Cradle Catholics v. RCIA Catholics

[elts1956]

I am a cradle Catholic along with my husband, but one of our biggest challenges is finding decent Catechism instruction for our children. Our parish (and I hesitate to say this because they rely on volunteers) does a TERRIBLE job in its RE program–lots of inconsistencies–largely due to the almost annual turnover of the Director of RE position. We are somewhat at a loss~I’ve volunteered in the past, but found it to be as big of a waste of my time as my kids. I know kids aren’t chomping at the bit to learn the ins and outs of their faith, but there has to be a way to make this more interesting and less tortuous!?

It is very difficult to teach children and teen agers the truths of the Faith. It is easier with the younger ones, so I can only speak from the personal experience of teaching them. You need all sorts of tricks up your sleeve, just as a classroom teacher needs. Kids from third or fourth grades through eighth would probably enjoy keeping a journal. This could be used for many things, ie. writing down a favorite biblical passage, keeping record of how many times they said the Rosary during the week, what kind acts they did within their family, or at school. The older the child, the lengthier the journaling should be. They could do this daily, or weekly when doing an assignment. They would bring in their journals each CCD class for you to review. Of course you would need a lot of parental involvement in helping the younger kids carry these out, also a system of rewards given to those who do carry out the given assignments. The reward could be as simple as a small piece of candy, a sticker for their journal. Of course the reward bit could be slowly taken away and a group reward could be instituted, ie. if 3/4 of the class did their assignments during CCD, you could treat them to a pizza, or have them come to your house for a celebration, or a movie with pop corn. Make CCD aa strong a class requirement, as math, or science.

 

[elts1956]

I am a cradle Catholic along with my husband, but one of our biggest challenges is finding decent Catechism instruction for our children. Our parish (and I hesitate to say this because they rely on volunteers) does a TERRIBLE job in its RE program–lots of inconsistencies–largely due to the almost annual turnover of the Director of RE position. We are somewhat at a loss~I’ve volunteered in the past, but found it to be as big of a waste of my time as my kids. I know kids aren’t chomping at the bit to learn the ins and outs of their faith, but there has to be a way to make this more interesting and less tortuous!?

I was listening to the radio a bit ago, and the discussion was focused around the idea that RCIA Catholics tend to be “more Catholic” than Cradle Catholics.

They were using the phrase “more Catholic” to describe going to Church more frequently, following the Church’s teachings, knowing the content and applicable verses in the Bible, attending confession more regularly, etc.

I’m a Cradle Catholic, and I tend to think I do a pretty good job. I was raised in a conservative Catholic family, so it was around me all of the time. My parents weren’t C+E Catholics like a lot of my friends who have fallen from the faith.

Any thoughts? It was interesting, because I had never given it any thought, and I don’t really know too many people who have gone through RCIA…

I don’t think we can give a blanket statement as to the fervor of either Cradle Catholics, or those who have gone through RCIA. It depends on at least a couple of things. If one is a Cradle Catholic, did s/he receive strong instruction in the Faith? Depends on when and where the instruction was received. The same can be said of those from the RCIA group.

As for myself, I am a pre Vatican II, pre many things, Cradle Catholic, having gone through 14 years of Catholic Education in the 40s and 50s. Did this make me more fervent? I can’t say it did. For one thing, the policy where I was taught in Grade and High School was, “read, memorize and believe”. I did have fervor for my Catholic Faith. I would defend it “to the death” as one was wont to say during those years. But it wasn’t until I began investigating the whys and wherefores, beginning with the Fathers of the Church, that my understanding of my Faith began. I think fervor for our faith depends upon the quality of knowledge that is given to the Catholic. I believed as a grade schooler and high schooler, I just didn’t “know” my Faith until I began studying on my own.

 

[VivienneJ]

Well all I can say as a 50 year old cradle Catholic is…

I think I know a great deal about Catholicism. More than many Catholics I know now. But I have not even begun to touch the fullness of knowledge that is possible to know about our Faith.

Whether one is a cradle Catholic, a revert or a convert, there is always something new to learn or discover about our Faith. My guess is that Pope Benedict would tell you that he too is continuing to grow in knowledge.

