Consenting to sinful thoughts?

[DeoJuventute]

If a thought is not sinful until you consent to it, then what exactly is consent? I suppose that sexual thoughts become sinful when you choose to take pleasure in those impure thoughts. But what about blasphemous, hateful, or angry thoughts? If someone cuts me off in traffic and I think to myself, “Boy, that guy really deserves to get t-boned,” then it is definitely me thinking that thought. And I may really believe it for several seconds until I cool down and realize that it’s wrong to have such a thought. But where is consent in all of that? Is there a timeframe for when consent begins?

The line between a “naturally occurring” thought and actually choosing to have that thought seems so thin that it’s very difficult to discern. What do you think?

 

[Bookcat]

(from previous posts of mine)

Regarding thoughts

while Jesus makes it clear that one can sin in ones thoughts…just cause some lustful thought happens does not mean that one sinned…

(and one can have a sufficiently good reason to think about sexual matters…for instance studying moral theology…but care must be taken to avoid things that would be a problem…but that is another question)

What should we do with* unwanted* sexual thoughts or other bad thoughts…thoughts against God etc? Those pesky temptations that can come …even though we are not seeking them etc…

(there are of course some things we should avoid that cause them…and there can be sin if it is something one should reasonably avoid…but often they come uninvited)

First…Relax. Do not worry.

Now are they mortal sins?

For a mortal sin one needs a grave matter …full knowledge AND deliberate consent!!!

A. If you do not want the thought…it the thought displeases you: it can be a sign actually that you did not give consent or do not give full consent.

B. Even if you felt a temptation for the thought – and were drawn to it —but rejected it and maybe even turned to God : again a sign not full consent.

C. But what if one has a tempting thought --say of a sexual nature and even hesitated for a moment…but then rejected it for one did not want to sin? : it can be partial consent perhaps (and thus a venial sin)-- or it may be no sin at all but rather a strong temptation that drew you but then you saw what was happening and turned away.

D. A temptation can even be very strong or the thoughts very often – but this does NOT mean one has consented! so worry not…even it they go on for a long time…

remember --for it to be mortal there must be that deliberate consent!

What to do? on the spiritual side–relax first of all and remember the above.

Next – know that the more one fears the thoughts the more likely they are to come… or said another way --the more a person seeks to avoid the thoughts the more likely he will have a problem with them. (but do not worry about this either!)

for example: for the next 10 seconds try NOT to think of an apple.

tick tock …

tick tock…

Ok what did you think of? Most likely an apple.

So it is best to ignore them and just not consent and then turn your attention to some other good thing…for instance whatever you are doing. Simply do not consent and move on. and do not worry

another point – thoughts can just happen --they are the stuff with which we think…it is up to us to consent and take them further or not. and just because they are REAL VIVID and almost “think themselves” does not mean per se that one has given ANY consent.

they can be annoying…but need cause no actual harm …

(Now difficulties with thoughts can happen to anyone…and has for centuries…nothing new!..but I will note too that “some” have a condition known as OCD (I knew someone with this once…it was a painful experience)…and thus should seek further professional help to work at overcoming it and to live a more peaceful life)

---

Another help…is the distinction between “first thoughts and emotions” (as Baur calls em) what they call the prima of the prima…“the first of the first” (as one of my Professors called em…he was a Dominican)…these are involuntary things that just come up…such are not sins. They can tempt one of course to sin…or one can then proceed to some sin…but they are the stuff of the mind and emotions which “happen to one” …and really the are opportunities for growing in virtue etc as well…

How to deal with these? First of relax…don’t scruple…don’t fear them…to try to swat them all as the come…just simply turn to other things…or the thing you are doing…or to God…(of course do not consent)…but if you are too defensive against them…they may get worse actually…and confuse you more…instead turn to God or again other good things…accept that hey…somethings wild thoughts will come to you…

(and these can happen to all of us by the way…)

There is a story from the desert of the early Centuries of the Church where a younger hermit when to an older one with the problems of thoughts happening to him all the time…the older hermit told him to go outside open his cloak and catch the wind.

The younger hermit said such is not possible…

the older hermit replied --neither is it possible to stop all the thoughts that can come to you…your choice is to say “yes” or “no”.

So relax about “unwanted thoughts”…sometimes they just come…you know like unwanted phone calls from politicitians and salepersons etc…but you can always say “no thank you” or just ignore the call and go about your business

 

[Bookcat]

Of course we need to reasonably avoid temptation we know will be a problem for us…that we can reasonablly avoid…now we of course know we can not avoid all…for they are everywhere…but one has to know oneself…and for example know that he needs to not watch a particular movie etc…but even if we do this…there will still be temptations!

Based on Tanquerey (but my words somewhat…and others note similar)

When one is tempted…

Now what are some signs of lack of consent or partial consent…

1. We may judge that there has been *no consent *if in spite of the suggestion and the instinctive pleasure …we experience that we do not want it or not happy we are tempted…or we struggle not to be overcome…it we are horrified at the evil…if we turn to God in prayer…(unless later of course one this changes…)
2. If one does not reject the temptation as soon as one realizes it it is dangerous for one…this is a fault against prudence …
3. If one momentarily hesitates… but then does not want to offend God etc…and after that moment of hesitation rejects the temptation–again there is a venial sin of imprudence.
4. If one resists the temptation in a half-hearted way…one does resist but weakly…or slow way …but in the end rejects the temptation…there would be it seems half-consent…thus a venial sin.

 

[Aelred_Minor]

Adding to what has already been said, I would keep in mind that consent is only one part of the picture, knowledge is another. This doesn’t just mean, or primarily mean, knowledge you have locked up in your brain somewhere, but actual reflection on the moral nature of the act at the time you give your consent to it.

To me, the angry thought at the other driver sounds like it might be something you gave your consent to, even gave it forcefully. Yes, strong spontanious emotions can reduce the voluntary character of an act, but on the other hand one can delibarately foster or at least co-opt emotions to add force to one’s decisions, in which case in my judgement the consent of the will is if anything strengthened, not reduced. One needs self-awareness to distinguish between the two situations.

Whichever case it is here (or one followed swifty by the other), it does sound like a spur of the moment thing, without first reflecting on the moral nature of the choice to give in to uncharitable thoughts. Once your conscience caught up with your will, it sounds like you repented of the wrathful thought the senario you described.

I’m not a mind reader of course, but to me at least that sounds like the situation you are describing.

Since I’ve brought up this issue of knowledge of the moral nature of the act at the time you commit it, let me just mention in case anyone might misunderstand that making an attempt to avoid reflecting on the moral nature of an act in order to morally “get away” with it will not exempt someone from culpability for it. By doing this they prove that they already know that the act is wrong or may be wrong, and they are lying to themselves and in a sense to God on top of it all. The Catechism of the Catholic Church says:

“1859 Mortal sin requires full knowledge and complete consent. It presupposes knowledge of the sinful character of the act, of its opposition to God’s law. It also implies a consent sufficiently deliberate to be a personal choice. Feigned ignorance and hardness of heart do not diminish, but rather increase, the voluntary character of a sin.”