Colton Burpo and Akiane Kramarik

[Drea_Mea]

Having just seen the movie “Is Heaven for Real” last night… I got to thinking.

The stories of Colton and Akiane… Both 4 when they first allegedly saw Jesus… Akiane’s parents were atheists so she didn’t know who that was at the time… at 6 she became proficient at painting, self-taught, and at 8 she painted the face of Jesus, the man she had visions of… and when Colton saw the painting when his father was researching it… he said that was what Jesus looked like when he visited heaven. He had previously rejected other depictions of Jesus as not looking like him.

I guess recently someone did some overlapping of the “Prince of Peace” painting with the shroud of Turin and the video maker claims to see the resemblances between the two. It’s on youtube, I’ll have to search out the link.

I’m just curious… as a Catholic… what should we think about this other than an uplifting story? I asked a priest and he said the Church doesn’t hold opinions of these types of issues since those involved are not Catholic.

It would be nice if they did look into things like this… if the Pope could hold a conference with actors like Russell Crowe because he appeared in the movie Noah, I wonder why he couldn’t meet with the artist or the little boy who said he went to heaven… and question them.

Do any Catholics here hold any credence other than “nice story”, “Lovely painting” to Colton and Akiane?

 

[robwar]

I read the book and saw the movie. In my opinion I felt both were real experiences by both children. In terms of the Catholic church and even though both were not Catholic families, their experiences would fall under private revelations which the Catholic church does not require Catholics to believe in or hold credence to. There are a number of saints that have had similar visions, apparitions etc but agains the Catholic Church doesn’t require belief in these things and for approved apparitions, there is a pretty exhaustive investigation. I know from some of the other threads that have touched on Colton Burpo, there are those that don’t believe the story. I think the story is true because the 4 year old came back with knowledge of a greatgrandpa and miscarried sister, things he would not have known otherwise. that just my take on it. Others feel differently. The same is Akaine who was being raised as an atheist. Both emphasized how much God loves children and their importance. I think that is a much needed message in a culture that throws away them.

 

[GEddie]

I’m not sure that the Church would pronounce on these occurrences even if Catholic families were involved, unless they became pervasively identified in the popular mind with the Church.

Even near-death experiences, which these were not, have drawn no formal teaching by the Church.

In the end, these are suggestive and hopeful narratives, but no more than that.

ICXC NIKA

 

[Memaw]

I’m not sure that the Church would pronounce on these occurrences even if Catholic families were involved, unless they became pervasively identified in the popular mind with the Church.

Even near-death experiences, which these were not, have drawn no formal teaching by the Church.

In the end, these are suggestive and hopeful narratives, but no more than that.

ICXC NIKA

I was under the impression that Akiane’s family did become Catholic. I have seen several of her paintings and they are really good. I really don’t see any comparison to these two different types of experience. I think the father of the little boy did most of the writing and I was not impressed by the book. Haven’t seen the movie. The Catholic Church is very cautious as to what it jumps in on, even when the people involved in it are Catholic. You can’t expect the Church to get involved in everything someone decides to make a movie of. God Bless, Memaw

 

[GEddie]

Of course the father did most, if not all, of the writing.

A young child is seldom an engaging author.

ICXC NIKA .

 

[Memaw]

Of course the father did most, if not all, of the writing.

A young child is seldom an engaging author.

ICXC NIKA .

I saw an interview of the boy with Hanitty, and he couldn’t answer most of the questions Hannity asked him, Mostly he said, ’ it’s hard to explain, or, ’ I can’t put it into words.’ etc. Well I’d like to know how he ever had enough words to fill a book and then a movie. God Bless, Memaw

 

[robwar]

I saw an interview of the boy with Hanitty, and he couldn’t answer most of the questions Hannity asked him, Mostly he said, ’ it’s hard to explain, or, ’ I can’t put it into words.’ etc. Well I’d like to know how he ever had enough words to fill a book and then a movie. God Bless, Memaw

St. Paul in II Corinthians described an experience where he went to heaven or was caught up there and said it was indescribable. I would think that if someone has an experience like this that our human words and understanding can’t describe what heaven is like to others back on earth. That seems to fit the experiences others have had. Akaine said that there were a million more colors in heaven than on earth. The way the book was designed how Colton’s experience unfolded after his surgery and how his family put the pieces together of what happen with the things he began to talk about and know about afterwards. I think the better focus on all of this is not a detailed description but that heaven is for real, our final designation to be with God. Heaven isn’t just a nice idea on paper but a reality that is our reward from Jesus for following Him.

