...conditional baptism and confession

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has anyone else gone through RCIA with a baptism that is in question?

am I a candidate (baptised) or a catechuman (non-baptised)?

do people feel different, after recieving the Sacraments? What if they’re “conditional”?

love
Saoirse
 
has anyone else gone through RCIA with a baptism that is in question?

am I a candidate (baptised) or a catechuman (non-baptised)?

do people feel different, after recieving the Sacraments? What if they’re “conditional”?

love
Saoirse
If your baptism is truly in question, you should approach your priest (provided that he is sound in his teaching) and ask him about receiving conditional baptism. You certainly cannot tell whether or not you’re baptised based on how you feel. You will not feel any different after baptism, unless you receive an extraordinary gift from the Holy Spirit. But surely this has happened only to a handfull for saints throughout history.

Out of curiosity, where (what denomination) were you baptised originally? Why do you believe it may be invalid? I’ve had some experience with this and I’d be glad to try to give you some direction.
 
You will feel different after conditional baptism…

…you will feel wet.😃
 
has anyone else gone through RCIA with a baptism that is in question?

am I a candidate (baptised) or a catechuman (non-baptised)?

do people feel different, after recieving the Sacraments? What if they’re “conditional”?

love
Saoirse
Here is how it is supposed to work.

If after serious investigation there is a real doubt about the validity of your Baptism. You will be conditionally Baptized. This should take place ASAP, in private, with the Minister, your Sponsor, and you. An entry will be made in the Baptismal register that you were conditionally Baptized. At that point you are for sure Baptized.

You are then a Candidate. You will make a “First Confession” sometime with the other Candidates during Lent and will be received into the Church just before Easter or just after Easter. If there is a need, you can be received at the Easter Vigil making sure that there is a clear distinction between Catechumens and Candidates.

Sometimes people will speak of a “conditional Confession” There is no such thing. This only seems to come up when the Rite is not properly followed and there is confusion. When conditional Baptism is improperly celebrated in public at the Easter Vigil. You then have the quandary of If the Baptism is valid then Confession is required before Holy Communion because the Conditional Baptism had no effect. If the Original Baptism was not valid then the Conditional Baptism is effective and no Confession is necessary.

If done properly conditional Baptism will be celebrated immediately upon discovering that there is a question about the Baptism. The Confession takes place a few months later just before being received into the Church. No conditional Confession, and no question about the proper order.
 
This should take place ASAP, in private, with the Minister, your Sponsor, and you. An entry will be made in the Baptismal register that you were conditionally Baptized. At that point you are for sure Baptized.

You are then a Candidate. You will make a “First Confession” sometime with the other Candidates during Lent and will be received into the Church just before Easter or just after Easter.
Then, at First Confession, would I confess sins from before the conditional Baptism, just in case?

love,
Saoirse
 
You certainly cannot tell whether or not you’re baptised based on how you feel. You will not feel any different after baptism, unless you receive an extraordinary gift from the Holy Spirit. But surely this has happened only to a handfull for saints throughout history.
I did not mean to imply any belief that a baptism’s validity can be determined by feeling… I meant to ask those who have gone through adult baptism if they felt any different afterwards…

I think, after the amount of desire, respect and awe for the Sacraments, which has only grown more intense and which I have been feeling for awhile now, and as a very emotionally intuitive person, that after recieving any Sacrament, I would personally feel something powerful, though I’m not sure exactly what to expect.

The only thing that could possibly get in the way of that would be my stupid pride that had me refusing to believe in the Church when I first started learning, because I didn’t want to admit to even myself that my life really was missing something that other people had. I also didn’t want to be dependant on anything or anyone, even God, for happiness or fufillment.

But I think, after growing in remorse for all the sins I have committed in my nineteen years of life, and after all the stupid and foolish things I’ve done, thought and encouraged - my pride may have just been crushed, and I have no illusions left that I can do anything at all without God’s help - and I have also realized that my own conscience has been and probably remains in many ways malformed - and so, having to trust something, I would rather trust the conscience of the Church to be my moral guide.

Being also, consistantly impatient in everything, I want to know yesterday what to expect and all other things that I don’t know right now and yet have questions around. I want to analyze what other people have felt and attempt to apply it to me. I want to visualize in my mind what to expect and what I might feel when the time comes for me to be initiated… (is that wrong? somehow it feels like it might be…)

love,
Saoirse
 
Out of curiosity, where (what denomination) were you baptised originally? Why do you believe it may be invalid? I’ve had some experience with this and I’d be glad to try to give you some direction.
I have already spoken with a priest about this, and he is someone whom I trust completely 100% (or maybe 99.9% as only God can really be right 100% of the time)…

but for the sake of discussion, and to get some more opinions on this matter:

The denomination of my baptism was the United Church (St. Luke’s), supposedly.

The trouble is, my mother specifically remembers me not getting baptised. I was born around the same time that she and my father were in the middle of a divorce; as such, the Evangelical Lutheran tradition would not consent to baptise me, especially as my mother was not Lutheran.

Also, the Anglican Church of my mother’s childhood would not baptise me because my mother no longer practiced, and because of the divorce.

My mother specifically remembers being turned away from various churches for similarly specific reasons, and walking away from one because it required the parents take a course before the child was baptised.

She also happens to be against infant baptism, and only half-heartedly sought it out for me in an attempt to smooth things over with her ex-in-laws (my dad’s parents)…

I can’t picture my Lutheran grandparents allowing a United Church baptism, because they are very firm Lutherans who are very firm in their pride at being perfectly Lutheran (even if it requires lying and refusing to allow me to question their pastor about their faith, incase it is realized that I was raised atheist by their son, as opposed to Evangelical, Fundamentalist Lutheran).

In fact, no body in my family specifically remembers me being baptised - if they think about it, they come up with details from my brother’s baptism and think it must be mine… for example, my brother’s baptism happened in an entirely different city, and they think that’s were mine occured as well, but the only record of me is at St. Luke’s United in the city I’m in now.

No one can tell me who my Godparents are supposed to be, though according to my mother the couple who (from the US) have been filling that role are actually my brother’s Godparents, of which there is actual proof.

I do have some old baptismal gifts, however - things like a children’s picture-bible with a leather cover (I think it’s St. James version), and a little white and gold music-box/jewelry-box/piano.

Plus, the Priest who has been working with me has said that he doesn’t really trust United Church baptisms after about the eighties, because they started trying to be ‘creative’ in their ceremonies (using ‘creator’ instead of “Father”, “redeemer” instead of “Son”, and “Intercedor” instead of “Holy Spirit” and so on),

and I don’t trust St. Luke’s as I know their last few pastors have not been truly Trinitarian (they don’t believe in three seperate persons, just three different faces of the same person - fine distinction, I know, but it seems important to me), and the last student minister (my mom’s ex-fiancée) was actually an atheist who felt he could enjoy preaching ‘nonsense’ to all those ‘weak fools who needed God’.

love,
Saoirse

ps - I am sorry my posts are so long, and that there are three consecutive ones… I can’t figure out how to work the quote function without posting seperately in response to each quote, and I wanted to explain more fully what my meaning is.
 
Then, at First Confession, would I confess sins from before the conditional Baptism, just in case?

love,
Saoirse
Yes, if you can remember them, just like the other Baptized Candidates. But the part “And all the sins of my past life that I cannot remember” will also include them.
 
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