Church Security & Legally Armed Parishioners

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There are far more people shot in the US due to accidental discharge of a firearm than are shot by an armed guard or citizen to prevent or stop a mass shooting , therefore people are safer in a church which doesn’t allow carry of firearms than in one which does.

However, in either scenario the chance of getting shot is tiny, so I would suggest not worrying about it or letting it keep one from attending Mass.

My church announced at Mass a few weeks ago they were instituting a policy of having some parishioners carrying concealed, I’m not happy about it but I’m not going to miss Mass over it.
 
neophyte said:
Again, I suggest that you study the data, which overwhelmingly shows that it is. More guns in thr hands of law-abiding citizens = less crime.
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Actually, the data show that expansion of right to carry laws have led to a spike in violent crime. In 23 of the 31 states that had adopted the laws by 2019, the increase in violent crime was significant. In Pennsylvania, for example, violent crime rose more than 24% in 10 years, and it went up by nearly 17% in Texas.
 
Hightop said:
There are far more people shot in the US due to accidental discharge of a firearm than are shot by an armed guard or citizen to prevent or stop a mass shooting , therefore people are safer in a church which doesn’t allow carry of firearms than in one which does.
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I’ve always thought that a shooting described as an “accidental discharge” was funny. Sorry, but guns don’t just go off.

I have been around guns for most of my life. I shot my first one when I was a very young child. And my parents always had a weapon in the house. (Although not when my father was stationed overseas.) In most cases, we had multiple weapons. When I moved out and got married, I took my guns with me. And I have since added to those.

Not once has a weapon “just gone off.”

For a gun to discharge, someone has to pull the trigger. So, in my opinion, an accidental discharge" is not.
 
Your earlier question was about someone using a knife as a weapon in Church. In order to use a knife as a weapon, it would be brandished.
 
In my personal experience, I’ve a friend who has had a C2C since they were first available, has had many training classes, goes to shooting practice at least once each week. They were in a department store when the distinct POP came from the front of the store. Their words were “in spite of every kind of preparation I had, my instinct was to hit the floor and try to crawl out of there to a fire door”.

Aside from LEOs and those who have served not in just the armed forces but in a job where they had extra training (like a former marine sniper I know), folks think they are prepared until something actually happens. In real life, a situation with an active shooter is chaos. I do not believe any lay person training course can properly prepare someone
 
That is chilling, and the reason I do not want armed people at Mass
 
There is a well know quote, “No battle plan survives first contact with the enemy.” Helmuth van Moltke

This is true for even the most battle weary soldier.

But that doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t be prepared.

I’ve only had contact once. My first thought was duck and cover. I then reacted as I had been taught. I’m sure LEOs and well trained soldiers have had a similar feeling. (I know some do, I’ve talked to them about it.)
 
Can you site a source, please? I’m not aware of recent liberalization to our gun laws in PA.
 
You know how some parishes advertise an “incense free mass” or a “quiet mass for those with sensory sensitivities?” If a Bishop gave the okay for carrying guns to Mass, they could advertise the “gun free Mass”.
 
Source? With proof that it has anything to do with an increase in carry permits by law abiding citizens?

I’ve been around guns all my life. Have had a concealed carry permit in PA as long as I can remember. I carry concealed anywhere I am legally aloud to do so including church. If someone doesn’t carry, they just don’t understand how it feels no different than putting your wallet in your pocket each day etc.

They also call it concealed for a reason. No is is nervous around me because it is just that. Concealed. Always. And yes, it’s my right to do so for the protection of myself and my family.
 
I love in the Mass where we ask God to protect us from all anxiety/distress/unnecessary worry…

Can you/your wife watch the Mass on tv or online? That’s what those in my family who are practicing Catholics do when we don’t go, and imo it is an extraordinary service to our Lord, as it is using what He has allowed us to create - in this case technology - to give glory to Him. Which of course is what all His creation SHOULD be doing at all times, anyway. 👍💓✝️🕊️
 
Note that Peter was swiftly rebuked for what he did by Yeshua, and also wouldn’t have been able to pull that sort of stunt had he not had his weapon on him.

Also, a sword does not have the level of lethality as a gun does. To put it in very contemporary terms, guns are “overpowered”. They are literally “pull trigger and target dies” most of the time. Swords require closer proximity (amongst other things).

No usual weapon is more a tool of death than a gun is.

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The sword was the modern weapon for the time. No different than a gun is today. The idea that you pull a trigger and someone dies instantly is a result of watching too many hollywood movies.

If I plunge a sword through your body, the result will be the same as if I shoot you. It all depends on where on your person you are struck.

A gun is a tool of life just as much as it is a tool of death. It really depends on which end of the gun you are looking at it from.

BTW, guns are not designed to kill. They are designed to expel a projectile down a barrel at a high velocity with reliability and accuracy so the event can be repeated. The object which the barrel is pointed at is not necessarily a living thing. I have fired hundreds of thousands of rounds in my life and have yet to kill anyone.

I disagreed with the OP’s thoughts laid out in the post, but some of the stuff on this thread seems to come from some seriously uninformed people when it relates to firearms.
 
I live in Europe.

I have never seen a shooting, but I have seen situations where people got really angry about something. So angry in fact that they could well have killed the other person if they had the means. I’m happy that those people didn’t have guns.
 
Thank you. The link is to a pay site, but I found the article for free from the Stanford U. law school site.
If anything, the increase in violent crime that resulted from liberalized gun laws proves that we need more guns to protect ourselves from violent crime. :crazy_face:

I know an old lady who swallowed a horse. . .
 
Cirdan_XII said:
I live in Europe.

I have never seen a shooting, but I have seen situations where people got really angry about something. So angry in fact that they could well have killed the other person if they had the means. I’m happy that those people didn’t have guns.
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And you have those crazy socialist healthcare programs that would’ve provided care for the victims, too. Man, Europe is such a messed up place to live.

No guns and universal healthcare. . . . 😉 😊
 
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Pure, unsubstantiated opinion, not to mention hystrionic hyperbole.
 
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