 

[mikekle]

I saw an interview of the boy with Hanitty, and he couldn’t answer most of the questions Hannity asked him, Mostly he said, ’ it’s hard to explain, or, ’ I can’t put it into words.’ etc. Well I’d like to know how he ever had enough words to fill a book and then a movie. God Bless, Memaw

Well, obviously the kid had help writing the book, in the same way those 3 girls who were held hostage by that guy Castro in OH recently, they are all coming out with books, I doubt they are writers though, so they get actual writers to listen to their story and write a book, this is normal when an interesting story comes along but the people/person involved is not or cannot write. It takes pretty much talent to write a book anyway.

Furthermore, I think most of us, if we had this kids experiences, we too would have problems putting heaven into words, or even trying to explain it…I know I would.

 

[Drea_Mea]

I guess I’m just trying to make sense of it. I grew up as the typical Catholic who saw all the miraculous things happen to Catholic Saints (Popes, Nuns, Monks etc) - and very rarely do you hear of this happening in modern times. Most that happens in modern times always seem to be hoaxes, or easily discredited.

But this, I don’t know. I have to say I kind of want to believe the girl especially - That Akiane who painted “Prince of Peace” -

I mean, at 8 years old… I drew a picture of my family and they still looked like stick figure aliens, small bodies, too many fingers, giant heads with tiny facial features, the parents abnormally tall compared to the kids… (actually, That’s pretty much how I still draw ) And here she paints a hyper-realistic painting of Jesus’ face… not really knowing him because she was raised by Atheist parents (although her dad always made the distinction that he was agnostic and his wife was atheist.)

No lessons, no religion, 8 years old, and she paints this:

I mean, the only thing I could understand is if she’s a complete fraud and they’re passing someone’s paintings off as her’s… but there is no evidence of that. Or maybe she’s just some prodigy and they’re faking the Jesus visions - but again, there’s no evidence of that either.

I am just about to start the “Heaven is for Real” book (never actually read it… just browsed online synopsises… synopsisisis… synopsisees… I read the general gist of it.) so I’m going to hold off on Colton’s story.

So now you have the dilemma, take it as a wonderfully uplifting story… but put little stock into it since it’s not officially sanctioned by the Church… or believe there is something more miraculous to it? I guess that’s what I’m trying to figure out.

I’m usually not stumped. I can usually smell poo poo, but I guess maybe my hang up is you just want to believe little kids. When I listen to my little nephews who are the age Colton and Akiane were when they allegedly saw Jesus… they’re very innocent and honest and will say things that usually end up embarrassing the heck out of their parents.

LOL. I remember being that age, dragged from rummage to rummage with my mom and Grandma and I was getting tired. I knew my mom only did rummages when my grandma was in town so I turned to my grandma and said, “When are you going home Grandma? I’m bored of rummages. If you go home we don’t have to go to anymore.” LOL just blunt and honest. Or the time when I was 2 and couldn’t see over the checkout counter at the store, but told the cashier she had the most beautiful voice I had ever heard. or at 3 when I bluntly told a waiter he smelled like bad perfume. I didn’t understand not to say that kind of stuff… I just said what was in my heart as the honest to God truth. So, you want to believe kids. Maybe that’s the deal.

While the dad seems to speak a lot (in interviews I’ve seen.) for Colton… Aikane speaks pretty well for herself, and she always sounded honest enough.

Renny Roo…

Here’s that video I mentioned in my initial post. youtube.com/watch?v=UisIxFV_M6M

meh. I dunno. Maybe I’m just over thinking it. I tend to be a thinker. Probably why I toss and turn till 2, 3am every night. That or the millions of crickets and frogs outside my window at the moment.

 

[mikekle]

I guess I’m just trying to make sense of it. I grew up as the typical Catholic who saw all the miraculous things happen to Catholic Saints (Popes, Nuns, Monks etc) - and very rarely do you hear of this happening in modern times. Most that happens in modern times always seem to be hoaxes, or easily discredited.

Exactly!

