Church teaching on illegal immigration

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Hi, I’m not sure what the church teaches on this and what a catholic must believe. I have an impression that the US bishops want the government to keep illegal immigrants together in the US and help them get citizenship. That does not sound very reasonable to me.

Why are illegals allowed to break the law of a country?
Why aren’t illegals supposed to keep their own family together? Isn’t it their own responsibility to keep their family together even if it means going back to their own country? Why must the government here help keep their family together?

Any answers will be appreciated. Thanks
 
I was also wondering this, and searched some past threads. It seems confusing, as bishops implore immigrants to obey the laws of the country they live in, and the county they seek to enter. This would seem that they oppose and denounce illegal immigration.

However, most things I see in the media (I know, not the most reliable source) seems to show that Catholic bishops are all about keeping illegal immigrants in the country instead of encouraging them to go back to their nation of origin or even “turn themselves in” to the authorities for having broken the law.

There might be something I’m missing…in fact I’m sure there is. I’m looking forward to other responses to clear this up!
 
The Church has no definitive teaching on illegal immigration other than the solution must equitable and fair. The Church has been silent on the law breaking issue because 1) they are afraid of the Hispanics and how they would react if the church stood up for American laws and 2) liberation theology that blames capitalism for all the problems. I never have heard a single priest say that breaking immigration law is a sin much less breaking a law. Many in the church dont consider it a law. They consider it to be unjust because they do not believe in the concept of borders and capitalism. Many see the plight of illegals as a fight against American capitalism. To go against illegal immigration is like giving a green light for exploiting workers and uneven distribution of wealth. Benedict Groeschel said our nation was committing a sin that cries out to heaven for not giving illegal immigrants the money they thought they would get for using stolen and fraudulent social security cards.

What makes me mad is that I feel as though many in the church believe this nation is fundamentally corrupt and that I should be welcoming and supportive of law breaking. In a way, it makes me feel sometimes as if I am sinning and being a racist by opposing illegal immigration. I dont think I am either of those things but when you hear some of sermons and talks that priests give on it you certainly feel that way.
 
Well, I’ve never seen the church “afraid” of standing up for a certain teaching before. Standing up for American laws might offend some hispanics, but standing up for the immorality of artificial birth control offends most of the world! Yet, they stick by what is right. I don’t see fear being a reason.

I am mainly wondering why a more even-handed approach isn’t taken. For example:
“To the Americans, seek to welcome immigrants of all kinds, supply them with basic needs, treat them like brothers and sisters in Christ.
To the illegal immigrants, return to your country of origin willingly so as to avoid breaking the law and burdening foreign social systems. Remain their until you can immigrate legally, for the benefit of all.”

I always see the 1st part, but not the second? :confused:
 
Here’s a handy, dandy 2 page bulletin insert from the USCCB on Immigration (warning, it is in a .pdf format):

usccb.org/mrs/nmw/pdf/Immigration_JFI%20insert.pdf

The Catechism speaks only very briefly about it in CCC 2241:
The more prosperous nations are obliged, to the extent they are able, to welcome the foreigner in search of the security and the means of livelihood which he cannot find in his country of origin. Public authorities should see to it that the natural right is respected that places a guest under the protection of those who receive him.
Political authorities, for the sake of the common good for which they are responsible, may make the exercise of the right to immigrate subject to various juridical conditions, especially with regard to the immigrants’ duties toward their country of adoption. Immigrants are obliged to respect with gratitude the material and spiritual heritage of the country that receives them, to obey its laws and to assist in carrying civic burdens.
Basically, what we all need to keep in mind is respect for the fundamental dignity of the human person. Is it right for civil authorities to break up a family because one member is here illegally? No. Is it right for someone to buck the system simply as a matter of personal convenience? No.

I’m admittedly on the fence with this. In the interest of justice, I understand getting stand-offish and not wanting to give benefits to people who are only here because they managed to break a law without yet getting caught. But in the interest of respect for human dignity, I know that “deport them all” is not a viable moral solution. The reasons that people come here illegally are many and varied.

I’m a bit squeamish that the bishops are so vocally in favor of something that at least appears to be similar to what is being advocated by those same politicians who advocate for abortion. And yet, I’m perhaps even more hesitant to adopt a position that is opposed to what the body of US Bishops is encouraging.

All I know is that I don’t know enough about the issue to make public policy decisions. 🤷
 
The Church teaching on illegal immigration reflects the fact that telling people who are here seeking a better life for themselves and food for their families to go home and starve isn’t exactly a “pro-life” position.

