Cosmetic surgery and vanity

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divinefaith

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I have read some threads here on CAF where some posters link cosmetic surgery to the sin of vanity.
I dont see why this would be. Wouldnt vanity arise when we use our looks in a prideful way? My religion teacher once said that cosmetic surgery is not wrong since its aim is to fix a flaw we might have. I agree with this view because I dont see how trying to look a little more appealing makes us far from humility.
Any thoughts on this?
 
divinefaith said:
I have read some threads here on CAF where some posters link cosmetic surgery to the sin of vanity.
I dont see why this would be. Wouldnt vanity arise when we use our looks in a prideful way? My religion teacher once said that cosmetic surgery is not wrong since its aim is to fix a flaw we might have. I agree with this view because I dont see how trying to look a little more appealing makes us far from humility.
Any thoughts on this?
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I am an amateur photographer. Thumb Rule (is it what you say in English?): 80% of the persons do not like their bodies.
I remember seeing an article about German SuperModel Claudia Schiffer saying that she did not like her body as young for she was too tall. Then, she started liking it. Why? Because her body got her $$$$$ and €€€€€ and £££££. That’s only she needed to change her mind. She did not need plastic surgery.
Joking … but looks do not depend on the eyes that are looking at the looks ?
No mother finds her sons and daughters ugly !!!
 
We all have a flaw somewhere. Doesn’t mean we hate ourselves if we went for an alteration.
 
Reconstructive surgery is almost always okay. An example would be tattoo removal.

Cosmetic surgery is a bit more tricky, however who are we to judge? The patient’s intentions may be not for vain reasons at all. An example may be someone who wants a chin tuck after loosing a lot of weight.
 
divinefaith said:
I have read some threads here on CAF where some posters link cosmetic surgery to the sin of vanity.
I dont see why this would be. Wouldnt vanity arise when we use our looks in a prideful way? My religion teacher once said that cosmetic surgery is not wrong since its aim is to fix a flaw we might have. I agree with this view because I dont see how trying to look a little more appealing makes us far from humility.
Any thoughts on this?
Click to expand...
The way I see it, one has cosmetic surgery to fix real physical issues OR to try to get closer to physical perfection. If one has surgery to fix a real issue, I see no problem.

When I say a real issue, I’m thinking of cleft lip and/or palate, breast reduction, etc. With a cleft lip and palate, a child may face eating, hearing, speech and dental problems, etc. without corrective surgery.

If a woman has breasts that are too large in proportion to her body frame, she may elect to have breast reduction surgery since she may have back, neck or shoulder pain caused by the weight of her breasts, she may have skin irritation and shoulder indentations due to excess tissue and weight, she may have restrictions in physical activity due to the size and weight of her breasts, etc.

Some people have cosmetic surgery after accidents. They just want to try to go back to the same physical place they were before.

The above are valid reasons to seek cosmetic surgery in my opinion. The individuals are just trying to live life like everyone else and not stand out. If one has surgery to try to get closer to physical perfection (whatever that is) or to try to stand out, then I think vanity is the reason for the surgery. I do not think that vanity alone is valid reason for such surgery.
 
Maybe I can sum up with just a few words:

If one has cosmetic surgery to NOT stand out, it is not vanity and not a sin.
If one has cosmetic surgery so that they DO stand out, it is vanity and a sin.

Make sense?
 
SwizzleStick said:
Maybe I can sum up with just a few words:

If one has cosmetic surgery to NOT stand out, it is not vanity and not a sin.
If one has cosmetic surgery so that they DO stand out, it is vanity and a sin.

Make sense?
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Are you sure it is a sin to try to stand out? What about baseball players that try to hit more home runs than anyone else? They are trying to stand out in a different way, but I doubt if you would call that a sin. I’m not suggesting that all cosmetic surgery is fine, but I think you need come up with a more nuanced criterion for what is acceptable.
 
LeafByNiggle said:
Are you sure it is a sin to try to stand out? What about baseball players that try to hit more home runs than anyone else? They are trying to stand out in a different way, but I doubt if you would call that a sin. I’m not suggesting that all cosmetic surgery is fine, but I think you need come up with a more nuanced criterion for what is acceptable.
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No, I am not sure. But, it seems that pride and humility factor in there, yes? Too much pride or being proud about the wrong things can be sinful.

