Confused about mortal sin

[Thyme]

Hello,

On this forum I heard about mortal sin for my first time and it seemed like a mortal sin is a sin which the committee is fully aware of.

I asked my priest about this (as I did not fully understand it- and still don’t!) and he said that a mortal sin is something really serious, such as murder, abortion, adultary and missing Mass.

I’m not sure if it’s bad to write what I confessed, but I confessed sex before marriage (which would obviously involve contraception). He then told me that it wasn’t a mortal sin because at that time my faith wasn’t very strong, so it wasn’t deliberately going against God.

What do you think of this?

I never know if I’m in a state of mortal sin. I find it really confusing. Could something like telling a lie when you know it’s a sin be mortal? One time I felt like I had to lie (can’t remember why). I thought before about the fact that it would be a sin, but saw no other way around it, so lied. Was this mortal because I was fully aware it was against God? Or does it count for more grave matters, such as missing Mass, abortion etc?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Kasirpatiesiba]

Just a quick answer from me.
The matter has to be grave, otherwise it is not mortal sin. Apart form that free will and knowledge have to be present. One does not have to be fully aware that the sin is offending God (as some put it). If a nonbeliever was to murder someone with full knowledge and will he would sin mortally. Of course he has to understand that it is a very bad thing to murder.
It is hard to judge the sins in past, it is better to just confess them and forget.
It is good you have a priest you can talk to. Many people go through the stage where they become very anxious and worried, start seeing mortal sin in everything. I had such time in my life and it is horrible.
Sins committed with full knowledge have to be taken seriously, but they are not mortal if the matter is not grave.

 

[MtnDwellar]

I was once confused about mortal sins. If knowledge was key, would it be better to remain ignorant? The answer is of course, No.

The reason is that whether a sin is mortal or not, we have to atone for any action which offends God. Because the premarital sex and contraception was not mortally sinful, it did not require a great deal of forgiveness and alone would not send a person straight to hell upon death. But, atonement is still required.

 

[JRKH]

Hello,

On this forum I heard about mortal sin for my first time and it seemed like a mortal sin is a sin which the committee is fully aware of.

I asked my priest about this (as I did not fully understand it- and still don’t!) and he said that a mortal sin is something really serious, such as murder, abortion, adultary and missing Mass.

I’m not sure if it’s bad to write what I confessed, but I confessed sex before marriage (which would obviously involve contraception). He then told me that it wasn’t a mortal sin because at that time my faith wasn’t very strong, so it wasn’t deliberately going against God.

What do you think of this?

It is good that you confessed this and (I assume) was absolved.
Your priest told you that it was probably not mortal based on the “full knowledge” portion of the requirement. You see there are three requirements for a sin to be Mortal. 1) It must be grave matter, 2) Full knowledge (that it is grave matter) and 3) Full consent of the Will.
To put the above in simpler terms, One must know something is a terrible thing to do and choose to do it anyway.

I never know if I’m in a state of mortal sin. I find it really confusing. Could something like telling a lie when you know it’s a sin be mortal? One time I felt like I had to lie (can’t remember why). I thought before about the fact that it would be a sin, but saw no other way around it, so lied. Was this mortal because I was fully aware it was against God? Or does it count for more grave matters, such as missing Mass, abortion etc?

We cannot say here if the particulars of the lie made it mortal. This is something best discussed with your confessor.
When in doubt, confess it.

Thanks in advance.

Happy to be of help

Peace
James

 

[Thyme]

Thank you very much for these replies!

There is one more thing to ask though; what is a sin of grave matter?

Is it something that goes against literal commandments? My best example is that “Thou shall not murder” can also include physically/verbally harming, but it’s only mortal if it’s literal murdering?

 

[Dorothy]

I feel the need to add this:

Remember that Our Lord said that whoever looks at a woman with lust in his heart has committed adultery. (Sorry I didn’t have the quote in front of me and need to be out of the house soon).

The Church teaches us that sexual fantasies, (whether indulged in by men or women, of course) when indulged in deliberately, is as serious as adultery. Adultery is mortal sin, and so is sexual fantasies, deliberately indulged and consented to, a mortal sin. We all need to cooperate with the grace of God so that we can reject thoughts that are temptations, and recognize that these thoughts can go too far.

