Converting to Another Faith

[MacDaddy]

I am still interested in the original question:

When a Christian converts to another faith, such a Islam, Judaism, etc., in effect he/she is rejecting Christ. In your opinion, is salvation still possible for that person, or has that person condemned him/her self to hell, or…?

There is no such thing as “Christian” converting to another faith; that would imply that which the Father gave to the Son, a Christian, can be removed from the Son and the Father. John 17.

“Also, He who began a good work in you will complete till the day of the Lord”. It is the Lord who begins and completes the Christian.

Salvation is possible as long as a person is breathing.

For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and {then} have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. Hebrews 6:4-6

This is an example of an apostate; they know everything that is true of the gospel and they even declare or show some type of outward repentance, then walk away in unbelief.

Some would and do argue this is a Christian, but the Christian doesn’t put their toe in the water to test the water “tasted”; they go in head first “eat” and the verse say to bring them to repentance, that is not salvation. Remember a pig can be cleaned and go back to the mud and a dog back to its vomit, same principle here.

My God bought me with a price, His life, and when He bought me He knew exactly what kind of damaged goods He was buying and yet He still took me. If He can die to purchase me; how much more can He keep me through His life? No, my God loses none of His sheep, just as He promised many times in the Bible and I fully trust in His promises.

 

[Anna_Scott]

There is no such thing as “Christian” converting to another faith; that would imply that which the Father gave to the Son, a Christian, can be removed from the Son and the Father. John 17.

“Also, He who began a good work in you will complete till the day of the Lord”. It is the Lord who begins and completes the Christian.

Salvation is possible as long as a person is breathing.

For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and {then} have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. Hebrews 6:4-6

This is an example of an apostate; they know everything that is true of the gospel and they even declare or show some type of outward repentance, then walk away in unbelief.

Some would and do argue this is a Christian, but the Christian doesn’t put their toe in the water to test the water “tasted”; they go in head first “eat” and the verse say to bring them to repentance, that is not salvation. Remember a pig can be cleaned and go back to the mud and a dog back to its vomit, same principle here.

My God bought me with a price, His life, and when He bought me He knew exactly what kind of damaged goods He was buying and yet He still took me. If He can die to purchase me; how much more can He keep me through His life? No, my God loses none of His sheep, just as He promised many times in the Bible and I fully trust in His promises.

MacDaddy,

Hello! Welcome to the Forums!

Interesting perspective.

I quoted the same passage of Scripture in an earlier post.

God bless,
Anna

 

[MacDaddy]

MacDaddy,

Hello! Welcome to the Forums!

Interesting perspective.

I quoted the same passage of Scripture in an earlier post.

God bless,
Anna

Thank you for the welcome; I missed that post you referred to somehow. I’m going to go back and look. Bless you.

 

[MacDaddy]

Javl,
There are Christians who have converted to Judaism, which requires the renunciation of Christ. This seems like such a grievous sin. My first instinct is to say, what could be worse than renouncing Christ?
edit
I have given the following passage a great deal of thought:
Hebrews Chapter 6 (ESV):
4 For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.

Does this mean we can reach a “point of no return”? If yes, what thoughts/actions bring us to that “point”?

I had my own diversion from the path of Christ.

A Mormon bishop and his wife were my neighbors, before my divorce. I had known them for years. I admired the strength of their family. The bishop seemed like the father I never had. So, after my divorce, they invited me to their church. For weeks, I took lessons at the bishop’s home- with the Mormon Bishop and two Mormon missionaries.

I was at a very vulnerable point in my life. I wanted to belong someplace. I was a single mom, with no family in my city.

I went to the Mormon church and finished all the lessons. There were things that concerned me about the church services. I rarely heard the name of Christ spoken. Almost without exception, testimonies began with a statement of belief that Joseph Smith was a prophet of God. I was told that there are three heavens. I was also told that God, in the flesh, impregnated Mary.
I did eventually decide to join the church. The day before my baptism, a family member called me and told me about the Mormon belief that God has a wife and lives on a star/planet (kolob,) and men can become gods. I was so shocked; because none of this was discussed in the lessons-except a passing mention of exaltation.
edit
When I asked her about the Mormon belief that Adam is god, she could not deny that edit
I found myself literally on the floor, with my face down, begging the forgiveness of Christ. I received His forgiveness. I felt like one of the lost sheep, carried upon the back of Christ, to safety. I was Baptized into the Christian Church again. I went back to the Baptist Church-the Church of my upbringing.

