Communion and Non-Catholics

[Mary_Poppins]

“If it is because the absolution MUST come from God’s direct apostle, the priest, THEN I’d understand better.”

Hello, my dear Cheezey Poof! Why have I found another post by you? Your thirst for God is apparent. He wants to slake it, trust me there! But…I have to tell you, “the absolution must come from God’s direct apostle.” yup, you said it. This is what the Universal Church teaches. The apostolic succession is very important, The laying on, of hands! By the bishops, the successors of dear Peter! The laying on of hands, and- the keys, “whatever you hold bound shall be held bound, whatever you loose shall be loosed in heaven.” Wow- what a responsibility! Oh my dear Cheezey, the Church needs such as you! Can you come? Also, the Communion with the Community of believers. The family, you need. Otherwise it’s kind of a …Hey- NO FAIR!" proposition. For example, as a believing Catholic, I must receive what the Church teaches to be a valid absolution, if I have ever committed a serious sin, before I receive the Eucharist. d… well, if you have NEVER committed a serious sin, than, you can be sure that Christ Himself will administer directly to your needs, and the Eucharist will already reside in your heart. (my thoughts, only, take with a grain of salt!)

Isn’t there any way you can have this valid absolution from the apostles themselves? My dear, call a priest- any one worth his salt will come to you, instruct you, love you, help you- receive you lovingly into the fold of Christ- and if none will, than… If really not, than you can be sure- God Himself will feed you! Be brave, little marshmallow- call a priest!!

(Ok, I have have taken a serious liking to Cheezey, I will admit)

 

[cheezey]

Be brave, little marshmallow- call a priest!!

(Ok, I have have taken a serious liking to Cheezey, I will admit)

Ok, I have taken a serious liking to Mary Poppins, I will admit.:yup:
But now I want a s’more.

a HA!!!
Thank you. That is an example of what I needed to hear. I understood what others have said in theory, but not by way of doctrine. "You must profess.’ they said. I know!! What was left out was that it needs to be done apostolically. (Yes, I know it’s not a word, but ya gotta admit, it fits…

THANK YOU!!

 

[sousley]

1-as far as I understand - and admittedly, a discussion is in order to be sure (if ever it happens) - I have.
2.-Doesn’t the profession of all facets begin with me, as in, I believe this (all of this) with all of my heart
3. see above, my admission is that I am professing!!
4. I have but not formally.

My honest opinion? I’ve read your posts before, and I think there will come a day, in the not so distant future, that you may well become a more faithful Catholic than many cradle Catholics today. I say this because I think you care very much, and some take their faith for granted. To answer your first 2 points, though, no. The Church has the first responsibility, not only to teach the faith, but to be able and available to assist you with any questions or specifics you may have. Then, your profession is the final word.

 

[cheezey]

My honest opinion? I’ve read your posts before, and I think there will come a day, in the not so distant future, that you may well become a more faithful Catholic than many cradle Catholics today. I say this because I think you care very much, and some take their faith for granted. To answer your first 2 points, though, no. The Church has the first responsibility, not only to teach the faith, but to be able and available to assist you with any questions or specifics you may have. Then, your profession is the final word.

I understand now, about 100 posts later, and I am sure much to the relief of those who responded!!

Thank you

 

[Mary_Poppins]

yup. did you know that some Anglicans used to go to Russian to be ordained by the Orthodox there, just in order to receive the Apostolic succession? Cool, hey? I’m Roman Catholic, but hey- I really like that.

hm, I don’t have sources tho- this is just hearsay-

 

[cheezey]

Your thirst for God is apparent.

I certainly hope so; He is so front and center. It’s the lack of formal expression that’s bothersome now. I take comfort that His Church is not limited to four walls, and thus, His expression is shown to and from the world around us, as well. I can only do tiny little things, now, and that’s okay, but it now needs to be supplemented with formal expression. My life is so troubled, everything is overwhelming. I do not feel as if I am hearing Him well. But then He does something little/big, like when I called a hotline last night ( I was REALLY overwhelmed), guess who answered?? Faith. When I left for Church this morning, I found a dollar in the street, folded nicely in half. Good, because I have no money whatsoever. I know it would have been ok not to give; if you can’t, you can’t, but I am glad it was there for me to give away.

