College Student Copyright Laws

[hawksnest23]

Hey there! So here’s an interesting question: I’m a student in college, and in some of my classes teachers assign readings from many different books. They scan excerpts of these books and post them for us to read, so maybe you’re reading a chapter or so from this book. I’m pretty sure this is technically illegal, because the books have copyrights, which makes me feel bad for reading them, but also I don’t think I can be expected to buy each of these books, and I do have to do the reading for homework. What do you guys think the best path is for this issue?

 

[twf]

This probably falls under fair use as its for academic purposes. If the instructor is posting the excerpt and asking you to read it, the legalities are on them, not you.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

What twf said. Colleges have legal departments who monitor these things, so you don’t have to. Reprinting excerpts for “fair use” in an academic teaching setting is a standard college policy and is done at just about all the college out there, including big name law schools, who certainly have knowledge of the law and do not go around breaking it.

In addition, if permission is somehow needed from the author to use some material, the college knows how to go about getting it and takes care of it.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

I work for a college. This is almost always considered “fair use”. Most of the professors would send the books down to the copy shop with the pages noted and have the copy staff–familiar with the laws–make the copies.

Many times, copies are necessary because a book is out of print and has changed things—the publishing industry itself is rife with abuses. My philosophy professor had a particularly hard time because they’d constantly change editions in the most simple books. Why a book on Arostotle’s philosophies had to be annully updated is bizarre to the point of criminal.

 

[Lou2U]

It’s not an issue - often colleges have permission to reproduce a certain amount of pages or chapters from a book. I know at my university students could photocopy a certain number of pages of a book, as dictated by the publisher, so I don’t see why professors wouldn’t be entitled to something similiar.

 

[exnihilo]

I’m pretty sure this is technically illegal, because the books have copyrights

As others mentioned it is perfectly fine under the fair use doctrine. With copyright the ‘technically illegal’ line is most often very blurry. So I wouldn’t stress at all about it.

Why a book on Arostotle’s philosophies had to be annully updated is bizarre to the point of criminal.

Universities are a cartel. Theses days they exist primarily to enrich themselves.

 

[Crusaderbear]

I teach HS science and do the same thing, fair use for education. As long as I don’t charge or try and make a monetary profit, it is legal. I also include that caveat on the items as well. It amounts to maybe 6 a year.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

Universities are a cartel. Theses days they exist primarily to enrich themselves.

The universities are actually better publishers when it comes to frequent editions of textbooks. Pearson, McGraw Hill, Cengage, Wiley…they all engange in near-criminal activities when it comes to textbook production.

Given the number of options a student has if they actually look (online courses, CC, state school) it’s completely wrong to call universities a “cartel”

 

[exnihilo]

Their prices are always going up. The point of a cartel is high prices. They restrict competition. That doesn’t mean there is no competition. And they are highly subsidized if not actually run by the state. That is definitely a cartel.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

Their prices are always going up. The point of a cartel is high prices. They restrict competition. That doesn’t mean there is no competition. And they are highly subsidized if not actually run by the state. That is definitely a cartel.

Actually, it’s the students themselves that are often at the root of driving up prices. They want new cafeterias that serve gourmet food. They want doctors and nurses on campus full time, they want “free” extensive tutoring. They want numerous psychologists. Dorms need to be “state of the art” with individual rooms and bathrooms. Top performaing arts. Lots of entertainment, the fastest wifi, free computer repairs…

…I could go on and on and on.

Most colleges today are working to try and lower prices to stay more competitive but there are now things that are considered “integral” to the college experience that was basically unheard of a decade ago.

My university used to have “triples” which were the cheapest rooms–3 students to a room. It no longer has any…and many “doubles” are now “singles”. They have built 2 large dormitories with all singles or “unit” structure where a few singles have adjoining bathrooms and their own “living room”.

Before my time, the triples were “quads”. And they were the cheapest way to live on campus. Now even off-campus student apartment renters have found that students are willing to pay more money for more space. It used to be that a nearby apartment house with spacious rooms always had 8 students per unit—two to a room. They haven’t had that in nearly 15 years—now students live one to a room.

The high cost of college education today is nearly directly proportional to the services that students expect. Most colleges do NOT want to raise prices. Most are NPO’s that are struggling to find the cheapest way to acomplish all the things that students want.

Even community colleges are suffering. It used to be that it was easy for a CC to hire an adjunct. People came to class. They spoke to the professor after. They left…or went to the libary Now, CC students want a fancy cafeteria to hang out in. They want “office hours” from their adjuncts. They want to be tutored for free. They want their classroom to be the “smart” classroom. They want campus programming. They want to watch their “team” play sports.

All of this comes at great cost.

If you’re going to make claims about higher education, you should at least be informed as to why it’s happening and not place the blame on the NPO colleges that are trying to figure out how to give students what they want and keep costs down.

Believe me, schools WANT to keep their prices down—but they also run the fine line of not being attractive if they don’t offer the glut of “services” and cater to the crazy demands that have become part of college life today.

 

[exnihilo]

Believe me, schools WANT to keep their prices down—but they also run the fine line of not being attractive if they don’t offer the glut of “services” and cater to the crazy demands that have become part of college life today.

