Consumed by depression and desire to end marriage...help!

  • Thread starter Thread starter Tim19
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
T

Tim19

Guest
Dear Friends,

I feel that I am at a breaking point in my marriage, and have been for some time. This is going to be a very long post, so I apologize in advance, but I appreciate any advice/guidance anyone can offer.

My wife and I married a little almost four years ago. We are both Catholic, and we now have one child about to turn three and a 15-month-old. I suppose I should be thankful that our marriage has been relatively peaceful. We rarely argue or fight. There is no alcohol or drug abuse. We have close family members living nearby. So why am I so miserable?

First off, you should know a little something about me. I am an enormously guilty person. I feel guilty about everything, and I do whatever possible to make others’ happy. I do not stick up for myself, and I can’t stand confrontations. When someone I am close to is angry with me, it just eats me away from the inside. Therefore, when someone does something that makes me angry, I rarely say anything because I want to avoid confrontation. It just sits inside until I forget about it and move on. I hate that I’m like this, but it’s simply not something I’ve been able to change.

I met my wife on a blind date that a close mutual friend of ours setup. We dated regularly at first, up until the point that we got together about 4-5 times a week. I had a great time hanging out with her. We were engaged after approximately six months of dating, and we scheduled our wedding for about 10 months later.

As a little background, I was living with my sister and her two adopted children when my wife and I met. My sister and I have always been extremely close, and when I graduated college, neither of us had much money or many friends, so we decided to live together. I always wanted to live on my own, but money was always an issue. I had lived with her for about seven years. At one point during that timeframe, she reached a stage in her life where she felt like she would never get married. She really wanted kids, so she decided to work in foster care with the hopes of adopting children. To make a long story short, infants were moved in and out of our home, until she finally ended up getting full custody of a boy and a girl. Although I had always enjoyed living with her, I yearned more and more for a change, or to live on my own. By this point, I could’ve afforded to live on my own, but my sister couldn’t afford a place of her own with two kids, so I ultimately stayed for her sake.

Why is this important? Well, I feel it was one of the main reasons why my wife and I were engaged so quickly. I’ve never had very high self-esteem, and I had met a woman who I knew really loved me, and I didn’t expect to find anyone else. I’m incredibly embarrassed to admit this too, but I was also a 30+ year-old virgin, so you can probably fill in the blanks on that. Finally, I was yearning for a change. I wanted a change of scenery. If I wasn’t going to be able to live alone, at least I would have someone new to hang out with. Don’t get me wrong, I loved my wife both before and during the engagement, but I guess I didn’t know her well enough.

…continued…
 
Fast forward to the last month or so of our engagement. We rented an apartment together because the building where we wanted to live had only one open apartment and we needed to lease it prior to our marriage in order to get it. Although we didn’t technically live together, we did spend a lot of time together in that apartment prior to our marriage. It was at this point that red flags started going up for me. But so much money and time had been spent on the wedding preparations, so many relatives had made travel plans, etc. There was no way I was going to break it off at this point.

We married and experienced the “honeymoon” phase for a while. We were relatively happy living life as a young couple. We were practicing NFP and hoping to wait a year or so to have our first child. Well, as you might guess, it didn’t work that way. She ended up getting pregnant a month after our wedding, and everything just went downhill after that.

Don’t get my wrong, my kids are my whole world. I love them to death and wouldn’t trade them for anything. But I feel like I’ve fallen out of love with my wife. Actually, I may never have actually loved her. That said, I do care deeply for her and want what’s best for her and the kids. That’s why I’m posting this today.

I’m not really sure how to best describe my wife other than “unusual.” I know that’s a weird thing to say, but some of the things she does, thinks, and says are just so far “out there” that I don’t know how else to describe her. She makes very strange decisions, she seems to completely lack common sense. She is starved for attention, and she seemingly perceives everything negatively. As I said, we don’t really fight because I’m not able to confront her easily, but she does things on a daily basis that drive me crazy. They are mostly small things, but they’ve piled up so high for so long that I’m miserable and I dwell on leaving every day.

