Covering their sin

[Catholic_Dude]

In the OT, the Psalms and in Isaiah it speaks of their sins (that is people who lived before Christ died) being covered. God can not look a sin stained person so he covered their sin with robes of rightiousness. Those who live after Christ death and are believers have the stain of sin washed away by Christ blood.

Those saved in OT times were just as much “washed clean” by the merits of Christ as the NT saints. Places like Ps 51 demonstrate the inner sanctification that occurs. The references to “cover” are to be taken figuratively, on the grounds that God cannot technically “forget” a sin occurred but He can and does actually remove (wash away) sin.

The Bible tells us how God feels about sin and how he deals with it. Maybe you should read it sometime

Yes, and it is not the Protestant model of snow covering a dung pile making it appear to be clean/righteous (a concept condemned in Mat 23:25-28).

 

[allischalmers]

Really Baptist, that is wayyyyyyyyyyy to easy for ya. That is why I love my Catholic faith, it is a sacrifice and it is not easy. Jesus said it won’t be easy to enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

I think it is a whole lot easyer to live as you please all week long thinking that once a week you can go to a preist so he can make everything right with God for you. A whole lot easyer than waiting for the Holy Spirits guidence so that you will not sin

 

[txsoldier94]

We don’t HAVE to go to a priest either.

Before y’all jump on me…its true.

Yes, we should go to a priest for absolution, because that is the only way we KNOW (both through our own examination of conscience and Christ’s absolution) that our sins are forgiven. But in extremis, we can confess to God…it is imperfect…very imperfect, but possible. Also, intent to go to confession, but being unable to go (for valid reasons) also can result in absolution…of course, the reasons that you cannot go to confession have to be pretty permanent, or you would go, no?

Catholics confess to our priests in persona Christi because only the successors of the Apostles have the God-breathed (literally) power to bind and loose sins on earth. Every Christian has direct access to God…but some means of using that are more efficacious than others.

21 He said therefore to them again: Peace be to you. As the Father hath sent me, I also send you. 22 When he had said this, he breathed on them; and he said to them: Receive ye the Holy Ghost. 23 Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained.

John 20:21-23

 

[txsoldier94]

I think it is a whole lot easyer to live as you please all week long thinking that once a week you can go to a preist so he can make everything right with God for you. A whole lot easyer than waiting for the Holy Spirits guidence so that you will not sin

Heh…you speak here of the sin of presumption. We cannot just live as we please in the assumption that we can just go to confession and make it all better. It does not work that way.

To presume upon God’s forgiveness is a sin. We must live as God pleases, and when we fail…as humans always do. We trust in the guidance of the Holy Spirit, our Guardian Angels and all the saints to help us, and keep us from falling.

If the only Catholics you know are the ones that you describe, then you ought to know that they are not following the teachings of Holy Mother Church, and are not good examples of true Catholic Living.

God bless,

Mik

 

[Ceil-1]

You cannot sin all you want, then go to confession. One must have a firm purpose of amendment not to sin again. Hopefully, any further sins will be that of weakness rather than deliberate.

Many, many protestants live life with no outward sin, but, inside, they are as black-hearted as they come. The sad part is, because it is all “outward”, they think they are covered, they don’t make any attempt to seek God’s grace and become transformed into the image of Christ, which is the Biblical requirement of every Christian. In fact, they excuse their imperfections saying that God forgives them.

The apostles set an example of tireless sacrifice and suffering for the sake of the Kingdom of God. As a Biblical believer, wouldn’t you at least want to imitate them (who bear a remarkable resemblance to the savior?) If it seems to good to be true, it is.

 

[allischalmers]

I have to totally disagree with your statement " to presume upon God’s forgiveness is a sin". It is totally and completely unbiblical.
Ist John 1:9 (I think) If we confess our sins He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanes us for all unrightiousness

 

[allischalmers]

You cannot sin all you want, then go to confession. One must have a firm purpose of amendment not to sin again. Hopefully, any further sins will be that of weakness rather than deliberate.

