Communion bread forbidden?

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Greetings Church

Has home baked unleavened bread for Holy Communion been forbidden by the Church, if the recipe is followed correctly?
 
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robertaf:
Greetings Church

Has home baked unleavened bread for Holy Communion been forbidden by the Church, if the recipe is followed correctly?/QUOTE]
I haven’t heard anything that would indicate this is the case.

Deacon Ed
 
Hi
Thanks Deacon. Something I read in another thread led me to believe that maybe it had been forbidden.
I wondered it something of this nature had slipped by me.
 
I don’t know about now, but 30 years ago we had a organization in our parish called “Christian Family Movement”, does anyone remember it?
Once a month we would gather in each member’s home for Mass, etc. Once,when it was my turn, I baked the bread for Communon… I don’t even remember the recipe only that it was lumpy and raised… The “new priest” had given it to me…
I had to take my pewter ridged dish, which he used for consecration, next door to the sacristy the next day when I found CRUMBS (the Body of our Lord!) still left in it!! :mad: Talk about abuse…He got mad at me and told me I was overreacting…I don’t think so!:rolleyes:
Annunciata:)
 
OH NO! That, indeed is a horrible abuse.

I use to love baking the bread for Mass. Our Pastor was so very meticulous with it. Father had explained the traditional use of this flat unleavened bread in The Church and why we used the little plastic Jesus’ now.
I understand it isn’t used so much anymore because the homemade bread does not use any preservatives and does not keep well in the Tabernacle.
We used all that was Consecrated at Sunday Masses and the usual little hosts were consecrated at weekday Masses and kept in the Tabernacle.
 
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robertaf:
Greetings Church

Has home baked unleavened bread for Holy Communion been forbidden by the Church, if the recipe is followed correctly?
As such it is not forbidden by the Church but you would have difficulty getting it approved today, or should have difficulty for a number of reasons. Primarily to make sure that the recipe is followed correctly and that each host is of the same consistency, size, shape and will not readily crumble whether in storage or when handled. Also as was mentioned before it must be cooked correctly so it will not readily deteriorate while in storage either prior to consecration or in the Tabernacle. Absolutely no preservatives are allowed. I understand THE recipe is “wheat flour and water.” Period. Absolutely no additions or changes for any reason. I don’t know what the grind would be called but it must be such that when it is baked it holds together well and there are no crumbs. And dry enough so there would be no mold in storage.

They have changed a lot over the years. I remember the hosts when I was growing up were very limber compared to today’s hosts. Much thinner. As I remember they also had an imprint on them like IHS but am not really sure about that. It’s been a long time.

Now I’m not the smartest guy in the world but I heard a discussion about this on Catholic Answers more than once and that is where I received my info plus probably having seen articles on it. Anyway that is my understanding on it.

God bless,
Whit
 
I don’t understand how a lay person can make the bread at home. A grill similar to a waffle iron is used. (Usually made by cloistered nuns.) How can someone do that at home?
 
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whit:
Also as was mentioned before it must be cooked correctly so it will not readily deteriorate while in storage either prior to consecration or in the Tabernacle. Absolutely no preservatives are allowed. I understand THE recipe is “wheat flour and water.” Period. Absolutely no additions or changes for any reason. I don’t know what the grind would be called but it must be such that when it is baked it holds together well and there are no crumbs. And dry enough so there would be no mold in storage.
My church uses a home-made wheat flour + water bread, and I know from personal experience that it is hard to guarantee that it is cooked correctly - this Sunday it wasn’t, so the host was very doughy, almost raw inside! Also, in the past, there were a few different illicit recipes that were used that included honey and other stuff. Occasionally someone who isn’t on board with the correct wheat + water recipe will revert to one of the old recipes, which is hard to tell without tasting the bread before mass.
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whit:
They have changed a lot over the years. I remember the hosts when I was growing up were very limber compared to today’s hosts. Much thinner. As I remember they also had an imprint on them like IHS but am not really sure about that. It’s been a long time.
I think the wafer hosts vary widely in thickness and imprint, depending on who makes them. One parish near me uses hosts with an imprint of a lamb, another uses an imprint of a cross, and others have no imprint. And some are thicker, some are thinner.
 
Mike C:
I don’t understand how a lay person can make the bread at home. A grill similar to a waffle iron is used. (Usually made by cloistered nuns.) How can someone do that at home?
When the bread is made at home it is not made in the form of flat wafers, like that which is bought; it looks more like regula bread only relatively flat, since no levening is used (if one makes it correctly).

Unfortunatly, many people do not make it correctly. When I was in the seminary, in the mid 1970’s, there were a lot of things that were done incorectly, I don’t use the word “abuses” because I truly believe that the priests, as well as us seminarians, did not know that what we were doing was wrong. However even though we did not know that putting honey and other flavoring in the host was not allowed, it was still invalid matter and at thoses massed we did not receive the body of Christ, but just bread.

Another problem, due to (name removed by moderator)roper catechesis, was that we had two extra-ordinary ministers of the eucharist, and they would distribute Holy Communiion, while there were some priests (several in fact) sitting down. this didn’t make mass invalid, however it was an illicit practice.
 
Good Morning Church

Does anyone know if this is exactly the same recipe used in Jewish cerimonies?
 
