Could all Christians in America work together to end abortion?

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It is often said that the Church is the most united during periods of persecution. Although Christianity itself (at least in the United States) is not under direct persecution, many of the moral principles we share are. The most egregious of these is the horror of abortion.

Abortion itself is an outright denial of the existence of a creator; it is demonstrative of a society which only values an individual in terms of their material worth or their ability to labor or reason. This is also manifested in our ever-more-lax policies with regard to euthanasia.

I know that the Roman church has pro-life organizations, as does the LCMS (Lutherans for Life), and other churches do as well. But is this counterproductive? Is it possible for us to put our doctrinal differences aside for the sake of the unborn? Could a united Christian force set this country straight? How?

Looking for thoughts and ideas, and wondering what you all think.
 
Nominefili said:
It is often said that the Church is the most united during periods of persecution. Although Christianity itself (at least in the United States) is not under direct persecution, many of the moral principles we share are. The most egregious of these is the horror of abortion.

Abortion itself is an outright denial of the existence of a creator; it is demonstrative of a society which only values an individual in terms of their material worth or their ability to labor or reason. This is also manifested in our ever-more-lax policies with regard to euthanasia.

I know that the Roman church has pro-life organizations, as does the LCMS (Lutherans for Life), and other churches do as well. But is this counterproductive? Is it possible for us to put our doctrinal differences aside for the sake of the unborn? Could a united Christian force set this country straight? How?

Looking for thoughts and ideas, and wondering what you all think.
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Well, if everybody who even names the name of Jesus Christ just voted to end abortion, this brutal practice would be history in four years.

The problem is Christians who vote pro-abor … choice.
 
NotTooSmart said:
Well, if everybody who even names the name of Jesus Christ just voted to end abortion, this brutal practice would be history in four years.
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I wasn’t aware there had ever been a national vote on abortion. I thought it was a supreme court decision.
 
If by “Christians” we mean those who claim to know a guy named Jesus, then the main issue would be those who are starting to believe God is OK with abortion, or (like Nancy Pelosi) think their Church is OK with abortion.

If by “Christians” we mean those who know who that guy named Jesus is, worship Him sincerely, and honor His commands…there wouldn’t be enough to do anything.
 
Nominefili said:
I wasn’t aware there had ever been a national vote on abortion. I thought it was a supreme court decision.
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You can override supreme court decisions by either
(1) A constitutional amendment
(2) A future court reversing the supreme court decision

Come to think of it, within 4 years is probably overly ambitious. But it would happen eventually…if Christians just got united to vote moral principles instead of their pocketbooks.
 
NotTooSmart said:
You can override supreme court decisions by either
(1) A constitutional amendment
(2) A future court reversing the supreme court decision

Come to think of it, within 4 years is probably overly ambitious. But it would happen eventually…if Christians just got united to vote moral principles instead of their pocketbooks.
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Amen!
 
Byzantine_Wolf said:
If by “Christians” we mean those who claim to know a guy named Jesus, then the main issue would be those who are starting to believe God is OK with abortion, or (like Nancy Pelosi) think their Church is OK with abortion.

If by “Christians” we mean those who know who that guy named Jesus is, worship Him sincerely, and honor His commands…there wouldn’t be enough to do anything.
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I think you don’t give Christians enough credit, there are a lot more of us then you think. Besides it only takes one with faith the size of muster seed.😉 I pray every day that would be me.
 
