conaception

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Ella76

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Hi am new here
I was raised catholic but i moved away from the church because of things in my past
that i dont want to go into at the moment
I just came back from looking at other religions …
I have mental health problems and am married me and my husband dont want to have kids one because of my mental health being so bad the other reason is we cant afford to look after a child

Up until now we have been using condoms and yes i know that in Gods eyes its wrong
But there is no way i can go through a pregnancy with out my medication that i am on now
this medication that am on now barely holds me together as it is
If i was pregnant i would have to go on lower dose of medication with that i become a danger to myself and others
I hear voices and they tell me to hurt myself and others ( no its not possession)
i also see things and have delusions

My husband is also a atheist and dont believe in God
he says that we can make our own mind about it and damn anyone else who thinks other wise
my husband is a good man he take care of me even when am at my worse.
I myself dont think i could handle a child at all
Am unsure what to do my husband has an appointment tomorrow to see about getting a
vasectomy am going with him …unsure what to do
the medication am on at the moment would make the baby very ill if i was pregnant
 
My dear sister,
Your struggles seam so many. When I hear you talk about your situation I want to give you a big hug. If I, who am weak of faith and holiness, have this compassion, just think how much God is wanting to fill you with love and heal you!
Keep this honest conversation with Jesus in your prayers! Please! Talk to him about these things. You are right to not call contraceptions pure. However, it is my personal opinion, you are dealing with lots of aspects that make your blameworthiness in using condoms very minimal. I say this because I agree that you probably should try not to have children in your state of health. If you did get pregnant, God would provide! It may not be in the ways we wish. But His ways are higher than ours. Work on your faith. Pray and receive His blessed sacrament. Pray for your husband and that Jesus will be gracious in you, so that your husband will open his heart. I will pray this very thing for you after this post.
In the end, I say, take one day at a time. Give God your trials, and faith that He will heal you. Ask Him to take away the bad spirit giving you voices. Dont put too much guilt on yourself for using condoms. But give to Jesus small sacrifices of genuine love. Show your Him you love Him.
Thank you for sharing your struggles. I am praying for you.

God bless you my friend,
Michael
 
Mental illness (especially that of a serious nature, as is yours) is just that: ILLNESS. You must take your medication, there is no alternative. God has gifted you with that realization; it is not one that many who are severely ill RECOGNIZE. I think you are blameless and that contraception in your case is a MORAL CHOICE. In order to fully deal with this perhaps you should seek the counsel of a priest whom you can trust, one who is close to God. I can’t advise you on how to find such a priest, not all fit that description. But God WILL put him in your path if you pray.

God bless you, sister. I lost my daughter to a serious mental illness such as you have. You have been touched by Him, Whom has led you to this realization and treatment. Keep going.
 
april32010 said:
contraception is never a MORAL CHOICE
Click to expand...
Probably every sin can be “justified” in someone’s eyes as the lesser evil. An action at first glance may appear wrong in itself, but it seems less bad than something else. Nothing is inherently wrong, but everything is relative to a larger context. We have to look at the greater law, “love”, which leads us to use our own minds, God really wants us to learn and grow, rather than to just obey him.
This is the “moral theology” that began in the Garden of Eden, has already led to the Holocaust and abortion clinic. We need to find ways on this Forum to show love and affection, and good advice, to this good person, the OP.
 
commenter said:
Probably every sin can be “justified” in someone’s eyes as the lesser evil. An action at first glance may appear wrong in itself, but it seems less bad than something else. Nothing is inherently wrong, but everything is relative to a larger context. We have to look at the greater law, “love”, which leads us to use our own minds, God really wants us to learn and grow, rather than to just obey him.
This is the “moral theology” that began in the Garden of Eden, has already led to the Holocaust and abortion clinic. We need to find ways on this Forum to show love and affection, and good advice, to this good person, the OP.
Click to expand...
What you are preaching here is moral relativism, which is condemned by the Catholic Church.
 
