Could Catholic priests could benifit from being married?

[PbloPicasso]

Catholics would have to disagree with you on two issues:

1. Each and every priest made their own free-will choice to not “make” children
2. Every priest, is a very real Father and is raising up families in Christ!

Priests are simply raising up way more families in Christ than any physical father could ever be capable of!!!

I wish this were actually true. It’s a nice thought, but I still know that being a real Father involves real sacrifice that doesn’t include sex all the time. A real father will work himself to death to support his family. He will go into debt to keep the family afloat with nothing to hold him up. He pays out of his nose to keep his family fed and healthy. He gets up in the middle of the night over silly kid stuff, scared of shadows, monsters under the bed, etc. Frankly, I’m tired of the constant slobbering over priests sacrifice. We all sacrifice, some more than others. You think sex is a real sacrifice? Try beig marrying without the benefits of sex and workig yourself to death without the benefit of the public’s eye to praise you for your good works. Dads! We do it everyday and expect nor receive recognition for the much harder works we endure for the sake of our family and even for our friends and the Church.

Priests are great and we should give them the respect they deserve. However, lets not speak about all the sacrifices they make when the majority of the rest of us are doing the same. What about the divorced man who’s wife left him and he’s stuck raising the children or worst no children and has to remain celibate in the dark for the rest of his life. He did nothing wrong except marry an unfaithful wife. The same could be said about women.

I love our priests. But I will NOT promote them to Saint. I believe that celibate priests who actually sacrifice as woderful. They do exist, but unfortunately, there are not enough of them to truly believe they are sacrificing like dads who work 2 or 3 jobs, stressed from trying to pay the bills and feed the kids, keeping his wife happy and moving forward. It’s very hard. I know what it’s like to be single and dedicated to a job/career/vocation. It’s much harder to keep a family going and together i the anti-family world today that it is to be single, particularly when the Church provides you with a salary, $18,500 and allowances for clothing, housing and transportation. In the Army we called this 3 hots and a cot. As a family, sometimes you have to stoop below the belt to keep your family floating, particularly when there is no one to catch you when you fall. It’s much easier to trust in God as a priest or religious than for someone supporting a family struggling to make it all work.

Before you get bent, I’m talking about priest like Cutie and many others that love to get away and play golf, or go on vacations (that we never get to go on). Most guys would love to be single and get all of those benefits.

 

[Bezant]

Does anyone think that Catholic priests could benifit from being married? With all the pedophelia controversy on the news I wondered if this would be a reasonable suggestion to help the problem.
Thanks for reading and answering,
Protestant Me

As a solution to the pedophilia problem, definitely not. A legitimate sexual outlet is not enough to stop pedophilia, otherwise we’d make sure all pedophiles had wives and great sex lives.

That said, the celibacy tradition is definitely respectable, but coming from a Protestant background where our minister’s family was involved in the church, I think married priests could benefit parishes.

 

[Bl_Pope_Pius_IX]

Yes! Let them get married! We would actually have priests from AMerica Again!

A Priest is a priest. Plus, we are getting priests from America. A married priesthood would just get alot of priests who would rather put something in front of the priesthood. Albeit, by wanting an end to celibacy for this reason, your basically saying: Quantity not quality.

~ Pius :knight1:

 

[PbloPicasso]

A Priest is a priest. Plus, we are getting priests from America. A married priesthood would just get alot of priests who would rather put something in front of the priesthood. Albeit, by wanting an end to celibacy for this reason, your basically saying: Quantity not quality.

~ Pius :knight1:

Well, the irony is that we do need quantity right now. I haven’t seen much in the form of quality yet compared to the quality of some of my preachers in my history. I fact, other than the sacraments, I haven’t seen much difference yet. However, I do remain hopeful. But I hope that one day there will be a return to married priests in the western church.

 

[Tony888]

A Priest is a priest. Plus, we are getting priests from America. A married priesthood would just get alot of priests who would rather put something in front of the priesthood. Albeit, by wanting an end to celibacy for this reason, your basically saying: Quantity not quality.
~ Pius :knight1:

I don’t think it’s as simple as Quantity vs Quality

By excluding married people, one can easily argue quality suffers, you’ve greatly limited your pool of applicants. Also, a married priest can bring more relevant experience to his ministry of Catholic families.

I think the RCC needs married priests, but it’s not about pedophilia.

 

[Bl_Pope_Pius_IX]

Well, the irony is that we do need quantity right now. I haven’t seen much in the form of quality yet compared to the quality of some of my preachers in my history. I fact, other than the sacraments, I haven’t seen much difference yet. However, I do remain hopeful. But I hope that one day there will be a return to married priests in the western church.

