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danandirma
Guest
this is from an e-mail conversation I am having with an atheist-anti-catholic about the popes comments on condoms while in africa… please give me some (name removed by moderator)ut for a good response to this e-mail. thanks as always
Good morning Dan
I was quite surprised when reading this, as it so comprehensively disagrees with many (not a few, but ‘many’ in the dictionary definition sense) other people and organisations. Instead of listing 100 organisations, I will simply quote two, the AMA (American Medical Assoc and the Australian Medical Assoc - same initials). They strongly and vehemently disagree, so, why the press release?
If you search on Edward A Green, you will find he is a devout Catholic. Not exactly an ideal spokesman for you to quote.
Remember the Murchison asteroid that hit the earth in about 1969 or so? It was given to a research team, who had exclusive access to it while it was researched. It was an exciting specimen as it was a chrondite, meaning it had the possibility of holding (or having been in the presence of) water. After some time, they reported on it, and the report said made statements about the amino acids found in it (which was exciting in itself, as they are the building blocks of life - also why I personally am an exogenecist). The researchers made statements about the chirality of the acids (please, I don’t want to go into this but will if you insist). Remnants were then given to other researchers, and to cut a 30 year story short, it was found the initial researchers made a mistake in their findings.
The initial team came up with excuse after excuse as to why they were right and everyone else wrong. One example was earthly contamination. Problem is, that many of the amino acids found don’t appear on earth and are completely new to us!! So much for THAT story. Yet they persisted and still do to this day despite the youngest person on the team being almost retired. Now, about 0.1% of astrophysicists think contamination likely while 99+% think the first team simply made an innocent mistake, and haven’t had the guts to say so.
The statement of AIDS and condom use you gave me would be like me asking someone their opinion of the Murchison meteorite - someone on the original team. Someone so biased it is beyond any realm of possibility that they be unbiased. You wouldn’t respect my answer if I did cite such a knowingly biased source.
I know (and I suspect you know too) that I can find 100 sources that will disagree with your single source - and in under 10 minutes. Good, reputable sources. Part of the problem with preaching monogamy in parts of Africa is that they are a polygamous society (some, not all). The monogamy idea simply cannot work in the short term. The methods proposed have been trialled in Thailand and the Philippines, and worked well. Hence the incentive for the same to be tried in Africa.
Dan, you are clearly highly literate. I do not know if, as a Catholic, you are allowed to disagree with the Pope, or if that is some form of heresy. If such latitude is allowed, can I ask you whether you believe in your own heart of hearts that the Popes stance is the correct one to control the spread of AIDS??
I have thoughts on your response here but don’t want to share them yet for fear of biassing your answer. When proposing this as an issue I disagree with, I was well aware of the churches stance so do not need the thematic or dogmatic aspect of an answer - I know what it is (or, maybe not. Is there some depth the public is NOT aware of)? I personally have no gripe with John Paul II (as I do the current Pope), and yet I have seen it said, and supported, that he was responsible for the death of 20+ million Africans by his stance on condoms. It can be shown he influenced a far greater number of people, and they or their partners died. That figure makes Hitler look like a saint along side him. I am not saying this to be offensive; as I said, I believe he was a good man. Yet he is in the same class as Stalin (the man I possibly despise most in history). That 20 million figure is supportable, though I really don’t want to get into a slanging match over its integrity…
Simply, if you are allowed to speak your own mind, without fearing you are breaching a code of conduct, would you share how you feel about condom use personally?
Good morning Dan
I was quite surprised when reading this, as it so comprehensively disagrees with many (not a few, but ‘many’ in the dictionary definition sense) other people and organisations. Instead of listing 100 organisations, I will simply quote two, the AMA (American Medical Assoc and the Australian Medical Assoc - same initials). They strongly and vehemently disagree, so, why the press release?
If you search on Edward A Green, you will find he is a devout Catholic. Not exactly an ideal spokesman for you to quote.
Remember the Murchison asteroid that hit the earth in about 1969 or so? It was given to a research team, who had exclusive access to it while it was researched. It was an exciting specimen as it was a chrondite, meaning it had the possibility of holding (or having been in the presence of) water. After some time, they reported on it, and the report said made statements about the amino acids found in it (which was exciting in itself, as they are the building blocks of life - also why I personally am an exogenecist). The researchers made statements about the chirality of the acids (please, I don’t want to go into this but will if you insist). Remnants were then given to other researchers, and to cut a 30 year story short, it was found the initial researchers made a mistake in their findings.
The initial team came up with excuse after excuse as to why they were right and everyone else wrong. One example was earthly contamination. Problem is, that many of the amino acids found don’t appear on earth and are completely new to us!! So much for THAT story. Yet they persisted and still do to this day despite the youngest person on the team being almost retired. Now, about 0.1% of astrophysicists think contamination likely while 99+% think the first team simply made an innocent mistake, and haven’t had the guts to say so.
The statement of AIDS and condom use you gave me would be like me asking someone their opinion of the Murchison meteorite - someone on the original team. Someone so biased it is beyond any realm of possibility that they be unbiased. You wouldn’t respect my answer if I did cite such a knowingly biased source.
I know (and I suspect you know too) that I can find 100 sources that will disagree with your single source - and in under 10 minutes. Good, reputable sources. Part of the problem with preaching monogamy in parts of Africa is that they are a polygamous society (some, not all). The monogamy idea simply cannot work in the short term. The methods proposed have been trialled in Thailand and the Philippines, and worked well. Hence the incentive for the same to be tried in Africa.
Dan, you are clearly highly literate. I do not know if, as a Catholic, you are allowed to disagree with the Pope, or if that is some form of heresy. If such latitude is allowed, can I ask you whether you believe in your own heart of hearts that the Popes stance is the correct one to control the spread of AIDS??
I have thoughts on your response here but don’t want to share them yet for fear of biassing your answer. When proposing this as an issue I disagree with, I was well aware of the churches stance so do not need the thematic or dogmatic aspect of an answer - I know what it is (or, maybe not. Is there some depth the public is NOT aware of)? I personally have no gripe with John Paul II (as I do the current Pope), and yet I have seen it said, and supported, that he was responsible for the death of 20+ million Africans by his stance on condoms. It can be shown he influenced a far greater number of people, and they or their partners died. That figure makes Hitler look like a saint along side him. I am not saying this to be offensive; as I said, I believe he was a good man. Yet he is in the same class as Stalin (the man I possibly despise most in history). That 20 million figure is supportable, though I really don’t want to get into a slanging match over its integrity…
Simply, if you are allowed to speak your own mind, without fearing you are breaching a code of conduct, would you share how you feel about condom use personally?
