely go to church. While all most all the protestants I know do go to weekly worship, my point here is that isnt it odd that those who are lacking in the fullness of truth seem to out do the majority of us when it comes to the basic fundemental need of weekly worship. I personally do not let a day go by when I dont pray for those who neglect God to return so that they can rejoice in the joy that they will receive when they do. I am nothing, and I dont judge anyone, but I can judge actions and I am supposed to according to St. Paul. I hate the sin but I love the sinner.
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You’ve just proved that it is indeed God who will call them back to the fold. That is why we should not worry and thank God that our enlightenment has come about at an earlier moment in time. As long as we cling to the cliff with a single finger we can still make it back to safe land!!

You know its the parable of the talents all over again!!
 
My church choir sang at 10:00 this morning. Church wasn’t packed, but it was fuller than a normal Sunday 10:00 am Mass.

It was clear that there were many people there who don’t make it every Sunday. It was also clear that there were many people home for the Holiday that don’t normally attend our church.

I’m glad that they joined us for Mass, even if many of them didn’t quite recall when to stand, sit, and kneel. It’s nice to see the church full, and although we’d like to see it this full every Sunday, it was nice that it was full today.

I’m hoping that by people being charitable to others that it might inspire them to come more often. Unfortunately, even I am not always comfortable in the church I belong to. The congregation doesn’t always make outsiders feel all that welcome, and although when I came to this town I had an “in” through music, I’m still not really made to feel like part of the family.

I don’t feel that way when I visit some of the area Protestant churches – and I do this more for professional development sake to give me the opportunity to sing harmony parts on the hymns and better develop my ear. There is an Episcopalian church nearby that invited me for coffee afterwards and invited me to join their choir. Their rector even wanted me to come in and meet with him if I was interested in joining their parish. A bit different than the cold and impersonal impression my own Catholic parish gives.

The C and E people might come more often if we were more welcoming. I don’t think Protestant “gimmicks” like coffee hour afterward are necessary (although I happen to like this one), but we need to make sure that people feel welcome in our parishes. A smile when they come in and a warm handshake during the Sign of Peace might make a big difference. The liturgy is central, no doubt, but what postures we take and how we act towards our fellow participants may go along way to bringing them back.

Yes… Catholics who only come on Christmas and Easter do look a bit silly when they get lost in the postures and gestures, but many of them are probably self-conscious of this. Let’s make an effort to make them feel more comfortable at Mass.

Peace be with you all.
 
in over 18 years involvement in RCIA in one capacity or another the number one reason people express a desire to join the Catholic Church is that a Catholic or several Catholics made them feel welcome when they finally came to Church. The number one reason people otherwise disposed to learn more about the Catholic faith gave as a reason that delayed their initiation was a feeling of not being welcomed by Catholics or being made to feel out of place.
 
I also think we have to be careful to not attribute incorrect assumptions toward those who seem to not fully participate in the Mass by appropriately kneeling, genuflecting, standing, sitting, etc.

I was telling my husband about this thread, and he had a good laugh before explaining that had the OP been ‘observing’ me today, he probably would have concluded that I was merely a twice a year Catholic. Being six months pregnant with extensive back injuries, plenty of extra water swelling, a sciatic nerve that constantly radiates pain from my lower back to the bottom of my foot, and a hip that doesn’t always like to stay properly aligned, kneeling and standing in mass only happens as my body allows it. Up until this point it’s been manageable, but my body was especially worn out from all the standing in the kitchen and cooking that I did the last couple days. I was so worn out this morning, and I was also dizzy from trying to observe the fast before mass. There was twice that I continued to sit instead of stand, and once that I did not kneel. This doesn’t mean I don’t KNOW I’m supposed to be standing or kneeling; it just means I felt unable despite my best efforts. I think if I had noticed someone staring at me or making exaggerated efforts to sit and stand with gusto (hmmm, sort of like shouting a hymn for no other reason than to make a point), it would have been very hurtful to me. I think if we could all just go to mass and not critique those around us, it might be a much more positive experience for EVERYONE involved.
 
I have really tried to have a different perspective on the C & E Catholics. I used to be more judgmental and irritated by them. Now, I am just so happy that they come, and I pray that somehow the Holy Spirit will tug at their hearts and bring them back into the fold.
 
Our parish did a really nice thing this weekend. During the services, the pastor and other celebrants welcomed those who don’t normally come to our parish/Mass on a regular basis. Also, we had two bulletins - our regular bulletin, and a special 4-page Christmas one with a 1 page welcome to all those who came to our parish this weekend, and filled with various ways they could continue to celebrate the Christmas season and the Christian way of life throughout the year. Looking at it, it really seemed like our parish community was really trying to reach out to those who don’t normally come out and invited them to become more active in our parish community. 👍

BTW - saw many of the regulars at the two Masses I attended this weekend…
 
Agreed - and I don’t think the OP would disagree either - I certainly don’t.

BUT

When you do make the effort - give them the words of the hymns , give them a ‘running order’ into their hands , ask them to switch off mobile phones etc etc and still they eat , chat read papers AND complain that everything is too difficult , what can you do ?

These really are the folk how are only coming because ti’s the ‘done thing’

Our Church has plenty of Protestants who come for Midnight Mass - they appreciate the Service and are very reverent in their behaviour - and they SING !!

We even have someone quietly saying " and now we stand for the … " and later " Now we Kneel " etc etc . We do make the effort for the twice a year attendees and the new people coming for the first time .

BUT - we will not disobey the rubrics for these folk
 
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