A return to married priests would be very much imprudent. If you think quality is down now, then quality would be a hell of a lot worse then, I think. Even the Holy Father said that the quality of Christians is more important than the quantity of Christians. We need to work on the former rather than the latter. This is crucial.

~ Pius :knight1:

 

[Bl_Pope_Pius_IX]

I don’t think it’s as simple as Quantity vs Quality

By excluding married people, one can easily argue quality suffers, you’ve greatly limited your pool of applicants. Also, a married priest can bring more relevant experience to his ministry of Catholic families.

I think the RCC needs married priests, but it’s not about pedophilia.

Forgive me for double posting.

I never said it was as simple as quantity vs. quality, see my earlier posts for my more in-depth responses. Because our pool of applicants is limited, it eliminates those who are unwilling to sacrifice married life, and other aspects of a non-celibate life for the Priesthood. We should want people who are willing to make that sacrifice, and follow Christ’s example which is so desperately needed. I don’t think a non-celibate priest has any less advise on married life than a married man does. He hears it all. He can make one aware of the struggles, the hardships, and also the solutions that he has heard from others. Not to mention, he can properly catechize the engaged couples on marriage and spiritually guide them.

The RCC does not need married priests. If She did, than Paul VI wouldn’t have supported it, and neither would our current Holy Father, Benedict XVI

~ Pius :knight1:

 

[PbloPicasso]

A return to married priests would be very much imprudent. If you think quality is down now, then quality would be a hell of a lot worse then, I think. Even the Holy Father said that the quality of Christians is more important than the quantity of Christians. We need to work on the former rather than the latter. This is crucial.

~ Pius :knight1:

I believe you need to do more study o the eastern Catholic priesthood before making such extreme statements about their priesthood. What you say is an insult to them and their priests, which are our priests too.

Your logic is way off.

 

[Tony888]

Forgive me for double posting.

I never said it was as simple as quantity vs. quality, see my earlier posts for my more in-depth responses. Because our pool of applicants is limited, it eliminates those who are unwilling to sacrifice married life, and other aspects of a non-celibate life for the Priesthood. We should want people who are willing to make that sacrifice, and follow Christ’s example which is so desperately needed. I don’t think a non-celibate priest has any less advise on married life than a married man does. He hears it all. He can make one aware of the struggles, the hardships, and also the solutions that he has heard from others. Not to mention, he can properly catechize the engaged couples on marriage and spiritually guide them.

The RCC does not need married priests. If She did, than Paul VI wouldn’t have supported it, and neither would our current Holy Father, Benedict XVI

~ Pius :knight1:

We must agree to disagree.
I 100% know that being married and raising a family is very different that “hearing about it”

You are lying to yourself if you feel a married Preist does not sacrifice. In my experience the scrafice can be greater for the married couple. The church gets two people for the price of one, with the spouse contributing much to the function of the church.

Net, you have cut your pool of applicants by over 90%, these are God loving men willing and able to serve.

I’ve also noticed that it is OK to be married so long as it happens before you transition. I hope they are tracking these married priests that have moved over to the Catholic Church.

 

[KathleenGee]

I don’t think people know the history of celibacy…going to followers of Christ, the early martyrs, ancient Christians having sex only for procreation of the species…as well as bishops, priests and deacons who were celibate…along with those who married.

The discipline for celibacy began primarily in Spain in the 200’s. The East evolved differently.

The other is that people here are unaware of the history of the priesthood and all their contributions to society, the impetus behind the schools and universities, hospitals and hospice…that were sustained sacramentally by the clergy and run by religious orders of celibates who gave their lives totally to Christ. If people could get beyond their own biases and study more, they would end up seeing the great good celibacy does and how it fulfills Christ’s admonitions of those who forsake all for the kingdom.

 

[PbloPicasso]

We must agree to disagree.
I 100% know that being married and raising a family is very different that “hearing about it”

You are lying to yourself if you feel a married Priest does not sacrifice. In my experience the sacrifice can be greater for the married couple. The church gets two people for the price of one, with the spouse contributing much to the function of the church.

Net, you have cut your pool of applicants by over 90%, these are God loving men willing and able to serve.

I’ve also noticed that it is OK to be married so long as it happens before you transition. I hope they are tracking these married priests that have moved over to the Catholic Church.

Exactly my point. But so many young men have been brain washed into believing that a celibate priesthood is the only answer. They seem to fail to recognize that celibacy is also a separate vocation from the priesthood. Today’s Latin Rite seminarian is discerning no less than 2 vocations, celibacy and the ordained priesthood. A married priest has already discerned celibacy or in his case holy matrimoy.