One of the biggest issues I have is that she has issues with my family. I’m extremely close with my family. It just so happened that my sister happened to meet someone and get married shortly after we did. She also had a child shortly after we did. My wife feels that my sister purposely did all these things in order to “upstage” all the large events in our lives. I know my sister better than anyone, and I know that this is utterly ridiculous. Yet this issue has been the basis for a huge rift between her and my sister for years now. I rarely see my sister because of this, and I miss her greatly. When we do all get together, I’m extremely uncomfortable for fear that something might be said or done that makes this rift worse. I can’t enjoy this time anymore.

My wife gets along slightly better with my parents, and they babysit our kids often. But seemingly every time they do, my wife finds something wrong with how they babysit. If my mom says something in conversation about my sister’s kids, my wife believes she is comparing her kids to ours. If you give her any advice on parenting, she gets upset. It’s like everything is a competition.

Speaking of parenting, my wife just doesn’t seem to get certain things. She’s a stay-at-home mom. She calls me at work probably 5-10 times a day, usually just to tell me meaningless information. During almost all of these calls though, there is some reference to some naughty thing my almost three-year-old son did. She’ll often yell at him to do something which causes him to have a major tantrum. Now since I’m not the one at home with the kids all the time, I can’t really say how I’d be in the same situation. But there’s too much yelling and not enough reasoning with the kids.

She puts my daughter in danger of choking by giving her huge bites of food. I have brought this up as an issue multiple times, but she never changes. She’ll hand my daughter a whole cracker or cut up honeydew into large chunks and just give them to her. She naturally shoves it all in her mouth at once, and multiple times she’s gagged and a bunch of food came out. She doesn’t always clean them up after they eat, so I’ll come home and the kids’ faces and hands will be caked with dried food.

…continued…
 
She exhibits no common sense when it comes to housekeeping or parenting. She’ll make huge messes cooking things and just leaves it all over the counter. She lets my 14-month daughter “choose her own clothes” every day. She says that my daughter chooses these fancy dresses all the time that never seem to be appropriate for the weather. I’ll get home from work and she’ll be wearing a skimpy dress when it’s freezing outside. I’ll pick her up and her arms and legs are like ice. Instead of “fighting” with my son over what shoes to wear, she lets him wear these huge galoshes all the time if he wants to (even in the summer). She throws her and the kids’ dirty clothes all over the floor right next to the hamper instead of putting them in. She routinely misses the trash can with her used q-tips and kleenex in the morning and just leaves them on the floor. I get home from work and the house is literally a total disaster with dried food all over the kids chairs and table where they sit, food caked all over the floor, sippy cups all over everywhere, dirty dishes everywhere, dried jam on the counters, etc. It literally makes me dread leaving work.

She started potty training my son at about 18 months and he still doesn’t have it down. She sometimes gets angry with him when he poops in his pull-up and calls him a baby. She wants to move my daughter from a crib to a toddler bed already. She tells everyone that my daughter is really big and dresses her in 24-month clothes that are WAY too big for her. If I bring up any of these issues with her, she takes the attitude that “if you don’t like the way I do it, do it yourself.”

She doesn’t respect me. She knows I’m a really light sleeper but makes no effort to be quiet when I am sleeping. She’ll slam drawers and doors, turn on the bathroom light right in my eyes, etc. I can’t get to sleep at all if she’s not already in bed because I know she’ll be waking me up when she gets home.

We’re super strapped for cash and have been for quite a while. I have a good job, and I’ve told her I need her to go back to work just to continue to make ends meet. She racked up about $50k in student loans getting a Master’s degree in Public Administration and we have medical bills from her difficult pregnancies and other debt. She says she continued on getting her Master’s degree after graduating college as a means to put off paying her student loans. She’s really bad at spelling and has fairly poor communication skills. She’s looking for a job at a non-profit, which will probably pay her about $15 an hour at most and won’t put a dent in her loans. She was basically fired from her part-time job as a teacher and program coordinator at an after-school program because of her poor communication (telling stories differently than other teachers). She claimed it was discrimination because she got pregnant.