Even though I cut all ties with Mormonism, repented, and received forgiveness for my sins; I found there are spiritual consequences, set into motion by our sins, that can continue long after we are forgiven. A few months ago, I discovered that the Mormon Church may still perform proxy Temple rites, on my behalf, after I die.
edit
I returned to the Baptist Church, because it was familiar. I have since discovered too many false doctrines to continue there. My experience with Mormonism has made it almost impossible for me to trust enough to convert to another faith, such as Catholicism–even with all the respect I hold for the Catholic Church.

Even though I left the Mormon church many years ago, I am still dealing with the “spiritual consequences” of my sin. I would say converting to a religion outside Christianity is dangerous any way you look at it.
Anna

Hi Anna,

If I were meeting with you at a church picnic and you brought these concerns to me. I would pick up a stone, say to you “do you see this”? Then I would throw the stone. What would come to your mind immediately?

You see all those people over there eating at the picnic, they do not know your history, God does, you do, and I do, but we are all sinners. Each of those people have a story and each is ashamed of the things they have done, this is why they are called sinners and this is why we are called Christian because we have been washed of our sins, all of our sins, by the God who is so personal, He took it ALL upon Himself to reconcile us to Himself so the penalty of sin could be removed. Isn’t He just wonderful?

Blessings to you and find that church that Christ is building; pray often and you will find it. Read 1 Timothy 3 and Titus 1 in detail. Know what “above reproach” and the rest means" and know 1 Tim 5 and see how serious God takes the work of His ministers, then after you have really looked at the qualifications and really see how God views those that are called to preach and to teach, then you will be able to discern who is building whatever church you would go to. It took me a few years to learn this, but I can go into a church now and within 2-3 visits discern if it is the genuine article or it is being built by works of men. Is it about Jesus and are the ministries concerning the building and edification of people and is there a push to get the word out, feed the poor, cloth the naked. Are they stewards of the resources given. Is it lip service or are they living it out? That is key and God can and will give His children that ability to discern from His unlimited wisdom.

James 1:5 “But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all generously and without reproach, and it will be given to him.” God is faithful to His promise and I’ll pray for this in every aspect of my life and He will deliver as promised.

You did not seem to notice this, but I did. You already were discerning truth from error, but you were suppressing the Holy Spirit’s work because of your emotional condition perhaps.** I will be praying right now just for you for that wisdom of discernment and the strength to follow His lead. **amen

 

[uglygal]

Hello Javl

Let me firstly say that I am not catholic or christian. I believe your question has been answered quiet well by other posters here from the catholic perspective.

From my experience I have found that a faith or religion cannot save one if the “God” is not there or who they say they are. It is not religion that imparts salvation rather God is salvation. Only God. No-one and nothing else.
I learned this the hard way and wasted many, many years of my life and youth on a god that wasn’t there.

I do not believe salvation is lost by converting religions. Religions are man-made and often abusive (my experience entirely).
But salvation is lost if you convert away from God the blessed and eternal Father.

That is my understanding. May the Father’s peace be with you

 

[MacDaddy]

Hello Javl

Let me firstly say that I am not catholic or christian. I believe your question has been answered quiet well by other posters here from the catholic perspective.

From my experience I have found that a faith or religion cannot save one if the “God” is not there or who they say they are. It is not religion that imparts salvation rather God is salvation. Only God. No-one and nothing else.
I learned this the hard way and wasted many, many years of my life and youth on a god that wasn’t there.

I do not believe salvation is lost by converting religions. Religions are man-made and often abusive (my experience entirely).
But salvation is lost if you convert away from God the blessed and eternal Father.

That is my understanding. May the Father’s peace be with you

Is it safe to say that you do not believe the Bible is the written Word of God? Who is Jesus?

 

[Javl]

Hello Javl

Let me firstly say that I am not catholic or christian. I believe your question has been answered quiet well by other posters here from the catholic perspective.

From my experience I have found that a faith or religion cannot save one if the “God” is not there or who they say they are. It is not religion that imparts salvation rather God is salvation. Only God. No-one and nothing else.
I learned this the hard way and wasted many, many years of my life and youth on a god that wasn’t there.

