Confession and Sacraments Help

[thomasf]

I have a couple of questions about the order of the sacraments, and first confession.

First, I don’t really remember much of my first confession. I get the impression it wasn’t a big celebratory thing like first communion and confirmation was. If I remember right, it was done during ccd class with just the kids in our class and our teacher. I don’t think parents were there, and it certainly wasn’t a mass or anything. Is this the general form of first confession?

Secondly, and this is the important part. While talking to my sister about her two sons, my nephews, it came to pass that while both sons had received their first communion and been confirmed at an early age, (somewhere around 8 to 10) neither have ever made their first confession. This absolutely stunned me.

First, because I was always under the impression that confession came before communion. Second, I don’t understand how a priest could do the sacrament of communion, or confirmation, on a child that hadn’t been to confession yet.

I get the impression from my sister that now that the boys have been confirmed, she’s not exactly worried about doing the confession. Nor do I think she’s really interested in continuing their ccd education. I gather that she thinks that as long as they have been confirmed and they go to church a couple times a year she’s completed her ‘duty’.

She also told me she doesn’t go to confession herself, and that she doesn’t think it’s a big deal. She seems to think she doesn’t have to confess to a priest, and claims she has been taught that in her church. And yes, it’s a catholic church.

Add to all this mess is the fact that she lives in a certain diocese in the middle of Michigan that, in some people’s opinion, is a wreck because of the last bishop who served prior to the current bishop.

So I don’t know what to do. It’s obvious that the kids are in trouble, haven’t been taught correctly, and are lacking as far as formation and the sacraments go. I told her she needs to get the kids to confession but she’s doesn’t seem to think it’s such an urgent issue. Although I think I could apply some kind of pressure to get her moving on it, I think if I do too much or push her the wrong way she’ll get stubborn and not do anything about it. I need advice on what to do, how to talk to her subtley, etc. I tried the whole “you’re kids are in mortal sin and they are in jeopardy” thing on her and she didn’t seem very affected. I think if I do too much of the “you’re going to hell” stuff on her it will turn her the other way.

I’m also very saddened and disturbed that a church would allow this to happen. Not only the church, but the priest. And to make things worse, when she does happen to take the kids to church, they all take communion, which compounds the whole problem that much more.

The priest knows and obviously isn’t doing anything about it, he confirmed them. Should I go to the new bishop? I understand he’s doing what he can to clean things up down there. Should I explain the situation and ask him to put pressure on the priest/my sister to get this done? I also want to call this matter to his attention so if it’s still going on it get stopped. But is that crossing the line?
I don’t know what to do.

 

[puzzleannie]

point number one, no, first confession should not be a big celebratory thing with parents, sponsors and video cameras. The children may have a communal penance service as a group with their school or CCD class, with individual confession to the priest, or they may, after suitable preparation, be taken to any priest for confession. However the catechist preparing the child cannot demand that they participate in the parish celebration, cannot demand proof they have gone to another parish for confession, there should be no certificate, and there is no entry in a record of any kind, because any of these would violate the confidentiality of the sacrament. By the way, the parent should never grill the child about his confession, either, or force him to go.

point number two - it is canon law that first confession must precede first communion. One must be in a state of grace to receive confirmation and communion, and it is a law of the Church that grave sins be confessed once a year. There are probably parishes and even dioceses where this is not stressed or taught, but don’t assume your sister’s is one of them.

point number 3 - the parent makes a solemn promise at baptism to raise their child Catholic, to bring them to the sacraments at the appropriate age, and to attend to their formal religious education throughout the school years. The parent who fails in this duty has failed in a serious obligation accepted before God and His Church. Unfortunately the attitude you ascribe to your sister is the most common. What we teach in the parish and what the parents actually do are usually quite different.

 

[Texas_Roofer]

I’m a little confused (but that is not new). What is the issue with you (or a godparent) picking up these children and going to confession?

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I have a couple of questions about the order of the sacraments, and first confession.

First, I don’t really remember much of my first confession. I get the impression it wasn’t a big celebratory thing like first communion and confirmation was. If I remember right, it was done during ccd class with just the kids in our class and our teacher. I don’t think parents were there, and it certainly wasn’t a mass or anything. Is this the general form of first confession?

Secondly, and this is the important part. While talking to my sister about her two sons, my nephews, it came to pass that while both sons had received their first communion and been confirmed at an early age, (somewhere around 8 to 10) neither have ever made their first confession. This absolutely stunned me.

First, because I was always under the impression that confession came before communion. Second, I don’t understand how a priest could do the sacrament of communion, or confirmation, on a child that hadn’t been to confession yet.

I get the impression from my sister that now that the boys have been confirmed, she’s not exactly worried about doing the confession. Nor do I think she’s really interested in continuing their ccd education. I gather that she thinks that as long as they have been confirmed and they go to church a couple times a year she’s completed her ‘duty’.

She also told me she doesn’t go to confession herself, and that she doesn’t think it’s a big deal. She seems to think she doesn’t have to confess to a priest, and claims she has been taught that in her church. And yes, it’s a catholic church.

