Could The Book of Mormon be considered mythology?

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I put in all of this information into my search engine and there is nothing except a wikipedia page with byu links on the bottom of the page, about Margeret Barker receiving an honorary doctorate from the Archbishop of Canterbury. (Aside from linked article)

Even the link you provided does not include Barker in the picture.

I’m not a conspiracy theorist but this appears to be a scam.

Please tell me what you come up with. I’m very curious.
From the Archbishop of Canterbury’s website?
rowanwilliams.archbishopofcanterbury.org/articles.php/1241/archbishop-of-canterbury-awards-lambeth-degrees

And like I said, hundreds of folks most of whom are not LDS have cited here books.

The Library of Congress calls her a scholar. Her DD is reference on over 1000 websites.
If that is not enough, I have no more.
Charity, TOm
 
From the Archbishop of Canterbury’s website?
rowanwilliams.archbishopofcanterbury.org/articles.php/1241/archbishop-of-canterbury-awards-lambeth-degrees

And like I said, hundreds of folks most of whom are not LDS have cited here books.

The Library of Congress calls her a scholar. Her DD is reference on over 1000 websites.
If that is not enough, I have no more.
Charity, TOm
Believe it or not, I think this is good news. When I have time I will read up on what you have provided.

Thank you 🙂
 
I am often baffled that folks do not think there are some points of strength in the pro-LDS (and even anti-Catholic) points I make. One explanation I tell myself is that these things are not seriously considered. … I guess I consider my words reasonable and a solid read of what has happened …
Everyone does believe they are correct in their beliefs. We all believe are words are reasonable, and we all think we have a clear understanding of those issues for which we hold a strong opinion. All Catholics do, all Mormons, all atheists, and everybody else.

A certain type of maturity may be defined as the ability to see that however reasonable, solid, good, and correct “my” views may seem, they may not seem as reasonable, solid, good, and correct to others. Hence, we have a world full of diverse religions, politics, and culture and ethnic prejudices.

Speaking for myself (naturally), the “distinctives,” as they were once known, of the Mormon movement do not have any points of strength. I’m not just throwing out some hopefully anti-teflonic blanket claim; I am speaking about topics I have personally researched, both pro and con, and on which I have held changing opinions over the years.

The reason I think they do not think there are “some points of strength in the pro-LDS … points” you make, is not because I am obtuse, evil, or stupid. If I am those, they are independent of my conclusions regarding the points in question. The reason I do not believe they hold much weight, is because such points that Mormons typically hold up as strong evidence of the truth of Mormonism are in fact weak, and not just weak but incredibly weak, based on wishful thinking rather than solid evidence or proper if not also strong reasoning. You have seen me go into detail on the problems with the claims about “Nahom” being related to an altar; with the impossibility of identifying Book of Mormon geography with Old World geography - although (naturally) it does line up with New England and Great Lakes geography quite well; and with the irrationality of a universe without a First Creator and a God whose power is part of his nature rather than a separate Priesthood that he had to be given by someone else.

The claims about the Book of Mormon being legitimate history, or about Mormon doctrines outside the Book of Mormon being sound Christian doctrines are incompatible with our knowledge of Jews, Indians, geography, history, and rational (especially Scholastic) Theology.

TomNossor, thank you for the two links. Lax16 had presented some of the information earlier. I have now read more. The list of reviewers is not helpful. Too much searching to find the actual reviews and read them. So far I have not been able to access any. If you would collect them all at a single site, that would sure save a boat-load of time, and I wouldn’t have to subscribe to half a dozen journals or pay for back-issues. 😉

As I wrote earlier, yes, her views are interesting:
Her views are interesting, but for me not persuasive, and I wonder if she genuinely holds them herself or does she sometimes write as an exercise in alternative interpretations rather than for historically productive discovery.
For example, following your link to “Who is Margaret Barker?” by Kevin Christensen, after describing her as “a math and religion teacher at the Ockbrook School in England,” a “co-educational day and boarding school children aged 2-18 years” (on whose site she is not currently listed), the fourth sentence explains that she “remains outside the university world” curiously to “keep [her] academic freedom,” and reveals that it is her “ambition to redraw the map of biblical studies”!