“Illegal immigration” is misdemeanor carrying a maximum penalty of 6 months in jail and/or a fine of $50 - $250.
codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/8/12/II/VIII/1325

Note also that while illegal entry is a crime, remaining here once entered is not a crime. So they are only “criminals” in the sense that a person who chooses to exceed the speed limit are “criminals”.

By the way, the maximum penalty for speeding in Georgia (I just picked it because it’s where I live) is $1000 fine and up to a year in jail.
 
“Illegal immigration” is misdemeanor carrying a maximum penalty of 6 months in jail and/or a fine of $50 - $250.
codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/8/12/II/VIII/1325

Note also that while illegal entry is a crime, remaining here once entered is not a crime. So they are only “criminals” in the sense that a person who chooses to exceed the speed limit are “criminals”.
You make some good points, but this is only partially true. The penalty can also include deportation, which makes it a bit more serious.

Remaining in the country can indeed be a crime. The fine for “failing to depart” after receiving the order is up to $500…per day. This doesn’t include other laws that might be broken, such as document fraud, assisting other illegal entries, and the like.

codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/8/12/II/VIII/1324d

People do have the right to do their best to feed their families. But a poor person, risking fines of these amounts, (not to mention jail time…who feeds the kids then?) might not be taking the best course. I’m sure it varies case-to-case though.
 
You make some good points, but this is only partially true. The penalty can also include deportation, which makes it a bit more serious.

Remaining in the country can indeed be a crime. The fine for “failing to depart” after receiving the order is up to $500…per day. This doesn’t include other laws that might be broken, such as document fraud, assisting other illegal entries, and the like.

codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/8/12/II/VIII/1324d
Failing to Depart is based upon the alien having received a properly executed final order of removal. Of the 20 million+ people here illegally, very, very few have such order’s pending against them.

The VAST majority of illegals aren’t “criminals” in any proper sense of the word. It is a word some people use to misrepresent the problem in order to emotionally charge it.

Also I don’t believe deportation is a penalty per se, so much as its an attempt to “revert to the status quo”.
People do have the right to do their best to feed their families. But a poor person, risking fines of these amounts, (not to mention jail time…who feeds the kids then?) might not be taking the best course. I’m sure it varies case-to-case though.
Perhaps the better question is “How bad must things be in their home country, to make such a gamble worth while?”
 
Again, good points. I don’t know the statistics or procedures for serving an order to leave the county. I only know the well-publicized accounts…so my knowledge here is lacking.
Perhaps the better question is “How bad must things be in their home country, to make such a gamble worth while?”
Ahhh…the lure of the elusive American Dream…

Things don’t have to be very bad at all to see the greener grass on the other side. A “better life” is a more common reason than starvation for immigration into America. However, Christ did not instruct us to seek ye first the higher education. 😉
(Most people who are on the verge of starving can’t make the trip across the desert, or pay a coyote to smiggle them.)

I’m being kind of silly, but the families I know that immigrated here (both legally and illegally) were well fed…they just wanted something “better.” You can call it ambition, greed, or just wanting the “best” for the children. Depends on your perspective. However I don’t judge anyone’s reasons for coming here, because I don’t know what it’s like.
 
I tend to think that the disconnect between the teachings of the Church and the majority of the anti-immigration folks is a lot more nuanced than what I hear out of the bishops’ conference.

The CCC says;2241 The more prosperous nations are obliged, to the extent they are able, to welcome the *foreigner *in search of the security and the means of livelihood which he cannot find in his country of origin. Public authorities should see to it that the natural right is respected that places a guest under the protection of those who receive him.

Political authorities, for the sake of the common good for which they are responsible, may make the exercise of the right to immigrate subject to various juridical conditions, especially with regard to the immigrants’ duties toward their country of adoption. Immigrants are obliged to respect with gratitude the material and spiritual heritage of the country that receives them, to obey its laws and to assist in carrying civic burdens.
The Compendium of the Social Doctrine of the Church says: f. Immigration and work

** 297. **Immigration can be a resource for development rather than an obstacle to it. In the modern world, where there are still grave inequalities between rich countries and poor countries, and where advances in communications quickly reduce distances, the immigration of people looking for a better life is on the increase. These people come from less privileged areas of the earth and their arrival in developed countries is often perceived as a threat to the high levels of well-being achieved thanks to decades of economic growth. In most cases, however, immigrants fill a labour need which would otherwise remain unfilled in sectors and territories where the local workforce is insufficient or unwilling to engage in the work in question.

