communion service

[THurifer2]

Hello,

I am taking over communion service at a nearby state prison. I am replacing a deacon so I need to know the basic order for communion sevices.

When the deacon does it ( I went with him recently to learn the ins and outs of a Maximum security prison …no pun intended) he uses the sacramentary and omits the Eucharistic prayers.

COuld someone here point me in the direction of the basic order for a communion service…or perhaps even a book that explains it?

My bishop does not require special training for prison communion services…

Oh by the way…the only way theses inmates can recieve our lord is if I volunteer for this …I am the last availible person to do this.

 

[benedictgal]

Hello,

I am taking over communion service at a nearby state prison. I am replacing a deacon so I need to know the basic order for communion sevices.

When the deacon does it ( I went with him recently to learn the ins and outs of a Maximum security prison …no pun intended) he uses the sacramentary and omits the Eucharistic prayers.

COuld someone here point me in the direction of the basic order for a communion service…or perhaps even a book that explains it?

My bishop does not require special training for prison communion services…

Oh by the way…the only way theses inmates can recieve our lord is if I volunteer for this …I am the last availible person to do this.

Thurifer, I have just what you need. Send me a PM and I’ll email it to you.

 

[AJV]

The directions can be found in Holy Communion and the Worship of the Eucharist outside of Mass (HCWEM). I found this online which reflects the order except for the following:

• There are no words prescribed as introduction or conclusion for the intercessions
• a genuflection is made after placing the ciborium on the altar, before saying the Our Father
• the wording is “Happy are those who are called to **his **supper”
• the distribution of Holy Communion is accompanied by the words “**The **Body of Christ”
• the minister places any particles left on the paten into the ciborium/pyx after the Communion. He may also wash his hands.
• a genuflection is made when the remaining Hosts are placed in the tabernacle, and the proper reverences are made to the altar, etc. at the beginning and end of the rite (This was probably taken for granted in the order linked to)
• an alternative final blessing (when the minister is not a deacon/priest) is “May the almighty and merciful God bless and protect us, the Father, and the Son + and the Holy Spirit”. It is not indicated in the link but the signing of the cross is not over the people (as with a priest or deacon) but of oneself.

Shorter Rite
The essential differences from the above rite are:

-the extended Scriptural readings (reading, psalm,[reading] Gospel) is replaced by a single text such as John 6:54-55, John 6:54-58, John 14:6, John 14:23, John 15:4, 1 Cor 11:26, 1 John 4:16

-there are no intercessions, and no option for the sign of peace.

Lastly, if you’re not in the USA, you may want to check whether the ICEL translation of HCWEM is approved for your country. In my parish, the “red book” has some different translations (for example, the concluding prayer is in the style of the old “O God, who left us in this wonderful sacrament…” instead of the ICEL “Lord Jesus Christ, you gave us the Eucharist…”)

 

[plato3]

May God bless you for bringing Jesus to the inmates. I have worked with inmates for the past eighteen years and God has been very generous to me in his blessings and grace in this ministry. You will not be sorry that you are doing this. Recently there were some changes in the Communion Service procedures. In no way is it to resemble a Mass. Also prayers should be said for vocations to the priesthood at these services. A new large handbook for Sunday Service in Absence of a Priest is available in Ca. The new daily rite has not been published yet in our state.

 

[bpbasilphx]

Would it not be better to ask the Deacon for instruction about this?

 

[benedictgal]

Sorry for the delay. I just sent you the document. Please let me know if you’ve received it. I was out in San Antonio promoting Miss Texas USA.

 

[THurifer2]

Would it not be better to ask the Deacon for instruction about this?

Already done…just getting ahead of the game. He is a VERY busy man and I wish to learn as much as possible on my own to alleviate any extra burden on him. He will be monitoring my first few communion services and likely will be happy that I sought out the procedure on my own.

He was equally pleased when I indpendently obtained training and credentials for work on the “inside”. It just lessened his load not to have to worry about getting me trained.

One just does not show up at a Maximum security prison and say I’m here to volunteer.

It takes permission, training and background checks.

 

[lizaanne]

God Bless you for your ministry!

~Liza

 

[Traditional_Ang]

Would it not be better to ask the Deacon for instruction about this?

bpbasilphx:

Actually, the rector of his parish or the priest in charge of the prisons or jails in his state or local area (if one is available)…

The Deacon would be next in line…

In Christ, Michael

 

[Traditional_Ang]

Hello,

I am taking over communion service at a nearby state prison. I am replacing a deacon so I need to know the basic order for communion sevices.

