Confessor of Ex-Girlfriend

[catharina]

I am a bit more interested in the psychology of this.

Why is this such an issue for you. Do you somehow feel that this is a statement on your relationship with this individual?

I would also like to ask you why/how this question even came up. What was your feeling/motivation in asking it? I assume that you instigated this and not the young woman.

As for dating being how to learn how to love. That is not the only way to learn how to love. Dating is for finding a potential spouse, if you do not wish to get married in the future then you are lying to the person you are dating. You are making them think you are available when you are not.

Do you have a spiritual director? I think these are two issues that you should bring up with them.

Adding this:

Intending no lack of charity, I must wonder if you
view the priesthood as some kind of “power” over others.

 

[SamH]

Dating + discerning a vocation to the priesthood = disaster
Either date or discern, not both at the same time!

Dating is discerning a vocation of marriage.
You are also discerning a vocation to the priesthood at the same time.
Two conflicting vocations!

I don’t see how the discerning process is mutually excusive from dating. The process of deciding to become a priest also means deciding not to enter into marriage. If the decision has not yet been made why is it an invitation to disaster?

What would be a disaster is a man making the decision to become a priest without adequately discerning all aspects of that decision. Imagine if 4 years from now the man realizing that he hadn’t fully explored the prospects of marriage and other avenues of life and doubting the decision that was made.

Discerning to become a priest doesn’t automatically mean the answer should be “yes” to becoming a priest - in some cases the answer should most definitely be “no”. Much like dating doesn’t automatically mean a marriage is forthcoming, in many cases after dating a while the decision is made the relationship should not continue and disaster would be the result a marriage were the result.

That being said, I agree with this:

OP: if you don’t realise how creepy your post sounds - well that’s creepier still!

 

[Cristiano]

Well, I should have added that I am in high school. But I would like to make a distinction. Dating is not simply a discernment of marriage. It is a way to learn to love. My vocations director is absolutely fine with me dating, so enough advice. Lets get back to the philosophy of a confession with a priest that one knows very personally. I have been to confession to a priest who was very close to my family and it was the best confession of my life.

I think that you need to find a more orthodox spiritual director.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

I don’t see how the discerning process is mutually excusive from dating. The process of deciding to become a priest also means deciding not to enter into marriage. If the decision has not yet been made why is it an invitation to disaster?

Dating is the discernment process to find a spouse. If one is not open to marriage (which needs to be discerned before dating starts) then one should not be dating.

Many dioceses and religious communites will not except men as candidate who have a recent history of dating. It does not show the ability to live out the promise of celibacy (for secular priests) or the vow of chastity (for religious).

 

[KCT]

What would be a disaster if a man making the decision to become a priest without adequately discerning all aspects of that decision. Imagine if 4 years from now the man realizing that he hadn’t fully explored the prospects of marriage and other avenues of life and doubting the decision that was made.

Should men considering marriage spend a summer in a seminary to be sure they are not called to the priesthood?

 

[SamH]

Should men considering marriage spend a summer in a seminary to be sure they are not called to the priesthood?

Only if they are ALSO considering becoming a priest. If they already know they don’t want to be a priest - what would be the point?

The decision to become a priest should not be entered into lightly. My nephew considered becoming a priest and rejected the idea and went college instead. He became a “regular” college student that dated and socialized with his friends. His junior year he decided to become a priest. My sister and my BIL encouraged him to wait until he graduated from college before joining the seminary. They feared he might have another change of heart. Two years later he joined the seminary.

The fact that the decision is hard or takes time does not reflect a lack of faith but recognition of the seriousness of the decision.

 

[SamH]

Dating is the discernment process to find a spouse. If one is not open to marriage (which needs to be discerned before dating starts) then one should not be dating.
.

And why is this man not open to marriage? He hasn’t decided to become a priest - it is an option he’s weighing.

Dating
Many dioceses and religious communites will not except men as candidate who have a recent history of dating. It does not show the ability to live out the promise of celibacy (for secular priests) or the vow of chastity (for religious).

I wasn’t aware of that, I can only speak from experiance in the Kansas City dioceses, they make no such prequalification. They will of course question the long term commitment of a man that has recently broken off a long term “serious” relationship.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

And why is this man not open to marriage? He hasn’t decided to become a priest - it is an option he’s weighing.

