Could Mary Be the Thrice Holy Divine Will Incarnate?

  • Thread starter Thread starter mar
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
M

mar

Guest
Curious as to others thoughts and Catholic Teaching references on whether Mary could be the Incarnation of the Thrice Holy Divine Will before time began, who through her as chosen by God to Be His Mother, Jesus was then Incarnated in time, but also Who outside of time, all things Came To Be.
 
I’m not entirely sure what you mean, but Catholics believe Mary is only a human being (a very privileged and favored one, but still only human). She is not divine. Considering her divine or pre-existing or any such thing is heresy.
 
I’m pretty sure I’ve heard something about Mary being the incarnation of the Holy Spirit, though. Of course, anyone can get on the internet and say just about anything, and I’m guessing this might be a case of that.
 
JLP1 said:
I’m pretty sure I’ve heard something about Mary being the incarnation of the Holy Spirit, though. Of course, anyone can get on the internet and say just about anything, and I’m guessing this might be a case of that.
Click to expand...
This is contradictory to Catholic teaching. You’re right it’s a case of anybody being able to say anything on the Internet.
 
No, Mary could not have existed before time.

Mary’s soul and body came into existence at a specific time and place. Mary was immaculately conceived and born to St. Ann and St. Joachim circa 16 BC. Prior to that, her soul did not exist.

It is church doctrine that a human person does not exist prior to their conception.
 
Last edited:
St Maximillian Kolbe taught that she is the quasi-incarnation of the Holy Spirit because her union with Him is so profound that it approaches, but does not reach, the union of divinity and humanity found in the Incarnation: Christ. It’s tied to the incarnation in that the mystical union of the Holy Spirit and Mary brought forth the incarnation.
 
Mary is not divine. It seems that you may be tapping into some of the Marian devotions that equate Mary as the incarnation and spouse of the Holy Spirit, but these are new innovations, are not scriptural, and are not Christian doctrine. If your question is did God predestine his Son to become incarnate as the Redeemer, then the answer is yes, absolutely. Refer to Colossians 1:15-20 and Ephesians 1:3-20.
 
JLP1 said:
I’m pretty sure I’ve heard something about Mary being the incarnation of the Holy Spirit, though.
Click to expand...
“Quasi-incarnation” is the word used, and it’s by virtue of her being the spouse of the Holy Spirit and two became one flesh. St. Maximilian Kolbe wrote that. It is not official Church teaching but was apparently not a hindrance to his sainthood. Taylor Marshall has expressed discomfort with it and kind of rewritten it using other terms. I’ll stick with St. Maximilian’s wording.
 
Last edited:
Hodos said:
and are not Christian doctrine.
Click to expand...
The Catholic Church does not take issue with St Maximilian’s writings on this, to my knowledge. They have not raised it to the level of a “doctrine” but it’s fine to read, pray/meditate on, and believe in the Catholic Church.
 
Hodos said:
Mary is not divine. It seems that you may be tapping into some of the Marian devotions that equate Mary as the incarnation and spouse of the Holy Spirit,
Click to expand...
Quasi-incarnation is very different from incarnation. Arguably, as “partakers of the divine nature” (which is very Scriptural), we are all “quasi-incarnations” of God to some degree. No one in orthodox Catholic circles would suggest that Mary is the incarnation of the Holy Spirit.
 
We will agree to disagree on that one. I find that is a distinction without meaning, personally, but if that is your Church body’s doctrinal position so be it.
 
I don’t believe there is a formal position on that particular terminology. This is theological speculation at this point.
It is akin to the title “Co-Redemptrix” which many apply to Mary, due to her special role in cooperating with the work of Christ’s redemption…likewise in that case, technically we are all “co-redeemers” as per St. Paul:
Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up those things that are wanting of the sufferings of Christ, in my flesh, for his body, which is the church.…(Col. 1:24)
 
I think “co-redemptrix” is a lot more controversial than “quasi-incarnation”. St Maximilian was canonized in an extremely short time frame. On the other hand, a Netherlands unapproved apparition (approved for faith expression only) concerning Mary as “co-redemptrix” has run into many issues with the approvers and the co-redemptrix concept is a major problem.

Edited to add, it’s this one, Lady of All Nations. There is a group who want “Co-Redemptrix” as the fifth Marian dogma. I can’t see the Church going for that any time soon and indeed they have not.

en.wikipedia.org

The Lady of All Nations - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
Last edited:
Was it Pius XII or VatII that declined to define co-redemptix as doctrine?

I suppose it is a bit differ when the magisterium has actually stopped short of defining it because they thought it would be easily misunderstood. It presents a bit more of a hurdle to get over.
 
Mary was a human… she is much, much closer to being like you or I than being like God.

I’m sorry to say that it is discussion like this that confuses many about the Church’s teaching about Mary
 
Pope Pius XII said no.
As he was a very mystic Pope, I should think that would be the end of it for the foreseeable future.

Co-Redemptrix - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

I am a big Mary supporter but even I can see a real issue with her being co-redemptrix. I cannot imagine Mary in her humility taking on that role.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top