You are absolutely correct. The Church is getting a sister assigned to the parish the priest pastors. If you do your research on the Eastern Churches you’d know this fact. As I told the much needed brother, hopefully a future priest, insulting our eastern Catholic brethren has no place anywhere within the greater Body of Christ. I for one take insult to those remarks.

 

[Bl_Pope_Pius_IX]

We must agree to disagree.
I 100% know that being married and raising a family is very different that “hearing about it”

You are lying to yourself if you feel a married Preist does not sacrifice. In my experience the scrafice can be greater for the married couple. The church gets two people for the price of one, with the spouse contributing much to the function of the church.

Net, you have cut your pool of applicants by over 90%, these are God loving men willing and able to serve.

I’ve also noticed that it is OK to be married so long as it happens before you transition. I hope they are tracking these married priests that have moved over to the Catholic Church.

A married priest does sacrifice. But if the LATIN RITE were to adopt a non-celibate priesthood, it would bear plenty of rotten fruit. But in the LATIN RITE I do not think that a married priest would work as well as the current system. I am tired of repeating myself. However, I will once more. For a married priest, more time and flexibility in the Parish would be taken away. He would need to provide for TWO families (his Parish and his biological family) and that is not fair to either. Come now, a Priest in the LATIN RITE cannot be divided like that.

Those “90%” of people that are lost from the Priesthood cause of marriage simply don’t belong in the Priesthood. If they belonged in the Priesthood, they would be in the Priesthood. In stead, they are married. That is their mission. that is their life.

I believe you need to do more study o the eastern Catholic priesthood before making such extreme statements about their priesthood. What you say is an insult to them and their priests, which are our priests too.

Your logic is way off.

In my defense, I never insulted the EC priesthood, and I am speaking purely of the LATIN RITE

~ Pius :knight1:

 

[PbloPicasso]

A married priest does sacrifice. But if the LATIN RITE were to adopt a non-celibate priesthood, it would bear plenty of rotten fruit. But in the LATIN RITE I do not think that a married priest would work as well as the current system. I am tired of repeating myself. However, I will once more. For a married priest, more time and flexibility in the Parish would be taken away. He would need to provide for TWO families (his Parish and his biological family) and that is not fair to either. Come now, a Priest in the LATIN RITE cannot be divided like that.

Those “90%” of people that are lost from the Priesthood cause of marriage simply don’t belong in the Priesthood. If they belonged in the Priesthood, they would be in the Priesthood. In stead, they are married. That is their mission. that is their life.

In my defense, I never insulted the EC priesthood, and I am speaking purely of the LATIN RITE

~ Pius :knight1:

Let me as you a question then. Then if God didn’t want them to become priests why are there not others to replace the falling numbers? Think about it. 50 years ago there were many more compared to today’s. Further, the Catholic population has increased. So where are the priests from that pool. It has occurred to me that God may be calling the Church ito a renewed era of married priest as it was in the first millennium. As I said, do your homework.

You seem to be defending something that does not need defending. There will always be those more blessed with celibacy. We need those men in particular. A married priesthood would reinforce the Church in a more modern day version of crisis. Celibacy has never reduced scandal, but rather created more control over the holy ones, who were doing many things back then that would curl our nose hair.

 

[Miriam1947]

Let me as you a question then. Then if God didn’t want them to become priests why are there not others to replace the falling numbers? Think about it. 50 years ago there were many more compared to today’s. Further, the Catholic population has increased. So where are the priests from that pool. It has occurred to me that God may be calling the Church ito a renewed era of married priest as it was in the first millennium. As I said, do your homework.

You seem to be defending something that does not need defending. There will always be those more blessed with celibacy. We need those men in particular. A married priesthood would reinforce the Church in a more modern day version of crisis. Celibacy has never reduced scandal, but rather created more control over the holy ones, who were doing many things back then that would curl our nose hair.

Perhaps there are not more priests because per family Catholics are having fewer children.

Do you think, maybe it’s because of birth control? And the fact that just because there are more numbers does not mean more truly practicing Catholics.

How many Catholic families today are even talking to their children about religious life or the priesthood?

 

[felsguy]

Could Catholic priests could benifit from being married?

---

Does anyone think that Catholic priests could benifit from being married? With all the pedophelia controversy on the news I wondered if this would be a reasonable suggestion to help the problem.
Thanks for reading and answering,
Protestant Me

To shift the discussion slightly ( and hopefully not highjack the thread) I would like to pose this follow-up question: ** Does anyone think the Catholic Church could benefit from having married priests?** I think the pedophelia aspect has been well answered by many posts above.