If one works hard to develop skill and strength and athleticism to accomplish a goal (or surpass another’s goal) and one attains that goal, one can be proud of that accomplishment, as long as that pride isn’t excessive, I suppose. It just seems to be something else entirely to undergo major surgery because one wants to become more attractive, desirable or beautiful.
 
I honestly dont see the immorality in cosmetic surgery. IMO vanity is sinful when one believes they are more ‘special’ than others, or if they use their looks to make people who they think are less attractive feel down about themselves.
Cosmetic surgery doesnt aim to do that, it depends on the intention.
 
DaddyGirl said:
…When people on this site have commented on the “sin” of tattoos, they often quote this:

Leviticus 19:28
King James Version (KJV)
28Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD…
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Well, that’s the problem then and the reason for confusion. They have the wrong version of the Bible. Catholics don’t use the King James Version. 😃

Yes, that was an attempt at humor.
 
I had some plastic surgery last December to make myself more attractive to my husband. After having been overweight for many years and having lost weight through healthy diet and exercise, I had sagging skin that was ugly. I sought spiritual direction about this from my priest. He told me it is wrong to do things to mutilate the body. But he said there would be nothing wrong with making myself more attractive to my husband. I did not have any augmentation–only lifts and liposuction. Our priest had many times encouraged parishioners to avail ourselves to the sacrament of the anointing of the sick before surgeries. So I did and was blessed to receive that sacrament.

I had also been pre-diabetic several months earlier. Losing 20 pounds in addition to the surgery reversed my prediabetic condition. My endocrinologist said he has almost never seen such good numbers even among healthy people.

Very glad I did it, my husband is attracted to me again, and I still have peace about the decision.
 
DaddyGirl said:
Oh, really? Do Catholics really not use the King Jame’s version? (not sure if you are serious about that part, or if that’s the “humor” bit… 🙂

If not, then which one do catholics use?
And earlier, older version that is closer to what was originally written? That would make sense…
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Modern King James Versions of the Bible do not contain the deuterocanonical books, so they are Protestants Bibles.

It is a matter of personal taste, so it varies on which Catholic Bible individual Catholics read. One Catholic Bible is the Revised Standard Version - Catholic Edition (RSV-CE).
 
Saint_Macarius said:
I was one ugly baby. My mother reminds me of that every year.
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exceptions…
at least you WERE, but you are not … she reinforces that to remind you of your beauty now … with a sigh of relief least you be forever that baby ,
 
petra said:
I had some plastic surgery last December to make myself more attractive to my husband. After having been overweight for many years and having lost weight through healthy diet and exercise, I had sagging skin that was ugly. I sought spiritual direction about this from my priest. He told me it is wrong to do things to mutilate the body. But he said there would be nothing wrong with making myself more attractive to my husband. I did not have any augmentation–only lifts and liposuction.
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Your priest said cosmetic surgery would be usually sinful because it mutilates the body? Correct me if i’m wrong.
 
divinefaith said:
Your priest said cosmetic surgery would be usually sinful because it mutilates the body? Correct me if i’m wrong.
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No, he just said that mutilation, in general, was sinful. I didn’t ask him to elaborate on that because it was clear that he didn’t disapprove of my intention. But I assume that mutilation would include obsessive cutting, excessive piercings or tattoos that make someone look really odd and limit their employment opportunities, or any surgeries that make the body freakish. I’m quite sure that sex change operations for otherwise normally developed individuals fall in that category.

I really pondered my decision heavily. Some questions I asked myself were:

  1. *]Will the surgery financially encumber my family?
    *]Should the money be given to the poor instead?
    *]What are my motives for doing this?
    *]What are the specific health risks of the procedure, given my health background?
    *]What are the benefits to doing this?

