Church spokesman: Islamic fundamentalists want all Christians out of Mideast [CC]

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Father Rafic Greische, spokesman of the Catholic Church in Egypt, spoke with Vatican Radio about recent difficulties faced by Egyptian Christians, including the imprisonment of Christians …

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when they stop killing Cathlolics, and innocent Muslims where im at, ill be happy to leave. until then…NO! i think ill stay. :knight2:
 
Hey I say if everyone just accepts islam, then that would be the end of that, wouldnt it?
 
algebra said:
Hey I say if everyone just accepts islam, then that would be the end of that, wouldnt it?
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unfortunately…no. if you are sunni, then the shia would be trying to kill you. and if you are shia, then its the sunni trying to kill you. and if you are wahabist, then you just kill everybody who does not agree with you. this is on the extreme end of shia, and sunni though. there are good muslims who want nothing to do with violence or terror. unless you are of the wahabist sect, then you still just want to kill everyone who doesnt agree with you. they are not too happy with anyone, who is not like them. take bin ladin for example…😦
 
OrdinaryMelkite said:
As far as I know, Orthodox Copts make up about 10 Million out of Egypt’s Population.

The Catholic Copts make up less than a Million. Distinct Minority.
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Yes, I know that Catholic Copts are indeed a very small proportion. After I posted I checked Wikipedia and it seems that the government put the percentage at 10%, but non-governmental sources put it higher–25% or more. Of course statistics in Egypt are often highly politicized, so it’s tough to tell either way.
 
Catholic_Press said:
Father Rafic Greische, spokesman of the Catholic Church in Egypt, spoke with Vatican Radio about recent difficulties faced by Egyptian Christians, including the imprisonment of Christians …

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These imprisoned Christians attacked children’s schools, blocked the highway, threw stones at every body , destroyed cars , destroyed the governerate building and terrorized the city for the whole day .

Wonder if the father would be calling for their release if they were muslim.:rolleyes:
 
Yes, and they’re also hiding weapons in churches and corrupting those poor innocent muslims :rolleyes:

What your saying sounds eerily similar to the typical propoganda which emanates from Egypt demonising the copts and justifying the outright persecution that the muslim government and society perpetrates against them. I think we can all look back to where a society had the same sort of attitude against a minority group with disastrous results.

Funnily enough I don;t hear the same sort of demonisations and condemnations against muslim extremists coming from Egypt and it is anathema for the Egyptian government to decry persecutions of copts. Now Im not saying that the copts didn;t protest (i would considering their circumstances) but the demonisations and outright lies muslim egyptian society disseminates about copts is telling of the mentality which seems so common in so many muslims not just in Egypt but universally around the world, just look at the societal situations in Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Somalia, Yemen, Iran etc etc.
 
Jehoshua said:
Yes, and they’re also hiding weapons in churches and corrupting those poor innocent muslims :rolleyes:

What your saying sounds eerily similar to the typical propoganda which emanates from Egypt demonising the copts and justifying the outright persecution that the muslim government and society perpetrates against them. I think we can all look back to where a society had the same sort of attitude against a minority group with disastrous results.

Funnily enough I don;t hear the same sort of demonisations and condemnations against muslim extremists coming from Egypt and it is anathema for the Egyptian government to decry persecutions of copts. Now Im not saying that the copts didn;t protest (i would considering their circumstances) but the demonisations and outright lies muslim egyptian society disseminates about copts is telling of the mentality which seems so common in so many muslims not just in Egypt but universally around the world, just look at the societal situations in Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Somalia, Yemen, Iran etc etc.
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I dont know what propaganda you are really taking about

youm7.com/News.asp?NewsID=308375

The following translation is from Google translate… use it yr self … its funny ofcourse because it isnt 100% accurate translation… but it does the job

''Hundreds of demonstrators Copts, building the pyramid of Giza Street, and they break down wall
Conservative way, in the seventh and a half in the morning, as tens of people gathered in front of the Urban District
And threw bricks and detention of workers protesting against the chief of the district, Major General Mohammad Hassan
Hamouda to stop building the Church of the Virgin Balamranip owners.

The rioting broke out among hundreds of Copts and the Central Security Forces, which had to use
Tear gas, and was attended by Engineer Mr. Abdulaziz, Governor of Giza, and Maj. Gen. Mohsen
Behavioral director of security to the Giza governorate building.

Caused riots in the street traffic disruption of the pyramid, and intimidation of junior high school students Pyramid
For girls adjacent to the governorate building.’’
 
Jehoshua said:
Yes, and they’re also hiding weapons in churches and corrupting those poor innocent muslims :rolleyes:

What your saying sounds eerily similar to the typical propoganda which emanates from Egypt demonising the copts and justifying the outright persecution that the muslim government and society perpetrates against them. I think we can all look back to where a society had the same sort of attitude against a minority group with disastrous results.