I am humbled by your thought.

 

[cheezey]

Mary Poppins:

As much as this is calling me, as much as it has over the years and always with a disappointingly ‘bad’ fit with almost everything but the Catholic Church, (some were just , ehh), it will take some getting use to from the human perspective; not that that’s not part of the spiritual perspective, but maybe the best analogy is going to school the first day, or worse, going to a new school in the middle of the year, where you know no one. You know it’s good, you know it’a perfect fit, you want to go and grow with it, but, YIKES!!
Perhaps just a spoonful of sugar would help??

HA!!!

 

[RedSparklyShoes]

I’m in the RCIA process and although on one level, I disagree with other validly baptised individuals not receiving communion, I deeply respect it. Each church has their rules and I aim to follow them. If you were to start attending some evangelical churches, they wouldn’t accept your infant baptism (or even understand what confirmation was to understand that you don’t need to be rebaptised as an adult).

 

[cheezey]

to all
if the Holy Catholic Church is to be capitalized, and it should be, please do so with the Protestant Church. That there are many Protestant Churches within shouldn’t matter.

Thank you

 

[Mary_Poppins]

Mary Poppins:

As much as this is calling me, as much as it has over the years and always with a disappointingly ‘bad’ fit with almost everything but the Catholic Church, (some were just , ehh), it will take some getting use to from the human perspective; not that that’s not part of the spiritual perspective, but maybe the best analogy is going to school the first day, or worse, going to a new school in the middle of the year, where you know no one. You know it’s good, you know it’a perfect fit, you want to go and grow with it, but, YIKES!!
Perhaps just a spoonful of sugar would help??

HA!!!

I’m sending you a s’more right now! What do you think of that?
In our church there is infant Communion- and the priest when he administers the Communion to little ones, with the liturgical spoon, says: “(name of little one) -taste, and see, how good the Lord is!”
And he is right- for the Communion wine he uses is very sweet, just for them. A spoonful of sugar indeed does help the Holy Medicine to go down, in this case! The children in their innocence and simplicity have thanked him saying his Communion is yummy. So sweet.

I wish I could come with you to Church! It’s always so much easier to go with someone, than to go alone- especially when you are not used to it. What can I do for you?

 

[RedSparklyShoes]

As a bit of a funny about the wine. At my cousin’s ordination (to I think the diaconate, but can’t remember which ordination it was), the kid in front of me in the line for the chalice took his and then said “Yuck, don’t take the wine!” I then had it myself and agreed with the poor kid that this stuff tasted awful.

 

[Aramis]

In order for one to receive Communion, one must be in a state of grace (I agree), believe in the True Presence (I agree), and be Catholic. I’m not sure if I agree with the last one. Shouldn’t a Christian of any denomination be okay to receive the Eucharist if they meet the first 2 requirements?

the last one isn’t exactly true - Some non-Catholics are admitted to Communion. Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, Assyrian Church of the East, and the PNCC are permitted to receive in the Catholic churches, provided they do not violate their own church’s rules in so doing. See Canon 844 of the CIC or Canon 671 of the CCEO

CIC 844:Can. 844 §1. Catholic ministers administer the sacraments licitly to Catholic members of the Christian faithful alone, who likewise receive them licitly from Catholic ministers alone, without prejudice to the prescripts of §§2, 3, and 4 of this canon, and ⇒ can. 861, §2.

§2. Whenever necessity requires it or true spiritual advantage suggests it, and provided that danger of error or of indifferentism is avoided, the Christian faithful for whom it is physically or morally impossible to approach a Catholic minister are permitted to receive the sacraments of penance, Eucharist, and anointing of the sick from non-Catholic ministers in whose Churches these sacraments are valid.