Right, but dating should only occur after one has discerned he is open to marriage.

I think I was pretty clear stating this in my post.

I wasn’t aware of that, I can only speak from experiance in the Kansas City dioceses, they make no such prequalification. They will of course question the long term commitment of a man that has recently broken off a long term “serious” relationship.

Like I said, many (if not most) dioceses and religious communites do have this requirement but it is not one of the listed requirments. Most of the listed requirements show what would disqualify one from ever applying. Having a recent dating history will not absolutely disqualify one from applying, it will just either necessitate a wait to apply or extend the application process.

 

[baltobetsy]

I think that you need to find a more orthodox spiritual director.

The OP is in high school. He needs experience with all kinds of relationships, including dating, as part of his normal development.

 

[puzzleannie]

I don’t see how the discerning process is mutually excusive from dating. The process of deciding to become a priest also means deciding not to enter into marriage. If the decision has not yet been made why is it an invitation to disaster?
:

do you understand why discerning marriage to Mabel at the same time you are discerning marriage to Ethel could lead to disaster?

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

The OP is in high school. He needs experience with all kinds of relationships, including dating, as part of his normal development.

So those who do not date during High School have abnormal development?

Why is dating part of “normal” development?

 

[Cristiano]

The OP is in high school. He needs experience with all kinds of relationships, including dating, as part of his normal development.

Dating in high school could be considered normal development for this very secular society but I believe it to be completely wrong. Dating is for men and not for boys. Boys are supposed to learn how to communicate and relate to girls but that is well before and independently from dating. Developing friendships based on character is appropriate for boys. Dating is about couples thus it is for men and women.

 

[SamH]

do you understand why discerning marriage to Mabel at the same time you are discerning marriage to Ethel could lead to disaster?

Agreed, but the Church is neither Mabel or Ethel.

I hope anyone that goes on a first date with your son or daughter knows what they’re getting into.

 

[Cristiano]

Agreed, but the Church is neither Mabel or Ethel…

Vocation is a calling that happens independently from other things, callings from God will not contradict each other. I assume that you would agree that a vocation to the priesthood does not happen at the same time of a vocation to marriage. If someone claims to discern between two different vocations at the same time, then the individual is simply doing comparative shopping for what it feels better. Such choice becomes relativism and not discernment for a true vocation.

…I hope anyone that goes on a first date with your son or daughter knows what they’re getting into.

If they do not know what they are getting into it, then they could use the opportunity to learn how grown ups should behave.

 

[SamH]

Vocation is a calling that happens independently from other things, callings from God will not contradict each other. .

How exactly do you know this?

 

[Cristiano]

Vocation is a calling that happens independently from other things, callings from God will not contradict each other. …

How exactly do you know this?

After re-reading it I see that the first part of my sentence can be confusing and mis-leading. I was trying to point out that priesthood and marriage are conflicting as vocations, and the lack of one does not imply the presence of the other. A person should not discern between the two of them because one is obviously false. Each vocation should be discerned independently from others. If they happen to be true then they will be separated in time.

 

[puzzleannie]

Agreed, but the Church is neither Mabel or Ethel.

I hope anyone that goes on a first date with your son or daughter knows what they’re getting into.

OP is the one who said he was discerning a vocation
would you let your daughter go on a first date with a guy who is “discerning marriage” with another girl?

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

After re-reading it I see that the first part of my sentence can be confusing and mis-leading. I was trying to point out that priesthood and marriage are conflicting as vocations, and the lack of one does not imply the presence of the other. A person should not discern between the two of them because one is obviously false. Each vocation should be discerned independently from others. If they happen to be true then they will be separated in time.

On top of that there are not just two vocations, priesthood and married life.

There are the single life, religious life, life within a third order (which can coincide with secular priesthood, married life, and single life), and the diaconate.

 

[SamH]

. A person should not discern between the two of them because one is obviously false.

OK, I’ll bite, which one is false?

 

[SamH]

On top of that there are not just two vocations, priesthood and married life.

There are the single life, religious life, life within a third order (which can coincide with secular priesthood, married life, and single life), and the diaconate.

Agreed. But what is your point?