So she intentionally stands aloof and above the fettered academic world – “the university world” – for the sake of “academic freedom.” Christensen observes that she does not write as a dispassionate scholar, but to persuade others. She is, in other words, an evangelist seeking converts not a nonpartisan seeker of truth. Her ambition is less to find truth than, as she stated, to “redraw the map of biblical studies.” (continued)
 
(continued)
From reading from the links you provided, I am more convinced that Margaret Barker is more than a little unconventional. Very knowledgeable, sometimes persuasive, touching on esoterica, but in her own way, not entirely credible. I do not say this as criticism of her, but as a description of how I view her writing.

You suggested that Tarquin and Lax16 should get come to an agreement on whether Barker is a scholar. I responded, but now you have linked to an essay by Barker that carries an important confession. In “Joseph Smith and Preexilic Israelite Religion” she has written, “I am not a scholar of Mormon texts and traditions. I am a biblical scholar specializing in the Old Testament…” She continues, “What I offer can only be the reactions of an Old Testament scholar: are the revelations to Joseph Smith consistent with the situation in Jerusalem in about 600 BCE?”

While I have to agree that an Old Testament scholar may be in an excellent position to provide useful “reactions” to a comparison of “the revelations to Joseph Smith” with Jerusalem of 600 BC, there is a large problem involved, of which one who is not also a scholar of Joseph Smith’s revelations and/or the Book of Mormon will not be aware.

1
In the first case, the problem is twofold. First, those “revelations to Joseph Smith” got dramatically CHANGED even during his own lifetime, and then after his demise, they were changed more!

Secondly, those revelations came after Joseph Smith had familiarized himself with the Old Testament over a course of two or more years.
In Letterbook 1, The Joseph Smith Papers:
“At about the age of twelve years my mind become seriously imprest with regard to the all importent concerns for the wellfare of my immortal Soul which led me to searching the scriptures…”
(josephsmithpapers.org/paperSummary/letterbook-1?p=8#!/paperSummary/letterbook-1&p=8)
And his mother reported in “Biographical Sketches of Joseph Smith, the Prophet, and His Progenitors for Many Generations” (Liverpool: S. W. Richards, 1853), p. 90, that he had most humbly informed her:
“I can take my Bible, and go into the woods and learn more in two hours than you can learn at meeting in two years, if you should go all the time.”
(archive.org/stream/BiographicalSketchesOfJosephSmithTheProphet/Biographical%20sketches%20of%20Joseph%20Smith%20the%20prophet%20and%20his%20progenitors%20for%20many%20generations#page/n91/mode/1up)
If he learned more in two hours with the bible than his mother could in two years “all the time”, then in the two years between that statement and the alleged date of his “First Vision,” he would have learned more from the Bible, at the rate of two hours per day, than his mother could have learned in . . . 730 years of continuously studying the Bible!! But perhaps Joseph Smith was exaggerating. Perhaps he exaggerated other things.

So, Joseph Smith’s revelations were not revelations to some uneducated farm boy. They were revelations to a boy who had worked to familiarize himself with the Bible. Did Barker have some means at her disposal to weigh the degree to which Joseph Smith may have simply mimicked the Old Testament in dialect and culture?

2
In the second case the problem is this. Barker wrote, “I am not a scholar of Mormon texts and traditions.” After knowing Mormons for years, she still could not help but warn us, “I am still, however, very much an amateur in this area.” This means not only is she unlikely to be familiar with the details of the changes made to the texts, nor with the historical changes, sometimes a 180 degree turn-around, of Mormon traditions (baptism, priesthood offices, temple rites, etc.); but she also probably missed the language and linguistic problems: the unhebraic misuse of pronouns, passages changed to read contrary to the original, and so on.

“Frankly, it doesn’t matter to me what his level of training is in these fields. What matters is whether his arguments hold any merit” – Casey Luskin

To be a scholar is to be a scholar. It is not to be right. One may be a scholar in the American history without being “credentialed” to speak authoritatively on biochemistry. One may be a scholar in the Old Testament without being “credentialed” to speak authoritatively on the Book of Mormon. One may know a lot about the Book of Mormon without knowing very much about the cultures and theologies represented in the Bible. Just as one may be an expert on U.S. History, Buddhism, horse training, construction work, without ever taken a single class or obtained the most elementary “credential” in that subject. What matters is not one’s “credential” nor the label “scholar,” but whether one is right or wrong. (If you had the impression that earlier I was denying Barker’s “scholarship,” that misimpression may have due to my caution in viewing scholarship as a sign of training, obeying, and passing tests in a certain field, rather than “proven expertise” in a field. Which is why I am not as unquestioning as some others, when a credential or label is used to bolster an argument by the holder of that credential or label. Barker has credentials and labels, granted, but she herself admits her deficiency in Mormon texts, traditions, historical changes, textual criticism, the Book of Mormon, and Joseph Smith’s revelations.

