Church's Wealth

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Bobby Jim:
Also “the church” is more complex than he’s probably thinking. Each diocese is basically an independent entity, at least for financial purposes. And yes, a lot of them in the US are in the red. My diocese, for example, is reportedly bleeding away its endowment at an alarming rate… they said they’re not using collection money to pay off lawsuits, so this is how they’re doing it. They’re spending down the principal, so within a year or two their income from these investments will be nil. If you ask me, they should require seminarians to learn some basics of financial management, since as pastors they will be faced with managing the day-to-day finances of individual parishes, not to mention the bishops who oversee the finances of whole dioceses.
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You know, I explained this to him - that we are no different than his Baptist church. When they need to build a new church or fund an outside project, they have to ask for donations from the faithful - Oh, No, he says! They collect one time at their services and their church manages to cover everything they need to do with that one collection at their services! The Catholic Church is always wanting more and more!

These people ought to hold seminars on how to handle money!? I don’t know of any church that can manage to do what they do from only a small collection that also has to cover all the maintenance, insurance, etc. as well! Amazing!

And sooooooo frustrating!
 
Y’all have been so helpful!! Thank You so much. I will consider whether it’s worth bringing the subject up again. As Fidelis said - why throw my pearls before swine!

But, if anyone has anything else to add - I’ll take it in!
 
Do you remember the story of St.Lawrence? He was a deacon of the church in charge of the treasury. He was brought before the magistrate demanding to see the riches of the church. St.Lawrence complied and brought a group of the poorest of the poor. He told the government, this is the wealth of the church…the poor! He was condemned to death.I think today, the wealth of the church is in its works of charity for those who need it the most. The Catholic church operates more charitable institutions and hospitals, clinics and missions worldwide than any other. I am sure they are all operating in the red!
 
Someone mentioned on the news the other day that the annual budget of the Vatican for running the world-wide Church is approximately equivalent to the budget of Chicago, Illinois.
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I also heard that the Vatican budget is even less than that of the University of Notre Dame.
 
If the Church were as wealthy as everyone thought, we could just cancel all the Sunday collections. In reality, most parishes are in debt. I don’t know about the Vatican but I suspect they are not that far from insolvency either. After all, there is no Sunday collection for the Vatican–just a once a year collection. And you know how little people contribute to “2nd” collections!
 
Maybe your husband should serve on the parish Finance Committee. They would be happy to have his help in locating all this wealth.
 
Certainly there are a lot of parishes that can not afford to turn on the lights, or heat the building on Sundays, or maintain the pipe organ, or fix the leaky roof, or any of these other seemingly routine maintenance things. And especially in parishes with declining attendance and a lot of older people on fixed incomes, collections aren’t that big - if you have 40 people at mass, who each drop a dollar or two into the collection plate, that’s not even enough to keep the lights on at that Mass. This is why many parishes in cities are closing or consolidating. They’re also cutting way back on programs that aren’t part of the “core mission” of mass and sacraments, e.g. parish schools, soup kitchens, youth groups, all those things that are nice to have but take some extra money to keep going.
 
Who is this nationally syndicated Catholic priest ?

1.* Further the Vatican has a known set of investments in stock of over $500 million.* Source for this claim please.

2.*Another statement, made by a nationally syndicated Catholic priest, … Our assets and real estate holdings must exceed those of Standard Oil, A.T.&T., and U.S. Steel combined. * Must exceed doesn’t mean that it does in fact exceed. What source does the ‘nationally syndicated priest’ give us for this claim?

3,The Wall Street Journal said that the Vatican’s financial deals in the U.S. alone were so big that very often it sold or bought gold in lots of a million or more dollars at one time. In what issue of the Wall Street Journal would I find this claim?

4.the wealth of the Vatican, which in the U.S. alone, is greater than that of the five wealthiest giant corporations of the countrySource for this claim please.

5.When to that is added all the real estate, property, stocks and shares abroad, then the staggering accumulation of the wealth of the Catholic church becomes so formidable as to defy any rational assessment. Source for this claim please.
 
Let’s not forgot. The Vatican is a country! I doubt there is a country in existance that does not operate with a multi million dollar budget, even third world countries do. It takes money.