I have a concern for all children who are not being taught this. They need to know what the boundaries are, and what a spiritual warfare we are in.

If they are not being taught this then God alone knows how morally culpable they are. However, the harm is being done to them by their not knowing this teaching!

Dear Jesus and Mary, I surrender all young people to you and pray that they come to know all of your teachings.

 

[JRKH]

Thank you very much for these replies!

There is one more thing to ask though; what is a sin of grave matter?

Is it something that goes against literal commandments? My best example is that “Thou shall not murder” can also include physically/verbally harming, but it’s only mortal if it’s literal murdering?

I have been told that mortal sins are those that violate the ten commandments. However I’m not so sure that thsi does not include grey areas (degrees of severity).

The best yardstick is probably,

1. Does the Action violate the Law of Love (Love of God or Love of neighbor) by causing harm to your neighbor (physical, mental, emotional)?
2. Does the thought (dwelling on the sinful desire) violate teh Law of Love and thereby cause damage to your soul?
3. Are you doing this in full knowldege that the thought or action offends God and you are choosing to do it anyway? In other words are you deliberately choosing to ignore, defy, and offend God?

Mortal sin, requires a conscience choice to defy and offend God. This can be done either by action or by thought.
But be careful - thoughts are often random and as such do not become sinful until we are aware of them and make the choice to dwell on them.
Example - Someone cuts me off in traffic and I become angry. This burst of emotion is not sinful. I then become aware of my anger and choose to dwell on it, that is taking pleasure in the anger and perhaps planning to cut him off at the first opporunity. This dwelling and planning is sinful for I know this is sinful.

Peace
James

 

[Thyme]

Example - Someone cuts me off in traffic and I become angry. This burst of emotion is not sinful. I then become aware of my anger and choose to dwell on it, that is taking pleasure in the anger and perhaps planning to cut him off at the first opporunity. This dwelling and planning is sinful for I know this is sinful.

Peace
James

Thanks.

Well, my priest told me that we sin all the time. For example, he said that waking up in a bad mood in the morning is a sin. It is a small sin that we didn’t commit on purpose, but we still need to ask for forgiveness.

So, am I right to say that; if someone cuts you off in traffic and you become angry, that is a venial sin. You then become aware of your anger and choose to dwell on it (mortal sin?), but if you dwell on it without thinking about the fact that it is wrong to dwell on it, it is a venial sin?

It’s difficult to see the line between non-grave and grave matter.

 

[JRKH]

Thanks.

Well, my priest told me that we sin all the time. For example, he said that waking up in a bad mood in the morning is a sin. It is a small sin that we didn’t commit on purpose, but we still need to ask for forgiveness.

So, am I right to say that; if someone cuts you off in traffic and you become angry, that is a venial sin. You then become aware of your anger and choose to dwell on it (mortal sin?), but if you dwell on it without thinking about the fact that it is wrong to dwell on it, it is a venial sin?

It’s difficult to see the line between non-grave and grave matter.

The difficulty in seeing the line between grave and non-grave matter is because we tend to look at this wrongheadedly. We tend to look to mauch at the “rules” and not enough at the underlying principles.

Lets’ ask some questions here.
Q: Does God condemn souls to Hell?
A: No. The soul, by its actions during life chooses hell. God rejects no soul which earnestly seeks to do good and to unite itself with Him

Q: What would happen if we died in a state of unrepented Mortal Sin?
A: We would Go to Hell.

Q: Why?
A: Because by committing an act (or thoughts) in direct and knowing defiance of Gods Will for us we are rejecting His saving grace and Mercy.

By the above I hope to show that the essential element, or first cause, in any sin being “mortal” is a rejection of God and God’s will for us.

God’s Will is that we Love Him as He has loved us. Since we cannot do this (Love God directly deserves) we must show our Love through how we treat our neighbor. When we deliberately reject that Love and refuse to show that Love to others, we are already falling into a state of mortal sin. Everything els is just fall out from that rejection.

On the flip side of the coin, if we truly Love God with all our being, then any transgression against Him, His Love and His Mercy, will be seen by us as a “grave matter” for it offends Him who I must Love above all else.

Of course we must be careful about becoming overly scrupulous in these matters. Fulton Sheen once said about hearing confessions at a convent, that it was ,“like being stoned to death with popcorn”. The upshot was that the nuns confessed many sins but all small ones.

I have found that the best way to approach this is by looking at the 7 deadly sins rather than the 10 commandments. Most of our sinful thoughts and actions stem from “spiritual character flaws” such as:
Pride is excessive belief in one’s own abilities, that interferes with the individual’s recognition of the grace of God. It has been called the sin from which all others arise. Pride is also known as Vanity.

Envy is the desire for others’ traits, status, abilities, or situation.

Gluttony is an inordinate desire to consume more than that which one requires.

Lust is an inordinate craving for the pleasures of the body.

Anger is manifested in the individual who spurns love and opts instead for fury. It is also known as Wrath.

Greed is the desire for material wealth or gain, ignoring the realm of the spiritual. It is also called Avarice or Covetousness.

Sloth is the avoidance of physical or spiritual work.

If we choose to work on these things, to improve ourselves, rather than worry about the degree to which we “break a rule”, I’m sure you will find, as I have, that you will sin much less. Then if we work on practicing the heavenly or cardinal virtues of *faith, hope, charity, fortitude, justice, temperance, prudence *, our desire, and even our ability to sin will be lessened even more.

So in conclusion it is far better to work work at growing closer to God rather than seeking to move further from sin. The first will lead directly to the second. Strengthen your Love, seek His Will in your Life, and you will find great peace. Look up at His Loving reward, not down at what we deserve.

Peace
James

 

[Corki]

Thank you very much for these replies!

There is one more thing to ask though; what is a sin of grave matter?

Is it something that goes against literal commandments? My best example is that “Thou shall not murder” can also include physically/verbally harming, but it’s only mortal if it’s literal murdering?

Not exactly. If you assault someone, it is almost definately going to be a mortal sin against the 5th commandment even though no one was literally murdered.

There are a number of good examination of conscience lists available. Almost all of the things listed could be mortal sins; they are grave matter. If committed with full knowledge and full consent, they should be confessed. Here’s an example:

scborromeo.org/confess.htm

 

[DanWelshiMac]

**Thanks, James.
I was starting to get confused reading the posts on this.
I am glad I am married and older now and usually have no serious sins
to confess. I still have so gluttony but that’s about it.
Thanks
Dan
**

 

[MtnDwellar]

Thanks.

Well, my priest told me that we sin all the time. For example, he said that waking up in a bad mood in the morning is a sin. It is a small sin that we didn’t commit on purpose, but we still need to ask for forgiveness.

So, am I right to say that; if someone cuts you off in traffic and you become angry, that is a venial sin. You then become aware of your anger and choose to dwell on it (mortal sin?), but if you dwell on it without thinking about the fact that it is wrong to dwell on it, it is a venial sin?

It’s difficult to see the line between non-grave and grave matter.

You are correct. It is difficult to draw a line between mortal and venial sin. The line is gray. An action may be mortally sinful for one person and a similar action, due to mitigating factors, may be a venial sin for another. When in doubt, it is best to consult with one’s confessor.

 

[JRKH]

**Thanks, James.
I was starting to get confused reading the posts on this.
I am glad I am married and older now and usually have no serious sins
to confess. I still have so gluttony but that’s about it.
Thanks
Dan
**

Glad to hear that you are so far along on your journey.
Just one suggestion. Be careful of the sin of Pride. It’s the sneakiest of them all.

Peace
James

 

[JRKH]

You are correct. It is difficult to draw a line between mortal and venial sin. The line is gray. An action may be mortally sinful for one person and a similar action, due to mitigating factors, may be a venial sin for another. When in doubt, it is best to consult with one’s confessor.

Always the best advise. When dealing with these kinds of issues it is best to consult with either a confessor, or a spiritual director.