But head knowledge is only a piece of what it means to be Catholic. The advantage cradle Catholics (at least those who grew up in good homes with good education) usually have over RCIA Catholics is the formation that comes with LIVING a Catholic life.

As a cradle Catholic I am inspired and strengthened by those who have the courage and wisdom to join the Catholic Church. I have no idea what I would have done if I was in their shoes.

The fullness of Catholicism simply cannot be lived by one person. It’s sounds cliché but we do need each other as parts of the Body of Christ.

Cradle Catholic, revert or RCIA, there’s a lot to learn about our shared Catholic faith and we need to share the traditions and questions to have a full Catholic life … for sure we need each other. We’re only as ‘good’ as our determination to live our faith to the best of our ability each day and we need to pray for help to live that faith daily.

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

I’ll have to look into where to buy the missalette then because I feel lost w/out it.That’s what I mean, I want to write it into the walk through I printed out. Where exactly… the striking the chest (I’m wording it wrong because it sounds goofy) and where exactly the crossing on the forehead, lips & then the heart is done… what if anything we’re supposed to say during that. If I remember the 2nd one, wasn’t it something to the effect of 'bless what I think, what I speak and what I feel"(??) but I fear I’m still miswording something. I should remember this/know it… but I’m sure I was sleeping 20 yrs ago or at least had my mind elsewhere.

Oddly enough, Fadda Levis and Fadda Trigilio covered that this week. If I could only remember the exact words! I think it was LIKE, “Let the word of God be on my mind, my lips, and my heart?”

 

[dianaballein]

I was listening to the radio a bit ago, and the discussion was focused around the idea that RCIA Catholics tend to be “more Catholic” than Cradle Catholics.

They were using the phrase “more Catholic” to describe going to Church more frequently, following the Church’s teachings, knowing the content and applicable verses in the Bible, attending confession more regularly, etc.

I’m a Cradle Catholic, and I tend to think I do a pretty good job. I was raised in a conservative Catholic family, so it was around me all of the time. My parents weren’t C+E Catholics like a lot of my friends who have fallen from the faith.

Any thoughts? It was interesting, because I had never given it any thought, and I don’t really know too many people who have gone through RCIA…

I am in RCIA right now. The cradle Catholics who attend do so to re-energize their faith and their teachings. New members in RCIA are learning and want to experience as much as possible, so it makes sense that they may attend more Masses, etc than cradle Catholics.

 

[George_C]

I am in RCIA right now. The cradle Catholics who attend do so to re-energize their faith and their teachings. New members in RCIA are learning and want to experience as much as possible, so it makes sense that they may attend more Masses, etc than cradle Catholics.

My first class is tomorrow morning. Can’t wait.

 

[dianaballein]

I think somewhere about halfway through RCIA, I fell in love with the Church. Initially, I was a disenchanted Episcopalian, more interested in registering my discontent with that poor, beleaguered denomination than I was in applauding the rightness, logic, and ineffable majesty of Catholicism. That changed. I am still in love, although I confess I may not be quite as zealous at expressing that love as I was 11 years ago when my family and I were first confirmed.

Fortunately for me, the Catholics I was exposed to when I converted (and it was a conversion,) were every bit as dedicated to the Faith as I ever hope to be. They were cradle Catholics.

However, I am currently working with a cradle Catholic, who makes me want to cringe every time she opens her mouth on the subject of our shared Faith. I work with mostly non-denominational Protestants. One day a group of us were talking about the Bible. This woman said something like, “You can’t expect me to know anything about the Bible. I’m Catholic.” I piped in and said, “I know my Bible, and I’m Catholic.” Her reply was, “You don’t count. You’re a new Catholic.”

She said what??? That is just terrible. How unwelcoming and un-Christian to say that to you. You should be applauded for converting. I am so excited as I take this journey, and I fall more in love with it every day.

 

[dianaballein]

My first class is tomorrow morning. Can’t wait.

I hope you get out of it as much as I do!! Our teacher is such a joy…very infectious in her love for the Lord. I have never felt more welcome amongst a group of people, ever. May God Bless You as you take this important step!