As above,
…her writings do not seem to lend much in the way of “significant” … support to particularly unique aspects of Mormon teachings of the 19th and 20th centuries.
 
Tarquin,
I first encountered Margaret Barker, reading Paradigms Regained. It is here:
publications.mi.byu.edu/periodical/occasional-papers-2/

Margaret Barker in her own words links her scholarship with the BOM highlighting numerous places in which the BOM fits well in 600BC Jerusalem rather than 19th century America.
This link should work. If not I can send you the PDF.
web.archive.org/web/20101011034507/http://byustudies.byu.edu/PDFLibrary/44.4Barker%20fb893f65-0851-4eb2-99d1-0e6d85d8a8bb.pdf

I think it is clear that Margaret Barker is a “scholar.”
I also think it is clear that Margaret Barker independent of the Book of Mormon came to conclusions about 600BC Judaism which when she read the BOM she found fit so well, she has used the BOM in her future studies.
I read that she was surprised to read the word “white” in connection with fruit when she read the Book of Mormon (or some essay about the Book of Mormon). Other than that, as I’ve previously stated, there are only correlations, which she extends to the Quran, some of the Dead Sea Scrolls, and the Narrative of Zosimus as well. Broad correlations, sundry speculations.

How hard might it be for a hypothetical fourteen year old to write a story based on stories in the Old Testament? Having written such a story, should we be surprised that what we find in the Old Testament about early Judaism “fit so well” with the story written by that youth? I was not even 12 when I wrote my first imitation of a Psalm (the 23rd). Later, I wrote an alternative Creation story. Then I wrote a fictional account of the Messiah. If they did not fit perfectly with the Bible, the language style in which they were written did. At that time, my family had only King James Bibles, so naturally those early stories fit well with Bible stories told in King James English. Others have also written stories with an Old or New Testament ring to them, such as Mark Rubenstein’s irreverent “The New Gospel”
newgospel.com/books/1.%20The%20New%20Gospel%20Standard.pdf), and even (in modern English) Vardis Fisher in his “Jesus Came Again,” not meaning to slight Meryl Arbing’s and Lorne Brown’s King James’ humorous version of ‘Humpty Dumpty’ (patheos.com/blogs/labmind/2011/07/humpty-dumpty-the-king-james-version.html).

“…she has used the BOM in her future studies”

What does that mean? Has she found Nahom, Irreantum, or the Valley of Lemuel? Has she found Laban’s tomb? Or records of Laban’s administration? Has she found traces of the Liahona? Has she found Ishmael’s tomb? Has she found pottery, arrows, or swords left behind by Lehi’s band? How has she used the book? Exactly what sort of “studies” has she used the Book of Mormon for? And how productive has its use proven to be, in practical not speculative terms?
 
Tarquin,
I liked reading your post. I have already thought of a number of things to say, but I thought I would just say it was a thoughtful post. It also evidenced that you read Barker’s and Christenson’s words.
More to follow eventually and hopefully.
I hope my posting will drop off in a few days when my family returns from a trip, but we will see.
Charity, TOm
 
Tarquin,
I thought I would make sure my understanding of these words is somewhat correct before I respond more fully.
You said:
Everyone does believe they are correct in their beliefs. We all believe are words are reasonable, and we all think we have a clear understanding of those issues for which we hold a strong opinion. All Catholics do, all Mormons, all atheists, and everybody else.

A certain type of maturity may be defined as the ability to see that however reasonable, solid, good, and correct “my” views may seem, they may not seem as reasonable, solid, good, and correct to others. Hence, we have a world full of diverse religions, politics, and culture and ethnic prejudices.

Speaking for myself (naturally), the “distinctives,” as they were once known, of the Mormon movement do not have any points of strength. I’m not just throwing out some hopefully anti-teflonic blanket claim; I am speaking about topics I have personally researched, both pro and con, and on which I have held changing opinions over the years.
I have on this board regularly acknowledged that “everyone does believe they are correct in their beliefs. We all believe our words are reasonable.”
It is my position that Catholic critics of Mormonism here (and many places, AND I AM UNSURE if I should include you, Tarquin, in this) not only suggest that my assessment of these questions is wrong, but that it is ridiculous and worthy of ridicule.
Stephen, thinks my points are so flawed he doesn’t believe I sincerely make them but rather that I am being “intentionally deceptive.”
I have not searched your posts to see if I would think you have suggested my points are so ridiculous they should be ridiculed. Certainly you did not do this in this post.
However, in this post you did say “do not have any points of strength.”