in my (extremely amateur) opinion there are some issues with getting all the Christians together to end abortion:
  1. so many people have been misled about it. after all, if your church says its a “personal decision” and doesnt teach that its a sin… how are you to stand up as a Christian and say “yes it is?” it takes a LOT of commitment to go against yoru group… so if you are not sure. really SURE you are right? and there is so much confusing talk about the whole topic. and truly heartwrenching personal stories, and lots of discussion about how govt (which many of us have reason not to trust) shouldnt be involved… etc etc.
  2. fear.
    i tried to point out on one blog that not everyone who was chatting was “pro choice” and got leaped on by people who started saying things like i was “pro cancer” because of the similarities between the fetus and cancer cells (no joke) and how i wanted women to die from back alley abortions. etc etc. to stand up, even a little, as pro life is to find out that youu have painted a target on your back.
    i lost a lot of friends over my simple statement that i was against abortion.
    i also had my computer hacked, personal assaults made on my carachter, and etc… imagine if i was considering saying this … say… in a work place? or a college campus? where people could get at me personally? or even just shun me? thats a tough thing to do.
  3. if everyone, in one election, could consistently vote for the pro life candidate… we would end abortion .
    which is why it will never, EVER come down to a simple pro life/pro choice debate in any election. the pro choice crowd cries at the top of their lungs " my opponent wants to tell YOU what YOU can do with your body" and this scares a lot of people. a lot of women dont really understand abortion… and even if they THINK they do, they are more afraid of someone mis using authority over them. if i dont trust the govt to be involved in my medical care… and it scares me! what does that mean to someone who doesnt really have a stand on abortion?
    in addition… somehow the election comes down to a pro life candidate who is , other than his pro life stance, intolerable… and a pro choice candidate who seems at least harmless, if not for his pro choice stance…
    so you get set up to worry about “how am i going to afford to feed and house my family?” and too many people hold their nose and vote for the pro choice candiidate. because the other guy seems like he is gonna end up with them out on the street.
    (i am NOT saying its true… just that that is the perception)
so the pro choice candidates all tell the other politicians “pro choice stance wins votes!” and the wishy washy politicians are suddenly all pro choice… because they are in this to be elected.
 
Wouldn’t it be better if we all worked together to make sure there was never a need for abortion?
 
Lutheranteach said:
Wouldn’t it be better if we all worked together to make sure there was never a need for abortion?
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well first of all, no one specified HOW to end abortion… ending the “need for it” would do…
but how do you end a “need” to murder a child?

the only times anything like abortion is “needed” the Church permits it… (like ectopic pregnancy) the rest of the time? how is it needed? usually because the aternatives do not have enough support… or because the woman doesnt have enough help and support…
but
as long as abortion is casually available… well i have heard far too many women, and men, say they would prefer to have an abortion than live chastely… would prefer to have an abortion than carry to term, etc
 
Lutheranteach said:
Wouldn’t it be better if we all worked together to make sure there was never a need for abortion?
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This I could get behind…let’s remove the cause that push women to a point where they feel they have no other choice than abortion. That is the most sensible post I’ve read in this thread.
 
Lutheranteach said:
Wouldn’t it be better if we all worked together to make sure there was never a need for abortion?
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I guess it depends on one’s definition of “need for abortion”.

Some believe that abortion is needed in order to prevent a child with birth defects coming into the world.
Some believe abortion is needed to protect their secret of infidelity.
Some believe abortion is needed because they didn’t want a child at that time.
Some believe abortion is needed because they wanted a girl, not a boy (or vice versa).
Some believe abortion is needed to control, by force if needed, world population, and reduce “global warming”.

How do we convince these folks that they don’t “need” abortion? A tall order, it seems to me, not that we should shy away.

Jon
 
Lutheranteach said:
Wouldn’t it be better if we all worked together to make sure there was never a need for abortion?
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What do you mean “never a need for abortion”?

When is there ever a “need” for abortion? Maybe in extremely rare cases to save the life of the mother.

Convenience is not the same as “need”.
 
I think that anyone who wants to end abortion would make a good start by trying to alleviate the things that lead to it. Some will still get abortions, but there are many who make that decision because it seems like the best of a lot of bad options. Helping people get past that would be a good first step, either through direct action or perhaps by supporting social policy that is more amenable to pregnant women.

I am skeptical of the idea that all Christians voting for pro-life candidates would be very effective. I am very skeptical of the commitment to the cause at a political level, even when individuals are committed. I think that often a lot of rhetoric on this comes out when trying to woo American Christians without any real intent for action.