I dont understand this either, as back in biblical days God/ Jesus seemed so willing to perform miracles, and do other supernatural acts right in front of large crowds, I find it very odd there is not 100s of REAL youtube videos of Gods ‘handiwork’ in modern times, there is plenty of evidence Satan is doing these kinds of things in our world today, (Just look at how many UFOs are sighted every single day around the world…), so why not God?

 

[Drea_Mea]

I just finished “Heaven is for Real” the book. ((SPOILERS if you haven’t read it.)) though it’s been out for quite a while… but still… spoiler alert. lol

I actually feel the movie made it seem more real than the book did. with the book, I have a few issues.

In heaven EVERYONE has wings? hmm - from all I know about angels in the Catholic sense (and granted it’s minimal), angels don’t seem to have actual wings, so why would we? He met Satan… Not sure how one would meet Satan in heaven, but He never seems to explain it. he clams up whenever he recalls meeting Satan… and he said he saw his dad battling a monster with swords. Its also odd that early on, his father (Todd) talks about how Colton loves swords… and it just so happens in heaven, everyone carries swords.

I’m also unsure about the nails in the palms. From what I’ve read… it would more than likely have been, he would have been nailed through the wrist. If we believe the Shroud of Turin is the image of Christ, that image has the marks on the wrists. But he said the ‘markers’ were in his hands.

Kinda lost me there. Although, my mom stated… God can do anything… maybe He changes each person’s perception to what they would be more easily able to understand in heaven. Especially if they were merely there for a visit.

We don’t know what heaven is really like, so it’s possible I guess. But I don’t know. The one thing both my mom and I joke about, these things seem to happen an awful lot to protestants. You just don’t hear Catholics talking about going to heaven, or having visions of Jesus anymore. And lately, it feels like Catholics really could use a miracle or two to remind us of who we are religiously and spiritually.

We know way too many “In name only” Catholics. they go around openly doing so many things that violate the church’s dogma and teachings, then come to church and administer communion like it’s no big deal.

I don’t know. maybe my values are just old fashioned and I don’t understand “Catholics of today” (even though I’m the same age or younger than most of them.) lol

 

[Memaw]

I just finished “Heaven is for Real” the book. ((SPOILERS if you haven’t read it.)) though it’s been out for quite a while… but still… spoiler alert. lol

I actually feel the movie made it seem more real than the book did. with the book, I have a few issues.

In heaven EVERYONE has wings? hmm - from all I know about angels in the Catholic sense (and granted it’s minimal), angels don’t seem to have actual wings, so why would we? He met Satan… Not sure how one would meet Satan in heaven, but He never seems to explain it. he clams up whenever he recalls meeting Satan… and he said he saw his dad battling a monster with swords. Its also odd that early on, his father (Todd) talks about how Colton loves swords… and it just so happens in heaven, everyone carries swords.

I’m also unsure about the nails in the palms. From what I’ve read… it would more than likely have been, he would have been nailed through the wrist. If we believe the Shroud of Turin is the image of Christ, that image has the marks on the wrists. But he said the ‘markers’ were in his hands.

Kinda lost me there. Although, my mom stated… God can do anything… maybe He changes each person’s perception to what they would be more easily able to understand in heaven. Especially if they were merely there for a visit.

We don’t know what heaven is really like, so it’s possible I guess. But I don’t know. The one thing both my mom and I joke about, these things seem to happen an awful lot to protestants. You just don’t hear Catholics talking about going to heaven, or having visions of Jesus anymore. And lately, it feels like Catholics really could use a miracle or two to remind us of who we are religiously and spiritually.

We know way too many “In name only” Catholics. they go around openly doing so many things that violate the church’s dogma and teachings, then come to church and administer communion like it’s no big deal.

I don’t know. maybe my values are just old fashioned and I don’t understand “Catholics of today” (even though I’m the same age or younger than most of them.) lol

I think one of the problems of today is we think “God can do anything” as long as it fits what we want. I was turned off by most of the book and not even interested in seeing the movie. I only read the book because my grandaughter brought it over and was very excited about it. But after I read it and we went over many things, she realized she just got caught up in the idea of the whole thing and never really thought about what it said. God doesn’t change the truth to fit each persons ideas. No matter what age they are. Your very thoughtful and a critical thinker which is almost a lost art today. So many just jump on something that “sounds good” to them. Hang onto your values, they are not old fashioned, the Church is 2,000 years old and still teaches the fullness of the TRUTH. I don’t understand many of the “Catholics of today” either and I’m a whole lot older than you. God Bless, Memaw

 

[robwar]

I just finished “Heaven is for Real” the book. ((SPOILERS if you haven’t read it.)) though it’s been out for quite a while… but still… spoiler alert. lol

I actually feel the movie made it seem more real than the book did. with the book, I have a few issues.

