Confessional Seal question

[Br.Rich_SFO]

My director told me that whatever I tell him during a session he considers under the seal/

He may act that way and one would hope he would, but nothing requires him to in the same manner as the “Seal of Confession” requires him to in the Sacrament of Reconciliation.

 

[Elizabeth502]

So if your director is a priest, and your asking him whether something is confessional material, and in that response you end up (say at the end of the session) “going to confession” (with him), everything up to that point would be fair game, just not the confession itself? That seems weird to me, and very “technical.”

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Examples?

a priest will die rather than reveal what is said in confession, and many have done so. If he should reveal a confession he is automatically excommunicated and will receive the most severe canonically penalty, removal from the priesthood

The point I was trying to make is that the Seal of the Confessional is necessarily protected by law.

I did not mean to imply that any priest would give in when/if pressured by the court.

 

[Elizabeth502]

Again, I have no fear of the material being mentioned in a court of law. Nevertheless, I would not like it mentioned among common company mutually known both to the priest and myself. I have my reasons.

Difficult to get a straight answer here. Not being bitter; I just see that there are varieties of opinions, & maybe I should just not attempt such a private conversation, period. It’s unfortunate. One would like to think one can approach a priest in confidentiality, outside of confession as well. Perhaps not. (It would seem that the confessional per se is not the proper place for this, given the time & conversation necessitated.)

Thanks for your attempts everyone.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Again, I have no fear of the material being mentioned in a court of law. Nevertheless, I would not like it mentioned among common company mutually known both to the priest and myself. I have my reasons.

Difficult to get a straight answer here. Not being bitter; I just see that there are varieties of opinions, & maybe I should just not attempt such a private conversation, period. It’s unfortunate. One would like to think one can approach a priest in confidentiality, outside of confession as well. Perhaps not. (It would seem that the confessional per se is not the proper place for this, given the time & conversation necessitated.)

Thanks for your attempts everyone.

Again, my comments were not really directed at your case.

Here is my suggestion. Ask the person you go to for Spiritual Direction when you first meet. The first couple of meetings should be where you see if you are comfortable with them as well as them seeing if they are comfortable with you.

Any competent Spiritual Director will keep what you say confidential as a good therapist would.

Especially if they are a member of some spiritual direction association as there will be guidelines for this.

 

[Joannm]

He may act that way and one would hope he would, but nothing requires him to in the same manner as the “Seal of Confession” requires him to in the Sacrament of Reconciliation.

Yes, I know, and I discussed that with him. He assured me that it is his personal decision to choose to treat direction in the same manner as confession and that he holds to that decision.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

So if your director is a priest, and your asking him whether something is confessional material, and in that response you end up (say at the end of the session) “going to confession” (with him), everything up to that point would be fair game, just not the confession itself? That seems weird to me, and very “technical.”

It is very technical and specific. Nothing discussed in the Sacrament of Reconciliation can be used or communicated outside the Sacrament. It pertains to and only to the Sacrament.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Yes, I know, and I discussed that with him. He assured me that it is his personal decision to choose to treat direction in the same manner as confession and that he holds to that decision.

It sounds like you have a good Spiritual Director.

 

[Chatter163]

The point I was trying to make is that the Seal of the Confessional is necessarily protected by law.

I did not mean to imply that any priest would give in when/if pressured by the court.

I am confused. You previously said the exact opposite of your first sentence above.

Not only that but as a mandated reporter there are things that must be reported to the relevant authorities.

**Also, the seal of confession is not fully recognized by law and the priest can be ordered to divulge what has been said in some cases if the court finds it necessary. **It is up to the priest to uphold the seal.

Can you provide an example of a local, state, or federal law that orders a priest to reveal what he has heard in confession? Can you provide an example of where a court has actually ordered this?

 

[Deacon_Ed]

Just to clarify something with regard to “mandated reporters.” This reply is limited to the state of California whose laws I am familiar with.

Clergy fall into the category of mandated reporters. That is, they are obligated to report abuse situations. However, there are legal limitations to this. For example:

A mandated reporter who is a clergy member who acquires knowledge or reasonable suspicion of elder or dependent adult abuse during a penitential communication is not subject to paragraph (1). For purposes of this subdivision, “penitential communication” means a
communication that is intended to be in confidence, including, but
not limited to, a sacramental confession made to a clergy member who,
in the course of the discipline or practice of his or her church,
denomination, or organization is authorized or accustomed to hear
those communications and under the discipline tenets, customs, or
practices of his or her church, denomination, or organization, has a
duty to keep those communications secret.

This same rule applies to child abuse.

This would apply to some communication in the role of spiritual director provided that a request for such secrecy was made in advance.

Deacon Ed

 

[Elizabeth502]

Just to clarify something with regard to “mandated reporters.” This reply is limited to the state of California whose laws I am familiar with.

Clergy fall into the category of mandated reporters. That is, they are obligated to report abuse situations. However, there are legal limitations to this. For example:This same rule applies to child abuse.

This would apply to some communication in the role of spiritual director provided that a request for such secrecy was made in advance.

Deacon Ed

The part that I was looking for (wondering about) was the part about “including, but not limited to.” And mine being not even a case involving material for mandated reporting, it would seem that confidentiality throughout the entire conversation (a conversation asking explicitly about confessional material) should apply.

But if I ever find such a clerical spiritual director, I’ll nevertheless ask him upfront if the entire conversation will be confidential, or just some possible sacramental segment of it.