I do not believe salvation is lost by converting religions. Religions are man-made and often abusive (my experience entirely).
But salvation is lost if you convert away from God the blessed and eternal Father.

That is my understanding. May the Father’s peace be with you

Ok on your post. I never mentioned religion in this thread. Religion is man made. I mentioned Faith. Faith is given to us by God’s Grace. We can either accept it, or reject it. There are many who do accept it and then, for some reason or another, they seem dissatisfied with what they have and try something else. Since Christians become such by God’s ( Jesus ) calling, they are by leaving Christianity in effect rejecting that calling. In doing so they are jeapardizing their salvation. It could be that in accepting the calling in the first place that 1) they did not understand it fully, 2) they accepted it under their own terms, 3) they really did not truly believe in it.

As you say, changing one’s religion has nothing to do with salvation. Changing one’s religion is like my leaving Catholicism for Eastern Orthodoxy, or Protestantism. My salvation is still assured since my faith is still the same, I still belive in Jesus and His teachings and promises.

It is if I leave Christianity and reject Jesus, and His teachings and promises for something that sounds better ( such as Buddahism, Ba’hai, Hinduism, etc. ) and much more to my liking, etc., that I am sure is that I am jeapardizing my salvation.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Sagefrakrobatik]

Ok on your post. I never mentioned religion in this thread. Religion is man made. I mentioned Faith. Faith is given to us by God’s Grace. We can either accept it, or reject it. There are many who do accept it and then, for some reason or another, they seem dissatisfied with what they have and try something else. Since Christians become such by God’s ( Jesus ) calling, they are by leaving Christianity in effect rejecting that calling. In doing so they are jeapardizing their salvation. It could be that in accepting the calling in the first place that 1) they did not understand it fully, 2) they accepted it under their own terms, 3) they really did not truly believe in it.

As you say, changing one’s religion has nothing to do with salvation. Changing one’s religion is like my leaving Catholicism for Eastern Orthodoxy, or Protestantism. My salvation is still assured since my faith is still the same, I still belive in Jesus and His teachings and promises.

It is if I leave Christianity and reject Jesus, and His teachings and promises for something that sounds better ( such as Buddahism, Ba’hai, Hinduism, etc. ) and much more to my liking, etc., that I am sure is that I am jeapardizing my salvation.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

Not to poke holes in your their put a Muslim could just as easily replace the name of Jesus with Allah likewise a Hindu can replace Jesus with Krishna and you would still get the same arguments. In fact there are major supposedly “spiritual” consequences for apostasy in Islam as I am sure many of you are aware of.

 

[Anna_Scott]

Hi Anna,

If I were meeting with you at a church picnic and you brought these concerns to me. I would pick up a stone, say to you “do you see this”? Then I would throw the stone. What would come to your mind immediately?

You see all those people over there eating at the picnic, they do not know your history, God does, you do, and I do, but we are all sinners. Each of those people have a story and each is ashamed of the things they have done, this is why they are called sinners and this is why we are called Christian because we have been washed of our sins, all of our sins, by the God who is so personal, He took it ALL upon Himself to reconcile us to Himself so the penalty of sin could be removed. Isn’t He just wonderful?

Blessings to you and find that church that Christ is building; pray often and you will find it. Read 1 Timothy 3 and Titus 1 in detail. Know what “above reproach” and the rest means" and know 1 Tim 5 and see how serious God takes the work of His ministers, then after you have really looked at the qualifications and really see how God views those that are called to preach and to teach, then you will be able to discern who is building whatever church you would go to. It took me a few years to learn this, but I can go into a church now and within 2-3 visits discern if it is the genuine article or it is being built by works of men. Is it about Jesus and are the ministries concerning the building and edification of people and is there a push to get the word out, feed the poor, cloth the naked. Are they stewards of the resources given. Is it lip service or are they living it out? That is key and God can and will give His children that ability to discern from His unlimited wisdom.

James 1:5 “But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all generously and without reproach, and it will be given to him.” God is faithful to His promise and I’ll pray for this in every aspect of my life and He will deliver as promised.

You did not seem to notice this, but I did. You already were discerning truth from error, but you were suppressing the Holy Spirit’s work because of your emotional condition perhaps.** I will be praying right now just for you for that wisdom of discernment and the strength to follow His lead. **amen

What a kind response. May I ask, are you still Catholic?