Hello Ella

For many Catholics the use of contraception is a personal choice. I think on this one topic where we all have to make our own prayerful and carefully considered choices. There are some things that unmarried bishops are always going to struggle to engage with on the same personal level as a married couple, and I think this is one of those questions. It is an issue that faithful Christians (Catholic or otherwise), in good conscience, take differing views on.

God bless you +
 
Michael1966 said:
Hello Ella

For many Catholics the use of contraception is a personal choice. I think on this one topic where we all have to make our own prayerful and carefully considered choices. There are some things that unmarried bishops are always going to struggle to engage with on the same personal level as a married couple, and I think this is one of those questions. It is an issue that faithful Christians (Catholic or otherwise), in good conscience, take differing views on.

God bless you +
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Michael, Although it is true that individual Catholics hold many differing opinions on the topic, the Catholic Church, instituted by Christ to guide the faithful, has unequivocally taught that contraception is always morally wrong and an intrinsic evil. We have an obligation to inform our consciences according to the teachings of the Church. It is misplaced compassion that is causing you to water down this teaching, but it is not actually loving because it cannot lead one to Christ the way the truth can.
Humanae Vitae:
Equally to be condemned, as the magisterium of the Church has affirmed on many occasions, is direct sterilization, whether of the man or of the woman, whether permanent or temporary. Similarly excluded is any action which either before, at the moment of, or after sexual intercourse, is specifically intended to prevent procreation—whether as an end or as a means.
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Ella76 said:
Hi am new here
I was raised catholic but i moved away from the church because of things in my past
that i dont want to go into at the moment
I just came back from looking at other religions …
I have mental health problems and am married me and my husband dont want to have kids one because of my mental health being so bad the other reason is we cant afford to look after a child

Up until now we have been using condoms and yes i know that in Gods eyes its wrong
But there is no way i can go through a pregnancy with out my medication that i am on now
this medication that am on now barely holds me together as it is
If i was pregnant i would have to go on lower dose of medication with that i become a danger to myself and others
I hear voices and they tell me to hurt myself and others ( no its not possession)
i also see things and have delusions

My husband is also a atheist and dont believe in God
he says that we can make our own mind about it and damn anyone else who thinks other wise
my husband is a good man he take care of me even when am at my worse.
I myself dont think i could handle a child at all
Am unsure what to do my husband has an appointment tomorrow to see about getting a
vasectomy am going with him …unsure what to do
the medication am on at the moment would make the baby very ill if i was pregnant
Click to expand...
I am so sorry about what you go through. Praying for you both.
You will be told that your only Catholic options are using NFP or total abstinence and not encouraging your husband on using condoms or having a vasectomy. I would suggest that you see your priest as soon as possible, with your husband if possible. This must be overwhelming to you and you need real help.

God bless you.
 
Ella76 said:
Hi am new here
I was raised catholic but i moved away from the church because of things in my past
that i dont want to go into at the moment
I just came back from looking at other religions …
I have mental health problems and am married me and my husband dont want to have kids one because of my mental health being so bad the other reason is we cant afford to look after a child

Up until now we have been using condoms and yes i know that in Gods eyes its wrong
But there is no way i can go through a pregnancy with out my medication that i am on now
this medication that am on now barely holds me together as it is
If i was pregnant i would have to go on lower dose of medication with that i become a danger to myself and others
I hear voices and they tell me to hurt myself and others ( no its not possession)
i also see things and have delusions

My husband is also a atheist and dont believe in God
he says that we can make our own mind about it and damn anyone else who thinks other wise
my husband is a good man he take care of me even when am at my worse.
I myself dont think i could handle a child at all
Am unsure what to do my husband has an appointment tomorrow to see about getting a
vasectomy am going with him …unsure what to do
the medication am on at the moment would make the baby very ill if i was pregnant
Click to expand...
God Bless you Dear Ella and welcome on your return to the Church.

