Cremation, ossuaries, re-use of graves

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Hipster_Doofus said:
My friend’s take on this is that every molecule that has ever been part of our bodies during our lifespan will be brought back together, resulting in resurrection bodies that are presumably enormous. He may be pulling my leg, but either way, the theory is ridiculous.
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:hmmm: I guess he better hope that he doesn’t share any molecules with any other person who has lived and been resurrected. **imagines intertwined bodies **:hypno:
 
stevescribb said:
While the Catholic Church prefers burial, cremation is permitted. If Catholics can be cremated, why not a non-Catholic?

Your issue seems to be carrying out her wishes which violates Catholic teaching. You could have her parent(s) if living, or other of her siblings handle the final arrangements to keep yourself out of the issue. But, then you might be blamed for usurping your duties and responsibilities as her husband.

You might want to talk to your parish Priest about this and if he doesn’t have an answer to your query ask him if he, or you could contact your Bishop for clarification. :highprayer:

Since cremation is permitted, I would assume that the Church must have something in writing concerning cremation. Does anybody else out there in the ether-world know if this subject is in the Catechism, or some other Church document? If so, please post it here, or let us know the source so we can clarify the standing of the Church on this. Also, does anybody know if cremation is a venial sin?

As for myself, I am fence sitting on this issue as well. :juggle: Hmmm, do I want to become worm food, or be thoroughly well-done in the easy-bake oven? :hmmm: Yea, I know when you are dead you don’t feel anything, but the thought of a glimpse of hell or purgatory gives me pause. Call me nuerotic if you like. But hey, most of us have experienced burns, one of the worst pains in my opinion. That’s why I am working on a e-ticket with a straight line to heaven. Don’t know if I will get it, but I think we all would like to bypass hell and purgatory. :bigyikes: :crossrc:

Yours in Christ,
Steve
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It’s not so much the cremation part, as it is the scattering of her ashes. That as I understand it is not permitted.
 
I’m curious what the penalty is–mortal sin, venial sin, or what?
 
Hipster_Doofus said:
I’m curious what the penalty is–mortal sin, venial sin, or what?
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I could be wrong, but given the limited amount of brain cells God gave me, my own common sense and logic comes to the conclusion that the Church in permitting cremation, or any other action, would never do so if a portion of its body, (members), would incur any sin as a consequence/result of that action. There, I answered my own question from a previous post about it being a venial sin! Again, just my opinion. I don’t know what the Church teaches on this.

As previously posted, cremation itself is not the issue, so long as the intent is not to dishonor resurrection. It’s the scattering of ashes that seems to be the sticking point.

Yours in Christ,
Steve
 
Here in south Louisiana, the water table is very high in most places (i.e. 3 - 4 ft. below ground). We have above ground tombs which are filled with earth. The early colonists found that if you simply buried in the ground, a rising water table would cause the caskets to pop out of the ground. Sadly, the floods of Katrina and Rita caused this to happen even with tombs above ground.

And so, I have an ancestral tomb in a Catholic cemetary. The rule is “a year and a day”. No one can be buried in the tomb until a year and a day has passed. The coffin is broken apart and the remains are carefully wrapped and placed below the new coffin. My family has had the tomb for over 150 years. There is something to be said for being able to see the passing of generations.
 
Sorry–I should have been more clear: what sort of sin might it be to sprinkle ashes or to agree to cremation knowing that might happen?
 
Dear Brotherhrolf,

At the risk of venturing into bad taste, I have to ask–what do you see inside a family tomb? Are there layers and strata of bone or that sort of thing? Is it like a lasagna or geologic cross-section?
 
Hipster_Doofus said:
Dear Brotherhrolf,

At the risk of venturing into bad taste, I have to ask–what do you see inside a family tomb? Are there layers and strata of bone or that sort of thing? Is it like a lasagna or geologic cross-section?
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http://www.about-neworleansla.com/wp-content/uploads/502906_new_orleans_cemeteries_3.jpg

New Orleans’ cemetaries are rightly called 'cities of the dead". The family tombs shown here are vaults. The slab doors are bolted on. When there is a funeral, the opening is covered in a black cloth so that the family cannot look inside. The casket is not placed into the tomb until after everyone has left. There is sufficient space in the rear of the tomb for the remains of the relatives to be placed.