    I had saved money from working overtime for several years and had the ability to pay cash and not encumber my family with any debt. Yes, I could have given the money to charity. However, being a former Protestant (Protestants seem to emphasize that more than Catholics), I take tithing seriously and am very generous with giving. Disposable income can be spent in a variety of ways and we are very frugal. Our only debt is a mortgage, 1 car, and a student loan. That’s it. We have no other consumer debt. I only have 1 purse, a few pairs of shoes, and if an article of clothing wears well, I’ll wear it for several seasons. My winter coat is 25 years old, but it still looks nice, so I keep using it. So is it worse if I save and spend $13K for an elective surgery than if another family goes into debt for new wardrobes every year, as well as a boat, RV, expensive vacations, etc? That is one perspective to keep in mind. Personal frugality and generosity toward others can only be assessed by looking at the big picture.

    I think anyone considering cosmetic surgery should be very honest about the potential impact of looking nicer. My motive truly was to be more attractive to my husband. I’m not interested in anyone else’s attention. That may partly be due to my age–I’m almost 50. But if someone feels that new attention from the opposite sex could jeopardize one’s commitment to their spouse, I’d strongly recommend against it.

    There was an additional motive. It is unfortunate, but in our society, menopausal women are not taken as seriously in the workplace. Aging men look distinguished, but aging women look tired. I think people unconsciously infer a woman’s mental and professional capabilities from her appearance. I had been feeling increasingly marginalized professionally, and I felt the surgery would help to mitigate that.

    Assessing health risks and benefits is also very important. Smoking greatly increases risks to surgery and a good aesthetic outcome to the surgery. I’m a nonsmoker and other than having been prediabetic several months earlier, I was otherwise healthy. Implants pose particular risks, and I was not having any implants, so that weighed in favor of my decision. I researched the reputation of the surgeon, as well.

    It is also important to have realistic expectations. The goal is improvement, not perfection. My outcome was not perfect. But it was very, very good, and I am very pleased with it. I feel so healthy. I’ve continued to lose more weight after the surgery, and I feel more energetic and healthy than I have in almost 20 years.

    It is a very personal decision to make in partnership with the Lord. Whether such a decision is sinful or permissible depends on many factors.
 
petra said:
No, he just said that mutilation, in general, was sinful. I didn’t ask him to elaborate on that because it was clear that he didn’t disapprove of my intention. But I assume that mutilation would include obsessive cutting, excessive piercings or tattoos that make someone look really odd and limit their employment opportunities, or any surgeries that make the body freakish. I’m quite sure that sex change operations for otherwise normally developed individuals fall in that category.

I really pondered my decision heavily. Some questions I asked myself were:

  1. *]Will the surgery financially encumber my family?
    *]Should the money be given to the poor instead?
    *]What are my motives for doing this?
    *]What are the specific health risks of the procedure, given my health background?
    *]What are the benefits to doing this?

    I had saved money from working overtime for several years and had the ability to pay cash and not encumber my family with any debt. Yes, I could have given the money to charity. However, being a former Protestant (Protestants seem to emphasize that more than Catholics), I take tithing seriously and am very generous with giving. Disposable income can be spent in a variety of ways and we are very frugal. Our only debt is a mortgage, 1 car, and a student loan. That’s it. We have no other consumer debt. I only have 1 purse, a few pairs of shoes, and if an article of clothing wears well, I’ll wear it for several seasons. My winter coat is 25 years old, but it still looks nice, so I keep using it. So is it worse if I save and spend $13K for an elective surgery than if another family goes into debt for new wardrobes every year, as well as a boat, RV, expensive vacations, etc? That is one perspective to keep in mind. Personal frugality and generosity toward others can only be assessed by looking at the big picture.

    I think anyone considering cosmetic surgery should be very honest about the potential impact of looking nicer. My motive truly was to be more attractive to my husband. I’m not interested in anyone else’s attention. That may partly be due to my age–I’m almost 50. But if someone feels that new attention from the opposite sex could jeopardize one’s commitment to their spouse, I’d strongly recommend against it.

    There was an additional motive. It is unfortunate, but in our society, menopausal women are not taken as seriously in the workplace. Aging men look distinguished, but aging women look tired. I think people unconsciously infer a woman’s mental and professional capabilities from her appearance. I had been feeling increasingly marginalized professionally, and I felt the surgery would help to mitigate that.