 

[George_C]

I hope you get out of it as much as I do!! Our teacher is such a joy…very infectious in her love for the Lord. I have never felt more welcome amongst a group of people, ever. May God Bless You as you take this important step!

Thank you.

 

[jmcrae]

**Not sure I agree. Hubby is a cradle Catholic. He attended daily Mass as a child, was an alter server etc. The Faith was a huge part of his life growing up. But he couldn’t answer more than 2 or 3 of my hundreds of questions when I was on my road to converting.

As a convert I wanted to know exactly what I was accepting and the whys behind what I would be required to do. He just did them because it’s how it always was. And he is not a Catholic-in-name-only by any means.

I think that many times the things we learn/do as children just become so familiar to us that we stop questioning. So in that regard I think converts can learn more in 6 months to year than someone who has been a lifelong practicing Catholic.

And my conversion journey really seemed to renew that desire for answers in him so now we learn together.**

Knowing something, and being able to put words to it, are sometimes two different things.

He may not know the word “genuflect,” for example, but he knows both when and how to do it. But the reason an adult convert needs a word for it, is because we have to learn how to do it, and also when to do it. That’s just a very simple example of what I mean. A convert can tell you the word and give you a dictionary definition, but you need a cradle Catholic to really show you what it is - even if they may not know what it’s called.

 

[VivienneJ]

Knowing something, and being able to put words to it, are sometimes two different things.

He may not know the word “genuflect,” for example, but he knows both when and how to do it. But the reason an adult convert needs a word for it, is because we have to learn how to do it, and also when to do it. That’s just a very simple example of what I mean. A convert can tell you the word and give you a dictionary definition, but you need a cradle Catholic to really show you what it is - even if they may not know what it’s called.

Excellent example I long for the day I can do it all by instinct like a cradle Catholic . . . and I came from a protestant tradition that is not all that far from Catholic practice!

 

[Roza]

Oddly enough, Fadda Levis and Fadda Trigilio covered that this week. If I could only remember the exact words! I think it was LIKE, “Let the word of God be on my mind, my lips, and my heart?”

That sounds much closer than what I had… I know it used to be in the Missalette and I couldn’t find it exactly… I will add those words to my walk through, put them on a separate sheet right now then add so I know I’m putting them in the right place.

Thank you & God bless

 

[Jennifer_J]

Only on certain days of the year - not all the time.

Actually, you should bow at the words when it’s recited at Mass:

<<He was born of the Virgin Mary,
and became man. >>

During the Christmas liturgy and Feast of the Annunciation, you genuflect/kneel!!

 

[Jennifer_G]

I have given it more thought, and I think I am going to go ahead and agree with the statements.

I went to Catholic school from pre-school until 12th grade. Out of my core group of 10 friends, 2 of us are still practicing Catholics beyond the the C+E “obligations.” The 8 that have fallen off use the argument that the Church was “pounded into them” by mandatory Church on Fridays + Church on Sundays when their parents felt like going.

They feel like they don’t “understand” the faith, which is weird because we were practically fed the Catechism starting in 6th grade.

I just thought it was a really interesting statement.

I look at it like this. (potential bad analogy alert. ) If protestantism is like eating a slice of plain pound cake, then the Catholic Church is like eating a huge multi-layered wedding cake with 3 inches deep of the richest icing you’ve ever tasted (one cake for each person at that!). For those who grew up eating “wedding cake”, it’s all they know and they’re used to it. For those of use who’ve eaten nothing but plain “pound cake”, then of course we want that wedding cake! We remember what it was like at a church without some/many/(all?) of the sacraments, when Holy Communion is something only offered once every 2 weeks (at 1 out of 3 church services)/once a month/once a year, when we had no visible heirarchy, or even none at all, when we didn’t hear stories of the Saints, and so on.

Actually, you should bow at the words when it’s recited at Mass:

<<He was born of the Virgin Mary,
and became man. >>

During the Christmas liturgy and Feast of the Annunciation, you genuflect/kneel!!

Yes, I remember learning that during the Christmas Mass last year during RCIA. All of the sudden, everyone knelt!

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

Actually, you should bow at the words when it’s recited at Mass:

<<He was born of the Virgin Mary,
and became man. >>

During the Christmas liturgy and Feast of the Annunciation, you genuflect/kneel!!

That’s what our misselette says! So I started second-guessing myself and looked it up, and I still think you bow then.

O PS: Dis wut DH finded during serch:

Mass, 101

 

[Roza]

Going to print out this one for myself too, once I have printer cartridges again! I hope and pray they go back to Missalettes for people like me! I miss those!

The moral of this story is, don’t ever go off on your own tangent away from the Church for near 20 yrs cuz you might be a bit lost.

 

[RHC]

Of course you are.

But don’t ever let anyone flatter you into thinking that you can learn more in six months to a year about the Catholic faith than someone knows who was born into a Catholic family and has been immersed in it for their entire lives.

You will certainly have fresh insights, and your enthusiasm will be a witness to others, but there will always - always - be lots to learn from those who got here first, and who have been “labouring in the vineyard,” so to speak, since “dawn,” or from birth.

I would never presume that. I think you must have misunderstood me.

I simply meant that we are passionate about apologetics and our faith because we have had opposition from our families. Furthermore, we have had to play a lot of “catch up” and thus have had to study intensely, partially to answer our families’ questions/comments.

Trust me, I wish I had the benefit of a Catholic upbringing. I am afraid I will always feel a bit of an outsider because I was not raised in the Church.

 

[Sasha]

Trust me, I wish I had the benefit of a Catholic upbringing. I am afraid I will always feel a bit of an outsider because I was not raised in the Church.

Please don’t. My father was a convert and my mother has always said he was a better Catholic than her (cradle Catholic). I am a revert… after not knowing my faith for most of my life I figured it out… don’t be jealous of cradle Catholics… you have had good instruction and God only cares of what is in your heart.

 

[Roza]

A question to ponder. If what I’ve been reading/listening to lately is on target… and that we possibly have 30 to 40 years of poor Catechetics, that would include while I was going through CCD/Confirmation (again I won’t blame my dabbling junk on the Church), it wouldn’t include the generation before me, it would include my cousins… at least 5 I know have left Catholicism.

I guess maybe I qualify as being a broken home kid too, what was the other term, latch key? Two bedrooms normal, two houses normal, obviously wasn’t the only one in a situation like that either. Plus as a kid… yeah, I read my horoscope, nobody told me not to that I remember. I watched ghost stories/specials/movies. I believed in UFOs, all sorts of things all taking my eyes AWAY from Jesus. I keep my eyes UP to where my HELP comes from. That tells me where I’m supposed to be looking. I can’t and won’t blame the Church but I certainly missed it and if we did have 30 to 40 yrs of bad Catechetics, then I’m not the only one, that missed things too.

I reverted (?) back to the faith last year because more and more every misconception and falsehood that I clung on to were proved wrong. So yeah, I am on fire now. That’s a good thing.

Cradle Catholics - ones who never left, you’re the smartest of us all. Maybe there could be parish Catechetics meetings (like we had Renew in the 80’s) that could be open to all members? I wonder if we could get something like that started. Should we?

 

[mullenpm]

I was going to stay out of this discussion because it is definitely way past my bed time; but, can’t do it.

I went to Catholic grade school (that is what we called it back in the 30’s) and we had Mass every morning before school (try that now); we had a Catechism class every morning and we had to memorize the questions and answers.

My mother was a convert but I don’t believe she was any more devout a Catholic than my Father.

I resent the generalization presented on this thread (and some others) that somehow we Catholics who grew up in the faith are less Catholic because we have become complacent; don’t go to Confession; etc.

You all have stories about people you know who have left the Church. Where are the posts from the devout Catholics who were properly taught as children and still practice their faith?

And the person who said he didn’t learn about Confession until recently; I cannot believe you did not learn about Confession when you were growing up. Where were you at your First Holy Communion?

That is all I have to say. Goodnight (or Good Morning; it is now Sunday and I will be going to Mass in a few hours).