**Many, many protestants live life with no outward sin, but, inside, they are as black-hearted as they come. The sad part is, because it is all “outward”, they think they are covered, they don’t make any attempt to seek God’s grace and become transformed into the image of Christ, which is the Biblical requirement of every Christian. In fact, they excuse their imperfections saying that God forgives them. ** The apostles set an example of tireless sacrifice and suffering for the sake of the Kingdom of God. As a Biblical believer, wouldn’t you at least want to imitate them (who bear a remarkable resemblance to the savior?) If it seems to good to be true, it is.

And of course the same can be said for many Catholics, But it is not for me to tell others how to live but for me to live a life that glorifys God

 

[Righteousone]

I have to totally disagree with your statement " to presume upon God’s forgiveness is a sin". It is totally and completely unbiblical.
Ist John 1:9 (I think) If we confess our sins He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanes us for all unrightiousness

Maybe you should follow in the footsteps of Guy Doud.

 

[Valke2]

I believe the concept of covering sins deals with the belief that you can’t undo the results of your sin. You can’t make it as if the sin never occurred or magically disappeared. If I insult you in front of a crowd, nothing I do can make it as if that action never happened. You can repent and be forgiven, but the sin itself doesn’t disappear.

 

[allischalmers]

Maybe you should follow in the footsteps of Guy Doud.

and who is Guy Doud

 

[txsoldier94]

Let me clarify what I mean when I say to presume upon God’s forgiveness…

I mean just the situation described above, living a worldly life, thinking that just by going to confession, all that I have done will be forgiven, and then I am free to go to Mass, receive the Eucharist and them resume my worldly ways until next Saturday…

Deliberately sinning just assuming that God will forgive your sins…that is the sin of presumption.

When we slip…when we fall…as we all must fall from time to time…that is one thing. But to say – “Its OK, I can do this and just go to confession before Mass”

NO

That is what I mean by the sin of presumption.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled discussion.

Mik

 

[khutcheson]

Many, many protestants live life with no outward sin, but, inside, they are as black-hearted as they come. The sad part is, because it is all “outward”, they think they are covered, they don’t make any attempt to seek God’s grace and become transformed into the image of Christ, which is the Biblical requirement of every Christian. In fact, they excuse their imperfections saying that God forgives them.

Wow.

How do you know what they’re like on the inside?

 

[Righteousone]

and who is Guy Doud

Guy Doud was a Baptist minister for 17 years, was on the 700 club, admitted he never liked Catholics, only to convert to Catholicism a couple years ago on Easter Sunday.

 

[allischalmers]

Maybe you should follow in the footsteps of Guy Doud.

The only Guy Doud that I could find anything on was a teacher that recieved the 1986 “Teacher of the Year Award”. No Baptist minister that converted to Catholic.
Speaking of your “Guy Doud” To bad that he was that unsure of his faith that he made that mistake. I am not that unsure about my faith and not at all convinced about catholicism that I will make that mistake.

 

[Righteousone]

The only Guy Doud that I could find anything on was a teacher that recieved the 1986 “Teacher of the Year Award”. No Baptist minister that converted to Catholic.
Speaking of your “Guy Doud” To bad that he was that unsure of his faith that he made that mistake. I am not that unsure about my faith and not at all convinced about catholicism that I will make that mistake.

He use to have a website, maybe not anymore. And I think you are the unsure one, perhaps that is why you are on a Catholic forum.

 

[txsoldier94]

The only Guy Doud that I could find anything on was a teacher that recieved the 1986 “Teacher of the Year Award”. No Baptist minister that converted to Catholic.
Speaking of your “Guy Doud” To bad that he was that unsure of his faith that he made that mistake. I am not that unsure about my faith and not at all convinced about catholicism that I will make that mistake.

