Church attire (all kinds)

[Books4me]

For me personally, I dress up for the Lord. I think it’s a sign of respect for God. I think the “I’ll wear what I want” attitude is just secularization creeping into the Church. It’s not about what you want, but what you think God would want.

 

[crazzeto]

I haven’t been to a wedding…well since 2005…and I wore slacks/dockers and a shirt. Before 2005…haven’t been since my own in 1988… Plus…am I going to wear that EVERY day?

Is it worth dressing up for the Lord every day? Well you seem to have made your choice. For me, it certainly is… As for me… I’m a guy with honestly very few dessy clothing and there’s a reason for them, I’m tramatized with memories from early childhood… Being choaked half to death with not quite correctly fitting dressy clothing.

I hate dressing up, or at least I very much used to… Then I started dressing up for the Lord (certianly not for me). Now… Well my dressy clothing doesn’t quite fit still but mostly because I’ve gained a lot of weight. But I still wear the best that I have each and every time. If I was able to go daily, then I would dress nice daily.

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

Is it worth dressing up for the Lord every day? Well you seem to have made your choice. For me, it certainly is… As for me… I’m a guy with honestly very few dessy clothing and there’s a reason for them, I’m tramatized with memories from early childhood… Being choaked half to death with not quite correctly fitting dressy clothing.

I hate dressing up, or at least I very much used to… Then I started dressing up for the Lord (certianly not for me). Now… Well my dressy clothing doesn’t quite fit still but mostly because I’ve gained a lot of weight. But I still wear the best that I have each and every time. If I was able to go daily, then I would dress nice daily.

Sigh…you just don’t get it do you:nope: I do wear the best that I have…that’s it…but how nice of you to judge me on it. Personally I think my Lord is happy that I make the sacrifice to go every day.

But again…thanks for putting rules/constrictions on me that just aren’t there. Now…I have yours…and I just have to wait for the next joe to tell me what I consider “my best” isn’t good enough.

Sarcastically I would ask you, "You don’t care enough about God to go out and buy new dressy clothes since you’ve gained weight? Or enough about Him not to gain the weight?

That’s kind of the attitude you are putting on other people…you know…sort of a “well, I guess you just don’t care enough about the Lord, but I sure do so I always wear my best”…

 

[crazzeto]

Sigh…you just don’t get it do you:nope: I do wear the best that I have…that’s it…but how nice of you to judge me on it. Personally I think my Lord is happy that I make the sacrifice to go every day.

There’s no Judgement Annabelle, none what so ever… There was never any attempt to judge, nor should there have been any hint of it in my postings. There is a strong exhortation to dress the best you can for the Lord every single day. You say you do this, terrific, then why argue for super casual?

But again…thanks for putting rules/constrictions on me that just aren’t there. Now…I have yours…and I just have to wait for the next joe to tell me what I consider “my best” isn’t good enough.

What rules and or constrictions have I placed on anyone… Go back, read what I have posted and cite specific examples. In fact if you elect to do so, then what you will find is many times over I have affirmed, there is no rule. Instead what I have said is

“isn’t it better to…”
“shouldn’t you want to…”
“for what reason don’t we treat a meeting with the Lord as well as a meeting with…xyz”

Where is the rule? Where is the constriction? Please, show me.

Sarcastically I would ask you, "You don’t care enough about God to go out and buy new dressy clothes since you’ve gained weight? Or enough about Him not to gain the weight?

That’s kind of the attitude you are putting on other people…you know…sort of a “well, I guess you just don’t care enough about the Lord, but I sure do so I always wear my best”…

Your decending into perseonal attacks. I exhort you (again), this time very very strongly to do as I suggest. Read my postings, and understand them properly.

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

There’s no Judgement Annabelle, none what so ever… There was never any attempt to judge, nor should there have been any hint of it in my postings. There is a strong exhortation to dress the best you can for the Lord every single day. You say you do this, terrific, then why argue for super casual?

What rules and or constrictions have I placed on anyone… Go back, read what I have posted and cite specific examples. In fact if you elect to do so, then what you will find is many times over I have affirmed, there is no rule. Instead what I have said is

“isn’t it better to…”
“shouldn’t you want to…”
“for what reason don’t we treat a meeting with the Lord as well as a meeting with…xyz”

Where is the rule? Where is the constriction? Please, show me.