I live in a large midwestern diocese with over 200 parishes currently, only 160 of which have a resident pastor. My own parish of 2200 families with a school of 450 students and a PSR program of several hundred more, with a large public university and several hospitals nearby is fortunate to have a resident pastor. He celebrates three Masses on Sunday, an evening Mass and whatever weddings and funerals that occur on Saturday and has no help except for the occasional visiting priest passing through.

So, if in addition to this one priest, obviously unmarried and for the sake of discussion able to devote 100% of his time, energy and effort to the parish…

what if there were also a priest with a wife who, for the sake of discussion, could devote 50% of his time, energy and effort to the parish…

and/or…

what if there were also a priest with a wife and children who, for the sake of discussion, could devote 25% of his time, energy and effort to the parish…

would this benefit the parish?

In posing the question, it’s obvious what my opinion is.

 

[PbloPicasso]

Perhaps there are not more priests because per family Catholics are having fewer children.

Do you think, maybe it’s because of birth control? And the fact that just because there are more numbers does not mean more truly practicing Catholics.

How many Catholic families today are even talking to their children about religious life or the priesthood?

You know, that is a very good point. The secular push for abortion and contraception has destroyed the moral compass of our society, and includes Catholics.

One idea that you triggered in my thoughts is the possibility of a married priest with a large family, paving the example of what a truly Catholic family should look like. The days of large families can only be avoided with birth control. I firmly believe that the Church push of NFP is merely being used as ABC anyway. I do not believe, personally, that any form of contraception, including NFP is acceptable in spite all of the misrepresentations about its use. NFP is being used as a contraception, and this particular use is illicit. A married clergy, consisting of priests and deacons representing the example of family as stated in scripture would probably benefit the Catholic population. 1 Timothy 3.2-7

1 Timothy 3:2-7

New International Version (NIV)

2 Now the overseer is to be above reproach, faithful to his wife, temperate, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, 3 not given to drunkenness, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money. 4 He must manage his own family well and see that his children obey him, and he must do so in a manner worthy of fulla]" class=“footnote”>a] respect. 5** (If anyone does not know how to manage his own family, how can he take care of God’s church?)** 6 He must not be a recent convert, or he may become conceited and fall under the same judgment as the devil. 7 He must also have a good reputation with outsiders, so that he will not fall into disgrace and into the devil’s trap.

[note: my “n” key keeps sticking and is driving me crazy. Each “n” requires several strokes… new keyboard time]

 

[JamestheOlder]

This can go on and on ad infinitum, with no resolution.

The American part of the Roman Catholic Church cannot support married priests. Has anyone considered this? Evidently not, as the reasons given for married priests are all over the place. Married priests are not the answer to this shortage of priests, they will simply be an added liability on to each diocese, as they are now. Yes we have married priests, former Epicopalian ones whom I know. The parishes cannot support them (all you who are yearning for married priests will evidently have to come up with a lot more change in the Offertory basket), so the diocese has to step in and contribute to their support. IT IS BECAUSE THEY HAVE FAMILIES. As if you didn’t know already, it costs MONEY to send kids to school. And no, you don’t get an extra half-person in the priest’s wife, because she is a mother, first.

I wish you would not beat up on the seminarian. Were I he, I would feel discouraged by the junk…yes, junk, that you are throwing at him. He has a vocation to the priesthood; if I am any judge, a STRONG vocation, which I admire highly. He is the one making the choice. He is the one who has looked at all the “angles”. He is to be supported in his choice, not nagged to death by some inapplicable opinions which may not even be based in fact. All you have is personal opinion. You have no facts, you have no Scripture, you really have no basis for your comments other than opinion. And please leave the Eastern churches out of the discussion; there are so few parishes in the US for you to make judgements in such general terms. For example, how many bishops, priests and deacons are married? Do you even know? But you will use that as a club. Shame on you.

You want to argue with someone about celibacy for the American Latin Rite priests, send an email to B16 and see how far you get.

Don’t bother to reply. I’m unsubscribing from this thread. It appears to be useless to argue with those who will not consider someone else’s opinion, Church TRADITION, SCRIPTURE, and the ruling of the Popes.

Forget it!

 

[PbloPicasso]

JamestheOlder, why are you so upset over this discussion? There is no need to get this upset over a conversation between adults, granted that we don’t all agree with each other. The priesthood is what it is and no amount of arguing among the laity will inevitably change it. To me, it’s like discussing which Republican is the best candidate and why. None of us have absolute knowledge. I’ve found it fruitful and cause for me to rethink the issue. It also helps me to defend my faith to my non-Catholic Christian family members who use very similar arguments against the Church. Whether I believe marriage is a worthwhile cause for priest is irrelevant. But it might help others to come to a better understanding of the issue and help them to understand that current priests discerning marriage would be like me discerning marriage in spite the fact that I’m already married and have 3 beautiful children. It’s just wrong.

