Controversial saints should they be emulated

  • Thread starter Thread starter MargaretofCortona
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
It takes a lot of preparation and knowing what you’re doing, so I hear.
I’ve only ever gone 2 days I think, like from Good Friday to Easter, and I think if one would go 3 days it requires a lot more precaution as after 3 days the body undergoes more stringent changes.
 
Last edited:
Basically, your body begins to digest itself. If you are prone to various heart and blood conditions, they can also manifest.
There is no way around this stuff with “precautions” regardless of what people say. It’s bodily damage, period.
 
Do not take this personal. I think some people think the harder or harsher their penance is, the more holy or closer to God they are. You do not have to abuse yourself to prove your holiness. That is the attitude I want to discourage. I do not think rape victims or survivors are worse people if they didn’t respond to their rapist in the same manner Maria Goretti did. Not many can forgive so freely and care for the soul of their rapist. I think only God gives people the grace to practice that level of forgiveness. A priest once told me true forgiveness is a miracle.
 
Rose of Lima died in her early thirties too. That is an awful way to die.
 
AdamPeter said:
Yet it still is practiced in various religious institutes.
Click to expand...
Yes, and there are people in some countries who in the name of religion have a volunteer crucified during Holy Week.

I personally think that if one feels compelled to starve, beat, or injure themself, it is the greater sacrifice to just abstain from doing whatever bodily harmful process one thinks is so wonderfully spiritual.
If God calls you to suffer, He will send you the stigmata or cancer or something…otherwise your body is God’s temple, you don’t go smashing up its walls.
 
Something similar happened to my mother. She was murdered by a lunatic. When he was captured he was interrogated by the police. One of the questions that they asked him was, “What were the dying woman’s last words?”
He replied, “She said, ‘Jesus loves you.’”
 
MargaretofCortona said:
I think some people think the harder or harsher their penance is, the more holy or closer to God they are.
Click to expand...
I don’t think people think that, I think the harsh penances come after the holiness and are looked upon by the church as such.

It’s not unhealthy just because it offends the sensibilities of the modern man.
 
There are people who think along those lines. Those practices are unhealthy because they will take a toll on your body. Just because saints did it in the past doesn’t mean it is right, healthy or how the Lord wants us to behave.
We live in very different times. Extreme penances are not always healthy. Our body is our temple. Practice what you wish.
 
I don’t think that’s an awful way to die. I am sure they had some of the better deaths among the human family. They were saints after all.

I think God took them when He will, they put so much to God, did many good works, had a close relationship to God, etc.
 
Happily, there aren’t too many still around, but still my skin crawls whenever I see a childrens’ book about St. Maria Goretti that praises her for “defending her purity”. This gives children the wrong message because, as mentioned above, she would not have sinned had she allowed the attack to save her life.

What hasn’t been mentioned is that according to psychologists, fighting one’s attacker is the natural thing to do when one is about to be violated in this manner. So although St. Maria no doubt wished to remain pure, she was simply doing the normal, natural thing in fighting off her attacker. It’s actually more difficult not to fight and to survive the horror, both physically and emotionally.

St. Maria Goretti certainly deserves to be venerated as a saint. But she should be remembered for her heroic forgiveness, not for doing what is natural or for defending a sanctity which she would not have lost.
 
Last edited:
It is sad her austere penances led to her early demise. I think I will simply stop questioning saints I cannot understand. I am not less than holy if I want to avoid dangerous penances. That is the attitude I do not like. Us 21st century Catholics are apparently spoiled and weak because we do not do the same practices of the saints of the past. Their austere penances prove that they cared more about God than earthly comfort and if I do not want to practice such behavior I’m a spoiled millennial. Look at how much those saints did for God. I do not think a lot of their practices were healthy or even what the Lord demanded. I thought our body was a temple.

Why some people against tattoos, but apparently flogging your body, hanging by your hair, sleeping on broken glass is acceptable?

I guess tattoos are vain
 
Last edited:
Yeah I’ve seen this, too.
It tends to be a certain personality type that tends towards extremes in everything.
I’m not saying they’re not sincere or mean well, often, they’re very anxious to “get it right”.
But the flip side of this attitude can be spiritual pride , or possibly they’re trying to force God’s hand about an issue.
The penance itself can become an idol, and they forget why they’re actually doing it in the first place because they feel so righteous doing it.
 
MargaretofCortona said:
It is sad her austere penances led to her early demise. I think I will simply stop questioning saints I cannot understand. I am not less than holy if I want to avoid dangerous penances. That is the attitude I do not like. Us 21st century Catholics are apparently spoiled and weak because we do not do the same practices of the saints of the past. Their austere penances prove that they cared more about God than earthly comfort and if I do not want to practice such behavior I’m a spoiled millennial.
Click to expand...
Actually there are entire bodies of scholarly literature on how back in the days of some of these female saints who starved and beat themselves, doing that was a way for them to actually accomplish something by being seen as “holy” and gaining some power to accomplish things in the real world as a result. Otherwise, their choices were marriage, which many of them didn’t want, or a convent, which cut them off from the world.

Nowadays, somebody who starves and beats themself and sees visions because they are inflicting pain on themself is not seen as particularly holy. They are seen as needing professional help, and may well be institutionalized against their will. We understand things differently now.
 
I think you are jumping to conclusions there, Bear, to imply that she died due to starvation if that is what you are meaning to say.
 
Last edited:
Do 33-year-old women just normally have strokes and die then? After having been paralyzed for a while?

Unless the lady in question is engaging in a high risk activity like smoking or taking large doses of birth control pills, and I am sure that St. Catherine was doing neither, it’s very odd for a woman of childbearing age to die of a stroke. Maybe not so odd if you have been abusing your health for 20 years though.
 
I think that determining cause of death might be difficult owing that she died in 1380.

Also, there were a number of saints, very very few who survived wholly on the Eucharist. This was purely a supernatural Grace from God. Her Confessor, blessed Raymond of Cappua, has this to say:

“For the seven year period prior to her death, Saint Catherine of Siena took no food into her body other than the Eucharist. Her fasting did not affect her energy, however. She maintained a very active life during those seven years. As a matter of fact, most of her great accomplishments occurred during that period. Her death had nothing to do with malnutrition, or anything connected with lack of food.”

I do agree with you, however, on the imprudence of overly-long fasts. I would say it’s very ill advised without the consent of your confessor.
 
Last edited:
I don’t think her confessor was a nutritional expert or an expert on cause of death.

We have had in our more recent times the controversial case of Therese Neumann, who claimed to be surviving solely on the Eucharist. The suspicion is that her father was sneaking her food.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top