Could Muhammad of been a prophet?

[Reuben_J]

There is no proof either way on whether Jesus sinned as a boy. His upbringing was purported to be guided by his natural father who probably sinned just like everybody else. It is probable that Jesus had playmates who liked mischief. Since no documentation exists either way, I opt for the most probable, given that Jesus was supposed to be human.

Please do not use the word probably when the Bible is definite about it. Jesus does not sin.

For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are–yet he did not sin. (Heb 4:15)

I just taken that from the translation that was quoted by dronald earlier on.

btw, normally natural father is the male parent who is also called a genetic father or birth father. Jesus natural father, if anything, is God. Not sure what you meant by natural father but it looks like you are referring to Joseph.

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

I said that “Q” was a purported document based on the deductions of German scholars who called it “Quelle”, which means source. The same words were found in both Matthew and Luke, but not in Mark, so they must have been copied from a common source other than Mark.
The Q source (also Q document, Q Gospel, Q Sayings Gospel, or Q from German: Quelle, meaning “source”) is a hypothetical written collection of sayings (logia) of Jesus defined as the “common” material found in the Gospels of Matthew and Luke but not in their other written source, the Gospel of Mark. According to this hypothesis, this ancient text was based on the Oral Tradition of the Early Church.[1]
Along with Markan priority, Q was hypothesized by 1900, and it is one of the foundations of modern gospel scholarship.[2] B. H. Streeter formulated a widely accepted view of Q: that it was a written document (not an oral tradition) composed in Greek; that almost all of its contents appear in Matthew, in Luke, or in both
There is no proof either way on whether Jesus sinned as a boy. His upbringing was purported to be guided by his natural father who probably sinned just like everybody else. It is probable that Jesus had playmates who liked mischief. Since no documentation exists either way, I opt for the most probable, given that Jesus was supposed to be human.

The Gospels are telling the SAME story, originating from the same group that followed
Jesus, It shouldn’t be surprising how some Gospels in some parts read the same way.
There is NO “Q”!
Jesus was supposed to be human, you are correct, but the idea of Jesus becoming a
human was to be PERFECT! If Jesus wasn’t perfect, then his blood saves no body, the
Jesus’ coming would have been pointless.

What are you, really?

 

[Mount_Carmel]

Please do not use the word probably when the Bible is definite about it. Jesus does not sin.

For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are–yet he did not sin. (Heb 4:15)

I just taken that from the translation that was quoted by dronald earlier on.

btw, normally natural father is the male parent who is also called a genetic father or birth father. Jesus natural father, if anything, is God. Not sure what you meant by natural father but it looks like you are referring to Joseph.

Yes, Jesus only had/has human DNA from His Blessed Mother, the rest of His ‘DNA’ is from His Father in Heaven via The power of the Holy Spirit, and is in effect timeless - ‘Before Abraham was, I AM’ - ‘I and the Father are one’.

 

[nmgauss]

The Gospels are telling the SAME story, originating from the same group that followed
Jesus, It shouldn’t be surprising how some Gospels in some parts read the same way.
There is NO “Q”!
Jesus was supposed to be human, you are correct, but the idea of Jesus becoming a
human was to be PERFECT! If Jesus wasn’t perfect, then his blood saves no body, the
Jesus’ coming would have been pointless.

What are you, really?

Are there different degrees of perfection? Where does human perfection rate in the scale of 0-100? Where does Jesus as a human rate in the same scale?

 

[Sooner87]

Is it possible that Muhammad was a prophet of God? Can the belief in Jesus as our savoir and Muhammad as a prophet coincide? I don’t know much about Islam, but I’m quite curious about it.

http://cdn.head-fi.org/c/cd/cd2bc46d_thread-derail-1953.jpg

Are there different degrees of perfection? Where does human perfection rate in the scale of 0-100? Where does Jesus as a human rate in the same scale?

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

Are there different degrees of perfection?

No

Where does human perfection rate in the scale of 0-100?

0

Where does Jesus as a human rate in the same scale?

100+ (BECAUSE HE’S GOD!)

 

[jakasaki]

http://cdn.head-fi.org/c/cd/cd2bc46d_thread-derail-1953.jpg

Love it…!!!

 

[Auntie_A]

http://cdn.head-fi.org/c/cd/cd2bc46d_thread-derail-1953.jpg

Thanks for expressing visually what I feel inside with many of these errant threads on CATHOLIC Answers Forum. I find it quite amusing how someone posts a question that is not really Catholic in origin (and poor grammar, by the way: “Could Mohammed HAVE been a prophet?” Not OF) and it goes on and on into strange little turns that are inspired by another religion’s fringe ideas or something inferred from a History channel attempt at Christianity or archaeology sponsored by a non-Christian cult.