I look forward to the day it is forbidden in my parish. The bread is brought to the altar. Then during the Lamb of God, the priest tears it into 4 pieces and places them in a candy dishes. At which time the EMHC’s partake in “active lay participation” with the priest at the altar- and proceed to tear the bread into smaller pieces suitable for distribution. Last week an older woman, after she was finished, was wiping her hands together to shake off the crumbs on the floor. The priest then places the host in the hands of each EMHC, and they proceed to take holy communion at the same time- (as concelebrating priests) at the altar. The remaining hosts are then placed in the tabernacle after the recessional song by a layman.
 
Greetings

I wonder how they dealt with the crumb problem in the early Church when Mass was said in the homes and home baked bread was torn in this manner.

I know the Priests seem very careful about this now. I wonder if this has always been the case.
 
I wonder how they dealt with the crumb problem in the early Church when Mass was said in the homes and home baked bread was torn in this manner. I know the Priests seem very careful about this now. I wonder if this has always been the case.
I’d wager it was. The very early Christians probably used something resembling pita or naan bread, i.e. leavened flatbread cooked quickly on an open fire. Freshly-baked pitas produce very few crumbs; they have more of an elastic consistency than the thick loaves that are eaten in the West today. As long as the bread is kept over a plate or cloth, any crumbs that do fall can be easily collected and consumed.
 
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ybeayf:
I’d wager it was. The very early Christians probably used something resembling pita or naan bread, i.e. leavened flatbread cooked quickly on an open fire. Freshly-baked pitas produce very few crumbs; they have more of an elastic consistency than the thick loaves that are eaten in the West today. As long as the bread is kept over a plate or cloth, any crumbs that do fall can be easily collected and consumed.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe the early Christians distributed the Eucharist in the same manner as the Eastern Christians do today: a small cube of the Precious Body was dipped into the Precious Blood by the Priest and given to the faithful via a spoon. It appears that in the Eastern churches, the crumb problem is dealt with before the distribution during the Office of Proskomidia. Rather than attempt to explain it and fail miserably, here’s a link to a nifty Byzantine Catholic page that explains the whole deal saintelias.com/Liturgy_elia/Proskomidia_elia/Proskomidia_elia.htm
 
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DJJG:
I don’t use the word “abuses” because I truly believe that the priests, as well as us seminarians, did not know that what we were doing was wrong. However even though we did not know that putting honey and other flavoring in the host was not allowed, it was still invalid matter and at thoses massed we did not receive the body of Christ, but just bread.
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Annunciata:
I don’t know about now, but 30 years ago we had a organization in our parish called “Christian Family Movement”, does anyone remember it?
Once a month we would gather in each member’s home for Mass, etc. Once,when it was my turn, I baked the bread for Communon… I don’t even remember the recipe only that it was lumpy and raised… The “new priest” had given it to me…
I had to take my pewter ridged dish, which he used for consecration, next door to the sacristy the next day when I found CRUMBS (the Body of our Lord!) still left in it!! :mad: Talk about abuse…He got mad at me and told me I was overreacting…I don’t think so!:rolleyes:
I have recalled since my previous post that honey was one of the ingredients…so I guess I didn’t have to worry about the crumbs after all… Annunciata:(
 
Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe the early Christians distributed the Eucharist in the same manner as the Eastern Christians do today: a small cube of the Precious Body was dipped into the Precious Blood by the Priest and given to the faithful via a spoon. It appears that in the Eastern churches, the crumb problem is dealt with before the distribution during the Office of Proskomidia. Rather than attempt to explain it and fail miserably, here’s a link to a nifty Byzantine Catholic page that explains the whole deal
Well, the proskomidi is really only preparing the Lamb. During the communion of the clergy, the priest still has to divide the Lamb into enough pieces for all the communicants, which generates a fair amount of crumbs. If the Lamb was previously dried, as when it is prepared for a celebration of a Liturgy of the Presanctified Gifts, the priest usually lets it soak in the wine before attempting to divide it, lest it explode into a shower of crumbs everywhere.

Offering the mysteries via intinction with a spoon in the Eastern churches started (iirc) around 1100, and was probably introduced for practical reasons (like when the Latins started giving the Body on the tongue). When the Liturgy of St. James is still celebrated according to its rubrics, the faithful receive the Body in the hand.
 
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ybeayf:
Well, the proskomidi is really only preparing the Lamb. During the communion of the clergy, the priest still has to divide the Lamb into enough pieces for all the communicants, which generates a fair amount of crumbs. If the Lamb was previously dried, as when it is prepared for a celebration of a Liturgy of the Presanctified Gifts, the priest usually lets it soak in the wine before attempting to divide it, lest it explode into a shower of crumbs everywhere.

Offering the mysteries via intinction with a spoon in the Eastern churches started (iirc) around 1100, and was probably introduced for practical reasons (like when the Latins started giving the Body on the tongue). When the Liturgy of St. James is still celebrated according to its rubrics, the faithful receive the Body in the hand.
Aha! I stand corrected, and thank you 🙂
 
When I was in the seminary 10 years ago, “homemade” Communion bread was all the rage (and sometimes rage-provoking with crumbs as big as a marble!). I don’t know if it is forbidden, but I think anything that causes crumb concern has a lot of problems. There can be lots of good intentions in this practice, but I think it is still at risk for antiquariansim and bad liturgy.
 
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robertaf:
I understand it isn’t used so much anymore because the homemade bread does not use any preservatives and does not keep well in the Tabernacle.
My understanding is that preservatives are not allowed in Communion Bread. Wheat & water, and that’s it. Not even salt!
I have seen recipes on parish websites that use sparkling water, though.
 
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