Confirmation: Decisive Sacrament in End-Times

[spauline]

Desmond Birch, in his 23 year research of fully approved Catholic mystics, uncovered a theme in which the mystics suggest that in the end times, what leads to the great apostasy is that Catholic parents will start back sliding and not Confirm their children.

They prophesy that when Antichrist comes, and visciously persecutes the Church, most of those that are confirmed shall be strengthened enough by the Sacrament to endure martyrdom, and hence be saved, whereas the majority of those who aren’t confirmed will apostatize and be damned.

Imagine that, the Sacrament that is perhaps least evident from Scripture ends up being the decisive mark for eternity.

I think of the parable of the Ten Virgins: five were wise and brought oil (they were Annointed with the Oil that confers the perennial Seven Gifts of the Holy Spirit, that strenghten for the adult Catholic life). The other five didn’t bring oil, and were damned.

Appropriate, isn’t it, at least for a Catholic?

 

[jmjconder]

Desmond Birch, in his 23 year research of fully approved Catholic mystics, uncovered a theme in which the mystics suggest that in the end times, what leads to the great apostasy is that Catholic parents will start back sliding and not Confirm their children.

They prophesy that when Antichrist comes, and visciously persecutes the Church, most of those that are confirmed shall be strengthened enough by the Sacrament to endure martyrdom, and hence be saved, whereas the majority of those who aren’t confirmed will apostatize and be damned.

Imagine that, the Sacrament that is perhaps least evident from Scripture ends up being the decisive mark for eternity.

I think of the parable of the Ten Virgins: five were wise and brought oil (they were Annointed with the Oil that confers the perennial Seven Gifts of the Holy Spirit, that strenghten for the adult Catholic life). The other five didn’t bring oil, and were damned.

Appropriate, isn’t it, at least for a Catholic?

That is a whole lot of thought-filled words. Actually, when one stops and reflects on it all ~ not a shocking realization.

As a Director of Catechesis in my parish I am with Confirmation candidates and their parents for years before prior to our Diocesan year for receiving the Sacrament. The troubling aspect that you speak of - happens way before the year of the supposed Confirmation.

It usually begins right after Baptism when parents fail to carry through on their Baptismal commitment to be the primary educators of their child. The Church documents call it an irreplaceable primary vocation in the educational ministry of their children: *“Hence, parents must be acknowledged as the first and foremost educators of their children. Their role as educators is so decisive that **scarcely anything *can compensate for their failure in it” (FC] On The Role of the Christian Family in the Modern World 36).

• “irreplaceable” responsibility and “scarcely anything” ~ What accurate words that lead to the troubling outcome that spauline has so boldly noted.

There is not truer statement…the family that prays together +

Let us keep praying for families…

 

[spauline]

That is a whole lot of thought-filled words. Actually, when one stops and reflects on it all ~ not a shocking realization.

As a Director of Catechesis in my parish I am with Confirmation candidates and their parents for years before prior to our Diocesan year for receiving the Sacrament. The troubling aspect that you speak of - happens way before the year of the supposed Confirmation.

It usually begins right after Baptism when parents fail to carry through on their Baptismal commitment to be the primary educators of their child. The Church documents call it an irreplaceable primary vocation in the educational ministry of their children: *“Hence, parents must be acknowledged as the first and foremost educators of their children. Their role as educators is so decisive that **scarcely anything ***can compensate for their failure in it” (FC] On The Role of the Christian Family in the Modern World 36).

• “irreplaceable” responsibility and “scarcely anything” ~ What accurate words that lead to the troubling outcome that spauline has so boldly noted.

There is not truer statement…the family that prays together +

Let us keep praying for families…

I absolutely agree, JMJconder (and JMJ to you, too! ).

So many Catholic families fail today to realize the grave obligation to educate their children. It is frightening to think of the souls lost because of this. The world is now run by the dragon. The myth of Augustine’s Millennium is no longer appropriate. We are in the hour of darkness, not light, and the majority of the Catholic families in Western civilization do not understand.

I am NOT saying that we are in the times of the end, for the self same mystics would place us not in the great apostasy currently, but rather the minor apostasy, that shall be healed if necessary by the minor chastisement, leading to Christian reunion and a restoration of Catholicism in the world.

But, it is incredible to think that the fallen nature shall be so depraved, that having a dress rehearsal for the end of the world behind them, the Catholics of the age of peace, as it disintegrates, shall be so lax as to fail in such simple matter: educate your children and confirm them.

I think of the words of Good Friday, where Christ chastens the Jews [of His day], what did I do to you to deserve this? I lead you out of Egypt, restored you after the Exile, had mercy?

So then, His rebuke is cried toward the Gentiles in the times of the end: Am I asking so much, to confirm your children? To simply accept the Gospel when it is peaceful? How have I wronged you? I lead you to freedom from pagan persecution, I gave you a kingdom. You resisted My Will, and gradually fell away. I chastened you, and restored you unto Myself, giving you a final age of peace? Is it asking so much, to simply raise thy children to know Me and love Me, and to confirm them? Am I asking so much?

Indeed, the world will then have no excuse.

 

[a_pilgrim]

…They prophesy that when Antichrist comes, and visciously persecutes the Church, most of those that are confirmed shall be strengthened enough by the Sacrament to endure martyrdom, and hence be saved, whereas the majority of those who aren’t confirmed will apostatize and be damned…

Perhaps, then, this is one more illustration of the merits inherent in the Eastern practice of administering the Sacrament of Confirmation to infants, concurrent with their baptism.