** 298. Institutions in host countries must keep careful watch to prevent the spread of the temptation to exploit foreign labourers, denying them the same rights enjoyed by nationals, rights that are to be guaranteed to all without discrimination. Regulating immigration according to criteria of equity and balance is one of the indispensable conditions for ensuring that immigrants are integrated into society with the guarantees required by recognition of their human dignity. Immigrants are to be received as persons and helped, together with their families, to become a part of societal life. In this context, the right of reuniting families should be respected and promoted. At the same time, conditions that foster increased work opportunities in people’s place of origin are to be promoted as much as possible.
I take the following as the actual teachings of the Church:

    • More prosperous countries are obliged, as much as they are able, to welcome the foreigner who is in search of security or a better livelihood.
    • Countries are, on the other hand, allowed to regulate immigration for the sake of the common good for which they are responsible (my interpretation: the common good for which a country’s government is responsible is that of the citizens of that country)
    • Once immigrants are allowed in this country, they should be treated with the same respect as citizens of the country.
    • Immigrants are, on the other hand, required to respect the culture and laws of the society that receives them.
    • The more prosperous countries (and their societies) are obliged to promote more improved economic conditions and work conditions in the poorer countries from where immigrants originate.
    The way I see it, the US Bishops’ Conference are about 50% right in what I’ve heard them preach and what I’ve read about what they’ve said.
    • They point out this country’s obligation to receive immigrants. But
    • While they acknowledge the right of the country to regulate immigration, they appear to want the country to open its borders to immigration completely without practical controls.
    • They preach very well at us about our obligation to welcome immigrants. But
    • I don’t see them preaching the obligation to respect the country’s culture and laws to the immigrants.
    • They preach well about a living wage for all. (And rightfully so). But,
    • At the same time, they sponsor groups that encourage day laborers (who, by the very nature of the job, do not have to present authorization to work in this country and who, by the very nature of the job, get paid cash and do not get a 1099 to track the wages)
    The one thing I haven’t seen, above all, are calls to improve life in the countries of origin of immigrants and calls for this country to support improved conditions for the populaces of those countries. Not saying that this doesn’t happen…but I don’t recall having seen it at all nor have I ever heard it.

    My wish: that I’d hear the bishops preach and take action on the WHOLE of the Catholic teaching on the subject, not just the half that they do discuss.
 
The problem is that there is NO legal way for a non-skilled worker from Mexico to enter this country legally. Anti-immigration folks go on and on about stopping illegal immigration, but have opposed any type of comprehensive immigration reform. There is nothing wrong with a government controlling immigration into its country. There is something wrong with not allowing legal immigration and then demonozing those who come to fill jobs we Americans offer them. There is something wrong with breaking up families in order to deport immigrants.
The Bishops have been very clear and have said that they support immigration reform, its just that they justly believe that we should have an humane way for the poor to immigrate here when there are jobs available for them.
Historically, governments have only been able to stop mass migrations of people through very draconian means. I don’t think that is what we want for this country. Right now, there is a surplus of labor in this country. In 10-20 years, due to demographic changes, there will be a shortage.
 
Given that the topic is what the Church teaches about illegal immigration and not about our personal opinions about it, let’s get back to what the bishops are saying. The most significant point is this: we have no moral obligation whatever to act in accordance with their wishes, expressed or implied.

The reason for this is that the Church has no position on any specific action that should or should not be taken. The issue of immigration, illegal or otherwise, is a prudential (political) issue about which we are free to form our own opinions and to act as we as individuals feel is best.

The bishops have seriously overstepped their authority to imply otherwise.

Ender
 
The problem is that there is NO legal way for a non-skilled worker from Mexico to enter this country legally. Anti-immigration folks go on and on about stopping illegal immigration, but have opposed any type of comprehensive immigration reform. There is nothing wrong with a government controlling immigration into its country. There is something wrong with not allowing legal immigration and then demonozing those who come to fill jobs we Americans offer them. There is something wrong with breaking up families in order to deport immigrants.
The Bishops have been very clear and have said that they support immigration reform, its just that they justly believe that we should have an humane way for the poor to immigrate here when there are jobs available for them.
Historically, governments have only been able to stop mass migrations of people through very draconian means. I don’t think that is what we want for this country. Right now, there is a surplus of labor in this country. In 10-20 years, due to demographic changes, there will be a shortage.
I agree that there needs to be a better way to deal with the immigration issue.