Your decending into perseonal attacks. I exhort you (again), this time very very strongly to do as I suggest. Read my postings, and understand them properly.

I have read your posts…multiple times. But as far as understanding them properly…well, I’d kind of have to be inside your head for that one You may know how you meant them to be…I don’t. And apparently to me they don’t come off as you intended. What I think is leading and judgemental with a hint of passive aggressive you don’t…again…maybe because you know what you meant.

As far as arguing for super casual…no I’m not…where I have I said that? Because I don’t think kneel length shorts are bad? Can we agree that there is a difference between knee length docker type shorts and…I don’t know…basketball shorts…or a gym shirt? I’m don’t believe I’ve argued for either of those.

 

[CMatt25]

It’s not about what you want, but what you think God would want.

:clapping: That’s what I’ve been saying too. I think God just wants us in His presence and take Annabelle Marie for instance. She I think has posted she goes to Mass numerous times during the week. Her husband joins her more than once a week if I recall correctly from what she posted. I really don’t think God cares if she shows up in a dress, skirt, or pants. Long or short sleeves. Or her husband in dress slacks, knee length docker shorts, a suit and tie or a polo. None of that matters to our Lord is what I think. What matters to our Lord is the actual heart. Not whether their attire gives someone else an impression of a lack of reverance.

 

[Colmcille]

…Trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean and reverent. Just do it! Don’t make a fashion statement or spectacle of yourself, period.

 

[CMatt25]

what I have said is

“isn’t it better to…”
“shouldn’t you want to…”
“for what reason don’t we treat a meeting with the Lord as well as a meeting with…xyz”

Where is the rule? Where is the constriction? Please, show me.

There isn’t a “better to” if one believes this issue is not one of such importance to our Lord.

You shouldn’t feel you must want to if one believes it is not of such importance to our Lord.

Meeting with Jesus has nothing to do with what secular society’s attire expectations for outer appearances might or might not be when meeting “xyz”. Jesus is beyond secular outer appearances. He sees the inside. Therefore He does not presume a lack of reverance based on the outside.

That’s what I think and believe.

 

[Dan_Daly]

Jesus is not the only one who sees you at Mass.

So does everyone else there.

We all should try not to be distracted from the Mass.

AND

We all should try not to be a distraction for others at the Mass.

AND

We all should attempt not to provide occasions for sin for others, at Mass or anywhere else.

I don’t think those who are saying “the clothes don’t matter, God sees inside me” don’t truly mean that. If that was the case, going to Mass in your underwear or naked would be fine, and I don’t see anyone advocating that. We all agree that you should be dressed appropriately, we simply disagree on what “appropriately” is.

One consideration that often comes up in discussions of modesty is swimming. My wife and I, like many other people, have come to the conclusion that although we enjoy swimming, as we raise our family we will not be going to the pool or the beach in the summer time. This sounds quite radical to many people, and by the standards of our culture it is. But again, when looking at what is modest from the culture’s perspective we must evaluate the culture.

In Australia and Europe many beaches are topless or nude. It’s not hard to imagine that being the case in the US sometime in the next 50 years. At that point will more American Catholics not take their family to the beach in the summer or will the new standard of our culture apply, just as bikinis and speeds have replaced one pieces, which replaced a not too long ago culture where men and women did not swim together at all?

Pax

 

[odile53]

I’m not even going there with a fashion commentary about what I see in the pews, either at my own parish (the occasional too-tight/top-short outfit,) or at the traditional parish I occasionally attend for the EF Mass (a few women that look decidedly Amish.) I dress like a contemporary middle-aged American woman who would know how to dress to go to a job interview or eat lunch in a finer restaurant. Sometimes that’s a skirt suit, and sometimes that is a pair of dressy slacks (not tight pants.) IMHO, many of the ladies you see that are wearing clothing that is immodest probably don’t own a full-length mirror. Let’s put it this way—their end does not justify their jeans!

I am, however, going to comment on something I saw at, of all places, the traditional parish. Apparently, the monsignor was planning a golf game after Mass. And he is a tall man. He really needs to get his albs or cassocks, or whatever the long base garment is called, tailored to fit his height, because he was wearing shorts underneath. And a pair of high-topped basketball sneakers with black socks. The alb was a good six inches too short, and what you saw was the aforementioned poorly chosen sneakers/black socks and about four inches of hairy white legs every time he was not behind the post V2 altar. Obviously, the sight was not provocative. It was downright silly-looking.