§3. Catholic ministers administer the sacraments of penance, Eucharist, and anointing of the sick licitly to members of Eastern Churches which do not have full communion with the Catholic Church if they seek such on their own accord and are properly disposed. This is also valid for members of other Churches which in the judgment of the Apostolic See are in the same condition in regard to the sacraments as these Eastern Churches.

§4. If the danger of death is present or if, in the judgment of the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops, some other grave necessity urges it, Catholic ministers administer these same sacraments licitly also to other Christians not having full communion with the Catholic Church, who cannot approach a minister of their own community and who seek such on their own accord, provided that they manifest Catholic faith in respect to these sacraments and are properly disposed.

§5. For the cases mentioned in §§2, 3, and 4, the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops is not to issue general norms except after consultation at least with the local competent authority of the interested non-Catholic Church or community.

 

[Vetzero]

I’m a new Catholic convert that came into the Holy Roman Catholic Church ‘offically’ on September 1, 2012. However, I was a baptized Christian before coming on in. My baptism was and remains valid as there is but one baptism just that it must be in the name of the Father, Son, Holy Spirit. Therefore, I got an abbreviated form of RCIA that still required I gain knowledge of the basics. It took me a few months to get it done…after having had to wait for RCIA since June 2005. Yes, took me 7 years to do it but perserverance has it’s perfect work.

One can’t just waltz right in and immediatly partake of the Holy Eucharist. I wanted to real bad but was refused a couple or three times.

I applied to and then joined the Roman Catholic Church specifically for the Holy Eucharist and it means everything to me. In order to participate in this sacrament and be allowed to come forward to recieve it…I had to complete RCIA… No other way, no shortcuts.

Only afterwards, having satisfactorily completed 'all ’ of RCIA would I be permitted to participate. However long it takes one has to finish it all and then get your signed certificate from the priest/pastor. You will then be confirmed into Holy Mother Church along with your First Communion.

It’s a wonderful, glorious time…unforgettable. You won’t regret the wait and you will be glad you did the work…take my word for it, a new Roman Catholic, you’ll greatly benefit.

Remember this, it’s all a process and takes time, for some it takes a long time and for others it takes several months but the rewards for your obediance is immense…you’ll see…I did.

*“You have to run with the footmen before you are allowed to ride with the cavalry”. *

 

[cheezey]

You won’t regret the wait and you will be glad you did the work…take my word for it, a new Roman Catholic, you’ll greatly benefit.

Remember this, it’s all a process and takes time, for some it takes a long time and for others it takes several months but the rewards for your obedience is immense…you’ll see…

First of all, congratulations! Perseverance is a wonderful thing. I am posting with questions on the same matter because some people want/need this as badly as you, but cannot proceed in the usual way. What to do, what to do… I have several extenuating circumstances that are stumbling blocks, which do not diminish the want/need…

 

[sgcecilia]

To the OP: Why would you WANT to partake in the Eucharist if you are part of another denomination?

Because Jesus said we have to receive the Eucharist to gain eternal life! I think that’s a pretty good reason.

Honestly, what is so wrong with a non-Catholic receiving the Eucharist if a) he/she is in a state of grace and b) he/she believes in the True Presence? Of course, this is provided that the person is aware of the need to be in a state of grace and the need to believe in the True Presence, which is unlikely if the person isn’t Catholic, I will admit.

 

[cheezey]

Of course, this is provided that the person is aware of the need to be in a state of grace and the need to believe in the True Presence, which is unlikely if the person isn’t Catholic, I will admit.

But not impossible!!!

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Because Jesus said we have to receive the Eucharist to gain eternal life! I think that’s a pretty good reason.

Honestly, what is so wrong with a non-Catholic receiving the Eucharist if a) he/she is in a state of grace and b) he/she believes in the True Presence? Of course, this is provided that the person is aware of the need to be in a state of grace and the need to believe in the True Presence, which is unlikely if the person isn’t Catholic, I will admit.

