Copyright issue - buying secondhand

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I bought a pre-owned foreign language curriculum for my son (we homeschool), and the seller had either lost one of the audio discs or forgot to include it in the box. The cd’s are only sold as a set. This is an older edition that was used widely in universities in the early 2000’s. I found the recordings of the missing disc had been uploaded as streaming wav files on an old Penn state website, and I am tempted to use them.

I obtained all the books and materials I need besides the one disc without paying a dime to the copyright holder. If I buy another set of the cd’s to physically be owning the one I am missing, they will also be bought secondhand (much cheaper), so the end result is still that the original company gets nothing. The person who sold me this curriculum paid the company its asking price, obtained a full set of cd’s and has transferred ownership to me. Can someone explain why it is ethically necessary for me to buy the missing disc?
 
I don’t know, but I needed to have a book that was out of print, and a university library had a copy of the book. I wanted to make a Xerox copy of the book, so I wrote to the copyright holder, the publisher, and asked for permission to make a copy. He wrote back and said I could make one copy only but requested a fee of $3.00. I thought that was pretty reasonable, so I made the one copy of the book and sent in the check for $3.00. Perhaps you might be able to make similar arrangements with the publisher.
 
Typically when it comes to recordings, you are buying a licence to use it, not the material. So when you sell it, you are transferring the licence to use it.

I can’t imagine a university would upload anything that isn’t kosher to download and use.
 
@rhubarb I agree. If the file is on the university’s .edu site it should be legitimate.
 
AlNg said:
I don’t know, but I needed to have a book that was out of print, and a university library had a copy of the book. I wanted to make a Xerox copy of the book, so I wrote to the copyright holder, the publisher, and asked for permission to make a copy. He wrote back and said I could make one copy only but requested a fee of $3.00. I thought that was pretty reasonable, so I made the one copy of the book and sent in the check for $3.00. Perhaps you might be able to make similar arrangements with the publisher.
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That’s pretty cool.
 
Melancholic said:
Can someone explain why it is ethically necessary for me to buy the missing disc?
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Can you explain why you think it is in the first place? You’ve phrased this question as if the only answer is “it is necessary” when in fact I don’t believe it is.
 
The original owner paid the copyright fee. Since they have transferred ownership to you, they are no long able to use the materials and you are now legally entitled to use them.

As far as the audio file in the Penn State website…unless you have somehow hacked into their computer system, or obtained access illegally (using a student’s login when you are not a student, for example), there should be no legal or ethical problem with using it. If PSU put it up on their public website, that’s a good sign that they have done so legally and it’s available for the public to use.
 
This is one of those areas where buyer protections and fair use have been eroded by the gigantic publishing industries. In my opinion, which is not a legal opinion but I do watch a lot of courtroom dramas, they shouldn’t be able to have it both ways. They claim they’re selling you a license, which means you have a license. Replacing a disc which is missing, damaged, etc. shouldn’t be any of their business, they got paid for the material.

Publishers will push things as far as they can. On more than one occasion used book stores have been pressured to pay fees for selling used books. Courts have, for the moment, told them to go away.
 
Melancholic said:
Can someone explain why it is ethically necessary for me to buy the missing disc?
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I don’t think it is. If you bought the set you’ve bought the set. If one element is missing then you should be able to replace it however you want.
 
Books are covered by the first sale doctrine. In the US there is no problem with buying them, giving them away, reselling them, etc. That changes when there are licenses involved as with software. Then it’s governed by contract law rather than copyright law.
 
Copyright simply means right to copy and right to distribute. As soon as a book or disc is sold on a web site or through another seller, unless physically stolen, that one-time sale is all the publisher gets. In the case of software, it depends. Some software can be used as is, but some software has to be registered to the new owner. There are usually instructions included regarding this. If I resold such a set, I would not want to confuse the buyer regarding which is the case.

I own a lot of second-hand books, and I know there are discounters out there that sell new and used school books and any related software. You should contact the publisher or the seller about the missing disc. After all, if you paid for a set, you should get everything. I mention contacting the publisher only in the case of the seller being unable to provide the missing software. It’s the seller’s responsibility to provide a complete set. I mean, why guess when you can find out?
 
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I go to used bookstores. I’m not sure what fees you are referring to but income is income. The used bookstore is a business like any other store. Unless they own the building, they also pay rent or a lease. Libraries are there for fair use and free reading. I can walk into a University library and read whatever is there.

Regarding a disc, it’s like replacing a device part. I have to buy another one if it gets damaged or if it’s missing and I notice it’s not there after buying it from a reseller. A damaged part is like getting a defective part. Was it the manufacturer or the reseller or former owner who damaged it? Or was it never put in in the first place? Sometimes, you can tell but sometimes not.
 
I meant historically. The "First Sale doctrine came about because a publisher attempted to ban the reselling of its books because they argued it took away potential sales if the used books weren’t available.
 
News to me. I work in the publishing industry and never heard of this. Did they try to limit used book sales at garage sales? 🙂
 
frarmandofm said:
As far as the audio file in the Penn State website…unless you have somehow hacked into their computer system, or obtained access illegally (using a student’s login when you are not a student, for example), there should be no legal or ethical problem with using it. If PSU put it up on their public website, that’s a good sign that they have done so legally and it’s available for the public to use.
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That’s a little complicated. Here is the link to the webpage I found. It says:
Audio Site
Audio recording of [curriculum] (textbook & workbook) is accessible at [link] in real audio format; user name: [given]; password: [given]. (User name and password are case sensitive.) Listening to the audio recording is required for this class.
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So the recordings are sort of public, in that the username and password to access them are given on a public page.

Previously, I did find another university website with the 3rd edition recordings, and these are definitely public (I have the older 2nd edition books, so these are not what I need). These pages were not hard to find through Google, and I want to believe that the publisher would have requested them all taken down years ago if they were strongly protective (like Disney for example). The recordings that I want to access were uploaded in 2011.

I have a history of blatantly stealing a large amount of copyrighted content before it became clear that it was wrong (think the old days of Napster). I feel that I am scrupulous in this area. That’s why I came to the forum for help.

I will try to contact the seller to see if she still has the last disc.
 
The universities pay fees to the publishers that allow them to make material accessible to their users.
Another example: public libraries subscribe to services that make magazines available online. If your library gets Consumer Reports, you could read/use all the information in CR without ever paying for it
 
My state library system pays for the overdrive system. You’re library card (free) gets you free access to ebooks on you’re personal device.
 
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