Anna

 

[Javl]

Not to poke holes in your their put a Muslim could just as easily replace the name of Jesus with Allah likewise a Hindu can replace Jesus with Krishna and you would still get the same arguments. In fact there are major supposedly “spiritual” consequences for apostasy in Islam as I am sure many of you are aware of.

Yes, I know and understand that, but I am speaking strictly about Christianity and Jesus. All Christians believe Jesus’ words that He is the life and no one goes to the Father except though Him ( Jesus ). Without Jesus there is no salvation. He said so, and we believe Him.

I am now asking all Christians for their thoughts, opinion, etc., as to what happens to those that had accepted Jesus as the life but now no longer do.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Teneas]

Yes, I know and understand that, but I am speaking strictly about Christianity and Jesus. All Christians believe Jesus’ words that He is the life and no one goes to the Father except though Him ( Jesus ). Without Jesus there is no salvation. He said so, and we believe Him.

I am now asking all Christians for their thoughts, opinion, etc., as to what happens to those that had accepted Jesus as the life but now no longer do.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

They are in serious danger of falling from grace, if they haven’t already. If they truly accepted Christ, and willingly walked away, they have fallen from grace. The problem with any of this at all, is that it is faith that we rely upon, not solid, no doubt about it, fact.

Who are any of us, Catholic Church included, to say that someone is going to hell? No one is besides Christ. That being said, I think we can all safely assume that Hitler has his own room.

 

[uglygal]

I am now asking all Christians for their thoughts, opinion, etc., as to what happens to those that had accepted Jesus as the life but now no longer do.

I am no longer catholic / christian and this is what I was told - I / we are going to hell.
But I will step out of this thread, interesting as it may be, since you are after Christian responses (ex-Christians excluded I assume??) and I am not one of them.

 

[Javl]

I am no longer catholic / christian and this is what I was told - I / we are going to hell.
But I will step out of this thread, interesting as it may be, since you are after Christian responses (ex-Christians excluded I assume??) and I am not one of them.

I’m asking the question of anyone who is willing to give an answer. Even though you may consider yourself no longer Christian, you may not have rejected Christ deep down and still believe.

It must have been a serious tragedy in your life for you to give up. My sympathy lies with you. If you wish to talk about it, please PM me, you have a willing listener to help in any way I can.

God Bless.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Bill_Pick]

When a Christian converts to another faith, such a Islam, Judaism, etc., in effect he/she is rejecting Christ. In your opinion, is salvation still possible for that person, or has that person condemned him/her self to hell, or…?

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

sALVATIUON is open to all people Reliegion does not sent a person to hell or heaven only the person can do that.

 

[Javl]

uglygal:

I meant to add that no one has the right to say that you are going to hell. You can go only by your own wish or desire. God alone is the one who determines where you will spend eternity.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[RomanCath379]

Not to poke holes in your their put a Muslim could just as easily replace the name of Jesus with Allah likewise a Hindu can replace Jesus with Krishna and you would still get the same arguments. In fact there are major supposedly “spiritual” consequences for apostasy in Islam as I am sure many of you are aware of.

But Allah didn’t die for our sins,
Kirshna or Buddha didn’t die for our sins,
Only Jesus Christ died for our sins.

 

[MacDaddy]

What a kind response. May I ask, are you still Catholic?

Anna

Hi Anna,

I apologize to you for the late response; I have been working on catching up on Catholic doctrine, catechism, dogma, bull etc and have too many threads at one time, rookie error I’m sure.

I was baptized as an infant and my mother grew up in the Catholic church as well as her mother, but at the age of 4-5 we moved and my mother, mostly because of my dad, was separated from the Catholic church, so I was only part of that for 4-5 years. I do not consider myself as Catholic nor Protestant, but Christian as I was purchased by Jesus on the cross and I accepted His free Gift by realizing there was nothing in me I could possible offer to God that would merit any kind of His forgiveness. I believed I was a “good” person, and compared to other people, I probably was. I always believed in God and even Jesus as God and even the holy Spirit. I always thought I would be in heaven on my terms because I was a good person and recognized God. Wow, big deal this won’t save you. Once my wife and I had children I began to realize that we needed to start going to church and a neighbor invited us to a church and we went for a while, but the travel was to far. But I began to read and read the Scripture, my mother had given me a study Bible ten years earlier, and it was never touched, same with my wife. I began to understand that I was not right with God and my soul, my wife’s soul were in jeopardy.