First pray for your husband that he will know God is real and loves him very much. Your prayers are a blessing for your wonderful husband.

On contraception, Natural Family Planning can be used with a higher rate of avoiding unexpected pregnancy than condoms. Due to your health issues, you and your husband may see that you need to avoid pregnancy. NFP may be a better choice than condoms.

You may find help from Couple to Couple League for Natural Family Planning. ccli.org/

You can give them a call for a chance to feel a bit at peace speaking to a real person.
1-(800)- 745-8252

Vasectomies are not without problems for the man who undergoes one.

Ask your husband if you two can check out Couple to Couple League and NFP before he decides to have surgery. He may find it a much healthier choice for him than to undergo a vasectomy. Research the side effects of vasectomies before visiting the doctor who will be making money on the elective surgery.

“Side effects of sterilization are numerous. In some cases, a benign (non-cancerous) but painful and sensitive lump known as a granuloma may develop in men. This is a result of leakage of sperm from the cut end of the vas deferens. Some men report decreased sexual desire, and a small number of men experience long-term testicular pain.” ccli.org/nfp/contraception-sterilization/sterilization.php

In Immunology class, we were taught that the male’s testicles can begin to shrink after a vasectomy. The testicles continue to make sperm, but there is no place for the sperm to go. So the body has to have a way to get rid of the sperm. The body will see the sperm as foreign and build antibodies against the sperm. These antibodies attack the sperm and also the testicles.

Your parish priest may have a couple who teaches NFP in your parish or near by. Your parish may have scholarships to help with the cost of taking the NFP class.
 
april32010 said:
contraception is never a MORAL CHOICE
Click to expand...
WRONG. You have absolutely NO IDEA what mental illness is. Why? Because you are not mentally ill and you have never lived with someone who is profoundly mentally ill. You THINK you understand it; you DO NOT understand it. There IS no “understanding” of it unless you are IN it yourself. This woman has “cancer”: she is taking chemotherapy; the mental illness she describes is a degenerative brain disorder, far more complex than a chemical imbalance, and there is NO CURE. Let’s say I have stage three cancer and I am of childbearing age and am married. Do I NOT TAKE chemotherapy and radiation, knowing they will render me sterile???

She has NO CHOICE but to take this medication. She is in a living hell. There are mitigating circumstances, your “god” is too small. He is inside of her mind, He understands fully what she is suffering. For all we know, this woman might be a victim soul. To deliberately bring a child into the world knowing there is a high risk of passing along your illness TO that child, losing control of yourself during the pregnancy and harming yourself or others, and/or being basically incapable of raising that child is a safe, secure, unconditionally loving environment, THAT is the sin. I think you need to pray about this, it is not your judgment that matters here and what you have written is hurting her. Think what is using you.
 
ellzeena said:
WRONG. You have absolutely NO IDEA what mental illness is. Why? Because you are not mentally ill and you have never lived with someone who is profoundly mentally ill. You THINK you understand it; you DO NOT understand it. There IS no “understanding” of it unless you are IN it yourself. This woman has “cancer”: she is taking chemotherapy; the mental illness she describes is a degenerative brain disorder, far more complex than a chemical imbalance, and there is NO CURE. Let’s say I have stage three cancer and I am of childbearing age and am married. Do I NOT TAKE chemotherapy and radiation, knowing they will render me sterile???

She has NO CHOICE but to take this medication. She is in a living hell. There are mitigating circumstances, your “god” is too small. He is inside of her mind, He understands fully what she is suffering. For all we know, this woman might be a victim soul. To deliberately bring a child into the world knowing there is a high risk of passing along your illness TO that child, losing control of yourself during the pregnancy and harming yourself or others, and/or being basically incapable of raising that child is a safe, secure, unconditionally loving environment, THAT is the sin. I think you need to pray about this, it is not your judgment that matters here and what you have written is hurting her. Think what is using you.
Click to expand...
Ellzeena, Though you weren’t addressing your post to me, you’d be right in saying that I’ve never personally suffered from mental illness. I think your compassion for these individuals is commendable. But you’ve set up a false dichotomy here. The choices are not either contracept and be healthy OR get pregnant. Abstinence is moral and healthy and, incidentally, also a lot more effective at preventing pregnancy than any contraceptive. Conservative NFP use is also highly effective at preventing pregnancy.

