Conversation with A Former Christian, Now Islam

  • Thread starter Thread starter Terry_from_Ypsi
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
T

Terry_from_Ypsi

Guest
Yesterday I was talking to a woman who had converted to Islam from being a Christian.

I asked her why she converted to Islam and her answer was that after some study, she found Islam to be a “perfect religion” for her.

I asked her what about Jesus and she said she had the greatest respect for Prophet Jesus.

I told her that Jesus was more than a prophet and that He came to be her saviour.

I also told her that she had rejected Jesus as saviour.

I tried to focus on the salvation work of Jesus but she said that
I was believing what Paul said.

I challenged her about the fact that God could be incarnate as man and she said that this idea was from the Romans who believed in gods and goddesses.

I said she was in error and she said I was in grave error.

I was saddened by the discussion.

My question(s):
  1. If a Christian converts to Islam are they thus rejecting the salvation that is in Jesus Christ and Him alone.
  2. Has the person damned themselveas to Hell unless they repent ?
As I drove off, I prayed for the womaqn for her conversion back.

This was very sad for me to experience.

Also, I prayed that God would act to encourage faith in people’s lives in order to resist the lure of Islam.

Regards,

Terry_from_Ypsi
 
Hi Terry…

That is a sad case indeed. Personally, I do not believe that anyone who is really Christian could convert to Islam or Judaism either for that matter. How could someone profess belief and Love for the Lord Jesus Christ one day, and then deny his existance or Divinity the next.

Nope…she was a nominal Christian…either CINA or as some non-Catholics might say never really saved in the first place.

Now…where does that put her salvation…I could not say. I feel uncomfortable making that call…'cause I surely am not God.

Pray for her often…
 
At least she’s not restricted to the Christian morality. She got alot to ‘gain’ being a Muslim.
 
But I wonder if she even knows what she has really signed on for, anyway. The Muslims actively working to convert non-Muslims in the West use Western vocabulary and ways of thinking to make their religion more attractive:

The Facade

The “Islam” that Muslim activists introduce to the West these days is completely different from the Islam we (the authors of the article) knew and experienced in the Middle East… A major facelift operation has been taking place here.

More here: islamreview.com/articles/facade.shtml
 
Dear Terry,

this is very saddening. On the other hand, we do not give up hope for such souls. She could still be saved if she is just following her conscience and taking reasonable measures to form it.

One of things that I think is crucial to showing an Islamic the deficiencies of their faith is to emphasize the Trinity and Incarnation as central to Christianity, that the God of Islam does not and CANNOT improve on the God of Christianity.

Tell them about the four levels of happiness:

I. Material Possessions and Pleasures
II. Egotistical Accomplishments
III. Intimate Relationships of Love with other Human Creatures
IV. Intimate Relationship of Love with God

what these four levels reveal is that the ultimate longing of the human heart is to give and receive LOVE for all eternity. It is only courageous, self-sacrificing, self-abadoning love, full donation of self, and of receiving the same type of love that we find ourselves and our meaning.

But if Love is the ultimate purpose for our existence and being, the only thing that can ultimately satisfy us, how can God be better as ONE Person instead of THREE? For if God is merely ONE in Person, who was God loving in eternity, before any creation? Himself? Then it would seem to be Infinite Narcisism. But from all Eternity we have God the Father who begets an Image of Himself, the Son, and the Love between the Father and the Son is boundless, and so great and deep that the Love between them literally becomes ANOTHER Person, the Holy Spirit.

Indeed, God has veiled this wondrous mystery into the very essence of our human sexuality. This is the wondrous theology that our dear late Holy Father gave us in his Theology of the Body. and so the man offers his love whole and entire to his wife, who receives it totally and also offers it back totally, and the love between them then becomes a THIRD person, a child, who is just as priceless as the holy man and woman that gave him life.

This is one of the most beautiful realities of the Catholic faith, one of the most serious and foundational things of human existence. And in attacking the Trinity, it is little wonder that the Muslims sexuality does not attain to the heights in Catholicism. Is it any wonder they have harems, and brutally “circumsize” women.

continued…
 
continued…

And we go on to the Incarnation. What the Muslim does not understand is that no finite creature can atone for a mortal sin. It is not possible. And so the Muslim who believes that “if the good outweighs the bad, I’ll go to heaven,” does not understand the true consequences of mortal sin. Consider, for example, the crime of a young man who, in lust, uses a girl for his pleasure, and then discards her to move on to someone else? How can he repay this? By giving lots of money to poor people? By fasting on some days? For the actuality of what he has done is an IMMEASURABLE INSULT to the dignity of the precious woman. For God has created all human creatures, especially women, for the purpose of receiving and giving total love for all eternity, to possess the infinite love of God and the saints in unending bliss. It is for this reason that every human creature is PRICELESS, as they are called to receive unending, immeasurable love forever. and so if a man chooses to regard such a priceless creature as some mere finite OBJECT, whose only worth is their mere physical body, to be USED, and then DISCARDED after “satisfaction”, he has committed an INFINITE insult. So then, how does he repay an infinite insult? By doing some “good works”.

But so then, how does a finite creature repay the Infinite God? But so then, the only way the person can be forgiven is if GOD HIMSELF pays the price, hence, the INCARNATION. for more information, you may consider reading my full article on this: Darth Vader, Lust and Hell.

Terry, if you ever see this person again, you may wish to share these things with her, in the hopes that she sees that Islam does not improve on Christianity. It is a deformation.