Then I came across some solid evangelical preachers over the TV and the internet and really realized I was a sinner who has trampled over the cross with my sin and I began to ball like a big baby and told the Lord that I now know there is nothing in me that is worthy of your love or holiness and cried out for forgiveness. The Lord hearing my cries and my recognition in sincerity began to change my life forever. My wife had the same type of experience and together we have been walking together in His love. Our children are still young and I thank God that we, as parents, have the opportunity to teach our children and have the opportunity to give them back to the Lord as He graciously gave them to us.

What is interesting is this is exactly what is happening between God the Father and Jesus the Son. The Father has given the Son a bunch of humanity for Himself and when it is all completed and all the redeemed will then be presented to the Father as a gift of Love back to the Father.

The family when it is working as best as humanly possible is a picture of love that is a shadow of the love shared within the Trinity and we are His children and will be praising and thanking Him for eternity for our adoptions into His household because we are joint heirs with Christ Jesus and we will all be one as Jesus is one with the Father and the Spirit, we to shall be part of that Holy communion. Just a beautiful display of the love God has toward His children and it is nothing we have done to deserve it, we just have to let go of self and accept the Gift in humility.

I’m done rambling. God bless

 

[MacDaddy]

Hello Javl

Let me firstly say that I am not catholic or christian. I believe your question has been answered quiet well by other posters here from the catholic perspective.

From my experience I have found that a faith or religion cannot save one if the “God” is not there or who they say they are. It is not religion that imparts salvation rather God is salvation. Only God. No-one and nothing else.
I learned this the hard way and wasted many, many years of my life and youth on a god that wasn’t there.

I do not believe salvation is lost by converting religions. Religions are man-made and often abusive (my experience entirely).
But salvation is lost if you convert away from God the blessed and eternal Father.

That is my understanding. May the Father’s peace be with you

Hi,

First, you title you gave yourself breaks my heart. No true Christian and there are few compared to the ones that claim to be; most are deceived by religion or self or some other reason, would consider anyone as ugly on the outside or inside, for we are all sinners. When we seek human “acceptance” and human “worth” through human “relations”; we are disappointed and often hurt every time it seems; we must first seek the wisdom and understanding and grace and knowledge of God before anything in this life has purpose.

Jesus is not a religion, but rather a person who cared enough about you and I to come to earth and take the human nature and set aside the glory He shared with the Father, so we could see God, but also that we can know that God knows all of our sufferings and He is compassionate.

It sounds like you have suffered a great deal at the hands of “so called” Christians who were actually anything but Christian. So do not get confused and separate Christian from God or Jesus. Jesus has a group on earth at all times that are His children and then there are many who call themselves Christian and are not. I know many true Christians and their is a love and a bond that can only be described as supernatural. I can meet a person i have never known in my entire life and when we see to common thread of love for Jesus, it is as if we have always known each other and I do injustice in presenting this, but it is true. The same is true when I meet a Christian by name only; I feel like I don’t know them and pray god will remove the veil of blindness and self deceit, which the Bibles says only Christ can do.

If you take anything away from this, just remember that Jesus desires all to come to Him, He is personal, caring , loving, but He is also just and He sets the standard of perfect holiness. If you want a transformed life and have the ability to look forward and not look back on the past, in fact all Christians look at their past life as a nightmare because compared to new life in Jesus, it was a nightmare, but no longer. We make mistakes and have things done to us that can be unspeakable, but the new life in Jesus puts that behind forevermore and we look forward to the day we shed this sin nature and will be one with the Father, the Son and the holy Spirit and look forward to our home where there is no sin, which means no abuse, no sickness, no pain, no tears, but all joy.

God bless you child and ask anything of me and it is yours if I have it to give and I have prayed for you this day.

MacD

 

[Sagefrakrobatik]

uglygal:

You can go only by your own wish or desire.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

Um Who “desires” to spend eternity suffering?

 

[Javl]

Um Who “desires” to spend eternity suffering?

Believe it or not, some do. They reject God and worship Satan, thinking that he can give them all they desire. There are a lot of Satanists in today’s society, especially among the young.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem