Communication before Marriage & Surprises in it

[Ms_Manners]

On so many forums, I see people talk about all the things that surprised them and caused problems when they got married and came home as husband and wife or started living together after a long relationship. Even some people who lived together before they got married ran into these things.

Sometimes I am just very suprised at some things people say they never talked about. For example, the numer of children (if any) and their upbringing, their roles in the marriage and household, making decisions, roles of their parents, even something so in-your-face as deciding where they would live.

What did you talk about when you were dating, and later when you decided to get married?

When you got married, were there many surprises? What were some of the biggest?

Did you feel like you were prepared for marriage by talking honestly about everything, or do you think some big issues (number of children, religion, roles of man and woman) can still come up?
Do you feel you should have talked about something that you didn’t cover?

 

[Debora123]

I agree with you. I don’t understand how communication can be so poor with someone you’re going to marry.

No, there were no surprises in our marriage when we got married. We knew each other inside and out.

 

[underacloud]

I remember doing our pre-marriage weekend course and having very little to talk about in some of the exercises because we’d already discussed the issues. On the other hand, some couples were stunned by the experience, where it raised issues that they’d never considered…like whether to have children and how many…stunning!

There are no doubt things that will come up that are issues that haven’t been discussed. But I believe it is the habit and manner of communication as much as the subjects of communication that help establish a good marriage. If you can discuss important issues and develop a constructive manner for such discussions, when difficult topics arise, you deal with them better.

 

[TBenedicta]

My husband and I have said that we’re both glad we knew each others’ stance on children (the number we wanted, how they should be raised, when we should start having children, even naming styles), finances, politics, faith, and lifestyle before going into marriage. Neither of us are the type to really want to marry someone who disagrees with our fundamental views. For me, it would be stressful having to battle my husband on everyday issues! We have so much consensus sometimes that it’s ridiculous. (In a good way.) We look at each other and laugh, saying “I can’t believe how much we agree on this!”

Children is the big thing for us right now. I’m pregnant with our first child, and I’m also a full time nanny to a one-year old and a two-year old. Occasionally, my husband will accompany us on playdates or trips to Gymboree. My husband, seeing the way other families live + parent (as I do every day at work), is really grateful that we agree on a stricter parenting style and a frugal lifestyle.

As for faith, I can’t imagine not sharing that with him. My parents have an interfaith marriage, so it certainly can be done, but I love that we have the same relationship with God and worship in the same Rite. It’s invaluable. And again, no battling it out with whether our kids will be raised this-or-that.

I don’t know how people haven’t discussed these topics, though, because they’re covered in PreCana… so are these couples just not paying attention? All converts? Or what?

Better to discuss it waaaaay ahead of time, even if you think it’s an “awkward” or “uncomfortable” topic, and be able to say “you know, I don’t think this relationship is headed towards marriage after all”, than to uncover everything after the fact. Agreement (or at the very least, knowledge of disagreement) can make life so much more peaceful. And don’t we all want peaceful, loving homes?

 

[Ms_Manners]

Not to run off, I’ll share my own story. (Just took me some time to type it. )

We talked a lot.

We talked about me being vegan and wanting a vegan partner, family and home.
(Well, actually, I never told him how exactly important this one thing was because I also wanted him to make that decision naturally, and not because of me. It was the only thing I intentionally hid from him. He was already vegan (decided on his own and doesn’t regret it) when he learned that I wouldn’t have agreed to share my life with him if he weren’t.)

We talked about how important animals are to me and their place in my life and home. My dog, rescuing more eventually.

We talked about the importance of giving back, volunteering, for people and animals.

We talked about money, and were very happy to find out that we felt the same about spending, saving, joint accounts, credit, etc. We also agreed to never go against something we agreed on in this area. Neither of us would spend money in a way the other didn’t approve, regardless of the amount. We both have access to all the money and all the bills.

We talked about children and what kind of parents we wanted to be.

We talked about how we want to arrange the household stuff and chores. We spent a lot of time together and got to know each other’s habits and ways.

We talked about personal habits, like smoking and drinking (neither of us does and we both prefer to avoid it).

We talked about what we wanted our relationship to be like, how we wanted to approach new things and solve problems, how we thought a couple should communicate. One thing that has always been very clear is that we care honestly and deeply for each other.