Point is, why are you on this forum, a Catholic forum, and why are you not al least trying to grasp Catholic concepts and beliefs. Every time I, as a Catholic, have been asked to understand another faith, I have been expected to look at things from the perspective of that other religion. So many of these questions and comments are not even Catholic based. All very fine for you, but why bring it here where we already have our own catechism and beliefs which we are happy with. Read a Catholic catechism and learn about the Catholic stance on Mohammed and muslims.

I am open to good interfaith dialogue but respect your host, please.

 

[tonyfish58]

Thanks for expressing visually what I feel inside with many of these errant threads on CATHOLIC Answers Forum. I find it quite amusing how someone posts a question that is not really Catholic in origin (and poor grammar, by the way: “Could Mohammed HAVE been a prophet?” Not OF) and it goes on and on into strange little turns that are inspired by another religion’s fringe ideas or something inferred from a History channel attempt at Christianity or archaeology sponsored by a non-Christian cult.

Point is, why are you on this forum, a Catholic forum, and why are you not al least trying to grasp Catholic concepts and beliefs. Every time I, as a Catholic, have been asked to understand another faith, I have been expected to look at things from the perspective of that other religion. So many of these questions and comments are not even Catholic based. All very fine for you, but why bring it here where we already have our own catechism and beliefs which we are happy with. Read a Catholic catechism and learn about the Catholic stance on Mohammed and muslims.

I am open to good interfaith dialogue but respect your host, please.

Because it is about sharing your belief - We are not Catholics

The more you look the more one may find that we all agree on a lot of things, but I assume no one is here to force ones views on others.

You said “that are inspired by another religion’s fringe ideas” - Who is to say those ideas are wrong?

Faith reaches its peak when we realize that God doeth as He willeth and to no one is given the right to Question!

Regards Tony

 

[Sooner87]

Because it is about sharing your belief - We are not Catholics

The more you look the more one may find that we all agree on a lot of things, but I assume no one is here to force ones views on others.

You said “that are inspired by another religion’s fringe ideas” - Who is to say those ideas are wrong?

Faith reaches its peak when we realize that God doeth as He willeth and to no one is given the right to Question!

Regards Tony

I think the issue that they were getting at is not so much that people are trying to bring their beliefs into it, but the fact that things just get wildly out of hand so quickly. This thread has not had anything to do with the original question in quite some time. It seems to be the norm with these threads.

 

[daler]

I think the issue that they were getting at is not so much that people are trying to bring their beliefs into it, but the fact that things just get wildly out of hand so quickly. This thread has not had anything to do with the original question in quite some time. It seems to be the norm with these threads.

Sooner,
. Very true. People like to enter these threads and chat sideways, and its always good for someone to remind people what the thread topic is.

. To me, this is a very good subject for people to discuss, especially westerners, who tend to be mostly ignorant and too often hold prejudices which need to be examined. My own prejudices on various fronts pop up every now and then, and until I confront them, they hold sway over me.

. We are human, and wired to survive. Part of this involves a process called “gross generalization”, by which means we assess our surroundings, generalize, and act for the needs of the moment. Only when there is an abundance of time and conditions allow us can we apply the elements of time and energy to examine that which is unfamiliar to us.

. When we assume “our” position is right, we usually are only blindly imitating our ancestors, quacking like ducks, or barking when other dogs bark. There is, or should be, more to being human than that, including what is the basis for our supposed “beliefs”.

.

 

[Auntie_A]

Because it is about sharing your belief - We are not Catholics

The more you look the more one may find that we all agree on a lot of things, but I assume no one is here to force ones views on others.

You said “that are inspired by another religion’s fringe ideas” - Who is to say those ideas are wrong?

Faith reaches its peak when we realize that God doeth as He willeth and to no one is given the right to Question!

Regards Tony

What? “no one is given the right to question”? Yes, God does as He wills but we have a right to question, discern, use free will to make choices.

You said, “Who is to say those ideas are wrong?” Answer: Someone who is right…Are you implying that all ideas are true? That idea is the definition of chaos. While I respect one’s right to believe what one wants, please don’t expect me to respect ideas that I believe are not true.

I know the “right and wrong” thing is out of fashion in some circles but I choose the world where there are right and wrong and good and bad choices, ideas, beliefs.

Dear Tony, my point remains: If I go to my neighbor’s home, I will respect my neighbor’s culture; why are certain posters ignoring Catholic culture and belief while they are visiting a Catholic forum? And why are we getting off the original post?

 

[daler]

Thanks for expressing visually what I feel inside with many of these errant threads on CATHOLIC Answers Forum. I find it quite amusing how someone posts a question that is not really Catholic in origin (and poor grammar, by the way: “Could Mohammed HAVE been a prophet?” Not OF) and it goes on and on into strange little turns that are inspired by another religion’s fringe ideas or something inferred from a History channel attempt at Christianity or archaeology sponsored by a non-Christian cult.