Two things to consider:

First, an open immigration policy is bad for labor. It artificially increases the supply of unskilled and minimally skilled workers, making it far easier for employers to pay less for everybody. Yes, you can have union contracts forcing higher wages and yes, you can have government mandates, such as the minimum wage, Davis-Bacon or Walsh-Healy rules, and the like, but those artificialities just cause the costs to be passed directly on to the consumer (which nullifies any benefit of the mandate). The natural way to control wages is to create an environment where there is a balance between the available quantity of the right quality of worker and the demand for that quality of worker. There should always be a slight shortage of workers.

Ideally, a worker should always be able to find another job. What that does is it allows the worker to guard against abuse for himself. If his employer doesn’t treat him properly, he could move on and find one who will. Employers, knowing this, will be more likely to treat the worker well in order to keep that worker.

A good immigration policy, without regard to where the immigrant comes from, is key to maintaining that balance. An excess balance of workers, whether skilled carpenters from Mexico, engineers from China, programmers from India, or physicians from Pakistan (I think I have all the stereotypes covered, right :cool:), provides an increase of hard-working people who are more than willing to put up with abuse, low wages, and long hours than those who may have been here for generations.

It’s one thing if we have virtually no unemployment. It’s another thing altogether when one has an 18% under or unemployed (not seasonally adjusted) level. (Don’t believe me, look at the U-6 number at the link)

Again, following the teachings of the Church (i.e., promotion of better economic conditions in the migrants’ countries of origin) would provide the ultimate relief from the problems created by immigration in this regard.

The second issue comes into that of the social assistance state (ref Encycl Ltr Centesimus Annus 48). The State has usurped much of what should be done either by the Church (through the gratuitous sharing of the blessings by the members) or on a far more localized basis. We have, as a society, allowed the political community to grievously abuse this for almost 80 years. This abuse is an occasion for resentment against immigrants (one of the principal strawmen raised by anti-immigrant people is the meme of the anchor baby. They don’t recognize that the problem here is not the anchor baby nor his mother, but the socialist underpinnings that make the anchor baby and his mother so expensive to all of us)

I’m not saying that this does or does not occur. But the issue needs to be addressed is that of the social assistance state, not the natural result of that social assistance state.

Finally, you mention, In 10-20 years, due to demographic changes, there will be a shortage. The question I have to ask is if the solution is mass immigration or if the solution is a return to the teachings of the Church? Not simply the issue of our society aborting and contracepting itself into oblivion, but the underlying economic issues in society and the materialism/consumerism of the members of society that lead them toward that point.

Like I said in my earlier post, they’ve got it about 50 percent. But they need to teach ALL of the teachings of the Church…not just the half that lines up with a certain political leaning.
 
Just an opinion:

At least people still want to come to the USA by virtually any means. There is some comfort in that thought. America still is a symbol of a virtue: Hope – even in these crazy times. When people start fleeing the USA – that’s when the worrying begins.

The USA should get out of the monetary welfare and healthcare business, reject socialism and leave it all to private Charity – in the USA and other countries. In that way, the people, will have the choice to work together and practice the virtue of Charity.
 
Given that the topic is what the Church teaches about illegal immigration and not about our personal opinions about it, let’s get back to what the bishops are saying. The most significant point is this: we have no moral obligation whatever to act in accordance with their wishes, expressed or implied.

The reason for this is that the Church has no position on any specific action that should or should not be taken. The issue of immigration, illegal or otherwise, is a prudential (political) issue about which we are free to form our own opinions and to act as we as individuals feel is best.

The bishops have seriously overstepped their authority to imply otherwise.

Ender
My, such opinions…I guess I’m waiting for all Europeans to go back home where they belong, give California and Texas back to the Mexicans and the rest of the United States to the Indian Tribes which were genecide by Everyone…also try to remember that all Spanish speaking people, from Spain (Cortez landed here and claimed for Spain) and the Mexican tribes and peoples were protected and at the same time, converted until there was NO other Religion for these people but Catholic…do you really know how many of us there are? Can you imagine the loss to the Catholic Church should she turn her back on all of them, NOW? I can’t even imagine the absolutes millions and millions of us…the RCC have always protected and even died to protect us the oppressed peoples…how many of you on this thread are of European origen? With European ethnicity…come to the land of promises for a better future? Your parents, grand parents…maybe you should consider going back home to the origin of your families too?
 