 

[KathleenGee]

If there are indeed Catholic seminarians, most faithful Catholics know in the Holy Spirit that the Latin rite has been and always will be celibate.

People cannot accept it.

Is it because they have lost their faith in the Spirit to the flesh???

Practically all celibate priests are very happy with their lives, filled with many people, countless dinner engagements, celibate friendships based on the Lord, and when they came home at night, they are wanting to be alone with the Lord.

What we are witnessing here in the USA and in English speaking countries as a whole, is a culture that has lost its faith in God for the altar of sex. This married clergy issue has become an issue following the sex revolution of the 60’s and 70’s, and look at all the deaths, diseases, broken relationships with children without fathers…

Orthodox priests confide to Latin rite priests they wish they were celibate and not married because they cannot give themselves fully to the Lord…

As Jesus said.

Let us pray for vocations blessed with grace who are called to live exclusively in the Spirit – and help us be counter this culture by professing Christ promoting virginity and chastity and the sanctity of human life.

 

[Bl_Pope_Pius_IX]

One idea that you triggered in my thoughts is the possibility of a married priest with a large family, paving the example of what a truly Catholic family should look like. The days of large families can only be avoided with birth control. I firmly believe that the Church push of NFP is merely being used as ABC anyway. I do not believe, personally, that any form of contraception, including NFP is acceptable in spite all of the misrepresentations about its use. NFP is being used as a contraception, and this particular use is illicit. A married clergy, consisting of priests and deacons representing the example of family as stated in scripture would probably benefit the Catholic population. 1 Timothy 3.2-7

I can play scripture too.

Now about virgins: I have no command from the Lord, but I give a judgment as one who by the Lord’s mercy is trustworthy. 26 Because of the present crisis, I think that it is good for a man to remain as he is. 27 Are you pledged to a woman? Do not seek to be released. Are you free from such a commitment? Do not look for a wife. 1Corinthians 7:25-28

That is one quote.

Here is another from the Gospel according to Mark:

For when they shall rise again from the dead, they shall neither marry, nor be married, but are as the angels in heaven. Mark 12:25

This shows that Clerical Celibacy sets a model for the life AFTER death.

Let me as you a question then. Then if God didn’t want them to become priests why are there not others to replace the falling numbers? Think about it. 50 years ago there were many more compared to today’s. Further, the Catholic population has increased. So where are the priests from that pool. It has occurred to me that God may be calling the Church ito a renewed era of married priest as it was in the first millennium. As I said, do your homework.

Why are you worrying? God wont let the Catholic Church fail. The gates of Hell will not prevail. But as of now, the Holy Father, and the Councils of Bishops side with me, not you. With all due respect (though clearly that respect doesn’t move in reciprocal), I would rather take the words of the Pope than yours. The discipline of over a thousand years than what ahs just recently occurred to you. Just because Priests were allowed this cannot be assumed that the majority were. On a side note. I will respectfully ask you to stop the “do your homework” comments. They don’t contribute to this conversation in the least.

You seem to be defending something that does not need defending. There will always be those more blessed with celibacy. We need those men in particular. A married priesthood would reinforce the Church in a more modern day version of crisis. Celibacy has never reduced scandal, but rather created more control over the holy ones, who were doing many things back then that would curl our nose hair.

Clearly it does need defending as you are so vehemently assaulting it. The blessed path that CHRIST put into effect by having Himself be celibate is under attack. From Pius IX, to Vatican II, to Benedict XVI, have defended it. And that is just within the last 300 years alone. Celibacy greatly reduced scandal. the scandal of nepotism that so plagued the Church was greatly reduced and sexual crimes were reduced I’m sure as well.

I wish you would not beat up on the seminarian. Were I he, I would feel discouraged by the junk…yes, junk, that you are throwing at him. He has a vocation to the priesthood; if I am any judge, a STRONG vocation, which I admire highly. He is the one making the choice. He is the one who has looked at all the “angles”. He is to be supported in his choice, not nagged to death by some inapplicable opinions which may not even be based in fact.

James, though I understand you have unsubscribed, I must thank you for your defending me. Also, I am not a Seminarian yet, I have just over two years till I am able to enter one. I have spoken with my Spiritual Directors on celibacy. All of them being celibate LATIN RITE Priests, they agree with me and with the Holy Father.

Clerical marriage has no place in the LATIN RITE, and will never have a place in the LATIN RITE. especially not under the reign of Benedict XVI.

~ Pius :knight1: