Condescenscion toward Pro-Lifers

[3DOCTORS]

If you are pro-life and speak out about it, have you been treated with condescension by the “pro-choice” side? I’m not talking about contempt or argumentativeness, but rather an attitude that if you are pro-life, you have led a sheltered life and don’t really “get it” and are being too much of an idealist?

 

[stephe1987]

Actually, I would argue the opposite. “Pro-choice” people have been brainwashed by relativism and the idea that nothing is really wrong. All this New Age garbage with the alternate realities (what’s wrong for you isn’t wrong for me, etc.). It seems the less sheltered you are, the easier it is to brainwash you with media advertising. It’s because the people who aren’t sheltered think they’re so well informed and believe they are above being tricked by advertising (arrogance/elitism). “Pro-life” people have seen both sides (can’t avoid the New Age stuff, since it’s everywhere and on TV and in the media) and are not so easily fooled by the tired “pro choice” arguments used to trick people into buying abortions/ABC/etc.

 

[Beth_Cecilia]

If you are pro-life and speak out about it, have you been treated with condescension by the “pro-choice” side? I’m not talking about contempt or argumentativeness, but rather an attitude that if you are pro-life, you have led a sheltered life and don’t really “get it” and are being too much of an idealist?

I have encountered these attitudes, but if I am honest, only rarely and never from people who know me. My actively pro-choice friends are among the most genuinely open-minded people I know. They disagree, and we argue. But we can usually find common ground. They know where I am coming from and I know where they are coming from and we can usually identify where specifically we disagree. (That varies. Some of my friends simply don’t agree that life begins at conception. Others believe that a body is ‘ensouled’ at some point. There are various other positions which I’ll not get into here.) My point, though, is that we can talk about abortion openly and honestly without attack from either side. I do not attack them, I try to understand. They do not attack me, they try to understand.

Now, of course I have been to rallies and marches and protests. There I am often met my people who are condescending and rude. But they don’t know me, and I don’t know them. All I can do it try not to judge people in that way when I see them in a counter protest. I do not mean that I do not judge their position, I mean I do not judge their motive for attendance or their knowledge of the issue.

I have found in my discussions with people who disagree that it is disarming if you can find a place you agree and work from there. For instance, when we talk about abortion they cannot blow you off as an idealist if you start by agreeing with them that unintended pregnancy can be a terrifying thing and it is life-changing. As much as we know that a baby is wonderful, we can also admit the real problems that real women face. Will they have to drop out of college? High School? Can they afford to take the time off from work that they will need to if they go through with the pregnancy? Abuse? They are real problems. You may not agree about what causes the problems, and you may not agree on how to solve them. But acknowledging that there are real problems that women must face, and offering pragmatic (not lofty, idealistic, or otherwise unapproachable) solutions will go a long way toward opening a real dialogue, one where you can actually hear each other.

Another way I have been able to disarm those who would like to blow me off as a sheltered idealist: meet the women in question. Volunteer at a crisis pregnancy center, so you see first hand the issues these women face. When you talk to your friends you can tell them what you have seen and how you would like to see it addressed.

 

[vera_dicere]

I get that a lot, actually.

Right up until I tell them about all the women I’ve seen in my job who’ve had abortions and how its utterly wrecked their lives, and the usual horror stories about botched abortions, mental scaring and regret.

And i dont’ even work in a nursing field where gynae is the main focus.

Abortion really follows these women around for the rest of their lives;

 

[Newbie2]

I’ve not encountered it, but it would be something I’d expect. Methinks it’s similar to the position that some take in religion being a “crutch” for the weak minded.

 

[catharina]

If you are pro-life and speak out about it, have you been treated with condescension by the “pro-choice” side? I’m not talking about contempt or argumentativeness, but rather an attitude that if you are pro-life, you have led a sheltered life and don’t really “get it” and are being too much of an idealist?

Yes. Definitely.

It seems to be a very easy way to “dismiss” the actual facts.

 

[puzzleannie]

If you are pro-life and speak out about it, have you been treated with condescension by the “pro-choice” side? I’m not talking about contempt or argumentativeness, but rather an attitude that if you are pro-life, you have led a sheltered life and don’t really “get it” and are being too much of an idealist?

condescension? I wish. How about outright attacks, professional and private, even physical at times, and complete rejection and antagonism from even family members as well as professional colleagues.

 

[Santi2]

If you are pro-life and speak out about it, have you been treated with condescension by the “pro-choice” side? I’m not talking about contempt or argumentativeness, but rather an attitude that if you are pro-life, you have led a sheltered life and don’t really “get it” and are being too much of an idealist?

Yes, in both public and private support of the unborn child. It does not bother me a jot. Condescension is a foreseeable effect of pro-life campaign in a society where priorities are in a mess.

 

[3DOCTORS]

I have found in my discussions with people who disagree that it is disarming if you can find a place you agree and work from there. For instance, when we talk about abortion they cannot blow you off as an idealist if you start by agreeing with them that unintended pregnancy can be a terrifying thing and it is life-changing. As much as we know that a baby is wonderful, we can also admit the real problems that real women face. Will they have to drop out of college? High School? Can they afford to take the time off from work that they will need to if they go through with the pregnancy? Abuse? They are real problems. You may not agree about what causes the problems, and you may not agree on how to solve them. But acknowledging that there are real problems that women must face, and offering pragmatic (not lofty, idealistic, or otherwise unapproachable) solutions will go a long way toward opening a real dialogue, one where you can actually hear each other.

Another way I have been able to disarm those who would like to blow me off as a sheltered idealist: meet the women in question. Volunteer at a crisis pregnancy center, so you see first hand the issues these women face. When you talk to your friends you can tell them what you have seen and how you would like to see it addressed.

Very thoughtful response and I wish it happened more often. And yet in the name of pragmatism it seems that the pro-lifers don’t have the “street cred” that the pro-choicers try to claim as their own. After all, we’re the (stereotyped) ignorant fundamentalist misogynistic folks that want to see women barefoot and pregnant, or we love the fetus over the woman, or we don’t care about it after it’s born. Never mind that it needs a chance to be born before any other questions about its welfare even come into play.

As you can probably figure out, I’m on a bit of a rant here because I was attacked by a friend on my Facebook recently (see the thread I started about that under “Back Fence” if you want to know the backstory).

Like some of you, I’ve seen the dirty ugly side of abortion. I attended my friend’s Project Rachel healing Mass and I think I went through more kleenexes than some of the attendees; I simply could not stop crying - for both the women and their babies. :bighanky: I am also a person who believes in creative brainstorming and I believe it’s possible to work to save and improve both lives that are at stake - but if abortion is still on the table as an option, there will be some who choose it.

Pope John Paul II in his encyclical Evangelium Vitae (The Gospel of Life) went into great depth about the challenges women facing crisis pregnancies go through, and the tone is so merciful and understanding. I wish more people could read it. He acknowledges their fears, the coercion of others, so many things. :sad_yes:

I’ve also read Silent No More and similar literature about post-abortion, and I plan to read Abby Johnson’s Unplanned book as soon as I can get hold of a copy. I am well-informed. Why then do I let people get to me when they try to make me out to be ignorant, unsympathetic, uninformed, whatever? Am I being bamboozled by Satan? If so, guess for starters I simply need to pray more.

 

[sherimarie]

Don’t be afraid to get on the offensive with these people, remember they are the ones who think it is perfectly alright to kill tiny little helpless infants, we are for mom AND baby, keep your focus on the baby and you will never lose! God warned us about these times when people would call evil good and good evil, i was glad to see you are keeping up on your reading because God can use us so much more effectively when we are prepared. Have you ever read Mark Crutchers blog on prolife america? He puts things in such a clear light, you will be chomping at the bit to get back in the arena with these people!
Hit the conversation with the same tenacity that a prize fighter brings to the a table and win another heart for God! Good luck!!!

 

[Beth_Cecilia]

Why then do I let people get to me when they try to make me out to be ignorant, unsympathetic, uninformed, whatever?

It gets to you because you are human. If they are too closed-minded to hear your perspective, than the best you can do is bow out of the conversation as gracefully as you can before you lose your temper and say things you will regret. That said, if you can keep your cool, you may be able to at least alleviate them of their prejudice, even if you cannot change their minds. Pro-lifers, like anyone else I suppose, are not all alike. Some are judgmental, unsympathetic, anti-woman fanatics. Some are ignorant. Some do care more about the baby than the woman. Most, however, know that to love the woman is to love her baby. We believe that we must defend and protect both. We know that women are faced with untenable situations are we are willing to work with them to find pragmatic solutions and to get real help. When they start going on about how pro-lifers are a laundry list of anti-woman adjectives, just say, “Yes. I met that guy too. He’s a jerk. Here is where he goes wrong…” Then introduce them to the attitude of a truly pro-life person.

