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SlackerCatholic
Guest
Oh Dear Jesus, I am sorry we produce so many useless, spineless, mealy-mouthed priests who do not truly serve you.
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Xantippe
Guest
“UPDATE: talked to priest today after Mass and he said no problem all he would need to do is wait until I turned 18 (which is soon), both of our baptismal records, he would want to talk to our parants, and then we would do the little ceremony after Mass one day.”
Is there some way you can do some sort of marriage preparation class, or would you be ineligible because of your civil marriage? I would really like you to do a marriage preparation class, or something similar (like a marriage retreat). I personally think my future husband and I really benefited from working through the problem areas that came up in the questionnaire that we filled out for our marriage preparation appointments Likewise, you’d probably get a lot out of doing Dave Ramsey’s Financial Peace University (it’s a 9-week personal finance class) or something like that.
One of the major issues that you will face if you go forward with this is the problem of how to equip yourselves so that you will be able to support a growing family when the time comes.
Is there some way you can do some sort of marriage preparation class, or would you be ineligible because of your civil marriage? I would really like you to do a marriage preparation class, or something similar (like a marriage retreat). I personally think my future husband and I really benefited from working through the problem areas that came up in the questionnaire that we filled out for our marriage preparation appointments Likewise, you’d probably get a lot out of doing Dave Ramsey’s Financial Peace University (it’s a 9-week personal finance class) or something like that.
One of the major issues that you will face if you go forward with this is the problem of how to equip yourselves so that you will be able to support a growing family when the time comes.
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1ke
Guest
The US Bishops have not raised the age from 16 to 18.it appears that a particular detail is being confused. In the United States the minimum age for marriage in the church is 18 however the legal age being lower. we have talked to numerous priests and all have said that they can’t marry anybody under 18 due to the fact that the US conference of bishops raised the minimum age from 16 to18.
The complementary norms (i.e., those canons that deviate from the universal norm) for the US can be found here:
usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/what-we-believe/canon-law/complementary-norms/
Canon 1083 (age) has not had a complementary norm issued.
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JackieMom
Guest
Ke,The US Bishops have not raised the age from 16 to 18.
The complementary norms (i.e., those canons that deviate from the universal norm) for the US can be found here:
usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/what-we-believe/canon-law/complementary-norms/
Canon 1083 (age) has not had a complementary norm issued.
I’m curious as to whether it could be within the priest’s rights to put off a teen couple until adulthood because he had concerns about their maturity or cognitive development. To the OP, being declined based on his age at the time may have been more a prudential judgement on the part of the priest rather than strictly due to Church law. As it is, in most places minors need parental consent to marry. Maybe this was not provided via the parents to the priest? The CCC is the CCC, but I can’t imagine any priest presiding at the wedding of a minor without extremely serious, long-term premarital counseling.
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khomes123
Guest
well in reguards to the whole being 18 years old thing, I promise you the minimum age for marriage in the church in the US is 18. we talked to about a dozen priests in 3 different cities and all said I needed to be 18 years old. if this were not the case, I would not be in this situation, we would have been married in the Church.
we have already completed a lot of our marriage prep. including an engaged encounter retreat and of course NFP.
we have already completed a lot of our marriage prep. including an engaged encounter retreat and of course NFP.
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1ke
Guest
Oh, I can think of very many pastoral and prudential reasons to encourage the couple to wait. Maybe there is even compelling evidence of an impediment on some other ground.Ke,
I’m curious as to whether it could be within the priest’s rights to put off a teen couple until adulthood because he had concerns about their maturity or cognitive development. To the OP, being declined based on his age at the time may have been more a prudential judgement on the part of the priest rather than strictly due to Church law.
But that is not what the OP has reported. The OP has reported that he was told he could not marry b/c the US bishops had raised the age to 18 and it would require a dispensation of the bishop. I can find no evidence that this is true.
The priest could not “put off” a teen couple by declaring them ineligible to marry under canon 1083 when they clearly are eligible. The priest has no authority to create an impediment.
Again, that is not what the OP reports. They are civilly married, so that would indicate if permission was required, they obtained it.As it is, in most places minors need parental consent to marry. Maybe this was not provided via the parents to the priest?
I think this is provincial thinking. The CC is worldwide. Primarily it is the US and a few other Western countries that delay adulthood and promote an extended childhood that is known as “adolescence” or “teen years”.The CCC is the CCC, but I can’t imagine any priest presiding at the wedding of a minor without extremely serious, long-term premarital counseling.
I am not advocating that these two, or any two, teens marry carte blanche. My argument is only that the OP seems to have been told something that is not true.
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1ke
Guest
Well, all I can tell you is what I know-- there is no complementary norm issued by the USCCB. It is not a documented impediment ANYWHERE, including my own diocese.well in reguards to the whole being 18 years old thing, I promise you the minimum age for marriage in the church in the US is 18. we talked to about a dozen priests in 3 different cities and all said I needed to be 18 years old. if this were not the case, I would not be in this situation, we would have been married in the Church.
we have already completed a lot of our marriage prep. including an engaged encounter retreat and of course NFP.
Also see Archdiocese of Hartford sacramental guidelines:
archdioceseofhartford.org/ministries/sacramentalguidelines.pdf
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Kensho
Guest
This situation does not look complicated to me. It looks like a straightforward situation of two young people deciding to be disobedient to the Church, and it’s the disobedience that is the main problem. Fortunately, since there are no children and no prior marriages, it also looks as though it would be uncomplicated to resolve the disobedience, although it would be difficult emotionally for the couple.
