"Come as you are"?

[AnneElizabeth]

Can it be said of the Catholic Faith that God wants us to ‘come as we are’? Should we fear to approach? Or is fear a part of approaching God as coming as we are?

Thanks in advance for any replies.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Of course God calls us to come as we are.

Fear, is not that we are to afraid to go to God, but that we have reverence and humility when we do.

Jim

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Really great question.

“Come as you are” feels more right than “become something you’re not yet and then come.”

Is that what you meant?

When it comes at actually coming to “the banquet” which I’m thinking is another term for “enter the kingdom,” then how you are, how you think and feel, your attitudes toward self, other, things, pretty much all of it… this is because the kingdom represents a state of mind where all of Jesus’s paradoxes make sense. Last shall be first. Greatest is the one who serves, etc.

But as far as coming to Jesus for counsel, friendship, warmth, that door is wide open. Because if we stick with Jesus, He will show us the way to the banquet.

Alan

Edit:

Of course God calls us to come as we are.

Fear, is not that we are to afraid to go to God, but that we have reverence and humility when we do.

Jim

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Yes, but make sure you’re dressed modestly first!!!

 

[AnneElizabeth]

…

“Come as you are” feels more right than “become something you’re not yet and then come.”

Is that what you meant?

…

Alan, yeah… sort of. I mean that I had read in some Catholic writings not to even dare come into a church if you have mortal sin on your soul- or something to that effect. Its confusing. What hope do I have if that is the truth? Perhaps the authors were addressing those who don’t believe… but if they didn’t believe, why on earth would they BE in church or even go to one??? Maybe things were different in those days? Some of the writings were from centuries past.

I just wanted to know basically if "come as you are' is a Catholic teaching.   I know the Protestants teach this.

JimR, I question the teaching that ‘fear’ means simply reverence and humility… Although I believe those are a part of it, why did St. Paul say “carry out your salvation with fear and TREMBLING”… No one trembles when they just reverence and are humble. Why tremble? Perhaps the answer lies in the translation from its original language?

There is a Psalm too that says something to the fact of putting a knife to your throat rather than going against the Lord. I’m not saying anything against what you are saying, but that I sincerely doubt that teaching that is going around that 'fear of the Lord" is simply reverence. I kind of feel this puts God on a ‘buddy’ level rather than placing Him on the Throne of one’s heart. And that is scary to me.

 

[AnneElizabeth]

Yes, but make sure you’re dressed modestly first!!!

Juliane, I laugh at the popcorn eating/watching emoticon. I know what sort of discussion this question of modesty leads to. Yet sadly, I’m not even sure what modesty is anymore either. How does that come into play with “come as you are”?

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Alan, yeah… sort of. I mean that I had read in some Catholic writings not to even dare come into a church if you have mortal sin on your soul- or something to that effect. Its confusing. What hope do I have if that is the truth? Perhaps the authors were addressing those who don’t believe… but if they didn’t believe, why on earth would they BE in church or even go to one??? Maybe things were different in those days? Some of the writings were from centuries past.

I just wanted to know basically if "come as you are' is a Catholic teaching.   I know the Protestants teach this.

It’s very simple. That’s a crock of stink, and is absolutely false.

You did well to follow your instincts, because it is insane to think that we are going to bring God and sinners closer toward each other, by locking them out. The Church is a hospital for sinners.

Matt 9:12, Mark 2:17, and Luke 5:31 all say that. Here’s one example:

[BIBLEDRB]Matt 9:10-12[/BIBLEDRB]

I’m interesting in seeing those writings. If you have a link, please share it. If it says what you are saying, and has a place to comment, I might just have to do like the poor woman and throw in my :twocents: .

Alan

 

[Deo_Gratias42]

You shouldn’t “come as you are” to receive communion.

 

[J_Peterson]

Alan, yeah… sort of. I mean that I had read in some Catholic writings not to even dare come into a church if you have mortal sin on your soul- or something to that effect. Its confusing. What hope do I have if that is the truth? Perhaps the authors were addressing those who don’t believe… but if they didn’t believe, why on earth would they BE in church or even go to one??? Maybe things were different in those days? Some of the writings were from centuries past.