It should not surprise you to know since you have interacted with me for a long time, I have regularly granted that a pro-Catholic or anti-Mormon argument has “points of strength.”

What I want to know and what I lean towards seeing in your post above is that honest and rational LDS should as a matter of intellectual honesty and Christian duty acknowledge that there are some points of strength in the Pro-Catholic and Anti-Mormon arguments we deal with. BUT that the Pro-Mormon arguments we deal with are flawed in a way DIFFERENT than these and Tarquin (in particular) and Catholics here (in general) as a matter of intellectual honesty and Christian duty should not acknowledge there is “any point of strength” present in the Pro-Mormon arguments.

One difference is a matter of weighing evidences and judging relative merits, the mature position of recognizing there will be differences. The other is a matter of some blind commitment inspite of all reasonableness, seeing “points of strength” when there is absolutely no “points of strength.”

Perhaps I misunderstand you and your “we have different views” is SOMEWHAT applicable to both sides, you just find the Catholic side much stronger. You can see that I find the LDS much stronger and this does seem a little off to you, but it is within the spectrum of disagreements we see in life. But when you say, “do not have ANY points of strength” I see this as a nice way of saying that there is a profound and obvious bias in my thinking that is substantially absent in your thinking.

BTW, my point is not that mocking and accusations of dishonesty should not happen when these assessments are made, this I think is clear to unbiased readers. I say this because I want more than an agreement about how such things should be avoided.

My point is that there is often an assessment that points I consider strong are so flawed they could be mocked or likely are not truly what I believe. There is a reason for this. I often think the reason is that my points are not really considered and/or there is a demonstrable DOUBLESTANDARD.

I apologize for repeating so much, but one more try.
Rebecca said:
Im not trying to pick on you. Of course we all have our own biases, but that doesn’t prevent us from following non biased methods. I don’t see that you’ve got that going. 🙂
I think your post suggests that you agree with Rebecca. “We all have our biases.” But, the reason I believe what I believe are Pro-Mormon evidences is because I do not “follow non-biased methods.”
Thus while it might be unkind to mock or to accuse someone of dishonesty, my conclusions are so radically flawed it is my methods AND my biases not just my biases. The Pro-Catholic and Anti-Mormonism poster here has biases, we all do, but they at least follow “non-biased methods.”

Charity, TOm
 
Tom, I have to wonder why you keep quoting me in posts to other people without talking to me directly and actually addressing what I say without tacking on tacky persecution complexes. It’s kind of weird.

It is more than obvious to me that Joseph Smith was a fraud. More than obvious that the Book of Mormon is a fan fiction, with wholesale plagiarism of the Bible. I think you have to ignore a whole lot to deny this.

I agree that taking the Book of Mormon seriously is like taking aliens seriously. Might be fun as a hobby. Mayb even provide a moral code such as with those who follow the new religion of the Jedi (seriously).

I do read Mormon claims, your links, but of course I see desperation to make it true
(Please God). Long tangents of scolding non believers, such as yours, aren’t helping your position. There is no evidence in scolding.
 
It is more than obvious to me that Joseph Smith was a fraud. More than obvious that the Book of Mormon is a fan fiction, with wholesale plagiarism of the Bible.
One wonders why the pope would waste time with adherents of such an obviously fraudulent religion.
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

Pope Francis even went to the extent of inviting an LDS apostle and president of the church to speak at the Vatican.
 
Please quote the revelation you are speaking about and I will tell you my thoughts.

Stephen168;13874605 said:
- You didn’t respond to anything in that post. So if you wanted to “give me your thoughts” you would have did it then.
I noticed Post #101 has been left unanswered.
TOmNossor;13874444:
I have already responded in my head to things on #101, but I just have failed to craft a response on the board. I will.
What I want to know and what I lean towards seeing in your post above is that honest and rational LDS should as a matter of intellectual honesty and Christian duty acknowledge that there are some points of strength in the Pro-Catholic and Anti-Mormon arguments we deal with. BUT that the Pro-Mormon arguments we deal with are flawed in a way DIFFERENT than these and Tarquin (in particular) and Catholics here (in general) as a matter of intellectual honesty and Christian duty should not acknowledge there is “any point of strength” present in the Pro-Mormon arguments.
This thread being about the Book of Mormon it seems fair to assume when you say Pro-Catholic or Pro-Mormon you are talking about their position on the Book of Mormon.