We talked about our relationships with our parents and their role and place in our lives as a couple and new family, their role in our children’s lives.

We talked about religion. At that time, I wasn’t living completely like a Catholic, so it was mostly about being respectful and realizing that I would want to raise the children Catholic.

And a million other things.

Unplanned, I moved in with his family. It was an emergency, I had nowhere else to go, his family let me move in. For a few months it was great. We didn’t have much money, I was getting used to working much more, we were all getting used to sharing our living space.
Still we didn’t argue at all, we’d been honest before and it was really working out.

And when we felt safe, God hit me (us?) over the head. And hard.
We realized that religion, the what-if of me getting back to it for real, was the only thing we never considered. And now this supposedly wonderful thing was coming between us. For the first time ever there was something we were unsure about.
So we started talking again. What if I this, what if you that, what if we never… I started looking in all sorts of places for some guidance and similar experiences.
All the previous talking came in so handy.
It’s taken us a while, but we managed to tell each other how we felt deepest deep down, what we really wanted, decided how to deal with things.
(We still live together, in his parents’ house, but no longer as married, and we talked to a priest. It is not the most fortunate situation, but we talk a lot, support each other and remind each other of what is really important, only now it is the same thing for both of us, we are very determined to do it right.)

 

[Ms_Manners]

Thank you for sharing!

I agree with you. I don’t understand how communication can be so poor with someone you’re going to marry.

No, there were no surprises in our marriage when we got married. We knew each other inside and out.

Debora, I’ve noticed you here while reading different threads, you seem to have a really great relationship with your hubby.

I remember doing our pre-marriage weekend course and having very little to talk about in some of the exercises because we’d already discussed the issues. On the other hand, some couples were stunned by the experience, where it raised issues that they’d never considered…like whether to have children and how many…stunning!

Our pre-marriage course was only 5 hours, 1 hour each day of one week, and not interactive at all!
The priest talked about some really basic stuff, like how you shouldn’t yell at each other and beat your kids, and some people had just never thought about that. Even the married couple who came as speakers said that it was only after their second was born that they realized that it wasn’t going to work if they have a child every time they are intimate.

 

[AthenaC]

Well, I did have one husband become a different person after the wedding, so there’s that. He also told me he was Catholic (had recently been through RCIA) and then later told me that he thought God and the Devil had some sort of mutually dependent existence …

That seems to be what happens with a lot of people; two people get married and then one of the people change into someone else.

With my current husband, we talked about everything that was important to us, and then made our decision to get married. That meant that there was still some discovering to do, so I don’t know if that counts as a “surprise” … but I can’t think of anything in particular that was a surprise. We did figure out last month (after 4 years) that our communication styles during arguments really irritate each other (so we are fixing that), but I don’t know if that counts as a “surprise.”

 

[maltmom]

I’m so sorry you are going through this Ms Manners. In my case it was what I found out after he cheated and I threw him out. We were both Baptist. I knew he’d been married before. He had two grown children. I thought we had talked about everything and that we’d be together forever. Once he cheated, I started to find out that the vast majority of what I’d been told about his was all lies. He’s been married and divorced 5 times. I didn’t know that and almost threw up when I found out it was true. He’d cheated on all of them. He was looking for someone with money who would take care of him. Obviously he didn’t believe me when I told him exactly how much business and personal debt I had. The things I found out were unbelievable. I’m now divorce, Catholic and I obtained my decree of nullity a couple of months ago.

I thought we communicated. We talked all of the time and never had a fight. Communication and agreement is so important. The key is for both people to be honest.

My prayers are with you.

 

[TheDoors]

I was engaged to a woman for two years and was in the sixth month of pre-wedding counselling. At the beginning we’d taken this personality test kind of thing. Went over the questions that it seemed should be asked before entering marriage: “Kids? How many?” “Christmas where?” “Who handles the money?” etc. etc. It was the last day of pre marriage counselling and the woman’s pastor (she had insisted on her church, her pastor) sits us down and says “Well, it looks like you two have discussed and agree on most things, so that’s good. I do see one trouble spot, question 46 ‘Do you believe you have the emotional commitment to sustain a lifetime of marriage?’. Now, Gene, you put ‘yes’, which is usual, but XXXX, you put ‘no’.”