When the deacon does it ( I went with him recently to learn the ins and outs of a Maximum security prison …no pun intended) he uses the sacramentary and omits the Eucharistic prayers.

COuld someone here point me in the direction of the basic order for a communion service…or perhaps even a book that explains it?

My bishop does not require special training for prison communion services…

Oh by the way…the only way theses inmates can recieve our lord is if I volunteer for this …I am the last availible person to do this.

THurifer2:

While I’m overjoyed that you’ve stepped up to do this for the prisoners and for our Lord, I’m appalled and grieved that in our Lord’s One, Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church there isn’t ONE Priest or ONE Deacon who can find the time to go ONE DAY/ WEEK to bring the LORD and HIS BODY and Blood and HIS Saving GOSPEL to those held in the bondage of sin and the devil.

As you are doing the work of a Deacon, I would suggest that you seek the Order of a Deacon - Ask your Bishop if you can be ordained as a Deacon so you can be an Ordinary Minister of the Eucharist for these prisoners held in the bondage of Satan and sin.

I looked at the pdf document of the service for for Administration of the Lord’s most Holy Eucharist in the Absence of the Priest - It looks a lot like a “Modern Business English” version of the ACA/TAC “Deaconal Service for the Administration of Holy Communion”. With that in mind, I’d do the longer form, and do the Lavabo both before and after - You are handling the Lord’s Body and Blood (per Trent).

I also think you might ask if your Bishop would license you to give a brief Homily or Sermon in that situation (Bishops can issue licenses for preaching only in particular situations in exigent circumstances). You can always use excerpts of the Homilies prepared by the Holy Church Fathers, Doctors of the Church, Popes, Bishop Sheen or the Fathers on EWTN…

I hope this helps. I am very glad that you’ve made yourself available to the Lord for this.:extrahappy:

Your Brother in Christ, Michael

 

[Spiller]

The Church ritual you should be following is located in this book:

catholicbookpublishing.com/ShowProduct.aspx?ProductID=410&DepartmentID=87

There might be other publishers of this book as well.

 

[Spiller]

THurifer2:

While I’m overjoyed that you’ve stepped up to do this for the prisoners and for our Lord, I’m appalled and grieved that in our Lord’s One, Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church there isn’t ONE Priest or ONE Deacon who can find the time to go ONE DAY/ WEEK to bring the LORD and HIS BODY and Blood and HIS Saving GOSPEL to those held in the bondage of sin and the devil.

As you are doing the work of a Deacon, I would suggest that you seek the Order of a Deacon - Ask your Bishop if you can be ordained as a Deacon so you can be an Ordinary Minister of the Eucharist for these prisoners held in the bondage of Satan and sin.

I looked at the pdf document of the service for for Administration of the Lord’s most Holy Eucharist in the Absence of the Priest - It looks a lot like a “Modern Business English” version of the ACA/TAC “Deaconal Service for the Administration of Holy Communion”. With that in mind, I’d do the longer form, and do the Lavabo both before and after - You are handling the Lord’s Body and Blood (per Trent).

I also think you might **ask if your Bishop would license you to give a brief Homily or Sermon in that situation **(Bishops can issue licenses for preaching only in particular situations in exigent circumstances). You can always use excerpts of the Homilies prepared by the Holy Church Fathers, Doctors of the Church, Popes, Bishop Sheen or the Fathers on EWTN…

I hope this helps. I am very glad that you’ve made yourself available to the Lord for this.:extrahappy:

Your Brother in Christ, Michael

This is also “the work” of laity. Keep in mind that becoming a deacon usually takes 4-5 years of formation in the Catholic Church. There is no “licensing” in the Catholic Church – that’s a Protestant peculiarity.

The purpose of the lavabo is not simply to clean one’s hand before touching the Blessed Sacrament and it’s not a part of the official ritual for communion service.

 

[Traditional_Ang]

This is also “the work” of laity. Keep in mind that becoming a deacon usually takes 4-5 years of formation in the Catholic Church. There is no “licensing” in the Catholic Church – that’s a Protestant peculiarity.

The purpose of the lavabo is not simply to clean one’s hand before touching the Blessed Sacrament and it’s not a part of the official ritual for communion service.

Spiller:

There are good Doctrinal Reasons for cleaning one’s hands before touching our Lord and for making sure that no “Sense Perceptible” crumbs, specks, etc are left on them after distributing HIM to others. The “Lavabo” is an appropriate and reverent means of doing this and is allowed in the GIRM and Order of Service.