Add to all this mess is the fact that she lives in a certain diocese in the middle of Michigan that, in some people’s opinion, is a wreck because of the last bishop who served prior to the current bishop.

So I don’t know what to do. It’s obvious that the kids are in trouble, haven’t been taught correctly, and are lacking as far as formation and the sacraments go. I told her she needs to get the kids to confession but she’s doesn’t seem to think it’s such an urgent issue. Although I think I could apply some kind of pressure to get her moving on it, I think if I do too much or push her the wrong way she’ll get stubborn and not do anything about it. I need advice on what to do, how to talk to her subtley, etc. I tried the whole “you’re kids are in mortal sin and they are in jeopardy” thing on her and she didn’t seem very affected. I think if I do too much of the “you’re going to hell” stuff on her it will turn her the other way.

I’m also very saddened and disturbed that a church would allow this to happen. Not only the church, but the priest. And to make things worse, when she does happen to take the kids to church, they all take communion, which compounds the whole problem that much more.

The priest knows and obviously isn’t doing anything about it, he confirmed them. Should I go to the new bishop? I understand he’s doing what he can to clean things up down there. Should I explain the situation and ask him to put pressure on the priest/my sister to get this done? I also want to call this matter to his attention so if it’s still going on it get stopped. But is that crossing the line?
I don’t know what to do.

You can’t have the Sacrament of Reconciliation (Confession) without a priest.

It must now come before First Communion and Confirmation. In the past some experimentation took place but Rome put an end to the years (25 or more) ago. She must prepare her children for Reconciliation and make sure that the celebrate this Sacrament ASAP. If either happened to be in a state of Mortal sin at the time of the Confirmation, they received the Sacrament but without any benefit to them. Same with Holy Communion. Does she not realize the Sunday and Holy Day Obligation? I suspect that she is just one of the many poorly catechized Catholics out there.

 

[stbruno]

I do sacramental prep and often time I will hear arguments that God knows that I am sorry,
so why do I have to confess my sins anyway?
The bare bones of an answer to that question
are quoted in yesterday’s Gospel passage:
‘For those whose sins you forgive,
they are forgiven;
for those whose sins you retain,
they are retained.’
The Church teaches us that Confession
is one of the Sacraments and that we really need, now more than ever.
In fact, The Catechism of the Catholic Church reminds us
that all mortal sins must be confessed
However even confession of everyday faults,
better known as our venial sins is strongly recommended by the Church.
Indeed the regular confession of our venial sins helps us to form our conscience,
So that we can fight against evil tendencies,
& let ourselves be healed by Christ
and progress in the life of the Spirit.
And if that is the case,
then why don’t more people go to Confession
so that they too might benefit by growing closer to God and his love?
Even children gain when they go to confession.
However, the biblical argument for confession is an important one.
We need to refer to Christ’s words to his apostles
“Whose sins you shall forgive they are forgiven,”
How can the apostles announce that some sins are to be forgiven
and some “retained” if they do not know what people’s sins are?
How would forgiveness work if no sins were mentioned?
The Catholic Church takes the biblical teaching
that the apostle is one who is “sent out” by God
and through whom God speaks with the message,
“Be reconciled to God.”
These very words that are used by the Church in absolution
are centered in Scripture,
which speaks of Christ "reconciling the world to himself.
In the letter of James we are told “confess your faults to one another”,
and in context this refers to confession to the priest.
Our late Pope John Paul II said in his book, Crossing the Threshold of Hope
That awareness of our own sinfulness, including that which is inherited,
is the first condition for salvation.
The next is the confession of this sin before God,
Who desires only to receive this confession so that He can save man.
Now that is a powerful teaching.
God desires to receive our confession so that He can save us!
Converts to our faith often times say
that Confession is the best thing about being Catholic.
Even the most bitter person realizes that the need to confess is deep in the human psyche
—so much so that, in the absence of the sacramental form,
a secular form of confession is cropping up on web sites and phone lines
to allow people to come clean about their dirty deeds.
Not surprisingly, users say that being able to reveal sins anonymously is cathartic.
It’s a shame more of us don’t see how good we have it as Catholics
We have had the Sacrament of Reconciliation around for thousands of years.
Yet the sacrament of confession is so much more than cathartic.
Jesus not only lets us “get it off our chests,”
but he lets us throw it all into his sea of forgetfulness.

Your sister’s decision to stop her child’s religious instruction is not lost, if you are the child’s godparent. She selected a godparent to keep her on track and also keep the vow she made before the priest in the persona of Christ at their baptism.

Keep praying and if you are your niece or nephew’s godparent, it is time for you to kick into high gear and help your little one.

 

[John_Lilburne]

The 2004 Instruction Redemptionis Sacramentum has:
“[87.] The First Communion of children must always be preceded by sacramental confession and absolution. [footnote 169: Cf. Code of Canon Law, can. 914; S. Congregation for the Discipline of the Sacraments, Declaration, Sanctus Pontifex, diei 24 maii 1973: AAS 65 (1973) p. 410; S. Congregation for the Sacraments and Divine Worship and S. Congregation for the Clergy, Letter to the Presidents of the Bishops’ Conferences. Episcoporum, In quibusdam, 31 March 1977: Enchiridion Documentorum Instaurationis Liturgicae, II, pp. 142-144; S. Congregation for the Sacraments and Divine Worship and S. Congregation for the Clergy, Response to dubium, 20 May 1977: AAS 69 (1977) p. 427.]”