The Catholic Church as it has always done since its beginning is to leave scientific claims to the scientists, so there is no Pro-Catholic position in regard to the Book of Mormon. As a Catholic, I side with the findings of empirical science which says the Book of Mormon is not true as claimed by Joseph Smith.

The Mormon Church is standing against empirical science, so yes there is not “any point of strength” present in the Pro-Mormon argument.
 
One wonders why the pope would waste time with adherents of such an obviously fraudulent religion.

Pope Francis even went to the extent of inviting an LDS apostle and president of the church speak at the Vatican
.
Therefore the Book of Mormon is true?:confused:
It is in comments like Neuro’s that make it seem the LDS is doing everything within it’s power to appear to be a mainline Christian Church. Inviting an LDS church leader to the Vatican does not make the claims of the BoM valid, nor does it validate the claims of J. Smith.

I have a leadership role in a local food ministry. Part of that ministry is a soup kitchen located at the Catholic church. Many local LDS wards take turns cooking, serving, and cleaning up. Does that somehow imply that the BoM is true? It’s not much different really than your example above.
 
Tom, I have to wonder why you keep quoting me in posts to other people without talking to me directly and actually addressing what I say without tacking on tacky persecution complexes. It’s kind of weird.

It is more than obvious to me that Joseph Smith was a fraud. More than obvious that the Book of Mormon is a fan fiction, with wholesale plagiarism of the Bible. I think you have to ignore a whole lot to deny this.

I agree that taking the Book of Mormon seriously is like taking aliens seriously. Might be fun as a hobby. Mayb even provide a moral code such as with those who follow the new religion of the Jedi (seriously).

I do read Mormon claims, your links, but of course I see desperation to make it true
(Please God). Long tangents of scolding non believers, such as yours, aren’t helping your position. There is no evidence in scolding.
Rebecca,
I was not trying to avoid you. As I was formulating my point, your words came to my mind. You offered something that helped me make my point. And I do not think I was making my point at your expense in anyway.
I also am not trying to scold anyone. I am trying to make a point.

Your position is that everyone has biases, but LDS such as me apply biased methodologies. This produces the disconnect where not only is my position not viewed as likely, it is viewed as similar to taking alien abduction stories seriously.

My position is that everyone has biases, but the pro-Mormon arguments I offer are not seriously considered and this creates the disconnect. It is not my position that the pro-BOM arguments I offer should compel Catholic here to cease to be Catholic. It is my position that the pro-BOM arguments I offer have “points of strength.” That they are not worthy of ridicule and they are not worthy of claims that I do not actually believe them but only say them to deceive others. (BTW, being worthy of ridicule and receiving ridicule are separate things, Catholic here judge Mormons as worthy and many are willing to dish it out).

Anyway, that is why I quoted you.
Charity, TOm
 
Therefore the Book of Mormon is true?:confused:
No. I’m suggesting that RebeccaJ may be just perhaps the tiniest bit overly harsh in her criticisms about the church. I mean, why would the Pope invite leaders of an obviously fraudulent church?
It is in comments like Neuro’s that make it seem the LDS is doing everything within it’s power to appear to be a mainline Christian Church.
What does it mean to you, to be a “mainline Christian Church”? Do we wish to be considered Christians? Yes, of course we do…
 
Popes throughout history have also met with Hindus, Muslims, members/leaders of various Protestant churches, and other faiths that certainly aren’t believed to be The Truth.
 
As far as I know, a myth is a story that’s old. If the Lamanites and Nephites were ancient civilizations that had access to steel weapons, which is what the book of Mormon attributes to them, we would expect to see evidence of that. We would expect to see steel armour with the buried Nephite warriors (they would be buried because of the huge battles that the book of Mormon claims happened, even with elephants, believe it or not).

The Nephites would’ve been extremely well documented because of all this innovative technology and major warfare that happened. Yet, outside of Mormon scriptures, I don’t think there is any evidence that the jews built boats and sailed to Central America, nor that they had access to forging steel weapons. When a civilization as big as the Nephites dies off, they always leave evidence behind.

TL;DR - no, because the stories of the Lamanites and Nephites cannot be traced back to ancient civilizations. Therefore, they cannot be called myths.
 