Because in receiving the Eucharist you are literally stating that you are in COMMUNION with the Church. That you believe and uphold EVERYTHING THE CHURCH TEACHES.

Tell me, if that is the case, then why does the non-Catholic not become Catholic?

If rather you have a case where say an Episcopalian wants to state that he or she is not in personal sin and believes in the Real Presence, but doesn’t want to BECOME Catholic, doesn’t want to believe in the Catholic teachings regarding divorce, male only priesthood, abortion, birth control, etc. . . .then that person might be personally not engaging in sin and believing the Real Presence, but that person is NOT IN COMMUNION with the Church, NOT ACCEPTING THE TEACHINGS OF THE CHURCH, and it would be a** lie** for him or her to stand up in front of the people and receive the Eucharist as if he or she was thus expressing total acceptance and agreement with the Catholic teachings.

Now you may say that some Catholics do not accept all the teachings (and they may or may not thus be in a state of grace if they do not. If they doubt but still accept the Church’s authority, they are not sinning. If they not only doubt but actively speak out against the teachings and still receive, they are profaning the Eucharist and will answer to the Lord). But just because some Catholics are in error, why allow the poor Protestants to make those same errors?

 

[Vetzero]

About perserverance, yes it is a neccesary part of being faithful and it’s only by the ability of our Lord and Lady that I had any chance at all to accomplish the goal of becoming Roman Catholic and going on to recieve Holy Communion.

I reckon that this ‘life lesson’ was what I needed at the time I needed it. The Lord got two things done at one time.

1. Giving me a burning desire to become Roman Catholic, join the church, get that First Communion and finish the work, don’t stop until it’s done.
2. Teaching me ‘perserverance’, being obediant and waiting for Father God’s anwser, ‘one day at a time’, believing that I would eventually get this done, if I don’t quit.

What is really wonderful to me about this is that I am by nature, impatient, some days more and some days less. This time I could not be impatient, no options, no excuses, no matter what delays and other obstacles were placed in front of me.

It all boiled down to,"How bad do I want this and to be allowed to partake of the body and blood of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ ? Is it really worth the effort ? Yes, it is, but words alone isn’t enough, this is all about commitment. I had to prove myself by showing up at the indicated.time, be quiet, listen, ask questions and most of all ‘learn the material’ and be submissive to the instructor, in my case, the Deacon at St Mary’s.

I am so thankful. I’ll go on from here and start work on ‘holiness’. I’ve already got a good start going and it’s worth the effort.

 

[sgcecilia]

Why do we have to admit to agree with EVERYTHING that the Catholic Church teaches (and I don’t think everything it teaches is 100% true) in order to do something that Jesus absolutely requires of us?!

What if Communion isn’t necessarily supposed to be about being in communion with other Catholics? What if it were supposed to be a communion between all people who believe in Jesus and a communion between Jesus and the person receiving? Is there any scriptural or other evidence that specifies that there should be a distinction?

As for people being unaware of the necessity to be free of mortal sin and to believe in the True Presence, couldn’t the priest just mention that in his super long prayer before Communion? Then people will be aware and not commit a sin by receiving the Body and Blood unworthily.

 

[empantarhei]

Why do we have to admit to agree with EVERYTHING that the Catholic Church teaches (and I don’t think everything it teaches is 100% true) in order to do something that Jesus absolutely requires of us?!

What if Communion isn’t necessarily supposed to be about being in communion with other Catholics? What if it were supposed to be a communion between all people who believe in Jesus and a communion between Jesus and the person receiving? Is there any scriptural or other evidence that specifies that there should be a distinction?

As for people being unaware of the necessity to be free of mortal sin and to believe in the True Presence, couldn’t the priest just mention that in his super long prayer before Communion? Then people will be aware and not commit a sin by receiving the Body and Blood unworthily.