I’ll cut him some slack, because it was about ninety-five degrees and humid in that church that day, and dressing in so many layers would have been a health risk. But really, Monsignor, if you’re going to wear shorts, at least wear an alb that comes down to shoe-top length!

 

[Dan_Daly]

I’d agree that your priest shouldn’t be wearing shorts or basketball shoes.

What priests wear is definitely important in this conversation. When are pastor most recently addressed the issue of attire with the congregation, he preempted any grumbling about how uncomfortable it can be to dress modestly during the summer months with this reminder during his sermon:

My hemline is lower.

My neckline is higher.

I’m wearing more layers.

And it’s hotter up here.

May God bless all of our priests!

Pax.

 

[crazzeto]

There isn’t a “better to” if one believes this issue is not one of such importance to our Lord.

You shouldn’t feel you must want to if one believes it is not of such importance to our Lord.

Meeting with Jesus has nothing to do with what secular society’s attire expectations for outer appearances might or might not be when meeting “xyz”. Jesus is beyond secular outer appearances. He sees the inside. Therefore He does not presume a lack of reverance based on the outside.

That’s what I think and believe.

How much time did the Lord spend speaking of preparedness? Do we really think this is too small for the Lord? If so, then what else is too small for the Lord? If those of us who certainly can offer a higher level of dress, choose not too simply to fit in, or simply because we’ve decided God doesn’t care?

Edit
Incidently, one more thing… it’s not like anyone is suggesting less well off folks (economically), or the homeless should be held to the same standard either. The goal is to offer your personal best. The question is, what is your personal best. Is it limited by our unwillingness to offer more? Or our physical inability to do so?

 

[VJCadarr]

You dress appropriately to go to parties, concerts, etc. WHY is there a problem with dressing appropriately (reverently) to go to Mass? We have people who lector and serve as EM’s who wear clothes that are so short, we gasp when they bow before they go up on the altar. I am embarrassed for the priests and deacons who celebrate the Mass. Tank tops, shorts, etc. are NOT appropriate attire for Mass. Period! If you must wear revealing clothes, carry a wrap-around skirt or extra pair of slacks and get dressed before coming to worship the Lord. And, yes, God is happy to see you at Mass, but you wouldn’t go naked - why go dressed like Mass (and God) are not important enough to dress so you don’t cause scandal to His people. We have enough distractions at Mass, people dressed inappropriately are just one more unnecessary distraction.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

:clapping: That’s what I’ve been saying too. I think God just wants us in His presence and take Annabelle Marie for instance. She I think has posted she goes to Mass numerous times during the week. Her husband joins her more than once a week if I recall correctly from what she posted. I really don’t think God cares if she shows up in a dress, skirt, or pants. Long or short sleeves. Or her husband in dress slacks, knee length docker shorts, a suit and tie or a polo. None of that matters to our Lord is what I think. What matters to our Lord is the actual heart. Not whether their attire gives someone else an impression of a lack of reverance.

Once again, Matt, it is NOT a case of ‘either you wear something nice, OR you open your heart to the Lord’ as if only the latter is important.

They are BOTH important. One’s ‘outside’ historically has been understood to both indicate the ‘inside’ and make it visible.

IOW, one starts with the ‘heart’ and one then ‘clothes’ the mind AND the body as well.

One does not just STOP with the heart and say, Oh OK, I’m FULL of reverence on the inside, that is ALL the matters, I don’t HAVE to actually DEMONSTRATE on the ‘outside’ what I feel on the inside.’

Now while it is possible (though extremely unlikely in today’s mega-casual culture) that a person could be dressed ‘reverently’ on the outside and not be reverent within, at least you are getting an OUTWARD appearance that indicates that if the person is not inwardly reverent, HE SHOULD BE.

Whereas if you have an ‘ultrareverent on the inside’ person dressed and acting as if there is nothing ‘special’ going on in life, HOW are you SUPPOSED to even GUESS this person is 'full of reverence?" What differentiates the man or woman wearing sloppy and unkempt ‘comfy clothes’ who is just focused on ‘comfort’ and one who is 'full of reverence?"

We NEED signs and symbols, Matt. That’s why our Church is so blessed with things like statues and other sacramentals. . .OUTSIDE SIGNS of INWARD PIETY.