Love and Blessings to you!

scott
 
btw, terry,

are you from Ypsilanti, MICHIGAN? I am a native of Michigan. Even lived in Canton, Michigan for one year.
 
Lillith said:
Hi Terry…

That is a sad case indeed. Personally, I do not believe that anyone who is really Christian could convert to Islam or Judaism either for that matter. How could someone profess belief and Love for the Lord Jesus Christ one day, and then deny his existance or Divinity the next.

Nope…she was a nominal Christian…either CINA or as some non-Catholics might say never really saved in the first place.

Now…where does that put her salvation…I could not say. I feel uncomfortable making that call…'cause I surely am not God.

Pray for her often…
Click to expand...
I assume then, that a jew or muslim who converts to Christanity was never really a jew or muslim, because how could they give up their covenant with God in order to believe that Jesus was God?
 
Hi Terrry
  1. If a Christian converts to Islam are they thus rejecting the salvation that is in Jesus Christ and Him alone.
Jesus said, if you deny me before men, I will deny you before my father in heaven. Gal 1:6-8 says those who preach another gospel are under God’s curse So, Yes to both your questions.
  1. Has the person damned themselveas to Hell unless they repent ?
Terry, if you have a chance to see her again, start with I Cor 15:3-4 and show where that was taught in the gospels.

Then go to John 1:1; 8:58, 10:30 and link it to Col 1:15-18 to show that both Jesus and Paul taught the divinity of Jesus.

Pick the main points of the gospel, diety of christ, incarnation and so on, and show where both Paul and the Gospels teach the same things. Show her that Paul’s teachings are consistent with Jesus’s teachings.

Muslims claim that Jesus never said he was God. When in fact, he claimed to be the Son of God thus making himself equal with God the Father ( John 5:18-19 ). So, your homework, sit down outline the gospel and related theology, search the gospels for those points and list where paul agrees.

So, next time a muslim hits you with this, you can start with I Cor 15:3-4 and show those points in the gospels.
 
Daniel_Marsh said:
Hi Terrry
  1. If a Christian converts to Islam are they thus rejecting the salvation that is in Jesus Christ and Him alone.
Jesus said, if you deny me before men, I will deny you before my father in heaven. Gal 1:6-8 says those who preach another gospel are under God’s curse So, Yes to both your questions.
  1. Has the person damned themselveas to Hell unless they repent ?
Terry, if you have a chance to see her again, start with I Cor 15:3-4 and show where that was taught in the gospels.

Then go to John 1:1; 8:58, 10:30 and link it to Col 1:15-18 to show that both Jesus and Paul taught the divinity of Jesus.

Pick the main points of the gospel, diety of christ, incarnation and so on, and show where both Paul and the Gospels teach the same things. Show her that Paul’s teachings are consistent with Jesus’s teachings.

Muslims claim that Jesus never said he was God. When in fact, he claimed to be the Son of God thus making himself equal with God the Father ( John 5:18-19 ). So, your homework, sit down outline the gospel and related theology, search the gospels for those points and list where paul agrees.

So, next time a muslim hits you with this, you can start with I Cor 15:3-4 and show those points in the gospels.
Click to expand...
Good points. :rolleyes:

And make sure to NOT mention the verse where Jesus says he has NO knowledge of the hour, almost as if God is schizophrenic. That will confuse her.

And do NOT mention the verses where Jesus prays to his God.

And do NOT mention the verses where Jesus says that he can do NOTHING without the power of the “father.”

And do NOT mention the verses where Jesus says that he is NOT good and that only God is good.

And perhaps, with a combination of Daniel’s advice and the aforementioned points I made, you can get any sucker to accept Jesus, or any other person for that matter, as God himself!

Regards,

Jonathan
 
jcaz said:
Good points. :rolleyes:

…Regards,

Jonathan
Click to expand...
Dear Jonathan,

why have you not commented on my remarks?

Admittedly, with just the Scriptures, it is not entirely clear that Jesus is God. We also need Tradition. But you have failed to address the fact that Islam is not as beautiful and loving as Catholicism, and you have failed to address the issue of how a young man who commits rape in lust can “atone” for what he has done.

You have failed to comment on how a God who is only ONE in Person is less an image of love than if there is a family of Persons within God’s One Nature. You have failed to address how a God who suffers for His creatures is greater in love and solidarity than a God who does not suffer for them.
 
Valke2 said:
I assume then, that a jew or muslim who converts to Christanity was never really a jew or muslim, because how could they give up their covenant with God in order to believe that Jesus was God?
Click to expand...
I don;t see this as being the same as a Christian converting TO Islam or Judaism, as a Jew or Muslim still believes in our God, they just realise at a later stage in life that Jesus is God too, so convert to Christianity.
 
It is sad indeed. Let us pray for her. I do not know if she has condemd herself to damnation in Hell. Paul speaks about those who recieve the law informaly in their hearts. This requires the Holy Spirit to come into them. So I guess it is so that if she continues the path that she is one she will be damned. Personally I do not know why someone would want to trade their personal relationship with God for another faith. That is truely sad. She has rejected Christ. Let us pray for her. God speed.
 
Vigis said:
Personally I do not know why someone would want to trade their personal relationship with God for another faith. That is truely sad. She has rejected Christ. Let us pray for her. God speed.
Click to expand...
They convert ONLY cuz they’re ignorant of Jesus.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top