It has been said that Margaret Barker supports and uses the Book of Mormon in her research, though at the time the claim was made, the type of research was not identified. It may have been archaeological research or it may have been theological or cultural research. She also uses the Quran, the Nag Hammadi manuscripts, and Paradise Lost. Would her use of texts for research justify claims that those texts are legitimate revelations or guided writing from the Divine, or even geographically accurate (e.g., the Book of Enoch, the Narrative of Zosimus, and Paradise Lost)?

Barker, who admits her lack of expertise when it comes to Mormon history, tradition, and texts, has written in “Joseph Smith and Preexilic Israelite Religion”:
“As far as we know, there was no idea of a closed canon in 600bce, and ongoing revelation from the prophets was accepted in that day, even if what the prophets said was sometimes very uncomfortable. …
Yet here is our first warning: IF some of the wickedness in Jerusalem mentioned in the First Book of Nephi (1 Nephi 1:13) included parts of Josiah’s temple purges, we should expect to find information relevant to the Mormon tradition in texts outside the Bible. And we do. Moreover, the biblical texts themselves take on new significance if we no longer assume that everyone agreed with Josiah’s purge. Jeremiah, a contemporary of King Josiah, has many passages that seem to criticize what has just happened in the city.”
(Tangentially, I can’t help but think she remarked that there was “no idea of a closed canon” as suggestive that books not currently held by traditional * Jews and Christians to be divine writ, are in fact, some of them, in her mind equally of divine origin as, say, the Torah and the Gospels. It seems to me that she makes assertions throughout her text that lack the foundation one might expect [evidence, citations, etc.]) (And remember, Jeremiah is in the Bible, not in the Book of Mormon. Jeremiah is specific; the Book of Mormon, generic.)

After saying, “And we do [find information relevant to the Mormon tradition in texts outside the Bible]”, she offers the location of some of those texts: “Perhaps reflecting these ancient disagreements, some books mentioned in the Old Testament are now lost.” This is mind-boggling sophistry akin to the Darwinist claim that “we know it’s true because we will find evidence for it sometime in the future,” and the Marxist claim that “Marxism works, it just hasn’t been done the right way yet.” The names of books “mentioned” in the Old Testament which “are now lost” fulfills her expectation that “we should expect to find information relevant to the Mormon tradition in texts outside the Bible. And we do.”

Speculation. But what “if” none of the wickedness included parts of Josiah’s temple purges, what then? A conditional is not a factual. A hypothetical is not a fact. We would be equally safe asking, “If” the Book of Mormon is true, is the Book of Mormon true? Does the Book of Mormon anywhere identify temple purges in Israel? “Temple” appears 27 times in the Book of Mormon according to an official Mormon website. Other than referring to the temple building of Solomon, I find nothing regarding the temple at Jerusalem. Lehi avoided the temple for some undisclosed reason. (Perhaps he was an apostate, had violated Mosaic Law, or was otherwise unclean and unworthy?) Josiah is not mentioned at all in the Book of Mormon. The Book of Mormon is little help as a research tool when it comes to Josiah, to temple purges in Israel, or to anything significant about the Jewish temple circa 600 B.C. at all.

But let’s look again, for when it comes to the possibility of the Book of Mormon referring to Josiah’s temple purges, here is how 1 Nephi 1:13 reads:
And he read, saying: Wo, wo, unto Jerusalem, for I have seen thine abominations
! Yea, and many things did my father read concerning Jerusalem – that it should be destroyed, and the inhabitants thereof; many should perish by the sword, and many should be carried away captive into Babylon. Here is where Barker joins in the same error as many Mormons – speculating that a **generality **(“abominations”) covers particular **specifics **(“temple purges”). The only “wickedness” mentioned in the Nephi passage is “abominations.” There is no way here to determine whether the wickedness included temple purges or not, so those purges are in my mind irrelevant in the absence of a definite connection. In fact, it would be easier to argue that the abominations were widespread, because the “wo, wo” is “unto Jerusalem,” the entire city, the entire population, all the “inhabitants thereof,” not just unto Josiah and his supporters.

What Mormon 8 seems to include as abominations are “murders, and robbing, and lying, and deceivings, and whoredoms,” and Jacob 2:20-28 , lists pride, persecution, giving a hard time to your neighbor. Jacob also identifyies as even “grosser” abominations the crimes of taking multiple “wives and concubines” and the old standby “whoredoms.” However, “temple purges” are nowhere identified as abominations.

There are other problems with Barker’s essay. I suppose it is typical of her style, preserving her “academic freedom” by remaining “outside the university world” where her “ambition to redraw the map of biblical studies” might find healthy review by her academic peers and more rigorous over-peers.*
 
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