I’ve never heard anything like that! What a horrible thing to say, mass if more benifitial to the sinner than the saint. You’re not to receive Communion in a state of mortal sin but we are still required to go to mass.

 

[wmw]

Yes, ALL should be willing to come with all our faults and have no pretensions that we are not sinners, but we should be as clean (washed, fresh from a confession, and well dressed) as we can possibly be because we want to be as presentable to share in His service as much as possible!

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Juliane, I laugh at the popcorn eating/watching emoticon. I know what sort of discussion this question of modesty leads to. Yet sadly, I’m not even sure what modesty is anymore either. How does that come into play with “come as you are”?

One of the churches we attend has a “come as you are” philosophy. People show up in just about anything. I haven’t actually seen pajama bottoms yet, but it wouldn’t be surprising, considering how casual the Masses there have become over time. Modesty to me means that dresses don’t show a lot of leg, no shorts, no strapless tops, no t-shirts with messages on them, no flip-flops. That’s pretty much the minimum dress code a church should expect, but I personally don’t feel comfortable with sleeveless dresses or tops in church. But who enforces the dress code? The priest there is proud of his “everyone is welcome” motto.

 

[Richca]

Can it be said of the Catholic Faith that God wants us to ‘come as we are’? Should we fear to approach? Or is fear a part of approaching God as coming as we are?

Thanks in advance for any replies.

Hello AnneElizabeth,
Yes, God loves us in spite of our sins, defects, and failings. Fear in approaching God is not yet perfect love of God as St John says, “There is no fear in love, but perfect love drives out fear because fear has to do with punishment, and so one who fears is not yet perfect in love” ( 1 John 4:18). Of course, who of us has perfect love of God? Fear in approaching God is an acceptable love of God as it is written “The beginning of wisdom is fear of the LORD” ( Proverbs 9:10). I don’t think we should concentrate so much on fearing God as loving him as can be seen in the devotion to the Sacred Heart of Jesus. However, I, for one, as my love for God is not perfect, will sometimes think of the eternal punishment of hell as a stimulus for loving God. This is acceptable but as I said, it is not perfect love of God. God wants us to love and serve him for who he is, what he is, what he does for us, and not so much as fearing him. For God is infinitely loving as St John says “God is love” ( 1 John 4:8). God wants us to love him as a Father and He wants to share his beatitude with us.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

AnneElizabeth

JimR, I question the teaching that ‘fear’ means simply reverence and humility… Although I believe those are a part of it, why did St. Paul say “carry out your salvation with fear and TREMBLING”… No one trembles when they just reverence and are humble. Why tremble? Perhaps the answer lies in the translation from its original language?

Fear of the Lord is one of the seven gifts of the Holy Spirit,

CCC
1831 The seven gifts of the Holy Spirit are wisdom, understanding, counsel, fortitude, knowledge, piety, and fear of the Lord.

Fear of the Lord isn’t fear of his wrath, but rather, fear not to offend him because of our filial-Love for him.

It’s the similar love a child has for a parent. They love their parents and seek not to displease them, because they love them, not because they fear the punishment their parent will give them.

In all, it’s based on reverence and humility in the presence of God, which are fruits of love.

Jim

 

[AnneElizabeth]

I’ve never heard anything like that! What a horrible thing to say, mass if more benifitial to the sinner than the saint. You’re not to receive Communion in a state of mortal sin but we are still required to go to mass.

I could be getting the gist of what was said wrong. So I hope I didn’t seem like I was inferring that it was correct… only that in my remembrance of what I read sounded like that was the idea- that don’t dare come inside if in mortal sin. I could be that it was just meant to show that the church is a holy place… Sorry… I probably was misunderstanding it. I think it was some saint’s writing. I’ll have to see if I can find it.

I agree that one is not to receive Communion in a state of mortal sin. I understand how that doesn’t not play a part in ‘come as you are’.

 

[Richard320]

Can it be said of the Catholic Faith that God wants us to ‘come as we are’? Should we fear to approach? Or is fear a part of approaching God as coming as we are?

Thanks in advance for any replies.

Yes.

One need not have full understanding, impeccable morals, and perfect faith to show up at Mass.

That would be as ridiculous as Weight Watchers telling someone “Lose 50 lbs and then we can help.” If you could do it alone, why would you need Weight Watchers?