Needless to say, I was suprised.

However, I’m suprised to hear that most pre-marriage counselling doesn’t have this kind of thing. It seemed an excellent way to insure that everybody was on the same page before ringing the bell and sealing the deal. Sure saved me alot of heartache.

 

[Ms_Manners]

I’m so sorry you are going through this Ms Manners.

We are doing much better now, it feels great to know that in this view also, such an important one, we are going in the same direction.
We talked to a priest together, in the neighboring parish though, and got some tips from him and info on a group at church, people our age, we can join together. It is so good that we can now share this, too, I am much more at peace now.

I am sorry that you had such a negative experience. I will also pray for you.

 

[Debora123]

Debora, I’ve noticed you here while reading different threads, you seem to have a really great relationship with your hubby.

Thank you. To be perfectly honest, it’s both a blessing and a curse. Since we were so open and honest and transparent with each other throughout our dating relationship, we reached the “boring” stage earlier than most couples do I think.

We’ve only been married for 2 years, but it feels like 50 already! Lol.

We just know each other so well, that sometimes I have to struggle to keep from seeing him as a brother or a best friend.

I look back at the excitement of the mystery we once had, and I miss it. I miss getting all dressed up to see him, I miss feeling sexy, I miss the butterflies, the warm fuzzies…

 

[Debora123]

I was engaged to a woman for two years and was in the sixth month of pre-wedding counselling. At the beginning we’d taken this personality test kind of thing. Went over the questions that it seemed should be asked before entering marriage: “Kids? How many?” “Christmas where?” “Who handles the money?” etc. etc. It was the last day of pre marriage counselling and the woman’s pastor (she had insisted on her church, her pastor) sits us down and says “Well, it looks like you two have discussed and agree on most things, so that’s good. I do see one trouble spot, question 46 ‘Do you believe you have the emotional commitment to sustain a lifetime of marriage?’. Now, Gene, you put ‘yes’, which is usual, but XXXX, you put ‘no’.”

Needless to say, I was suprised.

However, I’m suprised to hear that most per-marriage counseling doesn’t have this kind of thing. It seemed an excellent way to insure that everybody was on the same page before ringing the bell and sealing the deal. Sure saved me alot of heartache.

Yes, we had that “test” during our pre marriage counseling too. It’s supposed to show how well the couple knows each other, how well they line up in beliefs/etc, and how ready they are for marriage. The priest sat us down for a routine session with the results of our tests and told us we had the highest score he’d seen in a long time. Lol.

 

[maltmom]

We are doing much better now, it feels great to know that in this view also, such an important one, we are going in the same direction.
We talked to a priest together, in the neighboring parish though, and got some tips from him and info on a group at church, people our age, we can join together. It is so good that we can now share this, too, I am much more at peace now.

I am sorry that you had such a negative experience. I will also pray for you.

I’m so thankful you guys are doing so much better. Thank you for your prayers.

TheDoors reminded me of something. When I was 19 I got engaged. Again, neither of us were Catholic. My brother (non-Catholic) was engaged to a Catholic woman. He gave us an early Christmas present. He paid for us to go to a convent for a weekend Engaged Encounter. We did all of the workbooks and talked about everything. We went in November and I called off our wedding on New Year’s Eve. I realized after that weekend that we weren’t meant to be together and that we would end up divorced. As difficult as it was I told him to never contact me again. It really hurt, but a divorce would have been so much worse. We had a lot we agreed on, but there were also too many important things that we were never going to agree on.

 

[_Jenn]

We had no surprises. We talked about things far before most couples typically talk about “big” topics, I think. When we got to our EE weekend, we had such little to discuss when we came together to talk about each topic, because we already had done it and were already on the same page! So many other couples there, however, ended up actually fighting because they had no idea their significant other saw things in certain ways.

When we did our FOCUS (I think that’s what it was called - was a while back - been married 11 1/2 years now) test when we had our first meeting with our priest, he jokingly asked us, at the meeting to go over it, it we had cheated. LOL I told him it’s because we had already talked about everything!