She recently signed on with a staffing agency to look for a job. This is the only means she’s using to try and find a job. Recently they told her about a job about 25 miles from our house, and she told them that if it was going to be that far away, they needed to pay at least $45/hr (which is ridiculous for the type of job she’s looking for) in order for her to consider it. She did a one-day temp job for a company that the staffing agency found for her, and the employer told the staffing agency that she kept misdirecting calls and making other errors. So basically, she has these crazy stipulations on the types of jobs she wants, and the one job she did have reviewed her poorly. I don’t think the staffing agency is going to call again any time soon. If I bring up the job search with her though, she claims that she just doesn’t have time to look for another job. She’s too overwhelmed with the kids. This leads me to believe she doesn’t really want to work, yet she calls me constantly saying how burned out and overwhelmed she is taking care of the kids. I don’t know what to do.

Obviously, I could go on and on, but I think you get a fairly good idea of what the problems are. My parents, who are also pretty devout Catholics wouldn’t say it, but I think they’re surprised I’ve put up with her as long as I have. Apart from all this, I just don’t feel like we’re truly compatible. She’s got a strong personality and bluntly says what’s on her mind. I am passive. She’s always complaining about customer service and stuff when we’re in public, yelling at people upholding policies she doesn’t agree with, etc. Basically, I’m almost never comfortable when I’m around her in public or with my family.

So what is it I’m looking for? I suppose just advice on what I should do. Am I being selfish for wanting to leave? I know there are a lot of people out there in a lot worse situations than I’m in. I “made my bed” so to speak, and I know that marriage is a covenant. Should I sacrifice my happiness and stay for her sake and the kids?

How can I be forthcoming with her about my issues when they’re all personality based? They’re not going to change. How do I tell her she has no common sense, is lazy, and self-centered? I know she loves me to death and would be devastated if I left. She’s told me that already. I also worry seriously about her prospects of finding (and keeping) a decent job and feel like I’ll be paying for everything for my whole life whether we’re together or not. What is best for my kids? I feel like I would be much happier and probably a better father if we were apart, but I don’t like the idea of them living in a broken home either. Plus, I would feel extremely guilty leaving her.

What do you think I should do? Thanks.
 
Get marriage counseling. You married this woman and you have 2 children with her. For whatever reason, you made the covenant. Also, go to a doctor and get a thorough physical. You say you are consumed by depression. If you are truly depressed then you cannot see anything positive so your descriptions here might not have much to do with reality. If you need a counselor, you can see someone separately from the marriage counselor - but you 2 need to learn how to communicate and how to work out your problems together. Try Catholic Charities - they offer counseling on a sliding income scale.
 
I actually read your entire post Tim! I’m not exactly sure why, except that I consider myself a bit of a cheerleader for marriage, and so do want to help. I’m so sorry you are miserable these days. It sounds like your wife is not a happy person either. I don’t know how useful my suggestions will be - you should talk to professionals like your priest. You might also consider retrovaille - I haven’t done that program, but I’ve heard wonderful things.

I will say this - your kids are at an age that tests every marriage. They need constant attention, which makes it difficult for you or your wife to pay attention to details like job searches and jam on the counters. You are new parents, so you are not confident in your parenting skills which can sometimes be trial and error at this age. It gets better, you get better, they mature and become more independent, helpful, able to help and entertain one another - they are cute for a reason!

You have two kids, you say you love your wife - work on it. The money stuff is only money - take control of that. But most of all, find some counseling to get you to a place where you can be the best Dad you need to be. At some point, life is going to really challenge you both with something difficult, and you are going to want to hang on to each other tight. Two is better than one.
 
I agree wholeheartedly with the the above. Your marriage shouldn’t end unless and until you and your wife have agreed to counselling together. Retrouville is a good source for Catholic-based marriage counselling.

And yes, you do sound very depressed, which can color the way you view your wife and your marriage.