It is worth noting that in general, those attacking you are likely on the defensive. The ones who lash out most angrily are usually the ones who have had abortions, or are very close to someone who has. The way I see it, faced with that realization you have two choices. Contempt, anger and judgement or sympathy and love. You can go on the attack, since they attacked you. Or you can offer to show them how you reach out. If they have had abortions, they are likely dealing with guilt, and grief that they do not think they have a right to acknowledge. Be kind. Did you ever read about Norma McCorvey? She was Roe of Roe V. Wade fame. She is now a pro-lifer. She came around because she felt the love of the pro-lifers.

I have not read your other discussion and do not have time to now, but this is how I have responded to attacks from people I know.

“I am sorry my post angered you so much. Clearly, we both have strong feelings about helping women and families in their distress. I’d be glad to discuss it with you, but I will not engage in a battle where neither of us is likely to change the other’s mind and we are likely to hurt feelings. Would you like to meet to talk about it? I suspect we have more in common than you think.” Or something like that, depending on who it is and how I was attacked. If I can, I like to compliment their passion for protecting women- which indeed is noble in and of itself.

 

[3DOCTORS]

It gets to you because you are human. If they are too closed-minded to hear your perspective, than the best you can do is **bow out of the conversation as gracefully as you can before you lose your temper and say things you will regret. **

Yes. That’s why I hid the comment on Facebook so that it wouldn’t be an occasion of sin for me to make a snarky retort!

That said, if you can keep your cool, you may be able to at least alleviate them of their prejudice, even if you cannot change their minds. Pro-lifers, like anyone else I suppose, are not all alike. Some are judgmental, unsympathetic, anti-woman fanatics. Some are ignorant. Some do care more about the baby than the woman. Most, however, know that to love the woman is to love her baby. We believe that we must defend and protect both. We know that women are faced with untenable situations are we are willing to work with them to find pragmatic solutions and to get real help. When they start going on about how pro-lifers are a laundry list of anti-woman adjectives, just say, “Yes. I met that guy too. He’s a jerk. Here is where he goes wrong…” Then introduce them to the attitude of a truly pro-life person.

Cool idea. Will have to try that one!

It is worth noting that in general, those attacking you are likely on the defensive. The ones who lash out most angrily are usually the ones who have had abortions, or are very close to someone who has. The way I see it, faced with that realization you have two choices. Contempt, anger and judgement or sympathy and love. You can go on the attack, since they attacked you. Or you can offer to show them how you reach out. If they have had abortions, they are likely dealing with guilt, and grief that they do not think they have a right to acknowledge. Be kind. Did you ever read about Norma McCorvey? She was Roe of Roe V. Wade fame. She is now a pro-lifer. She came around because she felt the love of the pro-lifers.

Yes, I have Norma McCorvey’s book, Won By Love. It was quite intense but such a story of hope.

The person who attacked me has been a friend, though we are quite different in our views on most issues. What shocked me about it was that she just ripped into me and called me a politicized something-or-other term (this was where Facebook said “click to read more” and I chose not to, seeing as it was going nowhere good in a hurry).

We used to live in the same city and though we would have vociferous discussions, there was more of a respect when face to face. I could say, “Now, “Suzy,” you know we’re never going to agree on that,” or “Sorry, but I can’t agree with you there,” etc. in kind of a firm yet good-natured way. Now this person has moved to a university town that is very leftist and though she was never the meek sort, I think living there has made her even more entrenched in the pro-choice and radical feminist way of looking at the issues.

There’s the larger issue of Facebook itself - what one’s approach can be with it, which varies by the individual. I was so caught up in listing my many “likes” including pro-life - it was kind of like a scrapbook of “who I am and what I believe/enjoy/find interesting/etc.” Then before you know it I get caught up in the sharing and commenting. Maybe it’s evangelism in one sense, but maybe it ends up just being bickering at times. Worth some soul searching, IMO.

I have not read your other discussion and do not have time to now, but this is how I have responded to attacks from people I know.

“I am sorry my post angered you so much. **Clearly, we both have strong feelings about helping women and families in their distress. I’d be glad to discuss it with you, but I will not engage in a battle where neither of us is likely to change the other’s mind and we are likely to hurt feelings. ** Would you like to meet to talk about it? I suspect we have more in common than you think.” Or something like that, depending on who it is and how I was attacked. If I can, I like to compliment their passion for protecting women- which indeed is noble in and of itself.

Exactly.

 

[mark_a]

and complete rejection and antagonism from even family members

I have come to learn that attacks from within family are the symptom of deeply rooted personal guilt. I don’t bring the subject up and am extremely careful even when my opinion is sought. It’s not beneficial to anyone to pick at a neglected wound.