Converting from New Mass to Latin Mass?

[prodigalson12]

I desire to move over to the Latin Mass, I’m just really desiring to move much closer to tradition and after seeing and continue to see the changes with the new mass, I’m just feeling a real yearning to go this direction, to get closer to the roots, closer to tradition. I was raised entirely within the new mass V2, and this should give you guys an idea as to where my background is in this matter, so not a newbie Catholic.

That said, I’d like some (name removed by moderator)ut as to what to expect, how best to prepare myself with the transition, anything at all to help.

Yours in Christ, Brian

 

[banished]

Hello Brian,

St. Benedict’s Monastery in Brazil has helped me quite a bit. I load the Gregorian Chants for next Sunday into my MP3 player, and practice during my daily walk. A word of caution: There are quite a few false teachers here on the Internet, so get into a church quick.

Here is the link for St. Benedict’s Monastey free MP3 MPEG downloads:

christusrex.org/www2/cantgreg/index_eng.html

Richard

 

[I_Believe]

Hi Brian, try sanctamissa.org/en/tutorial/
Lots of good info on the TLM.

 

[tbcrawford]

Hi prodigalson12
I fully appreciate how you feel about Latin Mass I used to really enjoy it and last time was about 1994 for me.However my comment is wasnt Mass originally in Greek?So if we are to be truly Traditional should we not be saying Mass in Greek?Perhaps someone can enlighten me.I do believe we should be as Traditional and true to the original Mass as possible.God Bless

 

[Toribus]

Hi prodigalson12
I fully appreciate how you feel about Latin Mass I used to really enjoy it and last time was about 1994 for me.However my comment is wasnt Mass originally in Greek?So if we are to be truly Traditional should we not be saying Mass in Greek?Perhaps someone can enlighten me.I do believe we should be as Traditional and true to the original Mass as possible.God Bless

I’m afraid you’ve confused “tradition” with “antiquarianism”. Antiquarianism is where we value things simply because they are old, and the older something is the greater value we assign it.

Tradition is a completely different beastie. It reveres that which is substantially the same while having been allowed to grow. The Mass in Latin is of the same substance as the ancient Mass in Greek, but has also accumulated much richness and splendour over the centuries as a result of healthy growth. That’s Tradition.

 

[banished]

I’m afraid you’ve confused “tradition” with “antiquarianism”. Antiquarianism is where we value things simply because they are old, and the older something is the greater value we assign it.

Tradition is a completely different beastie. It reveres that which is substantially the same while having been allowed to grow. The Mass in Latin is of the same substance as the ancient Mass in Greek, but has also accumulated much richness and splendour over the centuries as a result of healthy growth. That’s Tradition.

Hello Toribus,

That’s pretty good, “tradition vs antiquarianism”. I never divided it like that. How do you divide the music in those terms?

I’m sure that we all have sat there during a NO Mass with out of tune singers strumming their guitars, and wondered, is this music from God? On the other hand, the Gregorian chants with pipe organ during High Mass are unmistakenly Catholic.

Richard

 

[dove51]

I first discovered traditionalism a year ago next month, and I’ve been attending an EF Mass as often as possible since then. It’s been a fun ride.

It can be very confusing at first. To be honest, I still don’t follow along perfectly, but having a ‘62 missal helps a lot with that. (I should probably have started attending the adults’ catechism classes at my parish just to get more familiar with traditionalism and the Mass in general, but alas, my mom wouldn’t let me.) But for the first few times, I just put down the missal in order to absorb as much as I could. I think this is good advice at least for the first time you go.

Aside from that, you probably know what basic protocol things will most likely go down: kneeling for the Eucharist, receiving on the tongue, not saying ‘amen’ afterwards, etc. Oh, and expect for your knees to hurt more than normal at first; at my parish, we probably kneel for over an hour altogether.

 

[weepixie71]

I desire to move over to the Latin Mass, I’m just really desiring to move much closer to tradition and after seeing and continue to see the changes with the new mass, I’m just feeling a real yearning to go this direction, to get closer to the roots, closer to tradition. I was raised entirely within the new mass V2, and this should give you guys an idea as to where my background is in this matter, so not a newbie Catholic.

That said, I’d like some (name removed by moderator)ut as to what to expect, how best to prepare myself with the transition, anything at all to help.

Yours in Christ, Brian

Hi Brian,

I know exactly where you are coming from. I was in the same boat. I believe that to appreciate the Tridentine Mass is a calling from God because so many of cradle Catholics that were raised in V2 should be used to change and going with the flow.

I have to tell you going through this process of slowly switching from Novus Ordo to Tridentine you may go through several emotions. First is oh my goodness, the comparisons are hardly there. How could the Novus Ordo have been derived from this mass. Second, you’ll go through the-Ive been robbed of so much growing up in my Catholic faith. about how beautiful it really is. The Holy Spirit seems to give you some graces through this also. Quenching your thirst with so much of His love. Third-when you go back to the Novus Ordo, and you will because you’ll have to see again if it was really as bad as you remembered it, and you will want to weep for lack of beauty and worship for Christ. right now im in the fourth stage- where you get struck dumb by people not seeing what you see. things that will become so obviously wrong (example: dress, altar girls, etc) because a bishop said its all right wont make it all right for you and for you love of Christ. And you will HATE it when people will tell you, “so what, those are disciplines”. People who say that, I have to believe do not understand what disciplines truly are.