Correct, the Vatican art is considered ‘priceless’ therefore marked only as 1 euro. This is not uncommon among churches, etc…
 
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awalt:
For example, some financials were revealed for the Boston diocese some time ago, in connection with a bond that was being issued to fund a building project. The Boston archdiocese listed its assets at Six Hundred and Thirty-five Million ($635,891,004), which is 9.9 times its liabilities. This leaves a net worth of Five Hundred and Seventy-one million dollars ($571,704,953). It is not difficult to discover the truly astonishing wealth of the church, once we add the riches of the twenty-eight archdioceses and 122 dioceses of the U.S.A., some of which are even wealthier than that of Boston.
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What nonsense!

The “assets” are the churches, Cathedral and schoolrooms! No doubt some obsessive has valued these up as if they were supermarket plots! I suppose you would like the church to shut up shop. Close the schools churches etc, and dig up the cemeteries to realise the money???
Further the Vatican has a known set of investments in stock of over $500 million.
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Do you realise how little that is for a worldwide institution? There are private individuals with many times more money than that. Some sport professionals must be getting close?

It is roughly a quarter of what the city of Manchester needs to build a new tramline! The US Government spends that on paperclips!
 
The Catholic Church is blessed with much wealth. It is important to look, however, not only at how much the Church has, but what it does with its resources. For example, I am fortunate and attend a parish in the tony suburbs of Washington, DC. According to my parish’s weekly bulletin, the average weekly collection for Sundays where I attend is close to $25,000. Depending on how you look at it, that number might sound like a lot of money (or a small amount of money relative to where you are). What that number does not tell you is that our parish supports a sister parish in Haiti. Without our help, it would be likely the parish in Haiti might close (not to mention that a new Catholic elementary school was just opened in our diocese). Not only that, but our parish constantly donates its resources to helping the poor, etc. At Easter, we took up collections and sent Easter baskets to the troops. So, while you may look at a figure and say that the Church has great wealth, remember what the Church does with its resources.

Pax Vobiscum,

Stephen
 
Once I read that the Cardinal of Chicago’s residence was worth well over 10 mil. I have been to it a few times - good times - party with the Cardinal at the end of ‘Theology on Tap’ program - highly recommended. Back to the topic. Is it really worth that much? Probably not, but as they say in real estate - location, location, location.
 
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stbruno:
I think today, the wealth of the church is in its works of charity for those who need it the most. The Catholic church operates more charitable institutions and hospitals, clinics and missions worldwide than any other. I am sure they are all operating in the red!
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Oh, Boy!!! This is where he really blew a gasket! That’s when when he more or less told me to “shut up!” and then flatly refused to continue the conversation! It wasn’t pretty!!!
 
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JimG:
Maybe your husband should serve on the parish Finance Committee. They would be happy to have his help in locating all this wealth.
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WHAT A FABULOUS IDEA!!!
 
you cannot convince anyone who has a conspiracy theory mind set of anything. Don’t try. The question you need to ask yourself is how should you, in the future, have a conversation with someone who answers you with a display of bad temper and a “shut up” - because that, believe me, can be very tiring.

May I suggest the Women of Grace website? Just plug in Women of Grace in your search engine. It has give me a lot of encouragement, as I am surrounded by abusive “shut up” types - and I am no longer the victim but the messenger. (not to imply that you are a victim- honest). Anyway, it really helped.
 
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DianJo:
Oh, Boy!!! This is where he really blew a gasket! That’s when when he more or less told me to “shut up!” and then flatly refused to continue the conversation! It wasn’t pretty!!!
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Have you ever noticed that there is not even a batted eye over millions of dollars on a sports stadium:nope: But God’s house is apparently supposed to be a shack.😦 I remember a certain repentant woman in the Gospels that was chastised for using expensive oil on Jesus:rolleyes:
 
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LSK:
you cannot convince anyone who has a conspiracy theory mind set of anything. Don’t try. The question you need to ask yourself is how should you, in the future, have a conversation with someone who answers you with a display of bad temper and a “shut up” - because that, believe me, can be very tiring.

May I suggest the Women of Grace website? Just plug in Women of Grace in your search engine. It has give me a lot of encouragement, as I am surrounded by abusive “shut up” types - and I am no longer the victim but the messenger. (not to imply that you are a victim- honest). Anyway, it really helped.
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Thank you, this sounds encouraging, I’ll definitely check it out. Believe me, I need some encouraging!
 
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Lisa4Catholics:
Have you ever noticed that there is not even a batted eye over millions of dollars on a sports stadium:nope: But God’s house is apparently supposed to be a shack.😦 I remember a certain repentant woman in the Gospels that was chastised for using expensive oil on Jesus:rolleyes:
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Oh my! How right you are! I hadn’t even thought about that! Thanks!
 
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