I do not believe for a minute that God would bless a union that was formed in disobedience to His Church. That is how Protestant sects start, disobedience to lawful authority. If a husband is going to exercise lawful authority in his own family, he needs to start by respecting the authority that has been placed over him. THAT is something to worry about.
Also, I am very concerned for the OP because he wanted to marry a severely depressed girl in order to take care of her. I have deep empathy for this, really I do, but you cannot take care of a depressed person in this way. I am so concerned for the OP that he is getting himself into a terrible situation that he doesn’t understand. It sounds as though a 12 step support group could be in order. I’m speaking from experience!
And as someone else has pointed out, the young woman’s depression may be severe enough to make her incapable of forming a valid marriage, at least at this time.
I do not believe for a minute that God would bless a union that was formed in disobedience to His Church. That is how Protestant sects start, disobedience to lawful authority. If a husband is going to exercise lawful authority in his own family, he needs to start by respecting the authority that has been placed over him. THAT is something to worry about.
Also, I am very concerned for the OP because he wanted to marry a severely depressed girl in order to take care of her. I have deep empathy for this, really I do, but you cannot take care of a depressed person in this way. I am so concerned for the OP that he is getting himself into a terrible situation that he doesn’t understand. It sounds as though a 12 step support group could be in order. I’m speaking from experience!
And as someone else has pointed out, the young woman’s depression may be severe enough to make her incapable of forming a valid marriage, at least at this time.
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SamH
Guest
That doesn’t sound like a very good reason to get married..they told us to wait until I was 18 to get married but I felt that I couldn’t do that because my wife had severe depression and I felt that I had to live with her and take care of her.
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khomes123
Guest
as for everyone talking about the depression issue, that was not the main reason for marring. not even close. we dated for 2 years, were engaged for one year and we were in true love. the depression isssue is what made me want to speed it up.
“I do not believe for a minute that God would bless a union that was formed in disobedience to His Church. That is how Protestant sects start, disobedience to lawful authority. If a husband is going to exercise lawful authority in his own family, he needs to start by respecting the authority that has been placed over him. THAT is something to worry about.”
I do believe the rules which are in question are good rules and have good purposes, however not every situation is straightforward. so I believe there can be some exceptions in certain cases. that’s what I thought about my wife and I at the time, not I realize im wrong. I do still believe there could be exceptions.
“I do not believe for a minute that God would bless a union that was formed in disobedience to His Church. That is how Protestant sects start, disobedience to lawful authority. If a husband is going to exercise lawful authority in his own family, he needs to start by respecting the authority that has been placed over him. THAT is something to worry about.”
I do believe the rules which are in question are good rules and have good purposes, however not every situation is straightforward. so I believe there can be some exceptions in certain cases. that’s what I thought about my wife and I at the time, not I realize im wrong. I do still believe there could be exceptions.
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SamH
Guest
That’s the reason you gave.as for everyone talking about the depression issue, that was not the main reason for marring. not even close. we dated for 2 years, were engaged for one year and we were in true love. the depression isssue is what made me want to speed it up.
“I do not believe for a minute that God would bless a union that was formed in disobedience to His Church. That is how Protestant sects start, disobedience to lawful authority. If a husband is going to exercise lawful authority in his own family, he needs to start by respecting the authority that has been placed over him. THAT is something to worry about.”
I do believe the rules which are in question are good rules and have good purposes, however not every situation is straightforward. so I believe there can be some exceptions in certain cases. that’s what I thought about my wife and I at the time, not I realize im wrong. I do still believe there could be exceptions.
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SlackerCatholic
Guest
Exceptions to rules are for grammar class, not the one true Church founded by Jesus Christ.
If you want a church that changes its rules according to the whims of its members, there are plenty of Protestant denominations.
And you did state the depression issue and taking care of her as why you needed to marry. A spouse is supposed to be a help mate. You’re supposed to take care of each other equally. There will be times where one need is greater than the other, but marriage should not be entered on purpose with one party as the giver, and one the taker. That won’t work.
If you want a church that changes its rules according to the whims of its members, there are plenty of Protestant denominations.
And you did state the depression issue and taking care of her as why you needed to marry. A spouse is supposed to be a help mate. You’re supposed to take care of each other equally. There will be times where one need is greater than the other, but marriage should not be entered on purpose with one party as the giver, and one the taker. That won’t work.
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Marysann
Guest
I have read this whole thread, but I think that I might have missed something. You are both still teenagers. Where are your parents in all of this? My own family has had a sad experience with people marrying too young. They thought that they were mature, and did not want to hear otherwise. I would be interested to know what your families think about this. Marriage is difficult enough under the best of circumstances. It is not a solution to problems.
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Xantippe
Guest
“I have read this whole thread, but I think that I might have missed something. You are both still teenagers. Where are your parents in all of this?”
Yeah, like where is the young couple living and who are they living with, who is supporting them, and are they in high school or college and what are their plans for the future? It’s hard to understand the situation without knowing that.
Yeah, like where is the young couple living and who are they living with, who is supporting them, and are they in high school or college and what are their plans for the future? It’s hard to understand the situation without knowing that.
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khomes123
Guest
we live by ourselves, we are supporting ourselves. I have a Job and she has a full ride scholorship to the university of arizona. our parents are completly and fully supportive
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