Control, Humility, and the "Problem"

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Isidore

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Our pastor has stated that one of the things most important to him is, “control”. Same pastor on humility, “I hate it”. Both statements in homilies. I’ve contemplated talking to him about it, contacting the Archbishop, etc. Contacting the Vicar General is not an option, as the pastor is also the Vicar General (once said, “I create or implement the rules; but, I may not necessarily follow them all”). It appears that much of the abuse problem is a result of the desire to have control over a person. Also, the stated hatred of humility creates the possibility of being “above” any problem, particularly one of abuse. Lastly, if rules are created, which ones are optional?

Suggestions on what do do are much appreciated.
 
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Isidore said:
contacting the Archbishop, etc.
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Welcome to Catholic Answers Forums.

Why would you contact the archbishop? Bad homilies? The priest’s admission of his own human weakness?
Isidore said:
It appears that much of the abuse problem is a result of the desire to have control over a person.
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It’s quite a stretch to make a connection between what your priest said and the abuse problem. Are you trying to suggest that your priest is part of that problem?
Isidore said:
Lastly, if rules are created, which ones are optional
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Everything is optional except Love God and Love Your Neighbor.
Isidore said:
Suggestions on what do do are much appreciated.
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Nothing, except try to have a bit more respect for your priest.
 
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I would say to first make an appointment with him to present your concerns in a respectful manner. Don’t gossip. These are concerning statements. Watch and see what other types of conclusions he is making and address them in a dry and respectful email after a period of time.
 
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Agree with the only optional exception is Love God and Love Your Neighbor. My contention is that he requires the rules be complied with by other priests; but, not necessarily himself and he is arbitrator.
 
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From what you wrote, I don’t see a problem with what the priest said. As Daisy wrote, present your concerns to him…

… and do not gossip. Making the connection with the “abuse problem” constitutes gossip, or more specifically rash judgement, detraction, and calumny.
 
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You seem to think that you need to control this situation. It may be best to rein in your own need for control and consider your own humility.
 
I wonder how many times that was said to victims of abuse.

Your statement, “You seem to think …” Wow!? And the further personal criticism. How do you know the size of the log in my eye?
 
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Are you a victim of abuse (not expecting an answer to this)?
Are you accusing this priest of abuse?

Making nebulous connections about an extremely serious issue is intellectually irresponsible at best.
 
Passive aggressiveness in posing a question when stating an answer is not expected. I have not been sexually abused; yet, know some who have. Many years ago, had I spoken up because they were fearful, as I was fearful, … no one knows.

Should we not have an opinion on the conduct of and statements by our priests? Should we not wish for a Church where leaders, themselves, follow the expectations they for those led? Can I/we not have a voice to question desire for control and absence of humility of our Church leaders?
 
I wasn’t arguing against that at all… I was arguing against your irresponsible connection of one priest’s words to the abuse scandal (again, unless of course you believe this particular priest to be guilty of abuse, in which case, call the authorities)
 
I was implying that the abuse problem may a symptom of a problem of the desire for control. If one has control, one can do as they wish. Giving up control may help resolve the problem. I never stated that I thought the specific priest guilty of sexual abuse. However, sexual is only one form of abuse - what I have seen: abuse of authority by demeaning employees of the Parish, criticizing specific Parishioners in front of others, withholding information that is material to financial situations, picking small “fights” to show who is boss (example: the material and color of outdoor basketball backboards), divulging not the person, but the content of a confession in such a way that it may have been easy to figure out who the confessor was - yes - I’m highly involved in our Parish, its finances, councils, school, etc. I see the “sausage-making”.
 
Without the context of the whole homily, or at least the specific point the priest was trying to make, it’s impossible for me to evaluate a statement like “I want control” or “I hate humility”.

Almost all humans want control. It is difficult to reach the point where you truly submit your will to a religious superior and/or to God Himself. If it were easy, then priests and religious wouldn’t have to go through long periods of formation on this topic, and we would not have priests disobeying their superiors or breaking their vows so often.

Likewise, “I hate humility” sounds like a typical “alarming” statement that a priest would put in a homily to shock and get everyone’s attention before he made a point. I myself have prayed the Litany of Humility and wondered if it’s really that great of a prayer in parts. I would not want someone with serious self-esteem problems praying that prayer.

When I can’t even totally understand what your priest is getting at, I also can’t understand how you would connect this to the abuse scandal. It is well-known that sexual abusers of all types are committing the abuse in order to feel powerful and “in control” and not out of lust, but you don’t seem to be claiming this particular priest is an abuser.
 
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I do not believe the priest is a sexual abuser. That said, the concern is that when one wants and actively evidences pursuit of control, where does it stop? If the priest states he does not need follow rules, which ones? Canon Law, Archdiocese Policy; lay laws, such as building permits, financial reporting, taxes; … any rule/law.
 
It should not be beyond the powers that be to introduce technology into churches so the faithful can respond in real time to sermons, up-ticking the bits they like, and down-ticking the bits they don’t. An excess of down ticks (say ten) should lead to an automatic cut to the pastor’s mic and a compulsory rendition of ‘Faith of our Fathers’, after which he will be allowed to resume. Experts like the OP should have a ‘super-tick’ ability to trigger this process on their own. Super-tickers could also have some electronic bells to ring persistently in the case of heterodoxy, and a special button to bring down (health and safety approved of course) fire and brimstone in the case of actual heresy. This button would also trigger a special dye like those used to protect money in bank vaults, staining the offending cleric so all will be aware of his transgression for a period of at least some weeks.
 
Isidore said:
Our pastor has stated that one of the things most important to him is, “control”
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I can’t say I fully understand the problem you have, not completely, but I have had a small problem with the element of control in our parish. I spoke with my priest in private about this and he explained that he had to be very much in control of everything happening in his parish so as to avoid any scandal arising. I understood completely and concern myself with helping him in that regard. So perhaps your pastor is likewise simply seeking to avoid scandal in the same way.

As for humility. We know how important that is no matter what position a person holds in the Catholic Church.
 
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Isidore said:
Our pastor has stated that one of the things most important to him is, “control”. Same pastor on humility, “I hate it”. Both statements in homilies. I’ve contemplated talking to him about it, contacting the Archbishop, etc. Contacting the Vicar General is not an option, as the pastor is also the Vicar General (once said, “I create or implement the rules; but, I may not necessarily follow them all”). It appears that much of the abuse problem is a result of the desire to have control over a person. Also, the stated hatred of humility creates the possibility of being “above” any problem, particularly one of abuse. Lastly, if rules are created, which ones are optional?

Suggestions on what do do are much appreciated.
Click to expand...
How about you schedule an appointment to discuss his homily with him, or pull him aside next time you see him?

Perhaps, just perhaps, you misunderstood what he meant? Or, perhaps he did a terrible job of expressing what he really meant?

Sometimes priests can be sarcastic or melodramatic in their homilies to drill home a point.

Talk to him first. Say something like:

“Father, I would really like to talk to you about the homily you gave on [day or date of homily]. I am having trouble understanding what you meant and it has been bugging me. Could I please ask you a few questions to clearify things?”

God Bless
 
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