I’m so sorry you find yourself in this situation – these things rarely improve without work by both parties. I wish I had known (in the early years of my marriage) what I know now.

I will pray for you and your family.
 
My wife and I both just finished reading The 5 Languages of Love. It is written by a Christian and he uses a little Scripture to help us find love again. The author offers challenges for couples to complete (he even has an app for it) as well as programs for churches. Do seek counselling as well, but this book may start shedding light for you.
 
Tim19 said:
She exhibits no common sense when it comes to housekeeping or parenting. She’ll make huge messes cooking things and just leaves it all over the counter. She lets my 14-month daughter “choose her own clothes” every day.

She started potty training my son at about 18 months and he still doesn’t have it down. She sometimes gets angry with him when he poops in his pull-up and calls him a baby. She wants to move my daughter from a crib to a toddler bed already. She tells everyone that my daughter is really big and dresses her in 24-month clothes that are WAY too big for her. If I bring up any of these issues with her, she takes the attitude that “if you don’t like the way I do it, do it yourself.”

She doesn’t respect me. She knows I’m a really light sleeper but makes no effort to be quiet when I am sleeping. She’ll slam drawers and doors, turn on the bathroom light right in my eyes, etc. I can’t get to sleep at all if she’s not already in bed because I know she’ll be waking me up when she gets home.

We’re super strapped for cash and have been for quite a while. I have a good job, and I’ve told her I need her to go back to work just to continue to make ends meet. She racked up about $50k in student loans getting a Master’s degree in Public Administration and we have medical bills from her difficult pregnancies and other debt. She says she continued on getting her Master’s degree after graduating college as a means to put off paying her student loans. She’s really bad at spelling and has fairly poor communication skills. She’s looking for a job at a non-profit, which will probably pay her about $15 an hour at most and won’t put a dent in her loans. She was basically fired from her part-time job as a teacher and program coordinator at an after-school program because of her poor communication (telling stories differently than other teachers). She claimed it was discrimination because she got pregnant.

She recently signed on with a staffing agency to look for a job. This is the only means she’s using to try and find a job. Recently they told her about a job about 25 miles from our house, and she told them that if it was going to be that far away, they needed to pay at least $45/hr (which is ridiculous for the type of job she’s looking for) in order for her to consider it. She did a one-day temp job for a company that the staffing agency found for her, and the employer told the staffing agency that she kept misdirecting calls and making other errors. So basically, she has these crazy stipulations on the types of jobs she wants, and the one job she did have reviewed her poorly. I don’t think the staffing agency is going to call again any time soon. If I bring up the job search with her though, she claims that she just doesn’t have time to look for another job. She’s too overwhelmed with the kids. This leads me to believe she doesn’t really want to work, yet she calls me constantly saying how burned out and overwhelmed she is taking care of the kids. I don’t know what to do.

Obviously, I could go on and on, but I think you get a fairly good idea of what the problems are. My parents, who are also pretty devout Catholics wouldn’t say it, but I think they’re surprised I’ve put up with her as long as I have. Apart from all this, I just don’t feel like we’re truly compatible. She’s got a strong personality and bluntly says what’s on her mind. I am passive. She’s always complaining about customer service and stuff when we’re in public, yelling at people upholding policies she doesn’t agree with, etc. Basically, I’m almost never comfortable when I’m around her in public or with my family.

So what is it I’m looking for? I suppose just advice on what I should do. Am I being selfish for wanting to leave? I know there are a lot of people out there in a lot worse situations than I’m in. I “made my bed” so to speak, and I know that marriage is a covenant. Should I sacrifice my happiness and stay for her sake and the kids?

How can I be forthcoming with her about my issues when they’re all personality based? They’re not going to change. How do I tell her she has no common sense, is lazy, and self-centered? I know she loves me to death and would be devastated if I left. She’s told me that already. I also worry seriously about her prospects of finding (and keeping) a decent job and feel like I’ll be paying for everything for my whole life whether we’re together or not. What is best for my kids? I feel like I would be much happier and probably a better father if we were apart, but I don’t like the idea of them living in a broken home either. Plus, I would feel extremely guilty leaving her.

What do you think I should do? Thanks.
Click to expand...
First, find a therapist for yourself. Since it would be wrong for me to diagnose you, I can say I am a very similar personality type so I understand. You should get a proper diagnosis for yourself first. Call around if you’re strapped for cash. I have had success with a clinic that charges me far less than the normal rate. Once you get a professional assessment for yourself, then ask about your wife. Her personality dynamic impacts you but you do need to understand how your personality/guilt/holding things in works, and seek counsel as to how to deal with you.

There is no telling how your wife will respond. But be hopeful, and pray. Once you see how that goes, I suggest you talk to a priest as well.

God bless you and your family,

Ed
 
I echo the above comments, and would add that it is to your credit that you were a 30±year-old virgin.
 
dconklin said:
My wife and I both just finished reading The 5 Languages of Love. It is written by a Christian and he uses a little Scripture to help us find love again. The author offers challenges for couples to complete (he even has an app for it) as well as programs for churches. Do seek counselling as well, but this book may start shedding light for you.
Click to expand...
We read this book too! It was so much fun doing the activities together and taking the quizzes. We had a strong marriage already but I never realized how much better it really could become. As an added bonus, it helped us see our children in a different light and many parenting problems improved tremendously. I recommend it as a good starting point.

It also seems that you need to learn to communicate. Nothing will be accomplished until that happens. Remember that respect is a two way street. Your wife may not feel respected either.

As the mama of 8, I can tell you that being home with a toddler and a preschooler is much tougher than any job I ever had. And many boys are not fully potty trained until age 4, especially if Dad isn’t willing to handle part of the training. Dads need to bring son into bathroom and show him how men use the toilet. I also often got behind on housework at that stage in my life because the kids demanded more of my time than I had to spare. Babies’ needs came first, husband second, house was least of my concerns.

I did see things that were concerning to me. The choking hazard was one, but some kids choke and gag more easily than others so I’m not completely convinced that is due to lack of care from your wife. I always give my kids a whole cracker a big slices of melon because it is easier for them to hold. However if one of mine was a “choker” I probably would change that practice with them. It also bothers me that she seems to want to prevent you from spending with your family. That’s not good.

I will pray for your family. Talk to your priest as a couple, or even just by yourself if your wife won’t go. Sometimes one spouse changing his/her reaction can make a huge difference in a marriage. You married this lady and fathered her children. You have a responsibilty to make this work.
 
I agree with the others, Tim. You need outside help here. Catholic couples counselling would be great but if she is not up for going, go on your own. Having certain tools and certain insights can go a long way to changing the course of your marriage on their own.

Your wife sounds like there may be some underlying confusions in her handling of life… perhaps undiagnosed Aspergers?

You’re not alone in ending up in marriage under the circumstances you did but that doesn’t mean it is doomed. It can help to consider the nature of arranged marriage and the special attitudes and techniques that nurture those. (I’m such a fan of Tevye and Golde from Fiddler on the Roof)

As you say, it’s mostly a composite of little things that make what looks like one massive problem. Tackle the little things with hope and courage. With a counsellors help, you especially need to find ways of addressing issues tactfully with your wife so prevent the seeds of bitterness and resentment overtaking your garden.

My best wishes to you both. Marriage is difficult at the best of times but what looks like insurmountably problems and irreconcilable differences are subject to the grace of God in a Catholic marriage. But you do need to look for some outside help in the way of Catholic counselling.
 
I think therapy would help both of you.

I also think reading the 5 love languages is a great idea too! I love that book!

Also, marriage is a partnership. It’s so easy to get discouraged if you feel like you are being taken advantage of.
 
Welcome to marriage…😛
Ok, so what was not probably too helpful but you stated many things that are also in my marriage. However I do not look at them in the same light as you do.

