Copyright

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My instincts tell me that the role of copyright law in Church literature and music is at best unproductive and at worst incompatible with Christian values. One cannot freely make an app, for example, that shares most translations of Catholic scripture or hymns because organizations which are largely otherwise unaffiliated with the church demand contracts or payments first. Shouldn’t we be making it easy to spread the word? The Church defends their use of copyright policy by saying it helps ensure things are copied without mistakes when a digital/paper publication stating the official version accomplishes that.
 
777777777777777 said:
My instincts tell me that the role of copyright law in Church literature and music is at best unproductive and at worst incompatible with Christian values. One cannot freely make an app, for example, that shares most translations of Catholic scripture or hymns because organizations which are largely otherwise unaffiliated with the church demand contracts or payments first. Shouldn’t we be making it easy to spread the word? The Church defends their use of copyright policy by saying it helps ensure things are copied without mistakes when a digital/paper publication stating the official version accomplishes that.
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Copyright law exists to protect the property of the person who owns the material, whoever that may be. Hymns (for example) are the property of the composer, not the church, which is why hymnals eventually go out of print – because the copyright to the individual hymns in them has expired. Scriptures (IOW the Bible) are freely available online.
I’m not sure what your issue is. Are you trying to create an app?
 
I’m talking about hymns that are commonly sung even in Mass. If those works have copyrights we shouldn’t be using them, or better, the authors should abandon claim to them. Hymns that are common in the church should belong to the faithful that sing them. When I say hymns I mean even the translations of Psalms that we use in the Liturgy of the Hours. That’s right – if you want to make an app that stores the LOTH you can’t because pieces of it are owned by different parties who want contracts and checks.

Most useful Catholic translations of the Bible (including all the ones used at Mass) have copyright protections. The only public domain English catholic Bible I can think of is Douay Rheims.

My issue is that these texts at the core of our religion – the scripture we use at Mass, the LOTH, and not as importantly but also our hymns – should be free. Free to share, own, and spread. Not burdened by contracts and restrictions because people want money. If I want to store those texts on my computer, on my phone, or send them to Mars, I should be able to easily and with minimum obstacles.
 
Concerning the Bible and LOTH – God’s word used in Mass and our prayers shouldn’t be “someone else’s property” under any circumstances. It’s not stealing to ask people to donate a translation, a lot more than that gets donated to the church every year.

If you’re creating hymns to make money we don’t need them.
 
The Bible and LOTH are NOT freely available anywhere. Any catholic English Bible that’s not Douay Rheims (including versions used at Mass) are under copyright and are only usable with permission and in some cases payments. LOTH is not in the public domain either – it contains translations of Psalm hymns, to say nothing of the other scripture, that is licensed by some random organization that has to give you permission to use it or store it somewhere.

And if you are a talented composer no I don’t think you should be making a living off the Church. Make a living some other way, if you want to live off of the church’s collection baskets become a priest. There is a tremendous lack of funding for many parishes basic needs like lights and heat, paying for music should not be a priority. Out of the 1.2 billion Roman Catholics in the world there are enough among them that can donate good hymns. This idea that there aren’t is silly given the numbers.
 
They are free for somebody to read but they are still under copyright. There are different definitions of free. Free as in gratis and free as in beer. LOTH is free as in beer. You don’t have to pay somebody to read it. But you can’t make a printout of it and give it away. That is illegal.

Here is the copyright notice located under a page of the LOTH on divineoffice.org/
The English translation of The Liturgy of the Hours (Four Volumes) ©1974, International Commission on English in the Liturgy Corporation. All rights reserved. Used with permission by Surgeworks, Inc for the Divine Office Catholic Ministry. DivineOffice.org website, podcast, apps and all related media is © 2006-2011 Surgeworks, Inc. All rights reserved.
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So, in a way, you’re right. They are free. I can read the LOTH without paying for it. But in another way the other poster was correct, they are not in the public domain. They do not use a license that enables people to freely distribute it, the LOTH is under copyright and it is illegal to reproduce it.
 
