Contemporary Liturgical Music

[giuseppe96]

I have been considering switching to a more traditional parish due to my parish’s modern hymns. The parish offers four Masses on Sunday; 3 contemporary and 1 with traditional choir and cantor. I love my pastor, he is a very kind and spiritual man. But sometimes the traditional choir (for reasons unknown) isn’t available, and they’re substituted with the modern guitar and piano band. Contemporary hymns simply aren’t my cup of tea, and they can be pretty distracting for me. I’m not sure what to do. Can somebody give me some advice please? Thank you and God bless you all.

 

[pianistclare]

If it’s Catholic music, I would suggest not being so easily distracted. If it’s simply Christian radio music, I would approach the Director and ask if some regular hymns can be thrown in. But it’s the Pastor’s preference, I’m sure.
If that’s the only problem, then I’d say focus on what really matters.

Parish hopping doesn’t do anyone any good.

 

[joeybaggz]

I have been considering switching to a more traditional parish due to my parish’s modern hymns. The parish offers four Masses on Sunday; 3 contemporary and 1 with traditional choir and cantor. I love my pastor, he is a very kind and spiritual man. But sometimes the traditional choir (for reasons unknown) isn’t available, and they’re substituted with the modern guitar and piano band. Contemporary hymns simply aren’t my cup of tea, and they can be pretty distracting for me. I’m not sure what to do. Can somebody give me some advice please? Thank you and God bless you all.

Go where you feel closest to God and you are peace with the Mass. After all, no mass is really about the music.

Personally, my parish is all about the traditional hymns and responses. Mass in my parish when it comes to music is like a funeral dirge. I’d appreciate some life in the music. But I go for the Eucharist, the communing with God Himself. I really don’t care about the music.

Different strokes for different folks.

 

[corsair]

I left a parish because of the “Glory and Praise” music. I now attend an FSSP parish which offers Gregorian chant and Sacred Polyphony. Masses seven days a week and confession before and after every Mass.

 

[Edmundus1581]

OP, my tastes in liturgical music are very similar to yours.

Note, however, that not every Catholic shares our tastes. There are many, including those of older generations, who actually prefer guitars and modern music.

Fortunately, for the sake of argument, there is already this response:

…
Personally, my parish is all about the traditional hymns and responses. Mass in my parish when it comes to music is like a funeral dirge. I’d appreciate some life in the music.
…

So, what I suggest you do about this is be grateful for the traditional music when you have it, and, when you don’t, be grateful also for the modern music and participate in it fully. We don’t want people to protest against music they don’t like by not participating. That could work both ways - you’d also have the non-traditionalists protesting against traditional music.

Don’t try and change anything. You will be wasting your time as you can be assured that everyone is already doing their best.

Occasionally say how much you like the traditional choir, and keep attending their mass. They will appreciate the support and the pastor will notice.

Also, you’re situation seems to be much better than you might be aware of. Many parishes have no traditional music, masses with no music or masses with a CD accompaniment. My parish has only one traditional choir, which sings every second Sunday - so that’s about 1 in 8 masses.

Be careful of parish hopping, and only do this as a last resort if the situation is truly unbearable.

In summary - I recommend just making the best of what you’ve got.

 

[Herculees]

I must admit my first response was we are called to support our local church, however, I would recommend you find a place where you feel “at home”. I am unhappy with the Latin Rite Church and therefore have adopted the Maronite Church as my church.

 

[Michael85]

Find yourself a parish with a Latin Mass. No contemporary music there. Or a Byzantine Rite parish.

I’m not sure if any of the other Eastern Rite churches have adopted contemporary worship (I certainly hope not!). But if there’s another Eastern Rite church in your area, check it out.

 

[exnihilo]

Also, you’re situation seems to be much better than you might be aware of. Many parishes have no traditional music, masses with no music or masses with a CD accompaniment. My parish has only one traditional choir, which sings every second Sunday - so that’s about 1 in 8 masses.

Be careful of parish hopping, and only do this as a last resort if the situation is truly unbearable.

In summary - I recommend just making the best of what you’ve got.

I’d generally agree with making the best of what you’ve got. I don’t like the Protestant four hymn sandwhich at my parish but I try not to let it bother me too much. And before anyone complains about this why I say bother is because I find the music very distracting. The music rather than help me worship God becomes a distraction for me. It often ends up being more performance pieces, especially since so many parishioners aren’t even singing. Guitar would be too much for me.

I did want to challenge your assertion that some parishes have no traditional music. They don’t only if they choose not to, but the Church has a great tradition of singing the Mass. There is an abundance of chants. Chant can be done by anyone and is much simpler than the four part hymns that parishes which use them in my experience don’t even do right since they only sing one part. You don’t need guitar, piano or organ to do chant.