I realized “Licensing” was probably the wrong word, but by the time I did, the 20 min, time limit for editing had elapsed. If you look at the pdf of the Document that is produced when you hit the Blue this on AJV’S Post - Re: communion service Post #3: forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=3801426&postcount=3
You’ll see a SHORT Homily (It might be only from a Deacon, but it doesn’t say that) is allowed - That’s why I suggested asking for permission from his Bishop in order to clarify the situation…

I think 5 minutes of commentary on the Gospel from a Father or Doctor of the Church would be better than nothing.

What the Catholic Church does in America NOW and what it has done in the past can be said to be 2 different things. According to you, St. Ambrose should never have been been Ordained Deacon let alone Bishop of Milan - Same with St. Augustine of Hippo, except in his case, he was ordained to the Priesthood and then Consecrated as Bishop in the same week…

The Church does what she needs to do. I’m just saying that he should ask and then do as instructed. The Extraordinary Ministers of the Holy Communion were never meant to replace Ordinary Ministers of the Holy Communion or the Ordained Ministers of the Catholic Church, but, with the permission of the Bishops of the Church to supplement the Priests and Deacons in their ministerial functions of administering the Holy Sacrament when there weren’t enough Priests and Deacons available to “handle the load”.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael

 

[Cristiano]

Spiller:

There are good Doctrinal Reasons for cleaning one’s hands before touching our Lord and for making sure that no “Sense Perceptible” crumbs, specks, etc are left on them after distributing HIM to others. The “Lavabo” is an appropriate and reverent means of doing this and is allowed in the GIRM and Order of Service.

I realized “Licensing” was probably the wrong word, but by the time I did, the 20 min, time limit for editing had elapsed. If you look at the pdf of the Document that is produced when you hit the Blue this on AJV’S Post - Re: communion service Post #3: forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=3801426&postcount=3
You’ll see a SHORT Homily (It might be only from a Deacon, but it doesn’t say that) is allowed - That’s why I suggested asking for permission from his Bishop in order to clarify the situation…

I think 5 minutes of commentary on the Gospel from a Father or Doctor of the Church would be better than nothing.

What the Catholic Church does in America NOW and what it has done in the past can be said to be 2 different things. According to you, St. Ambrose should never have been been Ordained Deacon let alone Bishop of Milan - Same with St. Augustine of Hippo, except in his case, he was ordained to the Priesthood and then Consecrated as Bishop in the same week…

The Church does what she needs to do. I’m just saying that he should ask and then do as instructed. The Extraordinary Ministers of the Holy Communion were never meant to replace Ordinary Ministers of the Holy Communion or the Ordained Ministers of the Catholic Church, but, with the permission of the Bishops of the Church to supplement the Priests and Deacons in their ministerial functions of administering the Holy Sacrament when there weren’t enough Priests and Deacons available to “handle the load”.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael

Michael,
I agree with you the he should pursue the Diaconate and that the Church does what she needs to. However, I do not see why the Church should not go through a period of proper formation for a new Deacon if the same individual can do his work as a lay minister. I do not think that rushing to ordain a person just to have a Deacon in the prison ministry would be prudent.

 

[AJV]

Spiller:

There are good Doctrinal Reasons for cleaning one’s hands before touching our Lord and for making sure that no “Sense Perceptible” crumbs, specks, etc are left on them after distributing HIM to others. The “Lavabo” is an appropriate and reverent means of doing this and is allowed in the GIRM and Order of Service.

I realized “Licensing” was probably the wrong word, but by the time I did, the 20 min, time limit for editing had elapsed. If you look at the pdf of the Document that is produced when you hit the Blue this on AJV’S Post - Re: communion service Post #3: forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=3801426&postcount=3
You’ll see a SHORT Homily (It might be only from a Deacon, but it doesn’t say that) is allowed - That’s why I suggested asking for permission from his Bishop in order to clarify the situation…

Sorry, I didn’t catch that when comparing the two orders, and so didn’t list it in the variances I compiled. You are right- I can’t seem to find something stating that a homily may be given. It perhaps could be inferred from the wording “The Liturgy of the Word now takes place as at Mass”, but it is no where given explicitly. This is the text from HCWEOM

1. The Liturgy of the Word now takes place as at Mass. Texts are chosen for the occasion either from the Mass of the day or from the Votive Mass of the Holy Eucharist or the Precious Blood, the readings from which are in the Lectionary. A list of these passages can be found in nos. 113-153 of this Ritual. The Lectionary offers a wide range of readings which may be drawn upon for particular needs such as the Votive Mass of the Sacred Heart.