Read your own links – they are not “free”. The USCCB doesn’t charge you money to read NABRE online, but it is provided there under copyright, and has tons of restrictions on it:
usccb.org/bible/permissions/

The LOTH in the link you posted is also under copyright and not freely distributable or reproducible. Once again the USCCB restricts its scriptures and the organization that licenses the Psalms in it is here:
giamusic.com/sacred_music/RGP/GrailLicense.cfm
If that were true, none of the hymns in our hymnals would have copyright protection on them, yet they virtually all do, so that the composers can be justly compensated. They haven’t been donated. Again, the facts belie your faulty opinions. If your view were accepted, parish adminstrators, jail ministry organizers, diocesan staff, organists, Directors of religious education, in fact no one employed in ministry but priests, would ever be permitted to be compensated. I find your view both naive and offensive. Moreover, it is contrary to church teaching. People are entitled to just compensation for their labors.
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If you know anything about the music publishing industry you’d know that first of all this has little to do with compensating composers. Mostly it is a huge business that pays itself, not unlike how companies in the record and movie industry work. We don’t have public domain hymns because the Church has decided copyright is great (it even copyrights the Bible) and not made this a priority. The analogy to parish-level staff being paid is false for two major reasons

#1 Those people are not huge companies with websites with “Careers” sections – the music publishers are. What’s offensive is these big companies making tons of money off of people’s faith. The idea that there are a bunch of starving composers out there who desperately need the church’s money to feed their families is a fantasy that you constructed for the purpose of your argument.

#2 None of your examples include the production of intellectual property. With IP, there is only the cost to produce it once, after which it can be used millions (infinite) of times. Not so with other staff who incur an expense constantly.
 
Sorry, but people have a right to benefit from their labor.

We don’t expect the janitor or bookkeeper to volunteer their time even if it’s at church. Why is a composer in a different category? The translator or composer also provides services and also deserves to be compensated.
 
The Church exists to spread God’s word, not create jobs. Unlike corporations it does not exist for the purpose of creating money. There is no reason to pay for music when there are Catholic musicians around the world who would gladly donate music.

And someone who creates intellectual property is in a different category because the product of their one-time labor can create infinite value as it is used by millions of people for decades.

Much more troublesome than the hymns, is the copyright of the Bible and LOTH. The purpose of the church is to SPREAD the Word not restrict it with policies. And if you want to spread the LOTH you have to get unilateral arbitrary permission from an organization that has no official affiliation with the Church. That is indefensible.
 
777777777777777 said:
The Church exists to spread God’s word, not create jobs. Unlike corporations it does not exist for the purpose of creating money. There is no reason to pay for music when there are Catholic musicians around the world who would gladly donate music.
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And there’s nothing stopping them from doing exactly that.

If I write a song and want to place it in the public domain I have every right to do that. If it becomes popular for use in church then that’s great. But if I support myself through my music, then I also have the right to do that.

Once upon a time, the church itself employed musicians and artists. Today we don’t have patrons who can support artists and musicians so they earn their living in a different way. And the rest of us benefit from their talent and hard work.
 
My grandfather, father, and uncle owned a small plumbing company. They donated their time and service as plumbers to our church, rectory, convent, and school.

Now, having said that, there would have been nothing wrong with them charging for services rendered.

We do not know what other spiritual and corporal acts of mercy composers are performing. For all we know, a composer could be donating all his net profits to his local Pregnancy Counseling Center.

It is not our place to judge the motives of others. That is God’s job, not ours.
 
Fifteen 7’s, you might be interested in this website:

Free the Word

I think that – at the core – you share similar concerns as Brandon Vogt. But I think you would be better off following his approach. Telling those who want to write music for the Church that they should either donate their talents, become a priest, or get lost is not going to win anyone over to your position.

I think there are valid points on your side (as Vogt articulates pretty well). But you need to also be willing to see the valid points against your position. Anyone with an internet connection can access the NABRE or the Liturgy of the Hours (or the Catechism or pretty much every major ecclesial document from the past 100 years). But, yes, it must be accessed following the terms of those who hold the copyright (which generally means you go to their sites to view those things).

Honestly, we are spoiled with the amount of access we have to these materials. Imagine living centuries ago where you would have to travel to a Church to read a copy of the Bible (not that it would matter as you probably couldn’t read it anyway). Now, we can access these materials from anywhere in the world at any time of day or night via the internet browser of a smart phone, and yet it is still not “free” enough. 🤷
 
Luke 10:7 “the labourer is worthy of his hire.” Jesus’ instructions to his disciples. He didn’t expect them to do the work of evangelizing for free.
 
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