 

[pianistclare]

I’d generally agree with making the best of what you’ve got. I don’t like the Protestant four hymn sandwhich at my parish but I try not to let it bother me too much. And before anyone complains about this why I say bother is because I find the music very distracting. The music rather than help me worship God becomes a distraction for me. It often ends up being more performance pieces, especially since so many parishioners aren’t even singing. Guitar would be too much for me.

I did want to challenge your assertion that some parishes have no traditional music. They don’t only if they choose not to, but the Church has a great tradition of singing the Mass. There is an abundance of chants. Chant can be done by anyone and is much simpler than the four part hymns that parishes which use them in my experience don’t even do right since they only sing one part. You don’t need guitar, piano or organ to do chant.

Chant is not easy.
There needs to be highly experienced Schola director.
Most parishes and pastors, simply do not want it.
If people want something different (more to their personal taste) they need only see the Pastor. Either he will say OK, or he will say no.
Simple as that.

 

[exnihilo]

Chant is not easy.
There needs to be highly experienced Schola director.
Most parishes and pastors, simply do not want it.
If people want something different (more to their personal taste) they need only see the Pastor. Either he will say OK, or he will say no.
Simple as that.

I respectfully disagree. Some chant is hard and some is easy. Some are certainly much easier than the hymns with changing tempos and a wide range that they take the time to teach before Mass.

I don’t know what most people want. If most people follow the advice often offered they keep their preferences to themselves. Also, often times the squeaky wheel gets the grease or certain people’s taste win out for reasons other than the majority’s opinion.

 

[pianistclare]

I respectfully disagree. Some chant is hard and some is easy. Some are certainly much easier than the hymns with changing tempos and a wide range that they take the time to teach before Mass.

I don’t know what most people want. If most people follow the advice often offered they keep their preferences to themselves. Also, often times the squeaky wheel gets the grease or certain people’s taste win out for reasons other than the majority’s opinion.

Money.
It comes down to money for materials, sheet music, hymnals, and instruments.
Places with bad music have volunteers that can carry a tune. That seems to be the only criteria in some places.
I know. I’ve been a professional church musician since right out of college.
Bad chant is worse than no chant.
I agree that hymns that are clearly meant as solos have no place in the liturgy for the people. If they have taken a traditional hymn and switched it up with many key changes, no one is going to like it or sing it.
They are called choirs for a reason. They are supposed to lead the faithful as one voice. Not flex their vocal chords unless it’s something proscribed ( or requested by the Pastor) and very difficult.
Also many people just don’t like chant (honest, I am not kidding) including pastors.
They want what will appeal to many and get the job done. The job interview before this current one, I told them I was well qualified to teach chant, and would be willing to have one Mass Schola dedicated to such. The pastor and the entire group of cantors were horrified at the prospect. No kidding. They passed me over for a convert who could sing very high. Nice woman, but she had no clue what to use at Mass and with no mentoring. They sing the Allelluia before and AFTER the Gospel.
Sigh. Another “innovation”.

I was the Music Director at a parish for 16 years and started at 6 grand a year, sixteen years later…making 11 grand. And I did EVERYTHING.
Bought music, trained people, rehearsed with people, made programs, printed stapled and folded the programs (For FHC, CONFIRMATION, FUNERALS, Christmas and such) and played most funerals for free because everyone thinks the funeral home or the priest pays the musician. THEY DO NOT. I would have to take a personal day from my real job with no pay, to make a funeral nice for someone. I did it because it’s the right thing to do.
But a gurl’s gotta eat.
Just sayin’

 

[Oneofthewomen]

Thank you for saying this!
I am sure, especially here, it will fall on deaf ears, but I thank you anyway.

Unless/until you have actually been in the trenches in a US parish, you really have no clue how things work.

The phone starts ringing 5 minutes before the office opens on Monday with someone with a bee in their bonnet over something that happened over the weekend, then the flood gates open.

The choir was too loud.
Deacon’s homily was too long.
The music at 5pm Mass was awful, can’t we sing some old hymns?
The music at 9:30 Mass was awful, why do we have to sing all the old, stuffy music?
Why did you have to talk about how we dress for Mass? Aren’t you just happy we are here?
You need to do something about all the crying kids? My children never behaved like that at Mass!
Father, Mr. Smilth was very mean to my wife and family yesterday at Mass! What are YOU going to do about it?!

And the list goes on, and on, and on…

And we wonder why there is a priest shortage?!

And why most priests take the path of least resistence.