First thing is first. If you two were free to marry under the eyes of God, then there is no divorce. Do not plan on it or think about it. It should never be an option. You may have to separate for a short while, but never divorce. In fact, when I got married, I understood that and under no condition will I ever leave my wife.

It seem like you were not expecting marriage to workout this way. Your honeymoon phase is over and now the real marriage begins. When a man loves his wife, he will sacrifice himself for her. The puppy love will fade and hopefully a stronger real love will emerge. Some talk about some things I know about
Tim19 said:
She’s a stay-at-home mom. She calls me at work probably 5-10 times a day, usually just to tell me meaningless information.
Click to expand...
Well guess what, My wife does the same thing except since she feels that it is important enough that she calls me so I know, then I will listen. Man and woman are wired differently. We like two minute phone conversation, they like details. I understand this and I am glad that she calls me to tell me about her day as suppose to calling another male that will listen. :eek:
Tim19 said:
She puts my daughter in danger of choking by giving her huge bites of food. I have brought this up as an issue multiple times, but she never changes. She’ll hand my daughter a whole cracker or cut up honeydew into large chunks and just give them to her. She naturally shoves it all in her mouth at once, and multiple times she’s gagged and a bunch of food came out. She doesn’t always clean them up after they eat, so I’ll come home and the kids’ faces and hands will be caked with dried food.
Click to expand...
You forget one thing, that is her daughter as well. There is truly no mine in a marriage. She is as much as yours and your wife.
Tim19 said:
She wants to move my daughter from a crib to a toddler bed already. She tells everyone that my daughter is really big and dresses her in 24-month clothes that are WAY too big for her.
Click to expand...
First, she will grow into them. I know, I do the same thing. Second, we put our 18 month old in a full size twin bed with a side protector to prevent rolling out. We skipped the toddler bed to save some cash
Tim19 said:
She doesn’t respect me. She knows I’m a really light sleeper but makes no effort to be quiet when I am sleeping. She’ll slam drawers and doors, turn on the bathroom light right in my eyes, etc. I can’t get to sleep at all if she’s not already in bed because I know she’ll be waking me up when she gets home.
Click to expand...
Perhaps, she does not, but do you?
Tim19 said:
So what is it I’m looking for? I suppose just advice on what I should do. Am I being selfish for wanting to leave? I know there are a lot of people out there in a lot worse situations than I’m in. I “made my bed” so to speak, and I know that marriage is a covenant. Should I sacrifice my happiness and stay for her sake and the kids?
Click to expand...
Yes you are if you want to leave, There are people in worst situations than yourself. You do not need to sacrifice your happiness for anything. You need to look at marriage for what it really is.

I know that my answer may sound harsh but I feel that talking about your wife without her tell her side of the story not fair for her. Instead if trying to get her to be what you want, try to be her perfect husband. Sacrifice out of love, not spite. That is the love the Jesus showed us. All in all I think you need to go see a professional for help with dealing with your concern. I will pray for you and I hope that you can see what a wonderful life you really have.
 
There are several levels at play here, from what I see.

First, it’s good that you see your own shortcomings. From your own words, you appear to be a rather weak person who doesn’t know how to resolve conflict constructively, so rather unintentionally, you resort to passive aggression. It sounds like your sister is a strong-willed person, and your wife is also.

As adults we have the relationships that are comfortable and familiar to us, unless we consciously see the pattern and work to reverse. You think you married the wrong person, but I don’t believe there is such a thing as a “wrong person” when it comes to marriage. Someone like yourself, who had personality issues coming into the marriage, would never have chosen differently. In other words, it’s not your wife’s fault. Even if you end the marriage, you will still have the same unhappiness because the true issues here are in you.

Marriage is a marathon and that is such a blessing! Things don’t have to change overnight. You say your wife loves you. That is everything.

My advice: 1). Start seeing a therapist solo on a weekly basis. Shop around until you find someone who “fits”. Doesn’t have to be Catholic to help you. 2). Talk to your wife. You admit you bottle things up; did you consider she is clueless to how you feel? She sounds like just an oblivious person. 3). Ask your wife to go to marriage counseling. You need a forum with a moderator to teach both of you how to talk and listen to each other.

I was reading an interview with Gwyneth Paltrow, of all people. She spoke of how she and her husband had considered divorce at times, but persevered, and she said something about marriage that was actually insightful for a celebrity: Divorce is easy. But the longer you work at marriage, the more value you find in it.
 
Tim19 said:
How do I tell her she has no common sense, is lazy, and self-centered?
Click to expand...
You don’t. You say things like:

“It’s such a little thing, but it really bothers me when I come home and all the counters are covered in jam.”

“I’m worried about our finances and especially our debt. I know you’re stressed taking care of the kids, but I can’t figure out any other way out of this debt than if you find a good job. Help me brainstorm?”

“I noticed Lulu seemed really cold today when I gave her a hug. She really loves those dresses, huh? Maybe you could stick her in a long-sleeved onesie before she gets dressed?”

“Is it important to you that little one move out of the crib? I like having her sleep there. If there’s no strong reason to rush it, could we postpone the transfer for another four or five months and reconsider it then?”

One of the things that the priest handling our marriage prep told us was that we should always remember that if it’s important to our spouse, it should be important to us. So even though I might not care my socks are on the floor, if it bothers my husband, I should make an effort to pick them. And even though he might not mind the garbage overflowing, if it bothers me, he’ll take out the trash. What occured to me while reading your posts is that your wife may have no idea what bothers you. You haven’t told her. Start by giving her compliments on the things she does that you do appreciate and gradually ask her to address some of your more pressing concerns. Counseling will help you ariculate your frustrations in a constructive way.

Also, you should stop thinking of it as debt she incurred. Either she had the debt before you were married and you accepted it as your own when you married her, or she got her MPA after marriage and it was a joint decision for her to pursue it. Start listening to Dave Ramsey; he may be able to help with more practical advice.

God bless.
 
nodito said:
You don’t. You say things like:

“It’s such a little thing, but it really bothers me when I come home and all the counters are covered in jam.”

“I’m worried about our finances and especially our debt. I know you’re stressed taking care of the kids, but I can’t figure out any other way out of this debt than if you find a good job. Help me brainstorm?”

“I noticed Lulu seemed really cold today when I gave her a hug. She really loves those dresses, huh? Maybe you could stick her in a long-sleeved onesie before she gets dressed?”

“Is it important to you that little one move out of the crib? I like having her sleep there. If there’s no strong reason to rush it, could we postpone the transfer for another four or five months and reconsider it then?”

One of the things that the priest handling our marriage prep told us was that we should always remember that if it’s important to our spouse, it should be important to us. So even though I might not care my socks are on the floor, if it bothers my husband, I should make an effort to pick them. And even though he might not mind the garbage overflowing, if it bothers me, he’ll take out the trash. What occured to me while reading your posts is that your wife may have no idea what bothers you. You haven’t told her. Start by giving her compliments on the things she does that you do appreciate and gradually ask her to address some of your more pressing concerns. Counseling will help you ariculate your frustrations in a constructive way.

Also, you should stop thinking of it as debt she incurred. Either she had the debt before you were married and you accepted it as your own when you married her, or she got her MPA after marriage and it was a joint decision for her to pursue it. Start listening to Dave Ramsey; he may be able to help with more practical advice.

God bless.
Click to expand...
Love this response!

I bolded the part that really stuck out to me. My husband is the same was as you (the OP) in some regards. There will be stuff bothering him but he won’t tell me what it is to give me a chance to work on fixing it or making it better. He just told me two years ago stuff that was bothering him from when we were engaged and first married. We got married in 2000. I think you need to tell her (in a nice way) how you feel about things. Maybe start with a couple of the easier to fix ones and work from there. Don’t give up on her when you haven’t even given her the chance to change. I know you think she won’t change but it’s not fair to her to assume that without giving her the opportunity to step up.

Best of luck!
 
First of all, thanks to all of you for your thoughtful and insightful replies. When I was reading the first few and everyone was suggesting that we seek counseling, I was puzzled. I felt like no one was actually reading the full story. Turns out that some paragraphs didn’t make it into the forum posts. I wrote all this out in a text editor and had to paste it in piecemeal since there are length restrictions. I left out some important information. Oops…

My wife and I actually have gone through counseling. It started about two years ago. I talked to a close family priest (also the one that married us) and he suggested that we go through a program they offered at the church. Basically, we worked with a volunteer couple who attempted to help us. The problem was, they had a really structured program and the second series was communication. They wanted us to sit down and talk in depth about what we felt we needed forgiveness for. What I needed at this point was help on how to communicate. We decided that this program wasn’t really for us and moved on.

About a year later, my grandmother passed away and a lot of family was out for her funeral. One of my aunts noticed that I was “shutting down” (her words) in marriage, pulled me aside, and offered to help. She helps a lot of couples with marriage issues at their own church in Ohio. A few weeks later, I gave her a call, explained my problems. She agreed to fly out and meet with us for a few days to try and help. I was worried that my wife was going to feel uneasy about this since my aunt is on my side of the family. But she didn’t have a problem with it, probably because she knew that I didn’t see my aunt very often and we have never really talked in-depth.

So she came out and talked with us for the weekend. We both provided her with a copy of what our core issues were and we discussed them. It was incredibly difficult for me, but we got through. My wife made some changes in the short-term, and things got a little better for a while. Several months passed and I felt like everything we had talked about had sort of been forgotten and we were kind of back to square one. My aunt decided to come out and meet with us again. While I think these meetings were helpful and helped us get our feelings out, my wife made a sarcastic comment after my aunt had left that made me realize that she didn’t agree with everything my aunt was saying. I decided at this point to seek counseling from a licensed professional that neither of us knew.

I found a local Christian (not Catholic) counselor and began going to one-on-one sessions with him. I told him all my problems. After three or four sessions, my wife and I started to go together. I also went on a mild dose of anti-depressants (at his and my aunt’s suggestion). We’ve probably met with him about eight times now together. I’ve been able to bring up and talk about a lot of my main issues at these sessions. My wife seems to listen and understand a lot of the issues. The problem is, she seems to make some changes for a very short period, and then reverts to old habits. In addition, she tends to throw my criticisms back in my face. For example, after we had talked at a session about the cleanliness of the house, my wife went above and beyond to make the house spotless when I got home from work for the next couple of days. All the work she did was not what I expected of her, and I had made that clear at the session. I was basically just looking for her to be a little more proactive about cleaning up messes as they happened instead of just leaving them. She went above and beyond, which I appreciated, but she sarcastically said something like “I wouldn’t want you to be upset coming home to a dirty house” or something along those lines. After a few days, the house was back to the way it was before.

In general, I feel like that’s been her response to criticism. She says she’s trying, but I just don’t see the results. She’s aware of most of my issues with her, and I just don’t see her efforts to correct them. There are many other issues that I haven’t told her, mainly for fear of hurting her. I brought up some examples of her lack of common sense in the original post, and while it definitely applies to those situations, it’s not limited to that. There is just a lack of common sense in almost everything she does.

One night recently, I asked her if she was happy. She said she was and asked if I was. I said that I felt like we had a lot of personality, perception and priority differences, and the idea of separation was raised for the first time. I’m aware of the church’s teachings on divorce. There’s no other woman in my life or anything like that, and I’m aware that I couldn’t get re-married without an annulment. She says she’s afraid to lose me, but I don’t see how I can continue living like this.
 
Does she bring up her issues at these sessions? What is your response to her issues? What changes have you made to improve her day-to-day experience of your marriage?
 
I heard some advice lately that might help both of you: “Always assume your spouse has had a worse day than you have.” If nothing else it will help soften your heart towards each other rather than thinking things like, for example: I had to work my fingers to the bone all day and I come home to food all over the counter! Or, I run myself ragged taking care of these kids and he comes home and wants to plop on the couch and relax!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top