But in the liturgical book “Rite of Christian Initiation of Adults” it describes children being baptised, confirmed and receiving the Eucharist in the one ceremony.
“At this third step of their Christian initiation, the children will receive the sacrament of baptism, the bishop or priest who baptises them will also confer confirmation, and the children will for the first time participate in the liturgy of the eucharist.” (Austalian and English edition n. 281, USA editon n. 305, Latin editon n. 344. RCIA introductions for England and Wales can be downloaded from catholic-ew.org.uk/liturgy/Resources/Rites/RiteRitual.html#RCIA .).

The children cannot receive the sacrament of penance before their baptism. So only if communion is first is received apart from the other sacraments of initiation is Confession required before it.

 

[thomasf]

My first confession was with a priest, but it was done in ccd class. We went to the church and took turns going up and going to confession and that was it. From what I remember. I realized I didn’t make that clear the first time.

Second, I know they need to go to confession. I was shocked they didn’t do that yet. From what I can tell this is the order of the sacraments as they did them: Baptism (after birth), First Communion, Confirmation. And that’s as far as she ever went. I get the impression she got them confirmed and then quit on the process. Yes, I know it’s bad. I think it’s horrible, and cannot believe that a priest would let this go, and still allow the kids to take communion. But like I said, her diocese is in bad shape and for years things have been out of control there. As I understand it the new bishop is trying to put things straight, but has to deal with these bad habits and crazy things that went down during the last bishop’s tenure.

What I really need to know is how to talk to her, urge her on while being somewhat subtle. Like I said, she’s not going to respond to me telling her she’s sinning and ruining her kids, no matter how true it is.

This is why I thought of maybe contacting the new bishop. Especially if this kind of sacrament and formation screw up is still going on.

 

[thomasf]

I should add, I am not the godfather for either nephew. The godparents my sister chose are pretty much non-existant and take no part in their religious education. My other sister is a godmother, and she isn’t even in the church any more. And as much as I’d like to step in and take a hands on approach, she lives 2 hours away from me and there’s just no way to take charge of this matter.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I should add, I am not the godfather for either nephew. The godparents my sister chose are pretty much non-existant and take no part in their religious education. My other sister is a godmother, and she isn’t even in the church any more. And as much as I’d like to step in and take a hands on approach, she lives 2 hours away from me and there’s just no way to take charge of this matter.

The best thing you can do is prsy for this child and the parents.

 

[grotto]

Here is a thought - how about spotting a Marian weekend retreat, or something like that - where there are youth centered talks and activities as well as the adult. Confessions are heard by several priests numerous times and if you went first and told the priest that the next “customer” would be your nephew or niece that received the Holy Eucharist without First Confession - then the priest would be able to help the younger one with the Sacrament.
I bet this could be a great time for you with your sister’s kids and could be accomplished without confrontation, etc. My grandchildren have always had a great time at the Marian Conference in Petoskey, Michigan (in October) at Boyne Mountain. They ask to go back! If it were not for those Conferences - we were starving for our Faith in the Diocese of Saginaw prior to Bishop Carlson.

 

[InLight247]

It is very sad that many parents want their children to be confirmed but they themselves don’t practice their faith. I have 23 students in my 7th grade CCD class, many of them don’t regularly go to Sunday Mass, and they don’t go to confession. 7th and 8th grade are confirmation classes. Last Advent I went through a detailed examination of conscience in class, specifically for teenagers, and urged them to attend the church’s penance service with individual confession afterwards. Only one of my students with his parents showed up.

No one can force anyone to go to confession. Therefore, contacting the bishop or priest are not going to help. The best thing is to pray for them.

There is a good book by Scott Hahn: “Lord, Have Mercy! The Healing Power of Confession”. If your sister likes to read or your nephews are old enough to read, may be your can give them this book.

Confession is such a beautiful and merciful Sacrament. We should run to the mercy, not run away from it. But the love of this sacrament has to come from within, from one’s own heart.
Pushing too hard will be to no avail. Pray and set a good example for them.

Once I shared with my small church group that how regularly go to confession helps me work toward holiness. After listening to me, a young man said he would like to do the same because he heard how it benefited me.

Action always speaks louder than words. We cannot convince people with words, but when we share our own experiences and witnesses, it always has better effect. So, show your nephews a good example how you appreciate the sacrament of confession, how it helped you, and encourage them to follow.

 

[puzzleannie]

please don’t blame the parish for what they teach or do not teach, until you find out of the children and the parents are actually attending the preparation classes and sacramental meetings, and actually go to Mass themselves. It is not the place of CCD to teach a child how to behave at Mass, it is for the parents. Catechists don’t take them to Mass, parents do. It is not the place of CCD to teach the child how to live out the commandments in daily life, that happens in the family, where the situations arise that call for moral reflection and decisions. We teach the commandments, the parents teach obedience and consequences.