Point is, why are you on this forum, a Catholic forum, and why are you not al least trying to grasp Catholic concepts and beliefs. Every time I, as a Catholic, have been asked to understand another faith, I have been expected to look at things from the perspective of that other religion. So many of these questions and comments are not even Catholic based. All very fine for you, but why bring it here where we already have our own catechism and beliefs which we are happy with. Read a Catholic catechism and learn about the Catholic stance on Mohammed and muslims.

I am open to good interfaith dialogue but respect your host, please.

Dear Auntie,
. Back on the reservation, a lot of people spoke other than King’s English, didn’t raise their little pinkie when drinking tea or coffee, and still had something worth saying.

. The beauty of inter-faith dialogue is that the pool is not stagnant, that there is a fresh flow of ideas from whatever source, tribe, nation, or religion, which tends to be quite attractive. That others from one’s own particular group feel comfortable to sit at such a table is a complement to the host, and as you say, all should certainly respect their host and maintain courtesy at all times.

. This being said, there are reasons why people of all Faiths want to talk about important topics such as this one. So many lives are affected by the contrasts of religious beliefs, and at the bottom of beliefs rests a “Prophet” Who has inspired this or that belief. At the beginning of any cycle of “new” beliefs, to which others are unaccustomed, the first to respond positively tend to be regarded as “fringe”.

. Jesus and His disciples were at one time such a fringe group. They were mercilessly attacked for their fringe beliefs. I can well imagine a Jewish Answers Forum hosting a thread way back when discussing the question: “Could Jesus of (have) been a prophet?” and genuinely inviting others to participate.

. I have learned much in the past few months of dialogue not only with Catholics, but people of other Faiths in a variety of threads, and am extremely grateful to those who have put together this Catholic Answers Forum and gone to so much trouble to make me feel comfortable at this wonderful table where such a variety of topics can be freely discussed. It is a blessed service.

Thank you, CAF

.

 

[tonyfish58]

What? “no one is given the right to question”? Yes, God does as He wills but we have a right to question, discern, use free will to make choices.

You said, “Who is to say those ideas are wrong?” Answer: Someone who is right…Are you implying that all ideas are true? That idea is the definition of chaos. While I respect one’s right to believe what one wants, please don’t expect me to respect ideas that I believe are not true.

I know the “right and wrong” thing is out of fashion in some circles but I choose the world where there are right and wrong and good and bad choices, ideas, beliefs.

Dear Tony, my point remains: If I go to my neighbor’s home, I will respect my neighbor’s culture; why are certain posters ignoring Catholic culture and belief while they are visiting a Catholic forum?

“no one is given the right to question”? This is a subject that could be continued elsewhere.

Getting back to the Topic have you an opinion on Muhammad - to me Muhammad was the voice of God for that age, indeed a Messenger of God, the Seal of the Prophets!

We can learn a lot from Muhammad

Regards Tony

 

[daler]

“no one is given the right to question”? This is a subject that could be continued elsewhere.

Getting back to the Topic have you an opinion on Muhammad - to me Muhammad was the voice of God for that age, indeed a Messenger of God, the Seal of the Prophets!

We can learn a lot from Muhammad

Regards Tony

I first picked up the Quran back in the early 70’s when I was in my early 20’s, and my first impression was that it appeared to be very similar to the Old Testament. How could one with an unbiased mind weigh in the scales of blind justice the evidence that Moses was a Prophet of God, or Jesus for that matter?

I certainly had my western upbringing as a Christian (Methodist) to both help and hinder me as I broadened my own independent search for truth. For me, there was a hunger for knowledge of the people’s and cultures of the world, including their religious beliefs, which needed to be fed, and the only way I could do that was to pick up their Holy Books and read, without colored glasses, and simply allow new information into my head, and heart.

It actually took me a few decades to finally overcome my western prejudices, based largely on fear of the unknown, to allow myself to fully recognize the beauty and sublime truths imparted in the verses of the Quran. The most challenging parts were the warlike verses, but in the context of the extremely violent nature of men, it is realistic that two-legged beasts must be dealt with even as four-legged beasts must be dealt with, when they are threatening your family and loved ones. Not much different than Leviticus, really, and other Books of the Bible.

.

 

[Auntie_A]

Dear Auntie,
. Back on the reservation, a lot of people spoke other than King’s English, didn’t raise their little pinkie when drinking tea or coffee, and still had something worth saying.

. The beauty of inter-faith dialogue is that the pool is not stagnant, that there is a fresh flow of ideas from whatever source, tribe, nation, or religion, which tends to be quite attractive. That others from one’s own particular group feel comfortable to sit at such a table is a complement to the host, and as you say, all should certainly respect their host and maintain courtesy at all times.