In heaven EVERYONE has wings? hmm - from all I know about angels in the Catholic sense (and granted it’s minimal), angels don’t seem to have actual wings, so why would we? He met Satan… Not sure how one would meet Satan in heaven, but He never seems to explain it. he clams up whenever he recalls meeting Satan… and he said he saw his dad battling a monster with swords. Its also odd that early on, his father (Todd) talks about how Colton loves swords… and it just so happens in heaven, everyone carries swords.

I’m also unsure about the nails in the palms. From what I’ve read… it would more than likely have been, he would have been nailed through the wrist. If we believe the Shroud of Turin is the image of Christ, that image has the marks on the wrists. But he said the ‘markers’ were in his hands.

Kinda lost me there. Although, my mom stated… God can do anything… maybe He changes each person’s perception to what they would be more easily able to understand in heaven. Especially if they were merely there for a visit.

We don’t know what heaven is really like, so it’s possible I guess. But I don’t know. The one thing both my mom and I joke about, these things seem to happen an awful lot to protestants. You just don’t hear Catholics talking about going to heaven, or having visions of Jesus anymore. And lately, it feels like Catholics really could use a miracle or two to remind us of who we are religiously and spiritually.

Your mom is correct and this was a 4 year old boy that had this experience. Revelations describes people in heaven with wings. Revelation was another book written by St. John after being caught up in heaven where there is no time and one can see past, present and future all at once. I think that is what Colton was trying to describe with the battle and the swords. I also don’t think that the comparison between Catholic type experiences and Protestant is fair. The Catholic Church fully investigates these sorts of experiences before someone could write a book using Catholic in the title (imprimatur). Protestants don’t have anything like that and hence forth someone can print a book claiming anything that happen to them. There have been a number of saints that have had heaven visits. Akaine had a similar experience and now the family is Catholic. The book also was written 7 years after he had this experience. The family didn’t rush to put this out there at all. I think people get too caught up in trying to look at details such as wings and horses etc and so on and don’t stop and look as the message of love especially for children, of hope for all and that heaven is for real. One thing Todd Burpo did work on in his church was children ministries and building them up because Colton keep telling his father at how much God loves children.

 

[Drea_Mea]

I have to read Revelations again. I don’t remember it mentioning that people had wings in heaven… but it’s been a long time since I read it straight through, and it’s not usually covered in church except a few times around Easter when they read verses from it.

I guess it’s just odd to think of, because growing up Catholic, we always heard about the miraculous visions of Catholic saints… and when it happened to protestants, it was usually rejected BECAUSE they didn’t have someone to answer to, there was no investigations and research to prove it happened before it was accepted.

It just struck me after I watched the movie, about how believable it was. They are kids… 4 years old when it happened to both Colton and Akiane. I mean… at 4 years old… kids are brutally honest. My mom always said… if you want to know what’s going on in a family, ask the kids first - they’ll tell you the truth. (at least till they turn 8. By 8 they’ve become good at fibbing.)

I was unaware that Akiane’s parents became Catholic. I knew they realized God existed after accepting her unusually professional talent came from Above, but I didn’t realize they chose a religious denomination. That’s interesting.

I guess, it’s hard for people to understand. Going to heaven, coming back and seeing all these amazing things our minds can’t grasp. I guess it would be like me seeing a color that doesn’t exist in our crayon box… and trying to explain that color to people who have never seen it. And for a 4 year old to find the right words can’t be easy considering they know so few words.

And that’s why, maybe my mom is right. If God knew he was taking Colton for a visit to send him back with a message… he made heaven something a 4 year old could understand and explain. Wings, Angels, His dad’s Pop, his sister, Still not sure about the whole Satan thing. Todd said Colton never explained Satan to him… he’d just clam up.

Was anything ever written about Akiane? I’d like to know more about her experiences and match them up to Colton’s. Just out of curiosity since Colton said her painting of Jesus was what he looked like.