Most schools are government run. The government never cares about keeping prices down. They receive money directly from the government to pay operating expenses. They receive money through government grants for research. The cost to their consumers (students) is subsidized through grants, scholarships or even just student loan subsidies.

The administrators don’t need to worry about price because they are so highly subsidized. But even if they did as long as the government gravy train is running there is nothing they can do to lower prices. Subsidies push prices up. The university Econ department should be able to explain that to the administrators if they weren’t typically so soclialist/fascist.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

Xanthippe_Voorhees:

Believe me, schools WANT to keep their prices down—but they also run the fine line of not being attractive if they don’t offer the glut of “services” and cater to the crazy demands that have become part of college life today.

Most schools are government run. The government never cares about keeping prices down. They receive money directly from the government to pay operating expenses. They receive money through government grants for research. The cost to their consumers (students) is subsidized through grants, scholarships or even just student loan subsidies.

The administrators don’t need to worry about price because they are so highly subsidized. But even if they did as long as the government gravy train is running there is nothing they can do to lower prices. Subsidies push prices up. The university Econ department should be able to explain that to the administrators if they weren’t typically so soclialist/fascist.

You have no idea what you’re talking about.

I suggest you actually look at the cost-drivers of college.

 

[midori]

Another vote for “it’s legal”.

Colleges/university usually have things called an “educational license”. It allows them to, say, take a chapter from the book or a journal article and reproduce it in a specific way and then distribute it in a specific way. When they have something that they’re not able to reproduce/distribute in the way that’s in compliance with the educational license, then they’ll often pull that particular journal article, place it at the library’s desk, and have you go request to read it in-library. And hope that ten other people from your class don’t choose that same moment to go read that journal article at the same time. But sometimes, you do have to wait.

So, if your professor is posting stuff (all we got were photocopies back in the day), chances are that it’s (a) on a closed system; (b) probably through some sort of proprietary software/program if it’s not on a CD/DVD; (c) not being sold for profit; and (d) is either in one-chapter chunks or is less than a certain percentage of the entire book.

If it’s being thrown up on the professor’s personal website for the whole world to access, I’d be skeptical. If you’re being charged $150 for a CD that contains ten complete books, I’d be skeptical. But otherwise, I’d presume that the professor is acting in compliance with the institution’s educational license.

 

[exnihilo]

You have no idea what you’re talking about.

I suggest you actually look at the cost-drivers of college.

Actually I do. I have looked at what drives up college prices. Just because I don’t agree with your claim, that government run universities really want lower prices but can’t somehow achieve them, doesn’t mean I don’t know what I’m talking about.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

Xanthippe_Voorhees:

You have no idea what you’re talking about.

I suggest you actually look at the cost-drivers of college.

Actually I do. I have looked at what drives up college prices. Just because I don’t agree with your claim, that government run universities really want lower prices but can’t somehow achieve them, doesn’t mean I don’t know what I’m talking about.

If they were as your claim then prices would be driven lower because students would gravitate towards the lower cost opportunities and price out the higher cost ones.

There’s no reason, in 2017, that any student needs to pay University level tuition for their freshman year classes. They could all be satisfied by CLEP, AP, edX and community colleges for a fraction of the cost. Almost every college has articulation agreements with CC’s and generous transfer policies. Some up to 90 credits transfer. (that’s 3 years if you don’t know)

It’s the students who are opting out of the free and low-cost options—not the universities. For a uni to run a freshman gamut of classes-- English, Math, Eco, Basic CS, Basic science classes they need a building, a professor, tutors, they need “support staff” a cafeteria, sports, dorms and on and on and on.

Yet a student can grab a $10 study guide off of Amazon (or get it at the local library for free) study for a couple weeks then take a $30 CLEP test. Yet most are willing to pay $1,500-3,000 to a university for that same class. A few are willing to do the CC route and pay $400-$900 for that class.

Almost all colleges accept CLEP credit without a question.

So why in the world are students spending 100x what they need to?

Because they don’t want to stay home and take a year to do CC. They don’t want to “ruin” their summer with taking CLEP.

The issue needs to be addressed with the clientele first.

It’s not the colleges fault that they are giving the students the services they demand.

 

[1ke]

What do you guys think the best path is for this issue?

Follow your instructor’s direction on the reading materials. If they provide you materials, you should work under the assumption they have acquired the correct permissions or fair use applies. Fair use doesn’t always apply.

However, universities take copyright law seriously and they do not want to pay large fines for the actions of their staff and instructors.

In addition to fair use, there are also services that many companies and universities subscribe to, for example Copyright Clearinghouse, that allows use of materials through a paid subscription. Between fair use and a clearinghouse service, along with older materials and government publications that are public domain your university is crossing its “Ts” and dotting its “Is”. The university does not want to get sued. For courses on art, music, film, literature, etc., they are certainly purchasing rights to show and distribute where needed.

Here’s a good site on Fair Use:

Former UW Colleges Information

Bottom line: as a student you need not be concerned. It is the university’s responsibility to ensure proper procedures are followed. You have no guilt in committing any sin here.