The fact remains that contraception is always intrinsically evil. These are the Church’s words, not mine, although I happen to agree with them. That is, contraceptive sex is disordered even when a person must avoid pregnancy for very serious reasons. I sometimes liken it to purging. Regardless of the need for weight loss or for avoiding sugar consumption, it is never moral to eat something and then force yourself to throw up afterwards. If someone needs to lose weight, they should abstain from certain foods or eat them in limited quantities. Similarly, regardless of the serious need to avoid pregnancy, it is never moral to engage in sexual intercourse while rendering it sterile. This is always immoral.

It can be uncomfortable for a person who is struggling with this to hear the truth, but it does not actually hurt them. I’d argue that it is more hurtful to assure them that something is not sinful when it actually is.

God bless. And OP, I haven’t addressed you directly, but please know that you are in my prayers as well.
 
ellzeena said:
WRONG. You have absolutely NO IDEA what mental illness is. Why? Because you are not mentally ill and you have never lived with someone who is profoundly mentally ill. You THINK you understand it; you DO NOT understand it. There IS no “understanding” of it unless you are IN it yourself. This woman has “cancer”: she is taking chemotherapy; the mental illness she describes is a degenerative brain disorder, far more complex than a chemical imbalance, and there is NO CURE. Let’s say I have stage three cancer and I am of childbearing age and am married. Do I NOT TAKE chemotherapy and radiation, knowing they will render me sterile???

She has NO CHOICE but to take this medication. She is in a living hell. There are mitigating circumstances, your “god” is too small. He is inside of her mind, He understands fully what she is suffering. For all we know, this woman might be a victim soul. To deliberately bring a child into the world knowing there is a high risk of passing along your illness TO that child, losing control of yourself during the pregnancy and harming yourself or others, and/or being basically incapable of raising that child is a safe, secure, unconditionally loving environment, THAT is the sin. I think you need to pray about this, it is not your judgment that matters here and what you have written is hurting her. Think what is using you.
Click to expand...
You are wrong. And you don’t know that that the previous poster has not lived with mental illness. Perhaps YOU should pray that you should refrain from judgement. Actions are morally wrong, and we are called to proclaim the truth.

Calling a moral evil a good choice is wrong.

They do have a choice, its called NFP or abstainence.

IN case you didn’t realize, artificial birth control is NOT very effective at preventing pregnancy.
 
commenter said:
Probably every sin can be “justified” in someone’s eyes as the lesser evil. An action at first glance may appear wrong in itself, but it seems less bad than something else. Nothing is inherently wrong, but everything is relative to a larger context. We have to look at the greater law, “love”, which leads us to use our own minds, God really wants us to learn and grow, rather than to just obey him.
This is the “moral theology” that began in the Garden of Eden, has already led to the Holocaust and abortion clinic. We need to find ways on this Forum to show love and affection, and good advice, to this good person, the OP.
Click to expand...
Some people on this thread accused my post of preaching moral relativism. I had thought the first paragraph was obvious in illustrating the vice of moral relativism, exaggerating it so its errors would be more apparent. I guess it shows how deeply the religious educators and journalists have done their job, you can’t get more extreme than what they have done.
 
As my 4 year old Emma always says
“with God all things are possible” 🙂

I will tell you before daily rosary and bible reading my life was an emotional mess a lot of the time. I truly met Jesus Christ in 1998 when I wasn’t going to any church and them again at 2008 when I was attending a evangelical church.

Before you do anything start attending daily mass. So many of my emotional issues where washed away when I started living a holy life.

A recipe for success would be
  1. daily mass
  2. daily rosary
  3. daily bible reading
 
Ella76 said:
Hi am new here
I was raised catholic but i moved away from the church because of things in my past
that i dont want to go into at the moment
I just came back from looking at other religions …
I have mental health problems and am married me and my husband dont want to have kids one because of my mental health being so bad the other reason is we cant afford to look after a child

Up until now we have been using condoms and yes i know that in Gods eyes its wrong
But there is no way i can go through a pregnancy with out my medication that i am on now
this medication that am on now barely holds me together as it is
If i was pregnant i would have to go on lower dose of medication with that i become a danger to myself and others
I hear voices and they tell me to hurt myself and others ( no its not possession)
i also see things and have delusions

My husband is also a atheist and dont believe in God
he says that we can make our own mind about it and damn anyone else who thinks other wise
my husband is a good man he take care of me even when am at my worse.
I myself dont think i could handle a child at all
Am unsure what to do my husband has an appointment tomorrow to see about getting a
vasectomy am going with him …unsure what to do
the medication am on at the moment would make the baby very ill if i was pregnant
Click to expand...
Well, I might have an interesting experience to share with you.

I was also raised as a catholic. Went away from the church. Looked to other religions. I also lived with an atheist partner in the past (we were not married) and also had serious mental health problems, to be more precise obsessive-compulsive disorder, to a degree where it was nearly impossible to have a normal relationship with anyone. I would also see things and felt the urge to hurt myself sometimes. My atheist partner would also “take care of me”, in a strictly material and emotional way.

To make a long story short, this relationship ended and I met a catholic woman which I married. I was on heavy medication by then. She decided also to take care of me, but she gave the kind of care that can really change someone’s life forever: spiritual care.

I was drawn to catholicism through her faith and got reverted.

My mental problem was cured, literally, by a miracle. I just went to confession one day, and got out through the door 100% cured. Biggest problem of my life, gone forever, just like that. Grace of god, period. My marriage today is a real marriage, and my life is a real life. We have 2 kids now, and if God allows us, will have more. The biggest joy of our lives.

In all senses, it just feels like I woke up from a bad dream or something.

Nowadays I just realize how impossible it would be all those good things to happen in my life, hadn’t I chose the right person to share my life with.

Let me tell you something straight: atheism is NOT a detail in someone’s life.

Atheism, in fact, invites the devil into every aspect of life, and takes people down slowly. And it affects not only the atheist himself, by all people around it. Inside a home, it will destroy everyone.

It will destroy you as well.

I am telling you all that because right now you might think that you have a health decision to make in your life, but I want to invite you to give a broader scope to your decision. Think about what it means to have an intimate relationship with someone who doesn’t care about God, and all the hidden effects that this relationship might have in your life.

And dont take your medical condition as something you can’t change. Mine used to be like that too. But for God, nothing is impossible, and many like me are the living proof of that.

Try to live the holiest life as you can. Give that gift to your partner. Stay away from contraception, it will destroy your relationship sooner or later.

God bless you, and I hope my words can help you in some way.
 
eonporter said:
Well, I might have an interesting experience to share with you.

I was also raised as a catholic. Went away from the church. … I met a catholic woman which I married. I was on heavy medication by then. She decided also to take care of me, but she gave the kind of care that can really change someone’s life forever: spiritual care.

I was drawn to catholicism through her faith and got reverted.

My mental problem was cured, literally, by a miracle.

And dont take your medical condition as something you can’t change. Mine used to be like that too. But for God, nothing is impossible, and many like me are the living proof of that.

Try to live the holiest life as you can. Give that gift to your partner. Stay away from contraception, it will destroy your relationship sooner or later.

God bless you, and I hope my words can help you in some way.
Click to expand...
Thank you, EonPorter. What a wonderful testimony of the power of prayer and faith and the Sacraments of Confession and Matriomony. You and your wife are a wonderful witness!

God Bless.
 
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