Conflicted: Does it make sense to be gay and remain Catholic?

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RealisticCatholic

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Obviously, the Catholic Church teaches against same-sex behavior.

For brevity’s sake, by “gay” in the the thread’s title, I just mean same-sex attraction in general.

I’m not trying to start a controversial post. I’m truly conflcited after reading this article, but it put the whole “gay priesthood” thing in perspective for me.

My main feeling, coming away from the article, is that the whole system or institution of the church (hierarchy, priesthood, etc.) is deeply affected precisely because how the Church has come to talk about homosexuality.

It’s as if a gay man (or I suppose woman, too, but this article was about the priesthood in particular) is inevitably going to face great hardship in navigating the waters of vocation and a life of faith.

 
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This part especially made me feel extremely sad. I don’t know. It’s just this whole issue seems to be so complicated. It just makes me wonder if we’re right in the middle of a great mess that won’t be finally resolved for another hundred years.

Does it make sense to be a same-sex attracted Christian and be in the Church?
Then there is the common experience of a gay boy or teen, brought up in the church, who turns to God in struggling with the question of his difference and displacement from the normal. He is forced to ponder deeper questions than most of his peers, acquires powerful skills of observation, and develops a precocious spirituality that never fully leaves him. This resonates for myself as a Catholic boy and teen. The first person I ever came out to was God, in a silent prayer on my way to Communion. I was an altar boy, knew well how to swing a brass thurible full of incense, could debate the nuances of transubstantiation by the age of 11, and considered the priesthood as a vocation (I concluded I wasn’t good enough a person). Like many solitary gay Catholic boys, I saw in Jesus a model — single, sensitive, outside a family, marginalized and persecuted but ultimately vindicated and forever alive.
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Yes, it does make sense to be same-sex attracted and a faithful Catholic. I know people who are attracted to the same sex who have left the Church and others who will never leave. What I see with articles like the above is the stereotying of ALL people with SSA as having the same ideas and beliefs about how one actually acts on their attractions, and how one lives in general.

The world tells people with SSA to define themselves by their sexual attractions. This is a harmful way to identify oneself.

I think the recent words of Archbishop Chaput are worth considering:

‘’There is no such thing as an ‘LGBTQ Catholic’ or a ‘transgender Catholic’ or a ‘heterosexual Catholic,’ as if our sexual appetites defined who we are; as if these designations described discrete communities of differing but equal integrity within the real ecclesial community, the body of Jesus Christ.”

http://m.ncregister.com/blog/edward...atholic-should-not-be-used-in-church-document
 
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Does it make sense for a human person to conform herself or himself to Christ, belong to his Church, and strive for holiness? Yes, of course.
 
Due to the fall, we all have disordered passions in one way or another. This is called concupiscence. The whole point of the Church is to save every single person, to help us battle against the concupiscences of the flesh and subdue them to the spirit, to heal our souls when we fall, etc.

That doesn’t mean every person is called or capable of living out every vocation within the Church, but we are all called to penitence and salvation, to pick up our cross and follow Jesus. And as a community of faith and charity, we should help bear each other’s burdens.
 
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I somewhat struggle personally. I’m gay or have SSA, and I’m on the road to becoming a Catholic. I think that you can be both, but it’s hard. And I personally believe that the Church needs to do more to help people such as myself who have this personal struggle.
 
I have SSA and I’m curious to hear how you’d like for this to be resolved? Or I guess whether you think if it could be resolved.
 
What I see with articles like the above is the stereotying of ALL people with SSA as having the same ideas and beliefs about how one actually acts on their attractions, and how one lives in general.
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Well, the article didn’t really stereotype in my opinion. It talks about faithful gay Catholics in the church as well as others who end up leaving the church, and those who strive for the usual standards like celibacy. The article is meant to show the struggles and why there is so much current conflict.
 
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I honestly believe that it’s hard to understand this topic, in the first place, if you don’t even know someone who can tell you about their experiences in the Church.

So thank you for opening up.

As the article suggests, it’s hard.