My, such opinions…I guess I’m waiting for all Europeans to go back home where they belong, give California and Texas back to the Mexicans and the rest of the United States to the Indian Tribes which were genecide by Everyone…also try to remember that all Spanish speaking people, from Spain (Cortez landed here and claimed for Spain) and the Mexican tribes and peoples were protected and at the same time, converted until there was NO other Religion for these people but Catholic…do you really know how many of us there are? Can you imagine the loss to the Catholic Church should she turn her back on all of them, NOW? I can’t even imagine the absolutes millions and millions of us…the RCC have always protected and even died to protect us the oppressed peoples…how many of you on this thread are of European origen? With European ethnicity…come to the land of promises for a better future? Your parents, grand parents…maybe you should consider going back home to the origin of your families too?
http://www.photoanon.com/images/uds2wopdbe9beugw8p0n.gif

Straw man Alert!!!

Maybe the question you should ask is how many of us who are here have descendants who came here in violation of the immigration laws that were in place at the time of their immigration rather than advancing that old horse that was beaten to death years ago.

But let us take this straw man and really apply it:

Perhaps the so-called native Americans should go back to Siberia, and ultimately Mongolia where they originated a few thousand years ago prior to migrating to this country.

Perhaps the Anglo-Saxons should go back to Germany where they came from.

Perhaps the Normans should leave the UK, France, Spain, Italy and go back to Norway where they came from.

On the other hand, perhaps the Church could do what She always has done and continues to do elsewhere:
  • Encourage and perform corporal and spiritual works of mercy for the poor, where they are
  • Work to improve the condition of the poor, where they are
  • Encourage the wealthy and the powerful to consider the virtue of justice in the actions they take
 
Given that the topic is what the Church teaches about illegal immigration and not about our personal opinions about it, let’s get back to what the bishops are saying. The most significant point is this: we have no moral obligation whatever to act in accordance with their wishes, expressed or implied.

The reason for this is that the Church has no position on any specific action that should or should not be taken. The issue of immigration, illegal or otherwise, is a prudential (political) issue about which we are free to form our own opinions and to act as we as individuals feel is best.

The bishops have seriously overstepped their authority to imply otherwise.

Ender
This is wrong. The bishops have a moral responsibility, as our primary teachers, to provide guidance on moral issues, even when they are politically charged. They have not implied that we have to follow them to the tee. We have a moral obligation to give our Bishop’s opinions their due consideration.
The idea that the Bishops should be silent on the critical social issues of our times is simply a means to appease our consciences when we don’t agree with them.

My bottom line, the anti-immigration folks ignore the realities of how hard it is to legally immigrate to this country, they continue to spew garbage about how hispanics don’t want to assimilate into our culture or learn our language like our European ancestors did, they support government enforcement actions that are plainly immoral immoral, they totally abuse the term amnesty. I can only assume that at root, their true feelings are rooted in bigotry. This bigotry is not only racially based, there is a great deal of anti-catholocism mixed in. They are nothing more than a modern day Know Nothing party,
 
The problem is that there is NO legal way for a non-skilled worker from Mexico to enter this country legally. Anti-immigration folks go on and on about stopping illegal immigration, but have opposed any type of comprehensive immigration reform. There is nothing wrong with a government controlling immigration into its country. There is something wrong with not allowing legal immigration and then demonozing those who come to fill jobs we Americans offer them. There is something wrong with breaking up families in order to deport immigrants.
The Bishops have been very clear and have said that they support immigration reform, its just that they justly believe that we should have an humane way for the poor to immigrate here when there are jobs available for them.
Historically, governments have only been able to stop mass migrations of people through very draconian means. I don’t think that is what we want for this country. Right now, there is a surplus of labor in this country. In 10-20 years, due to demographic changes, there will be a shortage.
You do realize that not all of the illegal immigrants are of Hispanic discent. True, the majority of them are but not all of them. Just try to remember that, please.
 
My bottom line, the anti-immigration folks ignore the realities of how hard it is to legally immigrate to this country, they continue to spew garbage about how hispanics don’t want to assimilate into our culture or learn our language like our European ancestors did, they support government enforcement actions that are plainly immoral immoral, they totally abuse the term amnesty. I can only assume that at root, their true feelings are rooted in bigotry. This bigotry is not only racially based, there is a great deal of anti-catholocism mixed in. They are nothing more than a modern day Know Nothing party,
Your brush is a tad bit broad, friend.

You may wish to re-think your statements.

(One of the deacons in my parish is a Filipino immigrant. He and his wife had to go through 15 years of paperwork. I know of no more anti-illegal immigrant person than this deacon)
 
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