Where I live, politicians just do not talk about abortion. We have no abortion laws - what we did have was struck down some time ago, and no one has ever been able to come to enough of an agreement to replace it - our population really is divided in a way that is difficult to compromise on. So I think there a good first step would be to come to some kind of common ground with those whose views are close to our own, to come up with some actual suggestions for political solutions that could actually be legislated and stand, and especially to influence other people through good arguments that really represent their basic understanding of what it is to be human. So good education, not rhetoric or half-truths or exaggerations. These things may seem more moving, but people catch on to them very quickly.

But I actually think it is surprising in a way that there is not a lot of co-ordination betwwen pro-life church groups, though I never thought much about it before.
 
I think abortion is more than just logistics and poverty and economics, more than situational, it’s a symptom of sin and a lack of Christ in the lives of most people these days. A solid Christian who is grounded in the faith of Our Lord, come hell or high water, would never commit the sin of abortion. My wife and I are so pro-life that we would’ve done ANYTHING rather than have to commit an abortion. We need to look at the causes of abortion, which are religious gaps, religious voids in people’s lives. Secular culture has done a bangup job of convincing folks that abortion is somehow like going in to have an in-grown toe nail taken care of or having a wart burned off. They’ve depersonalized the fetus and the love and sanctity of human life.

I hear liberals in politics say, “We don’t like abortion! We want to make it safe but RARE!” It’s an absurdity to say such a thing? Imagine if it’s NOT wrong, then why would you want to make it rare? We only want to make things rare that are IMMORAL or evil like homocide, kidnapping, burglary, incest, etc. Why, if abortion is a “right” and an aid to women (supposedly) would we want it to be made rare? The answer is, it’s NOT a right or an aid to women or anything the fruitcakes of the secular media have portrayed it to be. Colleges and liberal institutions have morphed abortion into a boon or an equilizer for women.

I applaud the idea of all Christians whether they are Anglicans, Lutherans, Catholics, Orthodox, Methodists, heck, Mormons, anyone, including Muslims, Jews, Hindus, everyone out there fighting the heinous and disgusting crime against humanity we call abortion. Instead of Catholics disecting and ripping apart Protestants in here at CAF and Protestants having a bone to pick with Catholics, all this ecclesiology warring and invalidating each other’s pastors and theology, maybe a bit more focus on the war on abortion might be fruitful! 👍
 
Yes, Christians could all work together to end abortion. The problem is, some Christians support abortion or support candidates who support abortion. That has to stop.
 
livi said:
Yes, Christians could all work together to end abortion. The problem is, some Christians support abortion or support candidates who support abortion. That has to stop.
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Part of the problem also, sadly, is that many “pro-life” candidates or politicans only pay lip service to the anti-abortion lobby and have done little or nothing to fight the problem. Many of them are just phonies or use this issue to get elected. Politics and voting is more complicated than just being pro life or pro choice. People expect jobs, a green environment, prosperity, health care, opinions vary about the wars we’ve been in, etc. I happen to be in a union job as a teacher, and I’m the union rep for my school. Many Republicans who happen to be “pro life” despite doing little or nothing on the record to fight abortion also happen to loathe organized labor and are hostile to public education, etc. As a teacher, I hate to shoot myself in the foot as well. The commitment to health care reform is one of the most important issues of our time; with several million voters having no health care, many of those voters will not support a prolife candidate who is against health care reform. It’s a mess. Our country has so many challenges. And unfortunately, as pro-life as I am, it’s a sad reality that the best we’ll ever do as a country is to limit abortions, not end the “right” to one. That’s what bums me the most. That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t fight like crazy against it but I am too much the realist. Ending it completely will never happen. God I wish I were wrong!
 
NotTooSmart said:
Well, if everybody who even names the name of Jesus Christ just voted to end abortion, this brutal practice would be history in four years.

The problem is Christians who vote pro-abor … choice.
Click to expand...
A good start would be with those who call themselves Catholic. I’m talking politicians and those who vote on all levels of government. Just think of all those so-called Catholics in Congress on on the US Supreme Court. If they would band together and vote for life, but for political reasons they won’t.
 
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