 

[Debora123]

We had no surprises. We talked about things far before most couples typically talk about “big” topics, I think. When we got to our EE weekend, we had such little to discuss when we came together to talk about each topic, because we already had done it and were already on the same page! So many other couples there, however, ended up actually fighting because they had no idea their significant other saw things in certain ways.

When we did our FOCUS (I think that’s what it was called - was a while back - been married 11 1/2 years now) test when we had our first meeting with our priest, he jokingly asked us, at the meeting to go over it, it we had cheated. LOL I told him it’s because we had already talked about everything!

Haha, yep! My experience to a tea!

 

[Cat]

55 years old, and I’ve been married 33 years to the same wonderful man that I started dating in high school. We dated for six years before we got married in 1979.

We talked about everything…

…except the history of mental illness in both of our families. THIS was a surprise to both of us when it surfaced in my husband almost 15 years after we were married.

Of course, back then, even in the early 1980s, people didn’t really talk about mental illness. There was still a lot of misunderstanding about conditions like depression or addictions; a lot of people, including me, thought depression and additions were things that people could “reason themselves out of” by thinking positive thoughts, thinking about all their blessings, comparing themselves to others who are worse off, having willpower, etc. I had been raised in a family that thought depression was a “spiritual condition,” and that believed that alcoholism was someone’s own fault.

When my husband was in his early 30s, he started manifesting symptoms of depression, and this was a shock to both of us. It shouldn’t have been a shock, since his grandfather suffered from depression (but of course, no one recognized it as a chemical inbalance that could have been treated had the meds existed back then).

This was a very hard time in our marriage. I basically shut my husband out of my life for the sake of my own survival. I had no idea how to deal with his condition, and so I dealt with it by ensuring my OWN survival, which in retrospect probably wasn’t a bad idea. But it was bad for HIM to lose his “companion” during his own struggle.

It took several years to work through this. My husband spent two years working with a psychologist on cognitive therapy and a psychiatrist on the chemical inbalance. He had to try several anti-depressants, and each time, several months had to pass so that the psychiatrist could assess the side-effects and the efficacy of the meds. The side-effects of many anti-depressants are nasty, BTW.

Eventually they found an anti-depressant that actually worked and had a minimum of side-effects. My husband is still on it. He will never go off this med. It’s not a drug he can “wean himself off of.” He has tried, under the direction of M.D.s, to cut the dosage, and the results of such experiments were not good. So thank God for that med!

And the cognitive therapy worked, too. My husband had to unlearn thought patterns that he had practiced for decades (e.g., extreme bizarre pessimism over the most minor situations; e.g., in his mind, running out of gas led to a chain of thought in which an entire neighborhood blew up and hundreds died in the explosion and it was all his fault for not maintaining his car, which was because he was disorganized and lazy…you get the idea!).

The meds gave him the ability to actually apply the cognitive therapy and to think more realistically.

For my part, I did a lot of reading about depression and learned about the chemical nature of the condition. This was very helpful for me, as I stopped trying to tell my husband to “just be happy.” Obviously that’s like telling a cancer patient to “just cure yourself.”

As the years have passed, our younger daughter has suffered through her own bout with clinical depression (we received a phone call from her university when she was a soph, and they told us that she was dangerously depressed and that they would like our permission to get her into treatment immediately to prevent a possible suicide). Her husband knows all about this, BTW, and knew about the family history before he ever married her.

And now our young nephew is on meds for depression (age nine). I’m glad that his parents are being pro-active about helping him to cope with this condition.

As for MY side of the family–we suffer from various psychoses, and several family members have been confined to asylums because they lost contact with reality and became violent (e.g., one of my aunts tried to stab my uncle). So far, no manifestation of symptoms (unless you count some of my posts on CAF!). But it’s good that we are now aware and watchful.

I think that every couple should be aware of the medical history of each, and that they should face the realities of what this can mean for their future. Many African Americans know about family history of sickle cell anemia, e.g., and the implications this has for their future and for their children’s futures. But there are plenty of other medical conditions that couples should know about; e.g., a history of heart disease leading to early death. Very sad, but something that the couple should face and work on during their younger years.

Mental illness in particular often doesn’t manifest itself until an individual is older. Couples need to seek out some counselling to determine whether they are willing to take this on so that they won’t be blindsided when it strikes.

I think that one of the conditions that all couples need to honestly face is the presence of the addictive personality in the family history that leads to alcoholism, drug addition, and other addictions, including porn. Some people that are very anti-smoking in their youth actually take up smoking when they are older.

This is a really, really TOUGH issue, because when we are young, a lot of us joke around and SAY that we are addicted to something, e.g., coffee, or a certain sport or television show.

But what the couple needs to examine with brutal honesty is whether there is evidence in the family of an “addictive personality” that has led to harmful behaviors; e.g., alcholism.

The couple must plot a course in their marriage that will help them to deal with the possibility of an addiction in the marriage. This needs to be faced and dealt with, not just brushed under the rug and/or laughed off. Alcoholism is funny on The Andy Griffith Show, but it is tragic in real-life.

I think a lot of marriages end in divorce because of the onset of mental or emotional illness, especially addictions, in one of the partners. I think that ALL couples should discuss this in detail before they are married.

 

[bmaj]

We dated five years before we got married and talked about many, many things between ourselves. Pre-Cana was very different back then (several decades ago) - it only consisted of a chat with the Priest for about a half hour. It’s wonderful to hear that it’s much more involved now!

I think the biggest surprises that became difficult challenges for us were never talking before marriage about child care/changing diapers/etc., and never discussing how we each viewed the opposite sex in general as far as objectifying them, viewing pornography, and pleasuring of one’s self via the use of pornography in the absence of the spouse. My husband never wanted to change diapers, and any time I needed or wanted to go somewhere it was always as if I was “imposing” on him to “babysit” his own children (and horror of horrors if he had to change a diaper while I was gone for a few hours!). I “gave in” much more often back then and didn’t push the issue, so I basically seethed privately for most of the early child-rearing years and didn’t leave the children under his care very often.

However, the hardest challenge of all was discovering my husband’s pornography habit and what he did to pleasure himself with it when I was not at home. After that discovery I also began to realize the way he often stares at women in public who “appeal” to him visually. This all hurt to the core and has taken a lot of open communication, many tears, and lots of hard work to bring our marriage on the road back (prayerfully, hopefully) to what God intended it should be. I wouldn’t wish that particular discovery on any wife; unfortunately, it appears the habit is much more commonplace than many wives think. Likely something that should really be discussed before marriage - if a couple has the courage… It’s sure not an easy topic.

Interesting thread - hope my bit of (name removed by moderator)ut helps in some way.

 

[Ms_Manners]

So many other couples there, however, ended up actually fighting because they had no idea their significant other saw things in certain ways.

Like I already said, over here there is no real marriage prep, it’s 5 days, 1 hour each day, and there’s usually too many couples to make it interactive. No compatibility test, no 1 on 1 (or 1 on 2 in this case) with a priest, nothing.
However, they told us that many people break up even after that.
The closest we got to talking with a priest was when we went to set a date and he ran us through the paperwork and told us what we had to get and when.

We talk and we are really close, but still I felt that something was missing. In general, that’s the feeling I get with church here, almost nothing is required or provided and most things are left to one’s own inclinations, priests are too often hardly involved.

I think that every couple should be aware of the medical history of each, and that they should face the realities of what this can mean for their future.

This is so true.

I am so sorry you went through such hardship, both of you. Thank you so much for sharing!

Bmaj, I am glad you are also doing better.

Another thread got me thinking today.
How do you (as a couple) deal with things one of you (no matter which one) wants, and the other disapproves?
If you knew your spouse wouldn’t want you to do something, but they didn’t say so, would you still do it?
And what if your spouse actually asked you not to do something, would you do it?
The other way around, would they do it?
For women, is it a matter of obeying your husbands or mutual respect?

Personally, we talk about things, and if I knew he wouldn’t want me to do something, I would not do it. If he actually asked me not to do something, I would respect that, even if I don’t really like it at that moment. Sometimes we’ll get back to that and talk some more.
But it’s not just obedience, I expect (and get) the same courtesy from him.
Like I already said, if it’s money, neither of us will buy things the other disapproves of, regardless of amount.
Of course there are decisions each makes on his/her own, but by now we know each other well enough to know what’s a no-no.