Yes, as others have said, Original Sin is a thing. No one is saying that everyone is born perfect and should therefore be able to live in accord with each and every desire they have.

Suffering can also indicate bad fruit from a bad position or policy, though. Has calling homosexual persons “intrinsically disordered” been helpful or harmful? What other group is called inherently disordered in an analogous way?

But at the same time, we shouldn’t predict every single struggle as a result of the fallen world. In other words, we don’t use this logic for other things. We try to discern and make things better. We try to end division. We try to accompany those who struggle, etc.

The point of bringing up the article is precisely to become attentive to the fact that for many SSA people, navigating a path in the church is often hard or at least a paradox for many. I highly recommend reading the article to understand my reaction.
 
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The Church offers what transform us by grace into holy men and women: the Sacraments. By being baptized and confirmed, and by confessing our sins and receiving the Body and Blood of Jesus in the Eucharist, we truly can (and do!) change.

We all struggle with something. I can’t pretend to know your own struggle but I can attest to the fact that the sacraments are not just symbols but really do give us the grace to change, to begin to be like Jesus.
 
The sacraments don’t heal one of homosexual inclination or same-sex attraction is the bigger point, though, and what is behind the article.

The issue is not that the Church is or is not the means to come into relationship with God.

The issue is how this whole issue of “gay priests” and the “crisis” has been impacted at least in part with how the Church deals with homosexuality in its language, policies, and culture.
 
@RealisticCatholic

The sacraments make it possible to live out the call to holiness.
 
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I understand what the Church is trying to say with “intrinsically disordered.” But I think that it can and has led to the laity mistreating those with SSA, due to being catechized poorly or improperly, or not fully understanding the Church and what they mean. That’s not to say it isn’t sinful to act on it obviously. I just think the way it’s approached could probably change. This is an area where I think the Church could reform in the way it addresses the topic, rather than calling it “intrinsically disordered.”
 
I stopped reading at the second paragraph when the author asserted that the Church “officially teaches that gay men are ‘objectively disordered’”. Which it doesn’t.
 
I’m not sure, except to say that I think that paragraph I quoted is very ironic, and probably resembles the situation for many gay/SSA people who also struggle with their faith. It requires them to do more soul-searching than other people, or at least if they did not have SSA.

This is possibly why so many priests have SSA, because they internalize everything so much, are serious about their faith, and yet have often been cornered into the priesthood as the only way to safely live out their calling.
 
That’s a shame, because the article was very long and had so much more relevant to this current conversation.
 
RealisticCatholic said:
Suffering can also indicate bad fruit from a bad position or policy, though. Has calling homosexual persons “intrinsically disordered” been helpful or harmful? What other group is called inherently disordered in an analogous way?
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I didn’t finish reading the article, however, based on what I’ve ready so far, it is intellectually dishonest or biased against the Church’s teaching.

The author is writing with the incorrect point of view that Church teaches that homosexual men are disordreded.

This is not true. The Catachism of the Catholic Church clearly states that “homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered.” But NOT homosexual men.
2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity, tradition has always declared that “homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered.” They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.
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Here is what the next two paragraphs go on to say:
2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.

2359 Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection.
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Yes, the issue is very complex. However, one again, the issue isn’t with men who experience same sex attraction. The issue is with men who disagree with the sexual morality of the Church. A closeted gay man who 100% agrees with the Church regarding sexual morality isn’t a problem. Actually, he’s most likely a blessing to the Church. However, the man who is secretly opposed to the Church’s teachings on sexual morality is a problem. Doesn’t matter if they are straight or gay; any priest who disagrees with the Church’s teachings regarding morality is a cancer within in the Church.

http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a6.htm#2357

I pray this helps.

God Bless
 
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The Sacraments can’t change SSA though, and the Church acknowledges that more often than not an individual can’t choose whether to have SSA.

It’s an issue that non SSA Catholics can’t truly understand. The support and empathy definitely helps but at the core of almost every Catholic that has SSA including myself, there’s deeper mental and spiritual battles than most have to think about.
 
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