You are being called to a hard journey. The rewards though are peace, happiness, and greater faith.

 

[Hesychios]

That’s pretty good, “tradition vs antiquarianism”. I never divided it like that.

I think the better point is that there is a continuum of the Tradition.

So which is the best Mass… the 1950AD Mass, the 1400AD Mass?

Or maybe the 600AD Mass or the 300AD Mass. In fact the further one goes back the more diverse the practice is across Europe, and all equally valid and all equally traditional.

Your question about the music is a valid one. Everyone appreciates the ‘Gregorian’ chant, but how many of us realize that it reached it’s definitive form in an age when musical instruments were not permitted, and the only proper vehicle for lyrical prayer was considered the unaccompanied human voice?

How many realize that the pew and the kneeler are relatively recent introductions to the Latin Mass, and that most of the time the faithful worshiped standing and otherwise free to move about the nave?

Is a preference to restore these attributes merely antiquarianism, or is it a yearning to properly worship the Lord Our God?

 

[Cristiano]

I desire to move over to the Latin Mass, I’m just really desiring to move much closer to tradition and after seeing and continue to see the changes with the new mass, I’m just feeling a real yearning to go this direction, to get closer to the roots, closer to tradition. I was raised entirely within the new mass V2, and this should give you guys an idea as to where my background is in this matter, so not a newbie Catholic.

That said, I’d like some (name removed by moderator)ut as to what to expect, how best to prepare myself with the transition, anything at all to help.

Yours in Christ, Brian

Before you spend to much time trying to follow your “feelings” I would encourage you to read the “Spirit of the Liturgy” by Romano Guardini. It was written in reference to the EF but it also applies to the OF. It is a small booklet that will give you quite a different take on the different aspects of liturgy and it will help you getting away from the modern vs. traditionalist frame of mind. It might help you to look at your spirituality more in terms of complementarity between the liturgy and private devotions.

 

[I_Believe]

Hi prodigalson12
I fully appreciate how you feel about Latin Mass I used to really enjoy it and last time was about 1994 for me.However my comment is wasnt Mass originally in Greek?So if we are to be truly Traditional should we not be saying Mass in Greek?Perhaps someone can enlighten me.I do believe we should be as Traditional and true to the original Mass as possible.God Bless

Remember we are discussing the TLM. The Latin Rite. The Kyrie is Greek though.

The Gregorian Rite (TLM) will continue to be prayed in Latin. If H.H. BXVI had any plans to change this, he would have refrained from releasing his Summorum Pontificum. Also consider that the organizations involved in training priests to pray the TLM are training them to pray it in Latin.

Your question is fair, but no, the Latin Mass should be left alone, especially considering it has only recently been freed of indult. It’s fine as it is.

 

[sarahraegraham]

I have a question that is related to converting from the NO to the EF, I hope you don’t mind, I don’t mean to butt in. I am right in my understanding the the N.O. is the Roman rite and the E.F. is the Latin rite? If so, what were to happen if my husband and I have children and want to have them receive the sacraments in the Latin rite while we ourselves are initiated fully under the Roman Rite? Are there any conflicts regarding that or are they kind of interchangeable as far as acceptability? Say they were baptized in the Roman rite, but later wanted to be married in the Latin rite or whatnot. We are members of both an NO and an EF parish, so it’s still confusing making this all make sense.

 

[dove51]

I have a question that is related to converting from the NO to the EF, I hope you don’t mind, I don’t mean to butt in. I am right in my understanding the the N.O. is the Roman rite and the E.F. is the Latin rite? If so, what were to happen if my husband and I have children and want to have them receive the sacraments in the Latin rite while we ourselves are initiated fully under the Roman Rite? Are there any conflicts regarding that or are they kind of interchangeable as far as acceptability? Say they were baptized in the Roman rite, but later wanted to be married in the Latin rite or whatnot. We are members of both an NO and an EF parish, so it’s still confusing making this all make sense.

The Roman and the Latin rite are the same thing.

 

[preV2tradcath]

The Roman and the Latin rite are the same thing.

Indeed they are. The EF was the Roman or Latin Mass for centuries before the 2nd Vatican Council. The OF, or Novus Ordo as some call it, is the Mass Pope Paul VI promulgated after the Council. The OF became the standard liturgy for the Roman or Latin rite at that time.

 

[sarahraegraham]

Indeed they are. The EF was the Roman or Latin Mass for centuries before the 2nd Vatican Council. The OF, or Novus Ordo as some call it, is the Mass Pope Paul VI promulgated after the Council. The OF became the standard liturgy for the Roman or Latin rite at that time.

Oh, okay, so “Latin rite” is really a misnomer, and the Latin rite so-called because it’s said in Latin is simply one of two forms of the Roman rite, OF and EF?

 

[Traditional_Ang]

Hello Toribus,

I’m sure that we all have sat there during a NO Mass with out of tune singers strumming their guitars, and wondered, is this music from God? On the other hand, the Gregorian chants with pipe organ during High Mass are unmistakenly Catholic.