 

[Duq]

I don’t know what clothes have to do with anything! Isn’t participation in the Mass enough? If you “dress” up in business casual why is that ‘good enough’, why not go shirt and tie, or suit coat and tie? When are you dressed up enough to show reverence, perhaps men should be in a tux and woman in gowns??

Just sayin.

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

I’d agree that your priest shouldn’t be wearing shorts or basketball shoes.

What priests wear is definitely important in this conversation. When are pastor most recently addressed the issue of attire with the congregation, he preempted any grumbling about how uncomfortable it can be to dress modestly during the summer months with this reminder during his sermon:

May God bless all of our priests!

While I may understand what the priest is trying to say…he however gets to change after Mass…for those of us that go during work…no such luck! Now…before someone gets on my case…I still have to wear what is appropriate to work.

I think it was best said…we just all can’t agree what is appropriate…and what is not. Or is your best.

So, what do you do about it? I hear a lot of grousing about so and so…and what people should wear. But what do you do when you are in the pew and see someone wearing something you deem inappropriate? When I say you…I mean you as in other people on this thread…it was a universal question.

 

[LilyM]

How much time did the Lord spend speaking of preparedness? Do we really think this is too small for the Lord? If so, then what else is too small for the Lord? If those of us who certainly can offer a higher level of dress, choose not too simply to fit in, or simply because we’ve decided God doesn’t care?

Edit
Incidently, one more thing… it’s not like anyone is suggesting less well off folks (economically), or the homeless should be held to the same standard either. The goal is to offer your personal best. The question is, what is your personal best. Is it limited by our unwillingness to offer more? Or our physical inability to do so?

If I could put it his way - yes I dress more casually for Mass than for work. I work in a profession where suits are expected. And so I wear one during the week. Purely out of human respect - other people would get miffed if I dressed more casually, and muchore importantly I would soon find myself out of a job.

Do you honestly want me to bring that same attitude - one of oppressive conformity combined with fear that I won’t “fit in” with the other folks - to my dressing for Mass? And treat my Sabbath Eucharist as one more grinding obligation to be endured along with those of my working week?

Or should I instead treat it as a joyful time of release from workaday social pressures? A time when I am face to face with my God and lay all my cares on him, including yhe burdensome obligations of dressing according to code? A time when other humans simply don’t matter as much?
And if so, then am I not entitled to express that attitude in a slightly less formal choice of clothing?

 

[ElisabethM]

The only rule need to be applied to one’s dress is, "“Will it draw attention to me?” If it does, it is inappropriate for Mass because all attention should be directed to Our Lord. We should be invisible, both in dress and conduct.

em

 

[TrueLight]

The only rule need to be applied to one’s dress is, "“Will it draw attention to me?” If it does, it is inappropriate for Mass because all attention should be directed to Our Lord. We should be invisible, both in dress and conduct.

em

Hmm. That’s tricky.

 

[marie_teresa]

This is a great post and addresses some important issues in the Traditional movement. While some Trads wear dresses and skirts everyday there is also the clandestine crowd that dress frumpy for the Tridentine mass and go home to change into their tight jeans and tight T-shirt. Then there is the crowd that wear the long skirts and dresses everyday but feel so uncomfortable in public that they only frequent other Trads homes and rearly go out unless in a group to feel okay about their dress. There is definitely pressure to conform to this standard with this group and a sense that they are holier because of their wardrobe, never mind the arrogance associated with it. The tridentine mass has suffered much from the women and their weirdness over the appropriate wardrobe to belong to these parishes. Many families have been “run off” because of their unwillingness to conform with the “dress code”. I’ve heard girls say “What’s with the uniform?” after leaving a Tridentine mass and comment on how weird it is. It’s like stepping back in time,Laura Ingalls Wilder style.

Ladies we live in 2011. God put us here, now for a reason. He could have put us on earth in 1880 or 1950 but he didn’t. I read a book in which St. Jane de Chantal wrote to one of her daughters advising her of what kind of dresses she should have made to fit in with the court that she would be expected to socialized with. Imagine a saint worried about the latest fashions and knowing that clothes matter with women.

If the women who attend the Tridentine mass get too outlandish with their clothes, no one but maybe the eccentric, will want to belong to these parishes. It’s time to let the Catholic world know that the Tridentine mass is for all women …pants, skirts or dresses as long as they are modest.