 

[spauline]

Perhaps, then, this is one more illustration of the merits inherent in the Eastern practice of administering the Sacrament of Confirmation to infants, concurrent with their baptism.

ahoj, jak se mas?

mam se dobre.

Perhaps, there is no dogma on when it should be given. Problem is, it is better that they are consciously able to choose it. That is at least how we see it in the West.

Bohu Diky.

Zpanem Bohem.

 

[Phemie]

Perhaps, there is no dogma on when it should be given. Problem is, it is better that they are consciously able to choose it. That is at least how we see it in the West.

But in the Latin rite Church doesn’t envision that one will have to wait until he/she is in high school for Confirmation, it says that one can be confirmed at the age of reason (7). It also does not consider the sacrament one of maturity since it says confirm those in danger of dying, even infants.

What it does do is allow bishops to set the age for their dioceses and over the last 3 decades or so that age has been getting progressively higher. Thankfully, some dioceses have started reversing that trend and have started confirming before First Communion, the traditional way of doing things.

 

[spauline]

But in the Latin rite Church doesn’t envision that one will have to wait until he/she is in high school for Confirmation, it says that one can be confirmed at the age of reason (7). It also does not consider the sacrament one of maturity since it says confirm those in danger of dying, even infants.

What it does do is allow bishops to set the age for their dioceses and over the last 3 decades or so that age has been getting progressively higher. Thankfully, some dioceses have started reversing that trend and have started confirming before First Communion, the traditional way of doing things.

well, yeah, age of reason. When did i say that means high school age. The point was, why infants? They don’t have age of reason. Most of what you say i already know.

Personally, I agree, 14 is definitely not a good age, that is the worst age.

better at 8 or 9, or else, 18-21. probably 18, because college will cause them to apostatize.

 

[a_pilgrim]

…Problem is, it is better that they are consciously able to choose it…

Why?? How does this make the sacrament “better?”

 

[Frosty]

But in the Latin rite Church doesn’t envision that one will have to wait until he/she is in high school for Confirmation, it says that one can be confirmed at the age of reason (7). It also does not consider the sacrament one of maturity since it says confirm those in danger of dying, even infants.

What it does do is allow bishops to set the age for their dioceses and over the last 3 decades or so that age has been getting progressively higher. ** Thankfully, some dioceses have started reversing that trend and have started confirming before First Communion, the traditional way of doing things**.

I’m a bit confused about this. When were Catholic children confirmed before receiving their First Communion? My siblings and I were born in the years between 1946 and 1956. All of us received First Communion at the end of Grade One when so we were either six or seven years old. We all were confirmed during Grade Six so we were either eleven or twelve. This was also the case with my parents and their relatives. Fast forward to the next generation and the only difference was that the kids received First Communion in Grade Two and Confirmation in Grade Seven.
I understand that each Diocese may have set a different time for these two sacraments but I do not know of any elderly people who were Confirmed before First Communion. So I guess my question is when was this the tradition?

 

[a_pilgrim]

…I do not know of any elderly people who were Confirmed before First Communion. So I guess my question is when was this the tradition?

I was… that is, if 57 years old qualifies me as being among the “elderly!”

That aside, to answer your question, this is Section 1290 from the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

1290 In the first centuries Confirmation generally comprised one single celebration with Baptism, forming with it a “double sacrament,” according to the expression of St. Cyprian. Among other reasons, the multiplication of infant baptisms all through the year, the increase of rural parishes, and the growth of dioceses often prevented the bishop from being present at all baptismal celebrations. In the West the desire to reserve the completion of Baptism to the bishop caused the temporal separation of the two sacraments. The East has kept them united, so that Confirmation is conferred by the priest who baptizes. But he can do so only with the “myron” consecrated by a bishop.

 

[Phemie]

I’m a bit confused about this. When were Catholic children confirmed before receiving their First Communion? My siblings and I were born in the years between 1946 and 1956. All of us received First Communion at the end of Grade One when so we were either six or seven years old. We all were confirmed during Grade Six so we were either eleven or twelve. This was also the case with my parents and their relatives. Fast forward to the next generation and the only difference was that the kids received First Communion in Grade Two and Confirmation in Grade Seven.
I understand that each Diocese may have set a different time for these two sacraments but I do not know of any elderly people who were Confirmed before First Communion. So I guess my question is when was this the tradition?

The order of the sacraments of initiation were Baptism/Confirmation/Communion until 1910 when Pope Pius X gave permission for children to receive Communion at the age 6 or 7 and the order of the sacraments was changed.

I received my First Communion at the end of Grade 1 (1960) and was confirmed the next year. In our diocese the bishop usually only visited once every two years and when he visited everyone who’d received their First Communion since his last visit was confirmed.

 

[Frosty]

**I was… that is, if 57 years old qualifies me as being among the “elderly!” **

That aside, to answer your question, this is Section 1290 from the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

I’m a couple of years older than you. The “elderly” people I meant are those of my parents’ generation. I asked the question about when it was tradition because I’ve found that on this forum the word tradition usually means something that was the norm before Vatican II. It wasn’t in my case nor with anyone I know, so that is why I am a trifle confused.

 

[Frosty]

The order of the sacraments of initiation were Baptism/Confirmation/Communion until 1910 when Pope Pius X gave permission for children to receive Communion at the age 6 or 7 and the order of the sacraments was changed.

.

Thanks. That’s what I wanted to know.

 

[Guy]

Sounds like a plausible (and probably probable) scenario