Richard

Richard:

In the early 1980’s, I was part of a “Young Adults Choir” that sang during an NO “Youth Mass”. We had just about everything that would drive most of the posters here nuts - electric guitars, keyboards, drums & amplification. I don’t remember anything ever being done out of tune by this group. I wasn’t particularly liked or wanted, & they didn’t go out of their way to make me feel welcome or to help me “fit in”, but that had nothing to do with the quality of their music.

Now, I PREFER Gregorian Chant, Traditional Music, and Traditional Liturgy, and I love periods of silence (esp during the Communion of the Faithful). But, I’ll accept any music which allows people to find & know the LORD and to worship HIM in Spirit and in Truth.

What I object to are priests who refuse to follow the G.I.R.M., priests who use Canon 5 (“Canon Make it up as you go”), priests & congregations who treat the Body and Blood of the Lord with such disrespect and lack of reverence that they might as well be handling ordinary Bread and Wine and priests and congregations who treat each other, the unborn and the poor with such indifference they might as well be Government bureaucrats or “Fat-Cat” “Plutocrats”. What I object to are bishops & priests who refuse to preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ and to teach the whole Catholic Faith or to stand up for the rights of the unborn.

Compared to those, sour notes from an off-key guitarist just isn’t all that important.

Your Brother & Servant in Christ, Michael

 

[I_Believe]

Oh, okay, so “Latin rite” is really a misnomer, and the Latin rite so-called because it’s said in Latin is simply one of two forms of the Roman rite, OF and EF?

No, the EF and OF are the two forms of the Latin Rite. The Novus Ordo Missae was introduced in Latin. An all vernacular OF Mass is the oddball that became the norm.
Only a Mass prayed in Latin is universal. The all Vernacular Mass is a territorial/regional novelty.

The Pope who called the VII Council, H.H. John XXII, released his Veterum Sapientia in 1962. In it he decreed and commanded that the Mass be prayed in Latin, forbidding anyone writing against the use of Latin in the Liturgy.

With the foregoing considerations in mind, to which We have given careful thought, We now, in the full consciousness of Our Office and in virtue of Our authority, decree and command the following:

Responsibility for enforcement

1. Bishops and superiors-general of religious orders shall take pains to ensure that in their seminaries and in their schools where adolescents are trained for the priesthood, all shall studiously observe the Apostolic See’s decision in this matter and obey these Our prescriptions most carefully.

1. In the exercise of their paternal care they shall be on their guard lest anyone under their jurisdiction, eager for revolutionary changes, writes against the use of Latin in the teaching of the higher sacred studies or in the Liturgy, or through prejudice makes light of the Holy See’s will in this regard or interprets it falsely.

Obviously, the movers and shakers at the Council ignored this Document. Despite the implied “anathema” of sorts.

 

[WhollyRoamin]

If the OP is still reading this thread, you’ll find a lot of good resources on this forum if you search around for it. But the best advice I’ve ever had was to attend the TLM for 3 weeks in a row. It’ll take a couple times to get the hang of it. And don’t be afraid to put down the missal if you’re hopelessly lost-- just unite your prayers to the altar and trust that Father is doing it correctly.

God bless!

 

[banished]

Richard:

In the early 1980’s, I was part of a “Young Adults Choir” that sang during an NO “Youth Mass”. We had just about everything that would drive most of the posters here nuts - electric guitars, keyboards, drums & amplification. I don’t remember anything ever being done out of tune by this group. I wasn’t particularly liked or wanted, & they didn’t go out of their way to make me feel welcome or to help me “fit in”, but that had nothing to do with the quality of their music.

Now, I PREFER Gregorian Chant, Traditional Music, and Traditional Liturgy, and I love periods of silence (esp during the Communion of the Faithful). But, I’ll accept any music which allows people to find & know the LORD and to worship HIM in Spirit and in Truth.

Your Brother & Servant in Christ, Michael

Hello Michael,

Yes that modern Christian music is very popular nowadays. I was blessed with a boy late in life, and he is now a 19 year old University student. He is also a member of one of those protestant mega churches with two large HD Screens and a rock band up on the stage between the two Screens. The college group that he belongs to travels all over Northern California to play that crazy music in churches. They are actually making a lot of money at it, and now they are going on a tour up to Washington State. He helps me download Gregorian Chants from the Internet into my MP3 player, but he isn’t the least bit interested in anything that is Catholic. I guess you can understand modern music better than I can, but I can’t find Jesus in all that noise. Can’t pray either, or hear myself think.

Richard

 

[corsair]

Some very interesting comments posted here. I really think that Weepixie has truely summed it up, though.

I converted to the Catholic Faith in Februrary of 1970 after about 5 years of discernment. I find it amazing that I survived the 70’s to the present. I have run the gamit of emotions that Weepixie describes.

So here I am almost 40 years later and now there is a light at the end of the tunnel. I must travel up to 120 miles each way for a TLM. Its expensive but I am so much happier now.

I truely believe that I was called to this Mass. May God bless all of you on your journey.