You must not have looked at the links that Google brought up. That is the same Guy Doud

Mik

 

[grandmaM]

Heh…you speak here of the sin of presumption. We cannot just live as we please in the assumption that we can just go to confession and make it all better. It does not work that way.

"]To presume **upon God’s **forgiveness is a **sin/**COLOR]./B] We must live as God pleases, and when we fail…as humans always do. **We **trust in the guidance of the Holy Spirit, our Guardian Angels and all the saints to help us, and keep us from falling.

If the only Catholics you know are the ones that you describe, then you ought to know that they are not following the teachings of Holy Mother Church, and are not good examples of true Catholic Living.

God bless,

Mik
1 John1:9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousnes 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar,and His word is not in us.

1 John 1:1 My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if you anyone sins, we have an advocate with the Father,Jesus Christ the righteous. 2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for our sins only but also for the whole world.

Pretty clear to me we can know we are forgiven.
|
Jude 1:24
Now to HIM who is able to keep you from stumbling, and to present you faultless before the presence of His glory with exceeding joy, 25To God our Savior, Who alone is wise, Be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and forever, Amen

Also very clear Who keeps us from stumbling.

 

[grandmaM]

You cannot sin all you want, then go to confession. One must have a firm purpose of amendment not to sin again. Hopefully, any further sins will be that of weakness rather than deliberate.

Many, many protestants live life with no outward sin, but, inside, they are as black-hearted as they come. The sad part is, because it is all “outward”, they think they are covered, they don’t make any attempt to seek God’s grace and become transformed into the image of Christ, which is the Biblical requirement of every Christian. In fact, they excuse their imperfections saying that God forgives them.
The apostles set an example of tireless sacrifice and suffering for the sake of the Kingdom of God. As a Biblical believer, wouldn’t you at least want to imitate them (who bear a remarkable resemblance to the savior?) If it seems to good to be true, it is.

How do you know it is only outward?Are you the Holy Spirit?
Luke 6:17 Judge not, and you shall not be judged. Condemn not, and you shall not be condemned Forgive, and you will be forgiven. 18Give, and it will be given to you; good measure, pressed down and shaken together, and running over will be put into your bosom. For with the same measure that you use, it will be measured back to you.
1 Samuel 16:7…for man looks on the outward appearance but the LORD looks on the heart.

 

[allischalmers]

He use to have a website, maybe not anymore. And I think you are the unsure one, perhaps that is why you are on a Catholic forum.

Actually, being on the CAF has made my Baptist faith stronger.
The reason for that is, I am a retired old guy that has a lot time to research what catholics on the forum have said to find the truth and the truth comes up on the side of what Baptist teach.
Also I can not find a good Regular Baptist forum on the wed.

by the way Guy Doud was an Evangalical Free minister, not a Baptist minister. No Baptist minister would make that mistake.

 

[Righteousone]

Actually, being on the CAF has made my Baptist faith stronger.
The reason for that is, I am a retired old guy that has a lot time to research what catholics on the forum have said to find the truth and the truth comes up on the side of what Baptist teach.
Also I can not find a good Regular Baptist forum on the wed.

by the way Guy Doud was an Evangalical Free minister, not a Baptist minister. No Baptist minister would make that mistake.

Really?
Deal Hudson—“An American Conversion”
Baptist minister turned Catholic

Steve Ray—“Crossing the Tiber”
Baptist Minister turned Catholic

Tim Staples—Baptist Minister turned Catholic

Jimmy Akin–“A Triumph and a Tragedy”
Baptist turned Catholic

Jeff Cavin—Protestant minister turned Catholic

Marcus Grodi—Protestant Minister turned Catholic

Alex Jones—Pentecostal Pastor turned Catholic

Dr. Scott Hahn–Protestant Minister turned Catholic

and last but not least John Henry Newman who turned Catholic and who later became a Cardinal…oh there are lots more if you’d like to know about ex-Baptist ministers.