Money.
It comes down to money for materials, sheet music, hymnals, and instruments.
Places with bad music have volunteers that can carry a tune. That seems to be the only criteria in some places.
I know. I’ve been a professional church musician since right out of college.
Bad chant is worse than no chant.
I agree that hymns that are clearly meant as solos have no place in the liturgy for the people. If they have taken a traditional hymn and switched it up with many key changes, no one is going to like it or sing it.
They are called choirs for a reason. They are supposed to lead the faithful as one voice. Not flex their vocal chords unless it’s something proscribed ( or requested by the Pastor) and very difficult.
Also many people just don’t like chant (honest, I am not kidding) including pastors.
They want what will appeal to many and get the job done. The job interview before this current one, I told them I was well qualified to teach chant, and would be willing to have one Mass Schola dedicated to such. The pastor and the entire group of cantors were horrified at the prospect. No kidding. They passed me over for a convert who could sing very high. Nice woman, but she had no clue what to use at Mass and with no mentoring. They sing the Allelluia before and AFTER the Gospel.
Sigh. Another “innovation”.

I was the Music Director at a parish for 16 years and started at 6 grand a year, sixteen years later…making 11 grand. And I did EVERYTHING.
Bought music, trained people, rehearsed with people, made programs, printed stapled and folded the programs (For FHC, CONFIRMATION, FUNERALS, Christmas and such) and played most funerals for free because everyone thinks the funeral home or the priest pays the musician. THEY DO NOT. I would have to take a personal day from my real job with no pay, to make a funeral nice for someone. I did it because it’s the right thing to do.
But a gurl’s gotta eat.
Just sayin’

 

[pianistclare]

Thank you for saying this!
I am sure, especially here, it will fall on deaf ears, but I thank you anyway.

Unless/until you have actually been in the trenches in a US parish, you really have no clue how things work.

The phone starts ringing 5 minutes before the office opens on Monday with someone with a bee in their bonnet over something that happened over the weekend, then the flood gates open.

The choir was too loud.
Deacon’s homily was too long.
The music at 5pm Mass was awful, can’t we sing some old hymns?
The music at 9:30 Mass was awful, why do we have to sing all the old, stuffy music?
Why did you have to talk about how we dress for Mass? Aren’t you just happy we are here?
You need to do something about all the crying kids? My children never behaved like that at Mass!
Father, Mr. Smilth was very mean to my wife and family yesterday at Mass! What are YOU going to do about it?!

And the list goes on, and on, and on…

And we wonder why there is a priest shortage?!

And why most priests take the path of least resistence.

This year, for the Easter Egg Hunt on Easter morning, people were asking why didn’t the
church have EASTER BASKETS to give away to the kids to use.

Ummmm…I spent HOURS filling eggs and 2 hours with teen volunteers putting 8000 eggs out.
It’s free candy. Use your purse. :banghead:

 

[Midwest88]

Thank you for saying this!
I am sure, especially here, it will fall on deaf ears, but I thank you anyway.

Unless/until you have actually been in the trenches in a US parish, you really have no clue how things work.

The phone starts ringing 5 minutes before the office opens on Monday with someone with a bee in their bonnet over something that happened over the weekend, then the flood gates open.

The choir was too loud.
Deacon’s homily was too long.
The music at 5pm Mass was awful, can’t we sing some old hymns?
The music at 9:30 Mass was awful, why do we have to sing all the old, stuffy music?
Why did you have to talk about how we dress for Mass? Aren’t you just happy we are here?
You need to do something about all the crying kids? My children never behaved like that at Mass!
Father, Mr. Smilth was very mean to my wife and family yesterday at Mass! What are YOU going to do about it?!

And the list goes on, and on, and on…

And we wonder why there is a priest shortage?!

And why most priests take the path of least resistence.

Ha! Yea, as with the music director and pastor needing to be open to sacred music, the parishioners also need to realize that a big part of the health of a parish is their own attitude towards various things you’ve mentioned.

They sing the Allelluia before and AFTER the Gospel.

This is my parish.

What’s funny is the music director at my home parish doesn’t do sacred music, maybe a Latin song here or there given the occasion, and a complaint was that the music sounded like funeral music. The music director before him had a couple of complaints from parishioners waiting him to burst out in song and dance. The only time a parishioner came up and said they liked the music - like truly was impressed - was when the current music director had a substitute for 10 A.M. Saturday mass, where the substitute played the flute, cantored while her husband accompanied her with the piano. Her personality really charged up the congregation, which is good I suppose, but when I compared that to sacred music and its reverence it’s just strange. The odd thing is that she’s employed by the archdiocese within the Liturgical Music division. I’m not sure how she feels about the music found in St. John Cantius, but then again that parish sticks out and is unique when compared most of Chicago’s parishes.

Most parishes and pastors, simply do not want it.

Why is this? They’re basically rejecting the musical heritage of the Catholic Church.

 

[pianistclare]

Ha! Yea, as with the music director and pastor needing to be open to sacred music, the parishioners also need to realize that a big part of the health of a parish is their own attitude towards various things you’ve mentioned.