    Assessing health risks and benefits is also very important. Smoking greatly increases risks to surgery and a good aesthetic outcome to the surgery. I’m a nonsmoker and other than having been prediabetic several months earlier, I was otherwise healthy. Implants pose particular risks, and I was not having any implants, so that weighed in favor of my decision. I researched the reputation of the surgeon, as well.

    It is also important to have realistic expectations. The goal is improvement, not perfection. My outcome was not perfect. But it was very, very good, and I am very pleased with it. I feel so healthy. I’ve continued to lose more weight after the surgery, and I feel more energetic and healthy than I have in almost 20 years.

    It is a very personal decision to make in partnership with the Lord. Whether such a decision is sinful or permissible depends on many factors.
Click to expand...

  1. I think you based your decision on good considerations 🙂
    I would not think certain procedures are wrong. For example, a nose surgery would not mean you’re damaging yourself with mutiliation.
 
petra said:
No, he just said that mutilation, in general, was sinful. I didn’t ask him to elaborate on that because it was clear that he didn’t disapprove of my intention. But I assume that mutilation would include obsessive cutting, excessive piercings or tattoos that make someone look really odd and limit their employment opportunities, or any surgeries that make the body freakish. I’m quite sure that sex change operations for otherwise normally developed individuals fall in that category.

I really pondered my decision heavily. Some questions I asked myself were:

  1. *]Will the surgery financially encumber my family?
    *]Should the money be given to the poor instead?
    *]What are my motives for doing this?
    *]What are the specific health risks of the procedure, given my health background?
    *]What are the benefits to doing this?

    I had saved money from working overtime for several years and had the ability to pay cash and not encumber my family with any debt. Yes, I could have given the money to charity. However, being a former Protestant (Protestants seem to emphasize that more than Catholics), I take tithing seriously and am very generous with giving. Disposable income can be spent in a variety of ways and we are very frugal. Our only debt is a mortgage, 1 car, and a student loan. That’s it. We have no other consumer debt. I only have 1 purse, a few pairs of shoes, and if an article of clothing wears well, I’ll wear it for several seasons. My winter coat is 25 years old, but it still looks nice, so I keep using it. So is it worse if I save and spend $13K for an elective surgery than if another family goes into debt for new wardrobes every year, as well as a boat, RV, expensive vacations, etc? That is one perspective to keep in mind. Personal frugality and generosity toward others can only be assessed by looking at the big picture.

    I think anyone considering cosmetic surgery should be very honest about the potential impact of looking nicer. My motive truly was to be more attractive to my husband. I’m not interested in anyone else’s attention. That may partly be due to my age–I’m almost 50. But if someone feels that new attention from the opposite sex could jeopardize one’s commitment to their spouse, I’d strongly recommend against it.

    There was an additional motive. It is unfortunate, but in our society, menopausal women are not taken as seriously in the workplace. Aging men look distinguished, but aging women look tired. I think people unconsciously infer a woman’s mental and professional capabilities from her appearance. I had been feeling increasingly marginalized professionally, and I felt the surgery would help to mitigate that.

    Assessing health risks and benefits is also very important. Smoking greatly increases risks to surgery and a good aesthetic outcome to the surgery. I’m a nonsmoker and other than having been prediabetic several months earlier, I was otherwise healthy. Implants pose particular risks, and I was not having any implants, so that weighed in favor of my decision. I researched the reputation of the surgeon, as well.

    It is also important to have realistic expectations. The goal is improvement, not perfection. My outcome was not perfect. But it was very, very good, and I am very pleased with it. I feel so healthy. I’ve continued to lose more weight after the surgery, and I feel more energetic and healthy than I have in almost 20 years.

    It is a very personal decision to make in partnership with the Lord. Whether such a decision is sinful or permissible depends on many factors.
Click to expand...

  1. I think you based your decision on good considerations 🙂
    I would not think certain procedures are wrong. For example, a nose surgery doesn’t seem immoral to me.
 
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