Church Position On Diary Of Saint Maria Faustina

[Jerry111]

I’ve been reading the stunning Diary Of Saint Maria Faustina Kowalska. Talk about a page turner! Almost every entry touches some emotion - the infinite love of Jesus for every soul, the paltriness of my love in return, humble gratitude in conjunction with overwhelming sorrow for His horrible passion and cruel death, remorse over one’s sins which Jesus tells Saint Faustina continue to inflict the agony of the scourging, Saint Faustina’s joy in taking on intense physical and spiritual suffering for souls, and much more.

However, this is a woman claiming to have numerous visions of Jesus and direct conversations with Him. It is my understanding that any visionary revelations beyond those of Revelation are deemed “private revelations”, which the Church may deem worthy of belief but are not to be considered authenticated by the Church. I believe even the Fatima apparitions, despite the well documented “miracle of the dancing sun”, are still just considered non-authenticated private revelations.

On the other hand, the Diary Of St Faustina has been given a Nihil Obstat and an Imprimatur - free from doctrinal and moral error - and Pope JP II canonized Sister Faustina, encouraged veneration of the Devine Mercy painting and instituted the Feast Of Devine Mercy. By doing so has the Church authenticated the messages and visions?

This Saint has brought me deeper into the faith and I have begun paying more attention to even the smallest of my transgressions and praying for souls on a daily basis. This won’t change even if the messages and visions are deemed private revelation, but I would like to know Church’s official position.

BTW in case I’ve been too vague , I highly recommend reading The Diary Of Saint Maria Faustina Kowalska for the sake of the living souls you love, the souls you grieve for, and “those of the whole world”.

I got mine from Amazon, $7.95 and nicely wrapped in cellophane

Thanks in advance for any replies

Jerry

 

[Edmundus1581]

Yes, normally private revelations are only judged as, at best, “not conflicting”, and “worthy of belief”, but it would seem to me that when the Church includes a “private revelation” in the Church calendar (eg. Feast of Divine Mercy, Feast of the Sacred Heart, Feast of Our Lady of Fatima) then it has endorsed the revelation with the highest authority.

 

[svid]

I believe Nihil obstat (“nothing stands in the way”) and Imprimitur (“let it be printed”) merely say that it’s okay to read and believe. But instituting a feast-day? That’s pretty serious evidence. Didn’t the feast of Corpus Christi come about the same way?

 

[TRAD1936]

It is interesting to note at this point that there has been a great deal of speculation over the book by numerous people both in and out of the Church. Some have claimed that Saint Maria was neither literate or educated enough to have written the book. It is felt that most of the book was either written in it’s entirity by the other sisters in the convent or at the least edited by them to a great extent.

Also Pope John XXIII in 1959.signed a decree that placed the book on the Index of Forbidden Books and it remained on the Index for over 20 years. At that time It was felt that some of the writing was not theologically sound. It was removed from the list in 1978.

In addition there are those who feel that she was canonized primarily because Pope John Paul 11 was Polish also and desired to canonize another Polish Saint…

I point these out only for histprical interest and to show how drastically things can change

 

[Scout]

St. Faustina did write the book. When her journal was found after her death, they spent years decyphering it because it was so poorly written. She spelled everything phonetically and in polish, so scholars had to go over it with a fine-toothed comb. And yes, she wasn’t educated. She’d had 3 years of schooling and that was it.

I’ve read the journal, also. I absolutely loved it. For me, it was like having my own private conversation with Jesus. It absolutely helped me grow closer to Him and I will be eternally grateful for it.

Scout :tiphat:

 

[TRAD1936]

St. Faustina did write the book. When her journal was found after her death, they spent years decyphering it because it was so poorly written. She spelled everything phonetically and in polish, so scholars had to go over it with a fine-toothed comb. And yes, she wasn’t educated. She’d had 3 years of schooling and that was it.

I’ve read the journal, also. I absolutely loved it. For me, it was like having my own private conversation with Jesus. It absolutely helped me grow closer to Him and I will be eternally grateful for it.

Scout :tiphat:

I’m not saying she did not write it. And I am not saying that it isn’t true. I am only pointing outs facts that some, maybe many people may not know. As far as the sisters having to decipher what she wrote that to me presents the possibility that some things were changed, re-written or flat out inserted by the sisters, charges incidentally, that were in fact leveled in the past. The only ones that know the answer to that are the sisters themselves, if any are still alive.

 

[NeedImprovement]

I have a copy of *Divine Mercy in My Soul *too. It’s an awesome read !

For anyone who thinks they might wish to see just what a stimulating read Saint Maria Faustina’s diary is, it is available for free online at this link. If one follows the link and then clicks on “Preface” and reads it in its entirety , one discovers just how extensive and comprehensive all the editing processes involved were - all the efforts to preserve the original writings when translating and compiling.

---

Ummm… I won’t ask for any sources of the “numerous people speculating in and out of the Church” mentioned in post # 4 .But, If indeed there are

… those who feel that she was canonized primarily because Pope John Paul 11 was Polish also and desired to canonize another Polish Saint…

… It would seem ascertainable that they probably never read her Diary and that, in all likelihood, they would never be able to recognize a miracle even if it were to come up and hit them right square in the face. :doh2:

God’s Mercy is His greatest attribute.

 

[TRAD1936]

I have a copy of *Divine Mercy in My Soul *too. It’s an awesome read !

For anyone who thinks they might wish to see just what a stimulating read Saint Maria Faustina’s diary is, it is available for free online at this link.

---

Ummm… I won’t ask for any sources of the “numerous people speculating in and out of the Church” mentioned in post # 4 .But, If indeed there are

… It would seem ascertainable that they probably never read her Diary and that, in all likelihood, they would never be able to recognize a miracle even if it were to come up and hit them right square in the face. :doh2:

God’s Mercy is His greatest attribute.

The fact that the book was on the firbidden book list for over twenty years would seem to indicate that at some in the Church questioned its veracity at thetime, and I am pretty sure they read it prior to banning it.

As I said, I am just pointing out things that are often overlooked as far as the diary is concerned.

 

[agnes_therese]

The fact that the book was on the firbidden book list for over twenty years would seem to indicate that at some in the Church questioned its veracity at thetime, and I am pretty sure they read it prior to banning it.

As I said, I am just pointing out things that are often overlooked as far as the diary is concerned.

My understanding (and no, I can’t point to a source at the moment) was that they were working with a translation that was not the best. That would explain why it could be forbidden, and then removed from the list when a better translation was available.

 

[Jerry111]

Thanks for the reply TRAD, interesting points

As for the literacy question, Sister Faustina did have a mere 3 years of schooling. The introduction to the diary does admit to editorial corrections for grammar and spelling (which apparently were extensive) but I have not come across accusations that anyone other than Faustina had a hand in authorship. I did find some of the writing extremely eloquent and beautiful for someone with so little education, but assumed (perhaps naively) it just came from the heart and perhaps some inspiration by the Holy Spirit.

In entry #358 of the diary Sister Faustina foresaw the 1959 ban and subsequent lifting. She wrote of a momentary vision in which she became aware that the DM devotion would “only seem to be utterly undone” and witnessed the suffering that would endured by her confessor and spiritual director Father Michael Sopocko for his role in promoting and defending the devotion.

The erroneous reason for the ban was explained in the 1978 revocation: “This Sacred Congregation, having now in possession the many original documents unknown in 1959, and having taken into account the profoundly changed circumstances, and having taken into account the opinion of many Polish Ordinaries, declares no longer binding the prohibitions contained in the Notification”

I’ve also seen implications of Polish prejudice influencing JPII, but it doesn’t seem to fit the man, to say the least

 

[Jerry111]

Yes Scout! You summed it up quite succinctly – the diary entries seemed to be MY personal conversations with Jesus. That is why the book has hit me so deeply.

I understood this to be a message for the world, but Jesus is also speaking to all of us individually through Sister Faustina and we will all experience something personal in these “conversation”.

Thanks

 

[NeedImprovement]

The fact that the book was on the firbidden book list for over twenty years would seem to indicate that at some in the Church questioned its veracity at thetime, and I am pretty sure they read it prior to banning it.

As I said, I am just pointing out things that are often overlooked as far as the diary is concerned.

But you don’t cite any sources. If you don’t wish to read the Diary yourself, perhaps you might at least read the entire linked Preface itself (my previous post was edited) because it is is loaded with credible sources which dispel some of the unsubstantiated doubts you try to raise. Here’s an example/excerpt - pertaining to the censure:

*". **SIGNIFICANT TEXTUAL INACCURACIES IN THE FORMER TRANSCRIPTS. *:As compared to the original, the former transcripts have omitted entire pages, left out whole sentences, and changed a great many of the words, substituting them with others. The number of inaccuracies cited fill several single-spaced typewritten pages, it is not surprising, therefore, that the former texts met with censure and mistrust. And thus, for example, on page 7 of the typewritten copy, 8 mistakes were found; on page 25, 7 mistakes, on page 177, 8, etc. "

That explanation makes perfect sense to me and concurs with the quote provided by Jery111 in post # 10; and it rests on the compilation of qualified experts .

Here’s the link again.

 

[damooster]

In addition there are those who feel that she was canonized primarily because Pope John Paul 11 was Polish also and desired to canonize another Polish Saint…

I point these out only for histprical interest and to show how drastically things can change

That is absolutely an unfair thing to say. Not only is it offensive to suggest the Pope would do something like that, but the Pope is not the sole person responsible for canonization. It’s a process that is handled by a committee and they are the ones that recommended canonization.

I’ll take you at your word in regards to you wanting the OP to be cautious, but to throw out unsubstantiated statements like the one I quoted is irresponsible. There are people who believe 9/11 was an inside job too, but that doesn’t mean those people are correct.

 

[TRAD1936]

That is absolutely an unfair thing to say. Not only is it offensive to suggest the Pope would do something like that, but the Pope is not the sole person responsible for canonization. It’s a process that is handled by a committee and they are the ones that recommended canonization.

I’ll take you at your word in regards to you wanting the OP to be cautious, but to throw out unsubstantiated statements like the one I quoted is irresponsible. There are people who believe 9/11 was an inside job too, but that doesn’t mean those people are correct.

You know I never said that I believed it. But some people do. That particular subject has been brought up before on this forum. Why do you say that it is unfair to bring it up? Believe it or not there are those who questioned the Holy Fathers motives then and now

 

[NeedImprovement]

You know I never said that I believed it. But some people do. That particular subject has been brought up before on this forum. Why do you say that it is unfair to bring it up? Believe it or not there are those who questioned the Holy Fathers motives then and now

Questioning motives is not the same as casting an aspersion, which is the case here. Aspersion involves an attack on a person’s integrity.

In law, defamation is defined as an attack on the good reputation of a person, by slander or libel.

Take your pick.

TRAD1936:

…In addition there are those who feel that she was canonized primarily because Pope John Paul 11 was Polish also and desired to canonize another Polish Saint…

In my limited opinion the offensive comment quoted above might look a little less like the spreading of derogatory remarks or of anti-Polish sentiment if you were able to cite your souces of “those who feel that way” at least; that is, if you’re going to be intent on posting them.

Otherwise people may begin to question your own motives for posting those particular comments. This is the second request for substantiation (the third if you understand damooster’s post) : If you wish to prove “that particular subject has been brought up before on this forum”, then where’s the link ? How much can you have read in one month ?

 

[laszlo]

The Church position about any private revelation is clear

67 Throughout the ages, there have been so-called “private” revelations, some of which have been recognized by the authority of the Church. They do not belong, however, to the deposit of faith. It is not their role to improve or complete Christ’s definitive Revelation, but to help live more fully by it in a certain period of history. Guided by the Magisterium of the Church, the sensus fidelium knows how to discern and welcome in these revelations whatever constitutes an authentic call of Christ or his saints to the Church.

Christian faith cannot accept “revelations” that claim to surpass or correct the Revelation of which Christ is the fulfillment, as is the case in certain non-Christian religions and also in certain recent sects which base themselves on such “revelations”.

vatican.va/archive/catechism/p1s1c2a1.htm

The fact that the feast of Divine Mercy was included into the calendar does not gives any special position to the diary of S. Faustina. The diary has many thoughts, insights, etc. the Divine Mercy is a clear Catholic teaching much before she lived. It was popularized e.g. by S Margaret Alaquoque in the 17th Century

We can suppose that S Faustine was canonized only because John Paul II was Polish two. This is the life. There are many people whose life could be example for everyone, but only a few get into the spotlight. In the Kingdom of haven, those who were not canonized are not less a saint then those canonized. The canonization is for us, and set an example only, she had her position before that.

 

[NeedImprovement]

Those who entertain the thought that Pope John Paul II canonized St. Faustina solely because both of them were Polish, are missing the point…almost completely. Christ wanted the message of His Divine Mercy to be spread in the world.

St Margaret Mary Alcoque was better known for devotion to the Sacred Heart of Jesus - which is the wellspring of Divine Mercy, but it was St. Faustina’s task to concentrate and expound upon tracts of Divine Mercy so that the devotion could be developed and spread. According to their private revelations,both of them, coincidentally, experienced a reproach from Jesus after going out to dance.

So here are the figures for anyone who refuses to dispense with this ridiculous drivel about St. Faustina being canonized simply because both she and Pope John Paul II were Polish.

This linked article and similar articles, confirm that, during John Paul II’s tenure as Pope, nearly 500 individuals were canonized and over 1,300 were beatified. Now, why don’t you find out how many of them were Polish (and make sure you don’t count them twice - as in the case of St. Faustina who was both beatified and canonized during Pope John Paul II’s tenure.)

Then, see if the numbers crunch. I believe you will discover, if you judge by your same warped prejudiced standards , that Pope John Paul II was actually leaning in favour of a different ethnic group.

I can’t believe I’m still actually answering anyone who is spreading that “canonized only because you’re Polish” tripe.

…Time for me to pray more and visit the threads a little less often I guess…

“Dear Lord, I am in your debt for so patiently putting up with me all this time, and I thank you immensely dear Lord for providing me with the “unsubscribe” button too.”

…Later guys; maybe, on another thread. God bless.

i26.photobucket.com/albums/c131/knowL_goonie/th_frustrated.gif

 

[jentindell]

I just finished reading this book, which I have been told was amazing. But I hated it! The Jesus she describes is so cruel and so opposite of the Jesus I know. Sure, He asks me to go out of my way to help others a lot and sometimes I give away my money when I suppose I should be saving but the things he supposedly says and does to Faustina are OOC (out of control!). I mean, He does give her many graces but He’s also pretty mean. And petty. I like ‘my’ Jesus way better. Plus, not to be rude or to offend anyone but I think she was crazy.

Jen

 

[Alfonsus]

Simply put, the diary contains private revelations. People may believe it, none must. No private revelation is binding.

Regarding Divine Mercy Sunday, popular piety, devotion, and private revelation may trigger its establishment. But the Church do not base the feast upon private revelation (same thing with the Sacred Heart).
The Church based the feast theological position from public revelation and Magisterial teaching.

Thus, any Catholic can celebrate it, find spirituality in it, love it, have theological understanding about it, with/without believing private revelations about it.

 

[laszlo]

Those who entertain the thought that Pope John Paul II canonized St. Faustina solely because both of them were Polish, are missing the point…almost completely. Christ wanted the message of His Divine Mercy to be spread in the world.

Among the unforgivable sins (sins against the Holy Spirit) there are two opposites: the desperation and the presumption. The first says that not matter what one does the total destruction up to the eternal death is inevitable; the second assures that we should not worry, let be happy, God’s mercy will provide us the salvation.

St Faustine herself understood this dialectic, and her diary shows a good balance between the desperation and the presumption.

I am not sure at all, that in our time to emphasize the mercy is God’s will. The presumption is rampant: confession is not necessary, omitting Sunday Mass is not mortal sin, the sexual sins are mostly venial sins the communion gives forgiveness, hell is a cursing word to be avoided in the sermons; and on the other side anyone can judge the pope and the bishops through his/her logic, we know the good and evil.

I am Catholic and strictly believe that Christ stands with the decision of His vicar, and He turns it good as much as possible; but the decision itself did not helped to restore the lost balance between the presumption and desperation.

Traditionally the Second Sunday after Easter was the Good Pastor Sunday. We all prayed for the priestly vocations and remembered what the priesthood means: the representative of Jesus who offers His sacrifice and who as the representative of Christ forgives our sins in the confession. I have serious doubt that to turn the spirit of penitence and sacrifice to the happiness of radiating mercy was a necessary step; and I believe that St Faustina herself would be terrified by this concept

Once more: God stands behind His vicar, but does not prevent wrong decisions, He gave freedom for everyone, and he do not micromanages every actions.