Peace
James

 

[Kasirpatiesiba]

This is indeed a difficult question.
I would start with referring to what has been said before:
It was said: “Mortal sin, requires a conscience choice to defy and offend God. This can be done either by action or by thought”. I would like to point out that for sin to be mortal there does not have to be a consciousness of offense caused to God. even sincere atheists can sin mortally
If anyone is interested there is a mistaken view that if we make a fundamental decision of following God in our lives (say YES to God), then none of our deeds are mortal sins as long as we do not decide to defy God. Idea was that sins against the creatures can not be mortal. Truth is, every sin to a degree harms our fellow men and defies God.
On the other hand, it seems evident that if a person renews such a fundamental choice every day and sincerely seeks God they would not commit a mortal sin.
I also wanted to say that it is normal and not sinful to get angry or wake up in a bad mood. The sin is going along with it. Even the saints get angry, it is human. Some would say, sin starts when we become aware of it and still keep doing it. It might be right. But then if because of our own negligence we get into a habit of being angry all the time, then I think our responsibility sets in even if we are not aware of it, because we have caused this state by sinful negligence. This also applies to cases of addiction. Our acts loose the mortal sin value when we are addicted as long as we try to work towards recovery. However, if one who is addicted does not try to change he is responsible for the weakened state of his will.
To be able to distinguish between mortal and venial sins, you have to work on your conscience. A good and easy guide are so called intrinsically evil acts, like abortion, murder etc. nothing justifies such acts. but the same principle of free will and full knowledge applies!

 

[Thyme]

Thank you for these responses. I think I have a better understanding now. I need to be able to fully judge my soul, or I may die thinking I’m without mortal sin.

Just to help clear things up though:

Say for example, someone said they would take a friend somewhere. The night before, they are up late and the next day, they no-longer feel like going. Would this be demonstration of not loving thy neighbour and be a mortal sin because it was out of free will, or would it be a venial sin because it does not have a grave matter?

Thanks again!

 

[JRKH]

Thank you for these responses. I think I have a better understanding now. I need to be able to fully judge my soul, or I may die thinking I’m without mortal sin.

Just to help clear things up though:

Say for example, someone said they would take a friend somewhere. The night before, they are up late and the next day, they no-longer feel like going. Would this be demonstration of not loving thy neighbour and be a mortal sin because it was out of free will, or would it be a venial sin because it does not have a grave matter?

Thanks again!

Where is the sin, or is there more than one sin here.
If you had agreed to take a friend somewhere, why did you stay up so late? (failure to plan)
If you simply don’t “feel like going” what prevents you from going anyway? (acting on your honor instead of on your “feelings”)

In all likelihood this issue would be a venial sin, but an examination the why’s surely will show up areas that need work. Potentially fatal areas, like Sloth, and Selfishness. Venial sins, when properly examined can show us much about ourselves.

Peace
James

 

[Thyme]

Where is the sin, or is there more than one sin here.
If you had agreed to take a friend somewhere, why did you stay up so late? (failure to plan)
If you simply don’t “feel like going” what prevents you from going anyway? (acting on your honor instead of on your “feelings”)

In all likelihood this issue would be a venial sin, but an examination the why’s surely will show up areas that need work. Potentially fatal areas, like Sloth, and Selfishness. Venial sins, when properly examined can show us much about ourselves.

Peace
James

Thank you,

So in that case, it would be sloth and selfishness, making it mortal?

However, isn’t even having a lie in on the weekend sloth and selfishness? But I don’t believe that having a lie in after a week of work is a grave sin. I don’t see how it is a grave matter…

…but then again, it is sloth and selfishness, which is grave?

 

[JRKH]

Thank you,

So in that case, it would be sloth and selfishness, making it mortal?

Please reread my post. I said that in all liklihood the scenerio proposed be venial.

However, isn’t even having a lie in on the weekend sloth and selfishness? But I don’t believe that having a lie in after a week of work is a grave sin. I don’t see how it is a grave matter…

…but then again, it is sloth and selfishness, which is grave?

Whether something is sloth and selfishness depends on why it is done.
If you have a lie in after a long weeks work is perfectly fine, unless you’ve made a promise to take someone somewhere…

Peace
James