Contemplation and Mysticism

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JReducation said:
I love this citation. A week ago they had Augustine on the new progra on EWTN, The Saints Are Coming or something like that. Anyway, the actor who played Augustine talked a little from this passage. Obviously, he’s not quoting it, since he’s supposed to be Augustne. He’s speakin as Augustine would, on this subject. He was alwesom.

I wonder if it’s online.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
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I really need to pay attention on what is on EWTN. Everytime I turn it on, I always see the mass, or Mother Angelica saying the rosary. 🙂
onmyknees said:
True Light, I love St. Agustine’s Confessions! Thanks for posting his beautiful words. It always helps me to read it again.🙂
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I am almost done with Confessions, but when I came to this quote, my mouth dropped open and my eyes filled with tears. So beautiful are the words and God’s patience with us.
 
TrueLight said:
The words are beautiful. Matt Maher’s style, not so much my style…

I tend to like either classical/neo-classical, Gospel, or really dramatic, intense, dark Christian music.

Minor keys rock!
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Yea, I like classical too but I was just thrilled that Matt Maher has his music on a Christian station. Most of the songs are by non-Catholics Christians. Jaci Velasquez is the only other one that is Catholic that I know of. Her song “When I am on my Knees” is beautiful. I really love Gregorian chanting! Wish our parish had a choir of men who could do it. 😦

What is an example of dark, dramatic, intense Christian music?
 
TrueLight said:
I really need to pay attention on what is on EWTN. Everytime I turn it on, I always see the mass, or Mother Angelica saying the rosary. 🙂

I am almost done with Confessions, but when I came to this quote, my mouth dropped open and my eyes filled with tears. So beautiful are the words and God’s patience with us.
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I was sobbing more than once during this book. But I am always sobbing when I hear beautiful words as well as when I pray to Jesus.
I don’t have any talents but I definitely was given the gift of tears. When I am at our Adoration chapel I feel embarrassed because I am always sniffling and have to bring kleenex.

I am so happy for you, that you are able to receive Jesus in the Eucharist now!🙂
 
From St. Therese’s Spiritual Memoir

“Divine love is graciously willing the good of the other that awakens an imitative reaction in one who is loved. It is not rewards of worthiness, but a loop of grace, unmerited love engendering disinterested love.”
 
onmyknees said:
I am so happy for you, that you are able to receive Jesus in the Eucharist now!🙂
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Thank you.

Every time I receive, it feels surreal. The Enemy had made it known to me that it was never going to happen. The devil is a liar.
 

Angela of Foligno (c.1248-1309)​

“OF WHAT USE ARE REVELATIONS, VISIONS, FEELINGS OF GOD’S PRESENCE?”​

“It is first told by God: ‘Look at me.’”​

[She describes her visionary experience:]

The soul is granted the gift to see God in the following fashion. It is first told by God: “Look at me.” And then the soul sees him taking shape within itself and it sees him more clearly that a person can see another person, for the eyes of the soul, in this experience, see a fullness of God of which I am not able to speak. What they see is a spiritual and not a material reality which is inexpressible. The soul delights in this vision, and this is an evident sign for it that God is within it. [p.189]

home.infionline.net/~ddisse/angela.html#anchor281091

peace
 
hazcompat said:

Angela of Foligno (c.1248-1309)​

“OF WHAT USE ARE REVELATIONS, VISIONS, FEELINGS OF GOD’S PRESENCE?”​

“It is first told by God: ‘Look at me.’”​

[She describes her visionary experience:]

The soul is granted the gift to see God in the following fashion. It is first told by God: “Look at me.” And then the soul sees him taking shape within itself and it sees him more clearly that a person can see another person, for the eyes of the soul, in this experience, see a fullness of God of which I am not able to speak. What they see is a spiritual and not a material reality which is inexpressible. The soul delights in this vision, and this is an evident sign for it that God is within it. [p.189]

home.infionline.net/~ddisse/angela.html#anchor281091

peace
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It really helps to understand Francis’ of Assisi’s view of the relationship between the soul and God in order to understand where Angela is going with this. The best person to explain Francis’ understanding of that relationship is Bonaventure. He outlines it for us in the Journey of the Soul into the Mind of God, which he tells us is really about Francis’ journey into the mind of God. Bonaventure, held up Francis’ journey for the world to see as the perfect journey.

Angela was a Secular Franciscan at the time that Bonaventure was Minister General. Actually, she outlived him. Bonaventure had decreed that no spiritual writings were allowed unless they were consistent with the life and spirituality of St. Francis. Everything to the contrary had to be burned.

Angela was guided by the friar named Brother Arnoldo (Arnold), as she told him of her mystical experiences, he helped her to see them through the eyes of Francis. Her writings were collected in a work called Book of Visions and Instructions. Much of what she says parrots what Bonaventure has said in the Journey of the Soul into the Mind of God.

What is important to know is that she is not simply repeating what happened to Francis using Bonaventure’s words. This piece of writing goes much deeper than this. It actually proves that Bonaventure was right. Francis’ journey into the mind of God was not a private gift for Francis alone, but it is a gift of Grace that God makes available to all who wish to follow in the path of discipleship. God makes this gift available and possible out of pure love and mercy. It is God’s wish to make himself known to the soul.

However, the soul can only come to know God when the individual, like Francis, steps out of his or her comfort zone and takes the plunge to be a disciple. Angela had done just that. She knew the Gospel. She loved God and was aware of God’s love for her. She needed a teacher on discipleship. Francis became her teacher through his sons. In following the teacher, she too arrives at the knowledge of God at a level that she can’t explain, because there are not words to explain the fullness of God.

Angela continues to contribute to the Franciscan tradition of recollection so as to enter into the mind of God and allow God to speak to the soul and be aware of what God reveals to the soul. This tradition of recollection will find its way to Spain in the 16th century and into the hands of Teresa of Avila in a book called The Third Spiritual Alphabet by the Franciscan mystic, Francisco of Osuna.

Teresa, wanting to follow the spirit of the early Carmelites who lived a life of silence and recollection so as to contemplate God, finds in this tradition the method that she’s been looking for. She adopts the method. Again, Bonaventure’s assertion is proven correct. This is not a private gift just for Francis, but for all who follow it. God speaks to Teresa’s soul and the result of that dialogue is her reform of Carmel and her contribution to a better understanding of Spiritual Theology.

It’s awesome to see how God works in our lives and how much he wants to speak to us, but we have to take that step toward discipleship. The master cannot teach unless the subject is a willing disciple.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
The book of divine consolation of the Blessed Angela of Foligno"

THE NEW MEDIEVAL LIBRARY

…The other way whereby the soul knoweth that God is within it is by an embrace which He doth give unto the soul. There is neither father, nor mother, nor son, nor any other person whatsoever who can embrace the object beloved with so great a love as that wherewith God embraceth the soul. For He doth embrace it with such love and draw it unto Himself with such sweetness and gentleness that methinketh there is not a man in the world who can declare it, nor express it, nor believe it unless he hath himself experienced it ; and although he might perchance divine somewhat of this love, yet could he not possibly know it as it truly is. Of a surety, God doth implant most sweet love in the soul, the which doth make it burn for Christ alone. And it beareth with it so great a light (whereby it understandeth the fulness of the goodness of God which it experienceth within itself) that it hath understanding of much more than it feeleth within itself.

peace
 
JReducation said:
I love this citation. A week ago they had Augustine on the new progra on EWTN, The Saints Are Coming or something like that. Anyway, the actor who played Augustine talked a little from this passage. Obviously, he’s not quoting it, since he’s supposed to be Augustne. He’s speakin as Augustine would, on this subject. He was alwesom.

I wonder if it’s online.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
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Hi Brother. 🙂 It is a new series called Saints Alive! Unfortunately it’s not on EWTN’s YouTube channel yet.

By the way, I found a site called Catholic Tube: catholic-tube.com/

The old site, Love to be Catholic, is no longer online. 😦

Pax†
 
CatholicFireman said:
Hi Brother. 🙂 It is a new series called Saints Alive! Unfortunately it’s not on EWTN’s YouTube channel yet.

By the way, I found a site called Catholic Tube: catholic-tube.com/

The old site, Love to be Catholic, is no longer online. 😦

Pax†
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Thanks. I don’t know who the actor was, but he did a very convincing job. After a few minutes, I really felt as if I were listening to Augustine.