This is my parish.

What’s funny is the music director at my home parish doesn’t do sacred music, maybe a Latin song here or there given the occasion, and a complaint was that the music sounded like funeral music. The music director before him had a couple of complaints from parishioners waiting him to burst out in song and dance. The only time a parishioner came up and said they liked the music - like truly was impressed - was when the current music director had a substitute for 10 A.M. Saturday mass, where the substitute played the flute, cantored while her husband accompanied her with the piano. Her personality really charged up the congregation, which is good I suppose, but when I compared that to sacred music and its reverence it’s just strange. The odd thing is that she’s employed by the archdiocese within the Liturgical Music division. I’m not sure how she feels about the music found in St. John Cantius, but then again that parish sticks out and is unique when compared most of Chicago’s parishes.

Why is this? They’re basically rejecting the musical heritage of the Catholic Church.

I suspect they don’t feel it’s appealing to the average Joe parishioner. Or his kids.
Plus, you have to remember, Latin is not used in the OF except for Pange Lingua, and Benediction hymns. Most people would have no frame of reference, nor the patience to stick with it and work at it.
People want the familiar.
Nobody wants to accept that, but it’s true.
We have a Sat night group that is just awful. But the same group of elderly folks have been going to that Mass since the church was built. Those people and their garage band country songs are their friends, they are FAMILIAR. They love them. If we were to switch it up, they would freak out, and stop tithing. The older parishioners keep the parish alive financially. And they gossip the loudest. When they complain to the pastor, he just wants to hide.
So things remain the same. And people are content. Visitors think it’s awful…but the longtime members do not. like. change.

It never enters into their thinking that they are “rejecting music of the church”. Far from it. They believe THEY and their favorites are being rejected.
Big difference.

 

[pianistclare]

So…it begs the question:

What makes music “sacred?”

Opinion? The composer who wrote it? Staying power? Popularity?

Not all CCM is remotely appropriate for the Liturgy.
But honestly, I don’t know of many parishes who can pull off Bach’s B Minor Mass nor any priest with the time to wait on a n hour and 45 minutes of singing PLUS the Mass prayers, readings, and homily. People who wax sentimental about classical music have no idea what it takes to actuality pull that off.

Do monasteries chant regularly? THEY SURE DO! They have a group established, the materials at the ready, and it’s part of their daily prayer. That’s a completely different thing. You can attend their Masses and be in hog heaven. But parishes can’t seem to pull that off.

Again, no time no money, no patience, no Director.

It’s kind of like wishing your pastor had fancier vestments.
He goes with his personal tastes or what was in the sacristy closet when he got there.
Whether people like them or not doesn’t factor in all that much.

 

[M-Dent]

In my experience you pay for what you get. Professional musicians/organ players require some investment. Then the selection of Hymns and Sacred Music broadens. If a parish wants volunteers you get the music that you get.

 

[exnihilo]

We have a Sat night group that is just awful. But the same group of elderly folks have been going to that Mass since the church was built. Those people and their garage band country songs are their friends, they are FAMILIAR. They love them. If we were to switch it up, they would freak out, and stop tithing. The older parishioners keep the parish alive financially. And they gossip the loudest. When they complain to the pastor, he just wants to hide.
So things remain the same. And people are content. Visitors think it’s awful…but the longtime members do not. like. change.

Complaints and money certainly can be a deciding factor. The sixties generation still has plenty of pull. They probably have more pull now more than ever since they have so much wealth.

 

[Oneofthewomen]

Complaints and money certainly can be a deciding factor. The sixties generation still has plenty of pull. They probably have more pull now more than ever since they have so much wealth.

Regarding the highlighted-
I keep hearing this, but I don’t buy it. Most of the “boomers” I know are struggling financially. Bad investments, loss of pensions, skyrocketing health-care costs, etc, make the “60’s generation” as you call it one of the poorest, at least in my area.

I think it has more to do with no new “volunteers” and the lack of parish funds to pay anyone with any musical knowledge a livable wage.

I have learned first hand that anyone under the age of 60 will not commit to anything volunteer related because “ya know, I might get a better offer”. It is the older parishioners that give time, talent & treasure, so if they are catered to more so than anyone else, that is the reason. Those who don’t like it should step up instead of complaining.

 

[johndaddy1225]

I left a parish because of the “Glory and Praise” music. I now attend an FSSP parish which offers Gregorian chant and Sacred Polyphony. Masses seven days a week and confession before and after every Mass.

I haven’t made the switch yet, but I am very close to and this not the only reason but definitely 1 of them. the glory and praise music and the norvis ordo style of mass in general makes me think im at a Lutheran or other more “traditional” protestant churches and not catholic. just my opinion and 2 cents.