. This being said, there are reasons why people of all Faiths want to talk about important topics such as this one. So many lives are affected by the contrasts of religious beliefs, and at the bottom of beliefs rests a “Prophet” Who has inspired this or that belief. At the beginning of any cycle of “new” beliefs, to which others are unaccustomed, the first to respond positively tend to be regarded as “fringe”.

. Jesus and His disciples were at one time such a fringe group. They were mercilessly attacked for their fringe beliefs. I can well imagine a Jewish Answers Forum hosting a thread way back when discussing the question: “Could Jesus of (have) been a prophet?” and genuinely inviting others to participate.

. I have learned much in the past few months of dialogue not only with Catholics, but people of other Faiths in a variety of threads, and am extremely grateful to those who have put together this Catholic Answers Forum and gone to so much trouble to make me feel comfortable at this wonderful table where such a variety of topics can be freely discussed. It is a blessed service.

Thank you, CAF

.

I have much agreement with you here, appreciate your positive response, and hope you understand my original concerns. My context of a “fringe belief” relates to the arguments that are way off the original post’s direction. In a different discussion or topic, I might not consider them “fringe” in a better context.

Incidentally, I love the fresh flow of ideas as long as there is respect to the host forum or household…Oh, and I cannot use a fine motor grasp while drinking tea (my pinkie has always been uncooperative) ; But that '‘of’" in the original post has been annoying me since it has been continuously posted in my e-mail for quite a long time. Sorry, I taught business English for a few years…my quirk. Apologies.

 

[daler]

I have much agreement with you here, appreciate your positive response, and hope you understand my original concerns. My context of a “fringe belief” relates to the arguments that are way off the original post’s direction. In a different discussion or topic, I might not consider them “fringe” in a better context.

Incidentally, I love the fresh flow of ideas as long as there is respect to the host forum or household…Oh, and I cannot use a fine motor grasp while drinking tea (my pinkie has always been uncooperative) ; But that '‘of’" in the original post has been annoying me since it has been continuously posted in my e-mail for quite a long time. Sorry, I taught business English for a few years…my quirk. Apologies.

Ha Ha Ha…

My mother was a school teacher back on the rez, Auntie. I know what you mean about the “of” thing, but I spent a lot of time with my Lakota friends, and they often bent the white man’s rules.

What makes me smile in memory is the word “enit” … Usually in the context of, “Enit, man?” which means, properly, Isn’t it? It descends naturally from the word: “ain’t”, and “Ain’t it?” (true)

As to respecting the host, if we fail to do this, nothing else much matters. Mom taught at a Catholic Mission school for some years, as well as in the little one room school houses. She could have written a sequel to “Little (School) House on the Prairie” …

And I fully agree with you that but for short sprees, folks should remain on topic. Maybe we need a school marm in here reminding us of that, enit?

God bless, and please hand me an eraser from time to time…
.

 

[Servant19]

No

0

100+ (BECAUSE HE’S GOD!)

I know someone who is 232 on this scale



(Btw are we on a sports field? So much competitive one upmanship around)

 

[daler]

I have much agreement with you here, appreciate your positive response, and hope you understand my original concerns. My context of a “fringe belief” relates to the arguments that are way off the original post’s direction. In a different discussion or topic, I might not consider them “fringe” in a better context.

Incidentally, I love the fresh flow of ideas as long as there is respect to the host forum or household…Oh, and I cannot use a fine motor grasp while drinking tea (my pinkie has always been uncooperative) ; But that '‘of’" in the original post has been annoying me since it has been continuously posted in my e-mail for quite a long time. Sorry, I taught business English for a few years…my quirk. Apologies.

Dear Auntie,
. I really look forward to chatting further with you. You sound like a real good soul, and “friendly”, and all that …

. I must get to bed, as its after 10 pm, and my mom said not to stay up too late…

. Also, in the morning I’m gonna go hear an old man named Dr Wolfgang Klebel speak at the Riverside, CA Baha’i Center, about 30 miles away. He was raised in Austria and said he saw Hitler go by in a parade when he was a kid.
. Very interesting man, Dr Klebel. He was a Catholic Priest, and later became a doctor of psychology, working in a women’s prison for many years. Quite a scholar now.

. God bless, and don’t stay up too late yourself, enit?
.

 

[swariffin]

“no one is given the right to question”? This is a subject that could be continued elsewhere.

Getting back to the Topic have you an opinion on Muhammad - to me Muhammad was the voice of God for that age, indeed a Messenger of God, the Seal of the Prophets!

We can learn a lot from Muhammad

Regards Tony

By being tender when do not have many followers but being a conquerer when already have many followers?