I looked for it again and I ran into an episode with Catherine of Siena. It was horrible. The woman who played Catherine was so saccharine that I had to run for my insulin. My diabetes went up by 20 points.

I fail to understand where people get the idea that saints speak differently or speak with an affect. I met and spoke to Bl. Mother Teresa and Bl. John Paul on more than one occasion. Neither spoke with an affect. Bl. John Paul was cheerful, polite and spoke to you as if you were the only person in the room. You couldn’t help feeling that you were in the presence of great holiness, without feeling bathed in sugar.

Mother Teresa was blunt, demanding, but with a great sense of humor and at times she would look at you as if you were dumb, because everything was so obvious to her. She did not realize that she was gifted by grace. That’s how unaffected she was. She just thought that the Gospel was as obvious to everyone else as it was to her. That’s because she did not see anything special about herself.

That’s what I liked about the Augustine in the program. He was inspiring while not trying to be so.

Augustine has always affirmed my theory that a saint is a human being in the making.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
JReducation said:
Thanks. I don’t know who the actor was, but he did a very convincing job. After a few minutes, I really felt as if I were listening to Augustine.

I looked for it again and I ran into an episode with Catherine of Siena. It was horrible. The woman who played Catherine was so saccharine that I had to run for my insulin. My diabetes went up by 20 points.

I fail to understand where people get the idea that saints speak differently or speak with an affect. I met and spoke to Bl. Mother Teresa and Bl. John Paul on more than one occasion. Neither spoke with an affect. Bl. John Paul was cheerful, polite and spoke to you as if you were the only person in the room. You couldn’t help feeling that you were in the presence of great holiness, without feeling bathed in sugar.

Mother Teresa was blunt, demanding, but with a great sense of humor and at times she would look at you as if you were dumb, because everything was so obvious to her. She did not realize that she was gifted by grace. That’s how unaffected she was. She just thought that the Gospel was as obvious to everyone else as it was to her. That’s because she did not see anything special about herself.

That’s what I liked about the Augustine in the program. He was inspiring while not trying to be so.

Augustine has always affirmed my theory that a saint is a human being in the making.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
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Well put. Here is the series site: ewtn.com/series/shows/saints-alive/index.asp

One of my favorite priests is an Augustinian. Must be something there. 😉

I know that EWTN has a schedule grid so you can see when they will repeat an episode.

CF
 
I have a further question for all involved. (I am putting this here, because it has to do with the spiritual/prayer life that directly leads to and is fundamental for contemplation and mysticism. My apologies if this is not the right thread.) I have been slowly reading through “Introduction to the Devout Life” by St. Francis de Sales on the recommendation of Br. Jay in another thread. (Well, it might be this one…I’m honestly not sure lol.) It has been wonderful, but it has raised another question for me. I will make a note that what I think I’m interpreting from it is the same thing that Padre Pio apparently recommended according to the book “Padre Pio: The True Story” by C. Bernard Ruffin. It seems to me like St. Francis is saying that meditation is more beneficial than even the liturgy of the hours.

“However, if you have the gift of mental prayer, you should always give it first place. Afterwards if you cannot say your vocal prayers because of your many duties or for some other reason, don’t be disturbed on that account. Be satisfied with saying either before or after your meditation the Lord’s prayer (the Our Father), the Angelic Salutation (the Hail Mary), and the Apostle’s Creed.” (Second Part, 1, Paragraph 7)

“During vocal prayer if you find your heart drawn and invited to interior or mental prayer, don’t refuse to take it up. Let your mind turn very gently in that direction and don’t be concerned at not finishing the voal prayers you inteded to say. The mental prayer you substitute for them is more pleasing to God and more profitable for your soul. I make an exception for the Divine Office (Liturgy of the Hours), you are obliged to say it, as in that case you must fulfill your obligation.” (Second Part, 1, Paragraph 8)

However, later on he says the following:

“In fact to say it once and for all, there is always more benefit and consolation to be derived from the public offices of the Church than from private particular acts. God has ordained that communion in prayer must always be preferred to every form of private prayer.” (Second Part, 15)

By public offices we know from context that he is certainly including the Divine Office. But this seems to contradict what he previously said, since in that previous part he explicitly says that you should give mental prayer priority over the Divine Office unless you are obligated by obedience to say it. This is very confusing. Especially when I have heard that in other of his writings, he says that the Rosary is the greatest method of prayer and that he would prayer nothing but it if he were not obligated to say the Divine Office. Now, I can at least make sense of this in one way, because the Rosary is mental prayer, but this still seems to conflict with what he has said about the Divine Office. Any help in interpreting St. Francis is appreciated.
 
In the first circumstance you are alone. In the second you are part of a community.

peace
 
Oh! Thank you! I don’t know why I never saw that part of it, but that makes perfect sense! God bless you, hazcompat, for your clarity.

Sean
 
What do you think?

In order for one to understand the Saints and Fathers of the [Orthodox] Church, it is not sufficient to merely read them. The Saints spoke and wrote after having lived the mysteries of God. They personally experienced the mysteries.

In order for one to understand them, he too must have progressed to a certain degree of initiation into the mysteries of God by personally tasting, smelling, and seeing. You can read the books of the Saints and become very well versed in them with a ‘cerebral’ knowledge without even minutely tasting that which the Saints tasted who wrote these books through their personal experience.

In order to understand the Saints essentially, not intellectually, you must have the proper experience for all that they say; you must have tasted, at least in part, of the same things as they. You must have lived in the fervent environment of Orthodoxy; you must grown in it… A Whole new world must be born in a Westerner’s heart in order for him to understand something of Orthodoxy.
-Alexandar Kalomiros
Against False Union, 1959

wordfromthedesert.squarespace.com/

peace
 
Thomas Merton: A Prayer For the Simplicity of Life and Love

July 2, 2006 in Blog Entries with 2 Comments

This is a prayer from New Seeds of Contemplation by Thomas Merton that I find to be moving, challenging and intriguing. Take a moment to be drawn in to the Spirit as you read this prayer.

“Justify my soul, O God, but also from Your fountains fill my will with your fire. Shrine in my mind, although perhaps this means “be darkness to my experience,” but occupy my heart with Your tremendous Life. Let my eyes see nothing in the world but Your glory, and let my hands touch nothing that is not for Your service.

Let my tongue taste no bread that does not strengthen me to praise Your great mercy. I will hear Your voice and I will hear all harmonies You have created, singing Your hymns. Sheep’s wool and cotton from the field shall warm me enough that I may live in Your service; I will give the rest to Your poor. Let me use all things for one sole reason: to find my joy in giving You glory.

Therefore keep me, above all things, from sin. Keep me from the death of deadly sin which puts hell in my soul. Keep me from the murder of lust that blinds and poisons my heart. Keep me from the sins that eat a man’s flesh with irresistible fire until he is devoured. Keep me from loving money in which is hatred, from avarice and ambition that suffocate my life. Keep me from the dead works of vanity and the thankless labor in which artists destroy themselves for pride and money and reputation, and saints are smothered under the avalanche of their own importunate zeal. Stanch in me the rank wound of covetousness and the hungers that exhaust my nature with their bleeding. Stamp out the serpent envy that stings love with poison and kills all joy.

Untie my hands and deliver my heart from sloth. Set me free from the laziness that goes about disguised as activity when activity is not required of me, and from the cowardice that does what is not demanded, in order to escape sacrifice.

But give me the strength that waits upon You in silence and peace. Give me humility in which alone is rest, and deliver me from prise which i s the heaviest of burdens. And possess my whole heart and soul with the simplicity of love. Occupy my whole life with the one thought and the one desire of love, that I may love not for the sake of merit, not for the sake of perfection, not for the sake of virtue, not for the sake of sanctity, but for you alone.

For there is only one thing that can satisfy love and reward it, and that is You alone (p. 44-45).”
gatheringinlight.com/2006/07/02/thomas-merton-prayer-for-the-simplicity-of-life-and-love/

Fast
 
hazcompat said:
Occupy my whole life with the one thought and the one desire of love, that I may love not for the sake of merit, not for the sake of perfection, not for the sake of virtue, not for the sake of sanctity, but for you alone.
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I love the part about loving not for the sake of merit. It’s easy to love those who seem to deserve it, isn’t it.

But Jesus calls us to love, just as God loves us. We who didn’t merit his favor received it. How can we not do the same to our brothers and sisters?

Thanks for sharing this post. 🙂
 
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