The may be one or more readings, the first being followed by a psalm or some other chant or by a period of silent prayer. The celebration of the word ends with the general intercessions

The washing of the hands is provided for after the distribution of the Communion (n. 36) That is, I think, analogous to GIRM 278. There is no mention of washing hands before the Communion. Though obviously, his hands should be clean, he could do so before the service (with soap ) rather than as a ritual action inserted into it.

 

[Traditional_Ang]

Spiller:

I ran out of time trying to do this edit, but this is very important, because it seems that the Roman Catholic Church in America seems to believe that Extraordinary Minister of the Holy Communion really means Minister of the Holy Communion - They’ve forgotten the EXTRAORDINARY, and I believe this has lad to a certain lack of awareness about WHO it is we’re consuming when we go forward to receive the Lord’s Body and Blood.

The “Work of the Laity” (according to Matthew 25:32-46) is to feed the hungry, give drink to the thirsty, welcome the stranger, clothe the naked, tend to the sick and visit those in prison; not to distribute our Lord’s Body and Blood. That’s supposed to be the work of ORDAINED Ministers - Bishops, Priests and Deacons. I believe people will have more reverence for the Blessed Sacrament when Ordained Ministers, and ONLY Ordained ministers distribute our Lord’s Body and Blood. And, I believe the Laity will take these other duties more seriously when they’re not spending so much time “paying around at being priests and deacons”.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael

 

[THurifer2]

Michael,
I agree with you the he should pursue the Diaconate and that the Church does what she needs to. However, I do not see why the Church should not go through a period of proper formation for a new Deacon if the same individual can do his work as a lay minister. I do not think that rushing to ordain a person just to have a Deacon in the prison ministry would be prudent.

One step ahead of you guys. I am entering into aspirancy this Fall. I have been accepted by my bishop after a year of inquiry and interviews.

Oh and by the way this is not California. There are hardly any priests in my area and the prison itself is 140 miles away from the chancery. THe deacon was in charge of this ministry for my diocese. But his is protestant country and the Warden and Chaplain of the prison are not Friendly to Catholics.

 

[Traditional_Ang]

Michael,
I agree with you the he should pursue the Diaconate and that the Church does what she needs to. However, I do not see why the Church should not go through a period of proper formation for a new Deacon if the same individual can do his work as a lay minister. I do not think that rushing to ordain a person just to have a Deacon in the prison ministry would be prudent.

Christiano:

I don’t understand why the RCC in America is addicted to this idea of using Laypeople to distribute the Most Holy Body and Blood of our Lord Jesus Christ - The Orthodox don’t do it, and the American church has only been allowed to do it only because of an Indult from the Vatican. And, Would you say that it’s promoted reverence for our Lord’s body and Blood, or just the opposite?

And speaking of “not properly formed” and “rushed”, St. Ambrose, Bishop of Milan and Doctor of the Church was literally a Catechumen on Tuesday, Ordained a Deacon on Wednesday, Ordained a priest on Thursday and Consecrated as Bishop of Milan on that Sunday. Are you really sure that you want to say that the Saint and Doctor of the Church who brought St. Augustine of Hippo into the Church and then discipled him wasn’t properly instructed or formed or that he was ordained too suddenly?

And then we have the case of the converts in the 2nd Chapter of Acts (Acts 2:9-11a - “**Par’thians and Medes and E’lamites and residents of Mesopota’mia, … and Cappado’cia, Pontus and Asia, Phryg’ia and Pamphyl’ia, Egypt and … Libya …, and visitors from Rome, both Jews and proselytes, Cretans and Arabians, …”). These new “Followers of the Way” had leave Jerusalem to go home before Rosh Hashonah 33 A.D., and they had to have NEW PRIESTS in order to celebrate the Eucharist in their home towns. That means these PRIESTS had maybe 3 to 3-1/2 MONTHS (NOT years) of formation.

The reason for this will be known to anyone who knows ancient seamanship - The Mediterranean Sea was too dangerous for most ships to sail on from late-October until Late March. As most destinations took anywhere from 3 to 6 weeks of total sailing time, that could mean starting no later than mid/late Sept. from a port in the SW Med.

Do you really want to say these priests ordained by the Apostles weren’t properly formed or were ordained too quickly?

I think we should not disdain what the Early Church did but instead imitate some of how the Early Church (the one with the Martyrs which “turned the world upside down”) formed and discipled priests and deacons so maybe we can have similar fruits - I just don’t think our fruits really stack up so well against theirs.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael

 

[Spiller]

Spiller:

There are good Doctrinal Reasons for cleaning one’s hands before touching our Lord and for making sure that no “Sense Perceptible” crumbs, specks, etc are left on them after distributing HIM to others. The “Lavabo” is an appropriate and reverent means of doing this and is allowed in the GIRM and Order of Service.
No it’s not. Ablutions are – lavabos are not.

I realized “Licensing” was probably the wrong word, but by the time I did, the 20 min, time limit for editing had elapsed. If you look at the pdf of the Document that is produced when you hit the Blue this

on AJV’S Post - Re: communion service Post #3: forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=3801426&postcount=3
You’ll see a SHORT Homily (It might be only from a Deacon, but it doesn’t say that) is allowed - That’s why I suggested asking for permission from his Bishop in order to clarify the situation…

I think 5 minutes of commentary on the Gospel from a Father or Doctor of the Church would be better than nothing.

What the Catholic Church does in America NOW and what it has done in the past can be said to be 2 different things. According to you, St. Ambrose should never have been been Ordained Deacon let alone Bishop of Milan - Same with St. Augustine of Hippo, except in his case, he was ordained to the Priesthood and then Consecrated as Bishop in the same week…

The Church does what she needs to do. I’m just saying that he should ask and then do as instructed. The Extraordinary Ministers of the Holy Communion were never meant to replace Ordinary Ministers of the Holy Communion or the Ordained Ministers of the Catholic Church, but, with the permission of the Bishops of the Church to supplement the Priests and Deacons in their ministerial functions of administering the Holy Sacrament when there weren’t enough Priests and Deacons available to “handle the load”.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael

 

[Cristiano]

Christiano:

I don’t understand why the RCC in America is addicted to this idea of using Laypeople to distribute the Most Holy Body and Blood of our Lord Jesus Christ - The Orthodox don’t do it, and the American church has only been allowed to do it only because of an Indult from the Vatican. And, Would you say that it’s promoted reverence for our Lord’s body and Blood, or just the opposite?

And speaking of “not properly formed” and “rushed”, St. Ambrose, Bishop of Milan and Doctor of the Church was literally a Catechumen on Tuesday, Ordained a Deacon on Wednesday, Ordained a priest on Thursday and Consecrated as Bishop of Milan on that Sunday. Are you really sure that you want to say that the Saint and Doctor of the Church who brought St. Augustine of Hippo into the Church and then discipled him wasn’t properly instructed or formed or that he was ordained too suddenly?

And then we have the case of the converts in the 2nd Chapter of Acts (Acts 2:9-11a - “**Par’thians and Medes and E’lamites and residents of Mesopota’mia, … and Cappado’cia, Pontus and Asia, Phryg’ia and Pamphyl’ia, Egypt and … Libya …, and visitors from Rome, both Jews and proselytes, Cretans and Arabians, …”). These new “Followers of the Way” had leave Jerusalem to go home before Rosh Hashonah 33 A.D., and they had to have NEW PRIESTS in order to celebrate the Eucharist in their home towns. That means these PRIESTS had maybe 3 to 3-1/2 MONTHS (NOT years) of formation.

The reason for this will be known to anyone who knows ancient seamanship - The Mediterranean Sea was too dangerous for most ships to sail on from late-October until Late March. As most destinations took anywhere from 3 to 6 weeks of total sailing time, that could mean starting no later than mid/late Sept. from a port in the SW Med.

Do you really want to say these priests ordained by the Apostles weren’t properly formed or were ordained too quickly?

I think we should not disdain what the Early Church did but instead imitate some of how the Early Church (the one with the Martyrs which “turned the world upside down”) formed and discipled priests and deacons so maybe we can have similar fruits - I just don’t think our fruits really stack up so well against theirs.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael

1- Can you prove that the Church has an addiction to EMHCs? I would say that in a lot of parishes individual pastors might overuse the services of EMHCs. I do not go around a lot of Catholic parishes and all I know is hearsay from this forum. Not a lot of theological strength here. Reverence or lack of reverence is due to lack of personal disposition and formation.

2- Your point about a few being ordained on the spot is true. However, it does not seem to me a prudent thing to do for everybody. Should we close all the seminaries in the world because we do not need proper formation for the ordained people? Are you saying that all the people that petition for the priesthood or diaconate are ready and do not need any further growth or learning? This is what your logic brings to.