Funnily enough I don;t hear the same sort of demonisations and condemnations against muslim extremists coming from Egypt and it is anathema for the Egyptian government to decry persecutions of copts. Now Im not saying that the copts didn;t protest (i would considering their circumstances) but the demonisations and outright lies muslim egyptian society disseminates about copts is telling of the mentality which seems so common in so many muslims not just in Egypt but universally around the world, just look at the societal situations in Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Somalia, Yemen, Iran etc etc.
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i hope they are hiding weapons. id hate to see what happened here in iraq, a few weeks ago happen in egypt. its open season on Catholics in this country. i dont hide my weapons, they are out in the open. right where they should be when dealing extremist from any background. 😉
 
meedo said:
I dont know what propaganda you are really taking about

youm7.com/News.asp?NewsID=308375

The following translation is from Google translate… use it yr self … its funny ofcourse because it isnt 100% accurate translation… but it does the job

''Hundreds of demonstrators Copts, building the pyramid of Giza Street, and they break down wall
Conservative way, in the seventh and a half in the morning, as tens of people gathered in front of the Urban District
And threw bricks and detention of workers protesting against the chief of the district, Major General Mohammad Hassan
Hamouda to stop building the Church of the Virgin Balamranip owners.

The rioting broke out among hundreds of Copts and the Central Security Forces, which had to use
Tear gas, and was attended by Engineer Mr. Abdulaziz, Governor of Giza, and Maj. Gen. Mohsen
Behavioral director of security to the Giza governorate building.

Caused riots in the street traffic disruption of the pyramid, and intimidation of junior high school students Pyramid
For girls adjacent to the governorate building.’’
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somehow i dont buy this meedo. it couldnt have been to big a deal. whats the body count? how many people did the coptics kill? i think more than likely, they were legitimately protesting, and the government cracked down on them. how may people? i didnt see anything close to resembling a mob in the photos provided. ive seen many more, on an average day in any city in iraq. 🤷
 
benidict said:
somehow i dont buy this meedo. it couldnt have been to big a deal. whats the body count? how many people did the coptics kill? i think more than likely, they were legitimately protesting, and the government cracked down on them. how may people? i didnt see anything close to resembling a mob in the photos provided. ive seen many more, on an average day in any city in iraq. 🤷
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I hope that what happaned in Iraq never ever hapens in my country Egypt.

I never said that they killed any one. But they rioted and terrified the city for a whole day . If it was Muslims doing this in Europe because they didnt get the permit of building a mosque every body on this forum would have been up in arms over ‘‘muslim barbarism’’.

Benedict… this was not a small protest… the city of Giza was nearly pralalyzed for a day because of this The Photos i provided is just couple of photos of some damages. There were 15 ecurity forces injured and one coptic demonstrator dead. They used molotov bottles among many other weapons
 
benidict said:
i hope they are hiding weapons. id hate to see what happened here in iraq, a few weeks ago happen in egypt. its open season on Catholics in this country. i dont hide my weapons, they are out in the open. right where they should be when dealing extremist from any background. 😉
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Since your location is North of Iraq, have you met or seen Christian Iraqis [Chaldean] migrating to your area?

It is very sad and unfortunate the systematic persecution of Christians in the Middle East, specifically in Iraq.

Pope Benedict condemns the violence against Christians in his World Day of Peace 2011 message, an excerpt:
  1. At the beginning of the new year I offer good wishes to each and all for serenity and prosperity, but especially for peace. Sadly, the year now ending has again been marked by persecution, discrimination, terrible acts of violence and religious intolerance.
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My thoughts turn in a special way to the beloved country of Iraq, which continues to be a theatre of violence and strife as it makes its way towards a future of stability and reconciliation. I think of the recent sufferings of the Christian community, and in particular the reprehensible attack on the Syro-Catholic Cathedral of Our Lady of Perpetual Help in Baghdad, where on 31 October two priests and over fifty faithful were killed as they gathered for the celebration of Holy Mass. In the days that followed, other attacks ensued, even on private homes, spreading fear within the Christian community and a desire on the part of many to emigrate in search of a better life. I assure them of my own closeness and that of the entire Church, a closeness which found concrete expression in the recent Special Assembly for the Middle East of the Synod of Bishops. The Synod encouraged the Catholic communities in Iraq and throughout the Middle East to live in communion and to continue to offer a courageous witness of faith in those lands.
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I offer heartfelt thanks to those Governments which are working to alleviate the sufferings of these, our brothers and sisters in the human family, and I ask all Catholics for their prayers and support for their brethren in the faith who are victims of violence and intolerance. In this context, I have felt it particularly appropriate to share some reflections on religious freedom as the path to peace. It is painful to think that in some areas of the world it is impossible to profess one’s religion freely except at the risk of life and personal liberty. In other areas we see more subtle and sophisticated forms of prejudice and hostility towards believers and religious symbols. At present, Christians are the religious group which suffers most from persecution on account of its faith. Many Christians experience daily affronts and often live in fear because of their pursuit of truth, their faith in Jesus Christ and their heartfelt plea for respect for religious freedom. This situation is unacceptable, since it represents an insult to God and to human dignity; furthermore, it is a threat to security and peace, and an obstacle to the achievement of authentic and integral human development.[1]
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Source: vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/messages/peace/documents/hf_ben-xvi_mes_20101208_xliv-world-day-peace_en.html

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…continuation

Furthermore, Pope Benedict XVI makes the clear distinction religious freedom must prevail and is the “litmus test” from which all other rights follow, excerpt:
  1. It could be said that among the fundamental rights and freedoms rooted in the dignity of the person, religious freedom enjoys a special status. When religious freedom is acknowledged, the dignity of the human person is respected at its root, and the ethos and institutions of peoples are strengthened. On the other hand, whenever religious freedom is denied, and attempts are made to hinder people from professing their religion or faith and living accordingly, human dignity is offended, with a resulting threat to justice and peace, which are grounded in that right social order established in the light of Supreme Truth and Supreme Goodness.
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Religious freedom is, in this sense, also an achievement of a sound political and juridical culture. It is an essential good: each person must be able freely to exercise the right to profess and manifest, individually or in community, his or her own religion or faith, in public and in private, in teaching, in practice, in publications, in worship and in ritual observances. There should be no obstacles should he or she eventually wish to belong to another religion or profess none at all. In this context, international law is a model and an essential point of reference for states, insofar as it allows no derogation from religious freedom, as long as the just requirements of public order are observed.[7] The international order thus recognizes that rights of a religious nature have the same status as the right to life and to personal freedom, as proof of the fact that they belong to the essential core of human rights, to those universal and natural rights which human law can never deny.
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Religious freedom is not the exclusive patrimony of believers, but of the whole family of the earth’s peoples. It is an essential element of a constitutional state; it cannot be denied without at the same time encroaching on all fundamental rights and freedoms, since it is their synthesis and keystone. It is “the litmus test for the respect of all the other human rights”.[8] While it favours the exercise of our most specifically human faculties, it creates the necessary premises for the attainment of an integral development which concerns the whole of the person in every single dimension.[9]
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I highly recommend and urge all to read the entire “World Day of Peace 2011” found here: vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/messages/peace/documents/hf_ben-xvi_mes_20101208_xliv-world-day-peace_en.html

The truth is, violence against non-Muslims are embedded in the Koran, Suras, and hadith.😦 The only way to peace is for Islam to change internally.

God bless all those who suffer from religious persecution. Our Lady of Salvation [the name and patroness of the Chaldean Iraq Church from which 58 died including 2 priests, 70 injured last October 31, 2010 by Islamist terrorists] pray for us!
 
A small correction, Darknight: Sayidat Al-Najat, where the Catholics were massacred, is a Syrian Catholic Church, not Chaldean. The Syrian Catholic Church is the section originally belonging to the Syrian Orthodox Church that has united with Rome, while the Chaldean Catholic Church is composed of believers whose ecclesiastical origin is in the Assyrian Church of the East. A minor point perhaps, but an important one with reference to the historical mosaic of Christianity in Mesopotamia.
 
DarkKnight…

Thanks for illuminating the Church stand…it is a keeper…Great standard…
 
dzheremi said:
A small correction, Darknight: Sayidat Al-Najat, where the Catholics were massacred, is a Syrian Catholic Church, not Chaldean. The Syrian Catholic Church is the section originally belonging to the Syrian Orthodox Church that has united with Rome, while the Chaldean Catholic Church is composed of believers whose ecclesiastical origin is in the Assyrian Church of the East. A minor point perhaps, but an important one with reference to the historical mosaic of Christianity in Mesopotamia.
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Dzheremi, thank you for the correction!👍 I am always open to my brothers and sisters to correct me if I am in error.

By the way, I’ve followed your commentaries in the other thread, “Interfaith: a new dialogue between Muslims and Catholic,” and have learned much from you. I look forward to your future commentaries especially on Islam.

God bless you always.
 
KathleenGee said:
DarkKnight…

Thanks for illuminating the Church stand…it is a keeper…Great standard…
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KathleenGee, thank you for reading and sharing our faith:)

I must say, if this sounds off-topic but concerns me, interfaith dialogue is all well and good; I find it useless in the end to talk about theology/doctrines with Muslims. Instead, we should focus on the human dignity of the person such as the right to religious freedom since it is the basis from which ALL religions can work from.

Pope John Paul II was the catalyst of the eventual fall of communism in Europe. We must remember, communism prevailed in his homeland Poland and the communists did everything to get rid of the Catholic Church. However, Pope John Paul II always worked on the basis of religious freedom. It is only fitting that Pope Benedict the XVI continues the hermeneutic of faith and echoes his predecessor, as he says in “World Day Peace 2011” that:
“[religious freedom is]the litmus test for the respect of all the other human rights”
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And to echo the phrase Pope John Paul II used when communism had its death grip on Europe and said throughout his life to console the world:

Do not be afraid!

God bless you!
 
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