 

[Drea_Mea]

Speaking of: Does anyone know of a good book similar to Heaven is for Real?

 

[marytk]

If you google Akiane you can see more. I did when I read “Heaven Is for Real”. I think I remember there was more recent information

To some of the above no one every claimed that Colton wrote the book. It isn’t a book of a revelation but a family story centered about this child’s experience.

 

[Memaw]

If you google Akiane you can see more. I did when I read “Heaven Is for Real”. I think I remember there was more recent information

To some of the above no one every claimed that Colton wrote the book. It isn’t a book of a revelation but a family story centered about this child’s experience.

I don’t think we said the boy wrote the book but I do believe his father filled in the gaps. The boy didn’t have much to say when recently interviewed by Hannity. However did he have enough to say to fill a book and make a movie???God Bless, Memaw

 

[Drea_Mea]

To be fair… You’re taking about being on a national news program with cameras on you knowing millions of people are watching vs. Talking to his parents. And if you read the book… they pulled the information out bits at a time. I didn’t see that interview but I saw others recently and he seemed attention shy. Being on tv is scary in a way.

Earlier this year I filmed a segment for a weather channel special coming out late summer/early fall… and it wasn’t easy even though I was discussing a phenomenon I studied for 3 years and wrote a full chapter in my book on. The big camera freaked me out at first. Some kids just get immediately camera shy.

Besides… you also have to remember he is now 18 having to talk about memories from when he was 4… Things he had a hard time describing to his dad when the memory was fresh because to him there are no earthly words for some things he saw.

So you can’t look at an interview and be… “he barely talks so how did he fill a book” cause again. … Big difference talking on national tv vs mom and dad. And even then it took the course of a year or two to get the story.

 

[Memaw]

To be fair… You’re taking about being on a national news program with cameras on you knowing millions of people are watching vs. Talking to his parents. And if you read the book… they pulled the information out bits at a time. I didn’t see that interview but I saw others recently and he seemed attention shy. Being on tv is scary in a way.

Earlier this year I filmed a segment for a weather channel special coming out late summer/early fall… and it wasn’t easy even though I was discussing a phenomenon I studied for 3 years and wrote a full chapter in my book on. The big camera freaked me out at first. Some kids just get immediately camera shy.

Besides… you also have to remember he is now 18 having to talk about memories from when he was 4… Things he had a hard time describing to his dad when the memory was fresh because to him there are no earthly words for some things he saw.

So you can’t look at an interview and be… “he barely talks so how did he fill a book” cause again. … Big difference talking on national tv vs mom and dad. And even then it took the course of a year or two to get the story.

I can see a 4 year old not being able to explain something like that but an 18 year old that has lived with this soo much, thru a book and now a movie. That wasn’t the first time he was on camera. All seems a bit to much of the father’s influence to me. Have you read the book?? God Bless, Memaw

 

[Drea_Mea]

I finished the book 2 days ago.

I still think it’s unfair. He’s a teenager. Not all people are gifted with public speaking abilities.

My cousin is just 4 years younger than me and our conversation would go like this:

“How ya been?”

“Good”

“What’s been new with you?”

“Nothing”

“I heard you got a promotion at work”

“Yeah.”

“Do you like it?”

“It’s cool”

Awkward silence

he’s been that way all his life. Talking to him is like pulling teeth… and to see his Facebook, you’d think he lives an interesting enough life that he’d have so much to talk about. Especially when you don’t see him that often.

Just because he grew up around cameras and this story doesn’t mean he’s a natural speaker… and he is only just a teenager. Teens always want to play it a little cool. The interviews I have seen of him in recent times since the movie’s release, he looks like he’s just a shy kid.

Like I said… I researched a phenomenon for 3 years… I wrote a book and devoted an entire chapter to it… and when I was asked by the weather channel to film this phenomenon I’m really an expert on at this point… it was disconcerting - and I’m a lot older than him with more public speaking experience under my belt.

So it isn’t fair to look at interviews and say that has baring on the book.

And like I said… this happened when he was 4. 14 years have passed. Memories aren’t always stronger as you age. Sometimes, especially when something happens at so young an age… memories fade. Or sometimes you talk about something so often… you just get tired of answering the same questions over and over.