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

My family’s tomb is like the one behind this guys right elbow. A masonry frame about 4’ high covered in stucco. The interior is earth. Same thing during a funeral - it is covered.

nytimes.com/2005/11/02/national/nationalspecial/02saints.html

We still clean the grave with soap and water and then whitewash it. The earth is planted with flowers. Come All Saints Day we put fresh flowers in the urns.
 
That first picture looks to be of St. Louis Cemetery #3, if I’m not badly mistaken. I think I see the grandstand of the Fairgrounds way off in the distance.
 
My family gravesites and tombs are also in New Orleans and the immediate surrounding area. I was told that there are several “shelves” (ex, 3) in the above-ground tombs. When the time comes, the remains are pushed to the back and the new coffin placed on the “shelf”. Freaked me out when I first heard that, but apparently the body and coffin break down and there’s not usually much left.

On a side note, one of my ancestors had an arm amputated and it was interred in a family tomb. Apparently burying the whole body was taken pretty seriously.
 
Hipster_Doofus said:
That first picture looks to be of St. Louis Cemetery #3, if I’m not badly mistaken. I think I see the grandstand of the Fairgrounds way off in the distance.
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No, its a Protestant mega-church built close to the foot of Canal St. And if you’re that familiar, what the hey are you doing asking me about what the inside of the graves looks like? 😃
 
proudnifi said:
My family gravesites and tombs are also in New Orleans and the immediate surrounding area. I was told that there are several “shelves” (ex, 3) in the above-ground tombs. When the time comes, the remains are pushed to the back and the new coffin placed on the “shelf”. Freaked me out when I first heard that, but apparently the body and coffin break down and there’s not usually much left.

On a side note, one of my ancestors had an arm amputated and it was interred in a family tomb. Apparently burying the whole body was taken pretty seriously.
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Think about it. The tombs are above ground and subject to all the heating of the sun - think oven. My beloved uncle (and godfather) died in 1968. My beloved aunt (and godmother) buried him in this really huge bronze coffin. My beloved aunt (and godmother) went to her eternal reward in 1990. All that money on a coffin…

Me? I’ve already told DW my wishes. The Benedictines at St. Joseph Abbey across the Lake are making plain pine coffins. Our beloved Bishop Ott was buried in one. A humble coffin for a humble man.

T’is close to the season of the year. When was the last time you heard on Ash Wednesday - “Remember man that thou art dust and to dust thou shalt return”?
 
“No, its a Protestant mega-church built close to the foot of Canal St. And if you’re that familiar, what the hey are you doing asking me about what the inside of the graves looks like?”

Well, I’ve been in that cemetery but haven’t seen inside a tomb.

“We y’ats stick together.”

Oddly enough, I’m not a y’at, but I am a longtime fan of NO. I’ve not been there since '93. I had planned to move there at one point, and even applied for a job with the “Times-Picayune,” but Katrina scared me off.
 
Texas born and bred. No Louisiana kin that I know of. And I think I’m the first Catholic in the family since the Reformation.

I lived from age 3 months to 6 months in Virginia and have been Texas all the rest. My ancestors came from England, to Virginia, North Carolina, and then Texas.
 
stevescribb said:
Hmmmmmmmm, sounds kind of like a Chalmette/Gretna dialect!
Where y’at? I lived in La Place for 8 years.

Steve
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Nah! Could be Irish Channel or Ninth Ward too - anywhere in NO actually. LaPlace, eh? Well, ever since Katrina, NO, BR, the North Shore and places in between have become one big city.

OK, I am an archaeolgist by training (UNO and LSU). The soil conditions down here are such that bodies and bones disintegrate rapidly. The major problem is modern coffins (which is why I don’t want one). Folks spend a tremendous amount of money on coffins/caskets which would be fine if the grave was intended for a single interment.

Lord, this is gruesome. My beloved godfather died in 1968. My beloved godmother (my mother’s sister) died in 1989. They opened the family tomb for my aunt and found that Unc was pretty much mummified - courtesy of the sealed bronze coffin. Unc’s remains were removed from the coffin and reinterred in the soil below where my aunt’s coffin was to go. No, I didn’t see it - that’s what we were told by the archdiocese. The soil conditions are such that there would have been precious little of previous generations.

As an archaeology student who has excavated Native American sites in LA, I can tell you that bodies interred in the soil remain in only bone fragments.

I have already told DW that this is the way I want to go:

saintjosephabbey.com/index.php?

Check out the Woodworks link.
 
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